YTSEJAM Digest 1693
Today's Topics:
1) Jason Becker on CNN/HNN
by Randall Braun <RBraun@tlr.ameridata.com>
2) Trading and other stuff
by kurt@fgallery.com
3) YTSEJAM digest 1689
by UMJG72D@prodigy.com (MS ANNA M STIGLIC)
4) Re: YTSEJAM digest 1689
by Adam Zirkin <zirk@Ascensionet.com>
5) YTSEJAM digest 1691
by UMJG72D@prodigy.com (MS ANNA M STIGLIC)
6) Re: YTSEJAM digest 1691
by Adam Zirkin <zirk@Ascensionet.com>
7) anything but DT
by Partha Mukhopadhyay <ahtrap@umich.edu>
8) Throwing coal onto the flames
by The Digital Man <cmerlo@cs.uvm.edu>
9) The World Is A Puzzle With A Peace Missing
by Adam Barnhart <adamb@cfmc.com>
10) News From Dream Theater...
by Alan E Adler <al766074@mail.mty.itesm.mx>
11) cow....... cant get enough of saying cow. cow.
by RipZero <ripzero@dreamt.org>
12) ? for Cynic fans
by Younis Youssef Hilal <yhilal@uclink.berkeley.edu>
13) IGoD, UGoD, WeGoD
by Imxtnit@aol.com
14) 600 CDs
by "Paul W. Cashman" <vanyel@crl.com>
15) Re: About Death...
by raika@megatoon.com (Simon Asselin)
16) 2112 flow and caffeine
by rterry@inforamp.net (Rick Terry)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 96 14:19:00 PDT
From: Randall Braun <RBraun@tlr.ameridata.com>
To: "'Ytsejam'" <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com>
Subject: Jason Becker on CNN/HNN
Message-ID: <31EAD03C@mailgate.ameridata.com>
Out of lurking I come agian.
I wonder of any other Y'Jammers saw the piece on Jason Becker on CNN/HNN
this last weekend. It was rather interesting, and showed how he's still
composing via computer despite his disabilities due to ALS, aka Lou
Gehrig's Disease. He's doesn't appear to have much voluntary muscle control
left, and is in pretty much the same state as the infamous physicist Stephen
Hawking (who also suffers from a similar neuromuscular degenerative
disorder) I hope they'll show it again for those of you who are interested;
sorry I couldn't have gotton this info out earlier, but I've only got Net
access at work.
Also, does anyone out there know if the lettering used on the first two
Galactic Cowboy CDs and on the Echolyn 'As the World' CD, are available as
fonts??.
Sorry no DT content, except to ask how soon, no more waiting?
Also I've gotten Shadow Gallery & Magellen; how does Cairo compare? Any
other Magna Carta groups worth getting, any similar groups on other labels?
Thanks for any help; Email directly if you want.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 18:05:30 -0400
From: kurt@fgallery.com
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Trading and other stuff
Message-ID: <TCPSMTP.16.7.15.-14.5.30.2916992174.311636@bbs.fgallery.com>
Hi.. a while back someone told me that he could make me a tape with over
9 difrent studio (demo) and live versions of ACoS ..i lost contact ..fo
if youre reading me im still up for it ..ill trade for money or blanks
since i only have WDATU and Instrumental II ..Also can anyone tape me
Scenes From A memory or Subconcious ? Same standards..ill trade for
blanks or cash ... thanx! :)
Cheers YtsejammerS!
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 17:41:50, -0500
From: UMJG72D@prodigy.com (MS ANNA M STIGLIC)
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: YTSEJAM digest 1689
Message-ID: <199607152141.RAA08680@mime4.prodigy.com>
>It's amazing what tricks the brain can pull on you behind your back.
Anyone
>else got any songs like that; songs that they associate with stuff
that has
>nothing to do with the song? Just curious.
yep...Awake. the entire album. (some songs more than others)
because when my boyfriend (now ex) made me a copy of it, we were
going thru some rough times, and as you can imagine, i listened to
that album once and i felt as if someone had been living my life and
just put it to music. :) and then, LSOAD, jesus...we broke up...we
got back together...we broke up...we got back together. that was his
song for me. oh yeah...now we're just friends who have been thru a
lot together. took us a while to realize we were better off as
friends. almost lost each other for a while there...
oops, pardon me, i'm babbling...
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 18:10:19 -0700
From: Adam Zirkin <zirk@Ascensionet.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 1689
Message-ID: <31EAEBFB.39A7@Ascensionet.com>
>
> Date: Sun, 14 Jul 1996 22:22:17 -0400
> From: Jon Byrne <rael@access.mountain.net>
> To: ytsejam@ax.com
> Subject: Re: Drugs in rock and roll
> Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19960714222259.2d574688@access.mountain.net>
>
> At 11:40 PM 7/12/96 -0700, somebody wrote:
> >Unfortunately drugs have ALWAYS been a part of rock and roll and they
> >always will be. Chuck Berry is a heroin addict and has been forever it
> >seems.
>
> True, not only have drugs always been a part of rock, but they have always
> been a part of music, period. Think of some of the great composers. Mozart
> was a chronic alcoholic, and Berlioz's "Symphonie Fantastique" (which is
> fantastic, BTW) is the result of an opium-induced dream. Add to those rock
> folks you mentioned above some of the recovered alcoholics/addicts (Roger
> Waters, Fish, etc.). Just goes with the territory, I guess.
>
> Buzzin' on caffeine...
>
> Jonathan Byrne
> rael@access.mountain.net
> http://access.mountain.net/~rael/jdbhome2.htm
> West Virginia University College of Law
Jon -- I'm a little skeptical of your cynicism of the music profession
with regards to drugs and alcohol. First of all, alcohol and drugs are
not necessarily most prevalent in the music profession. In fact, they
are just as prevalent among writers and actors and whatnor. But more
importantly, I'd be inclined to believe that the more professional
musicians do not get that involved with drugs.
Jon, I'll grant you outright that Mozart was an alcoholic and whatnot,
but realize that was during a time when the harms of alcohol were not as
well known as they are now. In Mozart's time, Alcohol was a way of life.
Nowadays, it's an image. It's much easier to shy away from an image than
it is to shy away from a lifestyle.
I was discussing the topic with Derek (Shenirian), and he mentioned that
those people on top of the music industry -- not the performes but the
companies will can an artist is the artist is involved with drugs. I
think that's precisely the reason why the bands and performers who are
the past legacies (Floyd, Dylan, the Eagles) and those who are upcoming
legacies (DT, the Chili Pepppers) are either shying away from drugs or
have never been involved with them.
Learning to live....
-- Adam Zirkin
-- zirk@Ascensionet.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 17:59:26, -0500
From: UMJG72D@prodigy.com (MS ANNA M STIGLIC)
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: YTSEJAM digest 1691
Message-ID: <199607152159.RAA13052@mime4.prodigy.com>
>Any of you addicts want to flame me for saying this stuff, I'll buy
you a
>lighter. I don't care. But I don't want the younger DT fans to see
this
>stuff and take it as a good way to reason out starting an addiction
to
>something that will only cause you harm.
i am one of the younger DT fans. you can't find a good reason for
starting an addiction to anything. i don't want this to become a
major issue on the jam, cuz it's really not relevant to anything we
have to talk about, but i will say that i _have_ gotten into some
stuff myself, and ya know, it's not that great. i have a close
friend who's into some pretty hard stuff, and i hate her for it. but
i love her like a sister, so what can i do? i tried to stop her...so
hard...but when someone's that dependant on it, taking it away from
them is like taking away the very air they breathe. to be blunt...it
sucks.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 18:19:41 -0700
From: Adam Zirkin <zirk@Ascensionet.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 1691
Message-ID: <31EAEE2D.D54@Ascensionet.com>
> Have any of you guys fund any new cool prog music?
I was playing some DT stuff in a music store and this guy came up to me
and told be to listen to these guys called "Echolyn." I bought the
album. I mean, in an instrumental sense they're pretty progressive.
They use a lot of keyboards and they often have three guitars going
(which can really add to the sound), but alas, they're poorly organized
so often the music sounds like 16 tracks thrown haphazardly on top of
each other. The lyrics are really corny, ie. "I move to a groove that
will never stop swinging and I sing to a song that'll never end." But if
you want to hear some pretty intricate music, it's pretty cool. The
album's called "As the World"
-- Adam Zirkin
-- zirk@Ascensionet.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 19:02:45 -0400 (EDT)
From: Partha Mukhopadhyay <ahtrap@umich.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: anything but DT
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.960715185051.28151B-100000@choplifter.rs.itd.umich.edu>
1) Welcome back, Al B. NOW WOULD YOU SEND THOSE DAMN TAPES ALREADY?!?!?
2) A Clockwork Orange truly is a sweet movie.....but, Rick, It seemed to me
that it was set in a modern society, in which some kooky
scientist types were running their own little rehab experiments on a
total punk???
either way, total recommendation for those who like weird movies..........
3) i wonder if brian cox is road tripping through any town where HE owes
tapes? (Was that you, Pell?)
4) "thought i'd something more to say"--floyd, pink
partha
"poets and madmen, all defy reason"--savatage
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 19:06:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: The Digital Man <cmerlo@cs.uvm.edu>
To: Ytse Jam <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Throwing coal onto the flames
Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9607151913.C15131-0100000@griffin.emba.uvm.edu>
> From: Pat Daugherty <pdaugher@bdmserver.mcl.bdm.com>
> Subject: Not my fault
>
> >>What do you expect from me Merlo? Do you expect me to welcome him back
> >>with open arms?
> >>
> > Aw shee-it. You two at it again?
>
> Merlo started it...
Did not! Did not!
----> From: Pat Daugherty <pdaugher@bdmserver.mcl.bdm.com> > Subject: Re: Trading Troubles > > He seems to be buddies with a lot of jammers. How come know one says pay > up Al?
Pay up, Al. Welcome back, bud.
> Believe me I have considered it a lost cause. Al Balkewicz is a RIPOFF. I > wont waste anymore space in the jam on this subject unless new > developments occur (or Merlo, fuels the flame fest... :) )
That's me, fueling the flame fest with four posts *today* on the subject.
------------------------------------------------------------------------ The Digital Man \|/ ____ \|/ Secretary cmerlo@cs.uvm.edu "@'/ ,. \`@" UVM Comp Sci Student Assn d-man@dreamt.org /_| \__/ |_\ "He won't need a bed http://www.emba.uvm.edu/~cmerlo \__U_/ He's a digital man" - Peart
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 16:27:34 -0700 From: Adam Barnhart <adamb@cfmc.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: The World Is A Puzzle With A Peace Missing Message-ID: <199607152327.QAA16452@main.cfmc.com>
Reflections on Digest # 1692:
>From: rterry@inforamp.net (Rick Terry) > > God! How could I have been so blind as to miss out on that >Huxley linkage!?!!? That is a fantastic book and well worth the time >to read. > Speaking of totalitarianism, has anyone seen A Clockwork >Orange? This is Stanley Kubrick at his finest. The movie portrays a >futuristic society where gang violence is as bad as it is in today's >inner cities. The main character, Alex, undergoes classical >conditioning to aversive to him any sort of violence or sexual >stimulation that the state deems unacceptable. > Alex is played by Malcolm MacDowell who played the baddy in >Star Trek:Generations. > Those of you who like the storyline of 2112 should really >enjoy this.
I'm not sure about that. I liked the movie, recognized it's importance in the annals of film. But I wouldn't call it amazing. Maybe a 6 or 7 on a scale to 10. I liked the book better....a lot of folks that favor the film feel the book wimps out a little at the end. I'd say "A Clockwork Orange" is an awful lot like "The Wall," with a soundtrack a cut lower. I suppose it's a higher piece of art, and I'd certainly suggest that anyone who's not seen it probably should, but there are several Kubrick flicks I like more.
Take this with a grain of salt, though. I liked "Independence Day" about as much...felt like it was, basically, a knock-off of "Star Wars" in a lot of places....
>>Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 12:55:11 -0500 >>From: RipZero <ripzero@dreamt.org> > >>dug out an old Faith No More cd! Sheeot! what ever happened to these >>guys either? > > You're no kidding. The Real Thing was a brilliant record. I >like every song on that disc, although Woodpecker from Mars wears a >bit thin after the 5th listen or so. :) From Out of Nowhere and >Falling To Pieces are still among my favorite songs. > When Angel Dust came out, I was so disappointed that I didn't >even bother to buy the one with the red cover. I can't remember what >it's called.
On the first point, I'd agree. "The Real Thing" is a fantastic record...the harbringer of the coming Funk/Punk/Metal/John Zorn sound. If Material wrote more accessible music.....
On the second point, I couldn't agree less. "Angel Dust" is an even MORE dramatic piece of work, I'd say. I don't know that the composition is as strong, but it's awfully good. It's sad that the band's basically disappeared....they're probably one of the dozen or so most interesting bands still going today (in the U.S., at least).
>From: Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu> > >>Yeah, "2112" is the obvious call. "The Fountain of Lamneth is one second >>short," and I think it hangs together pretty well, though it IS a little >>weird. But has no one here ever heard of "Thick As A Brick?" >> > >Heard it, love it. It does have a break in the middle, but since they were >fitting it on an LP I can forgive. My CD has only the one 42 minute track, >even though the back lists it as two twenty-minute ones. Is this true for >others who have the CD?
Yeah....it's broken down into "Edits" (you'll typically hear one of the first two on the radio), and appears as two cuts on my CD -- the "Side 1/Side 2" of the vinyl/tape setup. But it's one of their finest efforts, and has gone largely unnoticed in this discussion of the best long tunes in prog history. And that's a shame....
>>No, but I DID go to the show (the first one) she did at the Paramount in >>Oakland on the 12th (and just a five minute drive from my digs in Alameda, >>no less!). She was awfully good, but I hadn't seen her before....she played >>most of the tunes a lot more rubato than I'd have done. Letting a song >>breathe is one thing, doing CPR at the end of every phrase is quite another... > >True. Show was neat, but they had to drive to Seattle last night so she didn't >come out to meet more than the few fans right up front. :( And I was wearing >my Ytsejam shirt, too! I coulda gotten her opinion of the connection between >the two of them. Oh well.
Yeah, she played two shows when I saw her at the Paramount. Caught the first show, so she wasn't really gabby or anything after the show. She was pretty impressive, though....."Little Earthquakes," "Winter," and "Cornflake Girl" were standouts.
Adam D. Barnhart adamb@cfmc.com ydnt85a@prodigy.com
Five Gratuitous CD's: ===================== 1. The Noise Of Trouble -- Last Exit 2. Not Of This Earth -- Joe Satriani 3. Thud -- Kevin Gilbert 4. Shortstop -- Sara Hickman 5. All The World's A Stage -- Rush
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 20:07:28 -0600 (CST) From: Alan E Adler <al766074@mail.mty.itesm.mx> To: Dream Theater mailing list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: News From Dream Theater... Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91.960715200132.6452C-100000@academ01.mty.itesm.mx>
Well I'm not going to give the news....I'm going to ask for some...hehehe Well if you have something interesting about Dream Theater, Kevin Moore or Extreme please email me....I don't read the jam because it's too long and it says a lot of things that I don't care..... If anyone has bootlegs or are interested in some please email me... I have Extreme boots (audio and video), Red Hot Chili Peppers (from the new album), Smashing Pumpkins (from the new album too), Pearl Jam (from the new album...it also includes mad season live and a new song from soundgarden live too...), R.E.M., Cranberries, and some other groups... just send me an email.... if you want to send an email to Mtv telling them wich group do you want to see the address is conexion@mtv.com Thas all for now... Bye
at least somebody's cool as you @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ @_______________________________@ @ Alan Estrada Adler @ @_______________________________@ @al766074@academ01.mty.itesm.mx @ @_______________________________@ @ Don't Worry, Be Hippie! @ @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 20:38:56 -0500 From: RipZero <ripzero@dreamt.org> To: Heavy Metal Computer Nerds <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: cow....... cant get enough of saying cow. cow. Message-ID: <31EAF2AE.58DF@dreamt.org>
>SC2000 means Countdown to Extinction for me. I listened to dat while I >used billion dollar cheat codes and destroyed scenario cities. :-)
i always used to play Metallica's "One" while i trashed my cities :)
>Wanna know what a good idea is? Listening to music with earplugs in. >That way, when you turn it up loud, you can still FEEL the music (which >is why it's fun to turn it up), but it doesn't hurt your ears.
Ha! then the neighbors come kick your ass! i garuantee that'll heart more than your ears would if you left the plugs out :)
>Merlo started it...
youre both going to have to go sit in the corner and think about what you've done if you dont calm down.
>The drummer was released on bail and has a court date for July 30
yep, and nothing's gonna happen to him..... just once why dont they lock one of these guys up for a while!
>And, now, it's time to play SPOT THE LOONY!
hehehehehe, monty python's complete waste of time KICKED ASS!
a'sall 4 now ~Ro[
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 18:51:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Younis Youssef Hilal <yhilal@uclink.berkeley.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: ? for Cynic fans Message-ID: <Pine.ULT.3.93.960715184625.29302A-100000@uclink.berkeley.edu>
Actually, this question is for anyone who somehow stays informed about these things. I was wondering, what's up with the Shawn Malone CD that's supposed to be coming out? Is it still scheduled for a July (or Aug., can't remember which) release? And what's up with the rest of the guys from Cynic? Have they found a replacement for Shawn yet or what?
Sorry to post this non-DT stuff on the Jam, but I know there's Cynic fans on this list, and I've found that info about this band (or former band) is just really hard to come by. Thanks, all! Be seeing you on IRC!!!
Younis Hilal---------------------------------------yhilal@uclink.berkeley.edu AKA YoonDog
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 23:43:09 -0400 From: Imxtnit@aol.com To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: IGoD, UGoD, WeGoD Message-ID: <960715234226_577563059@emout12.mail.aol.com>
Fellow Jammersyste:
All this talk about IGoD made me go find and dust off my No Exit cassette tape. Yep, that's right, a tape (at least it wasn't an 8track!). When i switched over to CD's back in '89, No Exit was the only FW release that i didn't run out and get on CD. In fact, i just plain didn't like it. But the Jam made me want to give it another chance, so...
I must admit after listening to it several times this weekend, it's not as bad as i once thought it was. I was into 'em with Arch, and i guess the transition in vocalists, as well as the new prog focus was more than my less mature musical tastes could take back then. I dunno. I still don't like it as much as their other stuff, though. My fav FW efforts are, perhaps ironically, Perfect Symmetry and Awaken the Guardian. Completely different styles from these guys, but something about both of these albums really appeals to me.
As for the long song debate, two camps seem to be emerging: (1) those who want a long song to be identified as such on the record and only on one CD track; and (2) those who care only for the musical, lyrical, and thematic cohesiveness of a song, regardless of it's length or number of tracks it contains.
I must say that i've pitched my tent in the camp of the #2's. To an extreme. In fact, when it comes to 20 minute plus songs, my favorite is the Erotomania/Voices/TSM trilogy from our boys in DT. I know it's not identified as one song, and they probably don't even play these songs in order live, which makes my point less than valid to some extent.
But i can't help when i listen to Awake but to hear the musical cohesiveness of these 3 tracks as one song. The end of Erotomania and the beginning of Voices aren't differentiated at all...they just flow into each other. From Voices to TSM, while it is a rather jarring shift, there's no dead air in between tracks, and there is a flow to it despite the obvious shift from elecrtic to acoustic. Aside from that, the guitar break on TSM is quoted entirely within Erotomania. And there is definitely a common theme going on there, but i just can't put my finger on it right now :-)
And finally (yayayaya!!):
>I sort of agree with this, although there are studies from such universities >as Stanford which suggest that you can control any dream with enough >practice. This is called Lucid dreaming. I had a friend from High school >who could do this almost every night. It's like taking reality and twisting >it to your whims every night.
iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii am smiling next to you.... :-)
Tim
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 21:16:47 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul W. Cashman" <vanyel@crl.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: 600 CDs Message-ID: <199607160416.AA09543@crl9.crl.com>
I have close to that many CDs now, too, and I've found tyhe most economical way for me to store (but not transport) them is to buy these 90-CD trays from LaserLine. They can act as either trays or wall-mounted and they're less than $20 apiece, which isn't bad (believe me, I've looked). I have two waiting to be used right now, and four actually in service. I found them at Best Buy.
-- Paul W. Cashman, vanyel@crl.com Rush Dream Theater Korn Bonedance --- www.crl.com/~vanyel ------ Metallica Hawkwind Enya Superior Mutha's Day Out Sisters of Mercy Dead Can Dance Blue Oyster Cult "You can find all you need in your mind / If you take the time.." -DT
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 00:51:39 -0400 From: raika@megatoon.com (Simon Asselin) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: About Death... Message-ID: <199607160451.AAA00716@dagon.megatoon.com>
>Um, maybe you're a newer Death fan, and in no way do I say that to belittle >you, but Sean Reinert's performance with Death and with Cynic are far more >complicated and IMO, better sounding than Hoglan's. When we went to see >Death after Individual Thought Patterns, Hoglan was pathetic. He couldn't >play Reinert's stuff to save his life. He even cheesed on the double bass. >I will say, however, that this guy must have worked his BALLS off, because >he was amazing on Symbolic. Almost as good as Reinert.
I agree that Reinert is a better drummer, and you'll notice that I didn't compare the two in my original post. I didn't have the occasion to see them live, but sucking one gig is not the guarantee that you lack the talent. Just like James Labrie. This type of drumming is particularly demanding especially on the stamina side of things. Maybe he was just tired...
I don't agree though that he could have picked any double-bass drummer as a replacement. The stuff Gene Hoglan plays is by no means whitin reach of the average death-playing wannabe.
>his side project before the last Death tour. That could just mean that >Chuck didn't care about Death as much as his other music, and went full on >into that. It happens.
Very plausible. It sucks we don't get more info...
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 05:03:12 GMT From: rterry@inforamp.net (Rick Terry) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: 2112 flow and caffeine Message-ID: <31eb1f19.5019650@mail.inforamp.net>
Hi folks!
>Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 12:32:26 -0700 >From: Ben Laussade <laussade@enet.net>
>Which makes my point..it's one story spread over a few songs.
I guess I can see what you are getting at, but I still think that these are shifts in consciousness rather than completely separate entities. Then again, you say tomato and I say ....... :)
>>>Buzzin' on caffeine... >> >> Buzzin' on life! > >No...it's caffeine. ;-)
But caffeine gives me tremors bad enough to mix paint in a hardware store. I think I'd like to stick with plain old life for now. :)
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 1693 **************************
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