YTSEJAM Digest 2879
Today's Topics:
1) Re: Dream Theater: A Commercial Success?
by Albert Balkiewicz <balkiewi@UMDNJ.EDU>
2) Jethro Tull
by
3) Re: Fatez and DT
by Brian <DreamNDay@dreamt.org>
4) Wherry-ly we go!
by Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu>
5) Oh yeah
by Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu>
6) Fates at House of Blues
by dseeger@juno.com (Deborah J. Seeger)
7) Geoff Tate
by Phdavis@aol.com
8) Re: Dream Theater: A Commercial Success?
by "KorgX3" <korgx3@cyberhighway.net>
9) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2878, FW and sucky opening bands
by Matthew Travis <musicman@cu-online.com>
10) NDTC: Savatage Recommendations
by marshallm@juno.com (Mike Marshall)
11) Re: Dream Theater: A Commercial Success?
by eckie@asu.edu
12) Falling into Infinity (Japan cd)
by Ed Smith <ecs88@voicenet.com>
13) Re: reply to my own incoherency - and commercialism...
by ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack)
14) Dt's ages
by "Carlos A. Alfaro" <calfaro@caribe.net>
15) YEAH! Got my order! =)
by Marcelo Vanzin <vanzin@geocities.com>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 16:37:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: Albert Balkiewicz <balkiewi@UMDNJ.EDU>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Dream Theater: A Commercial Success?
Message-ID: <199708182037.QAA13319@njmsa.UMDNJ.EDU>
Rogerio "CARNIVAL" Brito wrote:
>
> I think that it would be a very nice thing if DT played Fates
> Warning songs. Fates has been playing for small crowds, charging
I've heard Fates songs being played before DT goes on, in particular
Monument................
-Al
^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^
email: balkiewi@njmsa.umdnj.edu the_prof@bigfoot.com
HOMEPAGE:http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Towers/9280/index.html
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 17:21:25 -0400
To: ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Jethro Tull
Message-ID: <33F8BCD5.3BBCDB8E@erols.com>
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Date: Mon, Aug. 18, 1997
]From: Madrigal
Did anyone see the Jethro Tull concert last night at Pier Six
Pavilion in Baltimore. We had an awesome light show. For those of you
not in the Baltimore Area a severe thunderstorm went through the area
last night. Jethro Tull played straight through the storm even though
lightning was striking pretty close and we had walls of water coming
down. Of course, I think they had to be slightly crazy since Pier Six
is a pier and has only a tent covering it. Anyway, I saw a Dream
Theater Awake shirt there and wondered if it was anyone on the 'jam. It
was a good show and I'm glad they stand by their fans and didn't cancel
the show.
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fn: Richard Shaak Jr.
n: Shaak Jr.;Richard
org: Wicked Monkey, Inc.
email;internet: rfsjr@erols.com
note: "Great Googaly Moogaly!" - anonymous
x-mozilla-cpt: ;0
x-mozilla-html: FALSE
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 17:26:08 -0700
From: Brian <DreamNDay@dreamt.org>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Fatez and DT
Message-ID: <33F8E81F.39E2@dreamt.org>
> > Actually, I think they did play Fates stuff recently (either the Fix shows,
> > or back on the ACOS tour). I think I remember hearing "Monument" among the
> > pre-show tunes (including, of course, "Rooster" :)).
Hehe. I was flipping out at the Poughkeepsie show last December because
I heard Mr. Bungle's Disco Volante playing. I have yet to meet a human
being in person other than me and my friends who listen to that album. I
think it's great, but most people think it's annoying and pointless.
========================================================================
"Are you gonna bark all day, little -----
doggie, or are you gonna ---- ------------- ----
bite?"-Micheal Madsen, ---- - ----
Reservoir Dogs -- - - - - - - - --
"Years of pain I will take and hone - - - - - - -
Manifest with your broken bones - - -- - -- - -
My heart bleeds for none but my -- - - - - - - - --
own"-Machine Head ---- - - - ----
"None But My Own" ---- ------------- ----
Brian -----
DreamNDay@dreamt.org
========================================================================
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 15:41:30 -0700
From: Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Wherry-ly we go!
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19970818154113.006e7be8@cats.ucsc.edu>
Okay, Brian? Speak up now ...
>What if 1 and 3 are quarter rests and 2 and 4 are triple forte quarter
>notes? I think this notion of beat strength needs to be elaborated
>upon. Chris?
>
>> If you add in syncopation, you can accent anywhere.
>
>I have no idea what that that means. Please elaborate on this
>syncopation addition yielding accentability phenomenon.
In a nutshell, syncopation means "putting the strong beats wherever the
hell you want" -- you see, before the days of Rock Music (tm) when notation
was standardized, you could tell where the strong beats were by applying
those handly little paragraphs I typed in my last msg. Now, since Rock
music, not normally based directly off classical, tends to syncopate their
rhythms quite a bit.
>> In three-four, the strongest beat is one, with two and three being about
>> equal.
>
>So exactly what is the beat strength ratio of 2-to-3 in 3/4?
As I said, about even (in other words, I dunno)
>> In six-eight, beat one is strongest, and beat two is weaker (remember, only
>> two beats in six-eight)
>
>Only two beats in 6/8? But 6/8 has the same number of eighth notes as
>3/4, but has only two beats, whereas 3/4 has three? I think this notion
>of beat evaporation needs to be elaborated upon.... :)
Okay, three-four, dissexted into eigth notes, looks like this:
STRONG weak STRONG weak STRONG weak
with the second and third STRONG not being quite as STRONG as the first
STRONG ;)
so, maybe more like
STRONG weak Strong weak Strong weak
And six-eight looks like:
STRONG weak weak Strong weak weak
with, like the second example, the Strong not being as strong as STRONG
>Yup, you got 'em! Awaiting answers....
Hope I provided some satisfaction, though you're probably not "really
satisfied" -- after all, I'm no Snickers bar. Urg, and I hope not "pure
chewing satisfaction" either ...
__ /\ __
__\/__\/__ ~Chris
\_||_/ http://www2.ucsc.edu/people/aspect/
/__||__\
// \ | \\ "Let nothing bleed into nothing, and did nothing at all"
\| Jim Matheos, Fates Warning, "A Pleasant Shade of Gray"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 15:42:57 -0700
From: Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Oh yeah
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19970818154250.006ee650@cats.ucsc.edu>
In my last message, only the strong eighth notes (i.e. the STRONG and the
Strong) count as a beat.
__ /\ __
__\/__\/__ ~Chris
\_||_/ http://www2.ucsc.edu/people/aspect/
/__||__\
// \ | \\ "Let nothing bleed into nothing, and did nothing at all"
\| Jim Matheos, Fates Warning, "A Pleasant Shade of Gray"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 19:07:09 EDT
From: dseeger@juno.com (Deborah J. Seeger)
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Fates at House of Blues
Message-ID: <19970817.222332.5047.0.DSeeger@juno.com>
Yes, yet another FW review.....
Last night was Fates' show at the House of Blues in Chicago and it had
its ups and downs, but the downs had nothing to do with the band, of
course. First of all, it took what appeared to be an eternity to drive
down from Milwaukee. The traffic absolutely sucked. But the drive down
there presented another problem, which I'll touch on later.
So we get there about 7:30. Some crappy band was playing. I thought it
was weird, because the tickets said the show was going to begin at 8:00.
We just sat there and dealt with it. After Crappy Band Number One,
Crappy Band Number two comes on. They were called Captain Crush. Don't
ever trust a singer that wears a toilet around his neck, that's all I
gotta say. You'd think in the entire Chicagoland area there would be ONE
prog band that needs a gig, how the hell did they get these shitty bands
to open for Fates?! I don't get it.
During the intermission after Captain Crush, I was having abdominal
pains. It happens when I haven't eaten for many hours and I think it's
linked to an operation I had last year. So I go up to the bar to see if
they had anything remotely edible. While I'm waiting for a bartender to
get his ass over I started feeling even worse and almost fainted. They
didn't really have anything, so I go to my friends and tell them I HAD to
eat right away or I wasn't gonna make it through the show. Rob Campbell
gets the good sport of the year award, since he was nice enough to come
with me to a restaurant and get me some chow. We thought we had time,
because I thought there was going to be another opening band. I was
wrong. When we got back to House Of Blues we heard APSOG, lo and behold.
They were about halfway through. I was extremely pissed and wanted to
smack myself for not taking care of business sooner.
Even though I missed probably about a third of the show, I got my $10
worth, and then some. Of course, it was awesome. However, I do agree
that the keyboard solos replacing the second guitar solos didn't sounds
quite right. I think Part 8 was played a bit slow, but maybe it was just
me. Joey Vera sounded great, and seemed to be having the time of his
life playing with Fates. Hell, I'd feel the same way if I were him! He
also did a great job with the backing vocals. Jim, Mark, and Ray were
playing in tip top form, too. Damn, I was surprised to hear about Jim's
father. You wouldn't have thought the man had just lost his father two
days prior if you were at the show. He even cracked a smile when the
dork in the Queensryche shirt jumped onto the stage and thought he was
going to lead us in chant, or something. My main complaint is that they
didn't play as long as I'd have liked them too, and they didn't play any
older material. So the moral of this story is if they come to a town
near you and you have $10 burning a hole in your pocket - GO!!!
Chris Ptacek and Maddy - where the hell were you?! I tried looking for
you, but could see you nowhere. Other than the Jammers I went with, we
only saw Scott Hansen the show.
Did anyone in attendance get to meet them after the show? I don't think
we got there early enough to attempt to catch them before the show, and
we didn't really see anything that resembled a tour bus.
This is getting long. I''ll shut up now.
Debbie Seeger
DSeeger@juno.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 19:13:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: Phdavis@aol.com
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Geoff Tate
Message-ID: <970818191218_-2004604514@emout07.mail.aol.com>
"woot" wrote
'
<< well I caught the QR concert on audionet.com last night, and while the
sound sucked (real audio) it was good enough to hear that Geoff Tate's
voice is really hurting. I heard he was sick, so maybe that's it, but I
doubt it. He had trouble hitting tons of notes that weren't even the
slightest bit "high." most of the high notes he didn't even attempt. All
these ppl that have been posting about how he was still right on and
everything have been fooling themselves. Word of advice: If you sing, don't
smoke. >>
I'm not sure how bad the audio was online.....but I was at the show. Geoff
was VERY ON. Did you even hear "Take Hold of the Flame"? He hit the notes.
Geoff has been sick but he sure didn't show it Saturday night. I saw the
band three times this weekend and believe me I would have noticed any
problems with Geoff's voice.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 17:24:23 -0600
From: "KorgX3" <korgx3@cyberhighway.net>
To: <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Dream Theater: A Commercial Success?
Message-ID: <199708182325.QAA25574@odin.ax.com>
>This is a question ive had in the back of my mind for a while... about
>how much actually goes to DT, for each album sold? A percent would be ok
>:) .. then we'd have to divide into 5.. hehe ...
I remember seeing a special on Dateline NBC or something a few months back
going through the motions of the record industry. It was some pretty sad
and pretty sick shit. Anyway, they covered the topic of money in
comparison quite briefly, but they said that each band member receives
$1.00 per every album sold. I don't know, it sounds kinda BS to me, but
that's 6.25% on average. (Using $16 as an average price for a CD.) Anyway,
they said that a band has to sell 10,000 (or was it 20,000) albums just to
break even. The thing I don't understand is you'd think the people who
actually wrote the songs would get a bit more. Then I'm sure the artists
accumulate a little more by touring, selling merchandise, etc. I'm sure
they get a little chunk here and there and it adds up in the long run. The
real lame thing about it was how they were showing how the record execs
actually have to go around bribing radio stations to play the songs. That
really sucks leg. Some of those radio DJs seem to expect pretty hefty
bribes to play songs. Why the HELL should it be this way? I thought that
was against the law, but they said that's only "payola" if money changes
hands. Since it's perfectly alright for pizza deliveries, band
memorabilia, etc. to change hands, that's what the DJs expect in order to
even "think" about playing the songs. Grrr.... I'm a grizzly...
Grrr....
Grrrrr...
KorgX3
KorgX3@cyberhighway.net
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 18:49:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: Matthew Travis <musicman@cu-online.com>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2878, FW and sucky opening bands
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.93.970818184812.23879A-100000@babba.cu-online.com>
BlevinsM@amsc.Belvoir.Army.Mil wrote:
:You know, this really bothers me - there were about 325 - 350 at the
:Springfield, VA Fates show, and everybody else is returning attendance
:numbers of 100 or less - and I thought this area sucked...
I went to the show in Champaign, IL and at the House of Blues. In
Champaign, we only had about 100 people there, but that was in a
bar with a max. capacity of 303 anyhow, so I don't think they were
expecting a LOT of people anyway. It was, I might add, very cool
to be up close in a small area as it made everything a lot more
personal. At HOB, there were at least a few hundred people, I
believe. It's hard to say since there are several levels at the
place and I was standing up in front of the stage and didn't
look around a lot. I think the crowd size was about right for
that size venue.
** on the same topic **
madmax@andrew.cmu.edu wrote:
:The Fates show in Cleveland was quite awesome (thanks to everyone who
:helped me find the place.) Someone opened a huge can of whoop-ass
:in part 2 of APSOG, and the intensity level for the whole thing was
:through the roof. The only problem was the keyboard didn't sound quite
:right in the old songs, but I think it would've been better if it had been
:mixed higher. It's hard enough for keyboards to replace guitars in
In Champaign, we couldn't hear the keys at all and then at HOB
it sounded to me like they were a little loud during the guitar/bass
solos (actually drowned out the guitar a couple times). Other
than that it sounded "fine" at HOB, but I just got the feeling that
he was a little out of place. Too bad Kevin Moore didn't stay on
after recording the album as that would have been totally kick-ass.
:general, but when you can't *hear* the keyboards, it becomes almost
:impossible. This was most apparent in the Eleventh Hour, but the song
:managed to kick my ass anyway because Ray belted it out beautifully.
:Sitting through the opening bands was difficult. Tempo Tantrum was pretty
:good I think, but I'm not familiar with them so I couldn't really get into
:it. Arena was pretty bad, IMO...the singer sounded like he'd been hired
:just for his ability to scream, and they had a serious lack of dynamics
:and not much melody. And their clean guitar sound was mixed so poorly that
:it was really painful to listen to. Way too bright. That probably wasn't
At both shows I was at, the opening bands sucked. My friends in Hate Choir
opened in Champaign (note the misspelling of the name "Champaign"
on the black long-sleeve concert shirts that FW was selling till they
sold out in Cleveland). They know how to play their instruments well,
but the only vocals consisted mainly of screaming "fuck!" as loud
as they could. Matt, the lead singer for Hate Choir, asked me before
FW came on, "Who is Fates Warning? I don't even know who they are."
Apparently, opening bands are just getting drafted into playing by
the clubs so long as they play cheap enough. Hate Choir got $100 and
part of the door cover.
At HOB, the first band was a generic thrash/speed metal band. Nothing
to get excited about. And not very good. The second opening band was
nothing but garage-style-amateurish thrash-metal. There was no
singing and the screaming over-ran the gain on the mic so all
you heard was buzz. It was just awful.
One last note, the radio station I hang out (WEFT 90.1, Champaign-
Urbana's only community radio station woo hoo) has a FW Pleasant
Shade of Gray EP. It has a remixed version of Part I, the original
version of Part I, and an unlreleased version of Part VII. I was
told that this was only sent to radio stations (and such). But
a friend of mine said he also had it. I was wondering if anyone on
the list has it as well (or would like a "copy").
Anyhow, I'll post a review in the next day or so (when I have
time). Summary: Fates kicks balls, opening bands suck them.
-The Phunky One
-- <A HREF="mailto:musicman@cu-online.com"> Matthew Travis </A> <A HREF="http://www.advancenet.net/~musicman/"> Dreaming In Stereo </A>In the night there's wonder, always there for you to see; In the light of morning, visions fade and dreams can flee.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 20:47:18 -0500 From: marshallm@juno.com (Mike Marshall) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: NDTC: Savatage Recommendations Message-ID: <19970818.204719.11166.1.marshallm@juno.com>
>> Recently at a music store I was gonna buy some Fates Warning or Savatage >> when I realized that I have no clue what albums are worth buying by each >> and and which are only for the diehard fans. Can anyone recommend what >> would be good introductory albums by each band? Thanks in advance. > >I can answer the Savatage part: > >EDGE OF THORNS!!!! Damn fine album.
I'll agree, but go one step further...EoT is perhaps their best album. Chris' guitar playing, along with Zach's singing are a great combination. Who knows what it could have become...
I'll also add that Handful of Rain is an awesome album in it's own right. If you're an Alex Skolnick fan, you'd enjoy how he cuts loose on this album. Zach's vocal performances reach new heights on this album.
Dead Winter Dead, despite having Al Pitrelli in the lead guitar slot, never really seemed to have as much impact on me as EoT and HoR did. Streets, Gutter Ballet, and Hall of the Mountain King have their moments, but I must warn you: These albums have the original singer, Jon Oliva (Chris' brother) singing. Jon's is a voice that (and I'm sure Mike Bahr will agree) is an acquired taste. I know a lot of people like him, and some don't; I'll leave it at that.
I think all the albums that I've left out are pre-HotMK. I can't really say whether they're good or bad. Being earlier albums with Jon singing, though, I'm not optimistic. Personally, I'd start with EoT, HoR, then try GB or Streets.
Just my $0.02 worth.
Michael
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 19:30:47 -0700 (MST) From: eckie@asu.edu To: ytsejam@ax.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Dream Theater: A Commercial Success? Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.970818192302.23697A-100000@general2.asu.edu>
Yeah, that IS sick, isn't it? I'm also sick of turning on MTV, and hearing rap songs of...wait, they're not even written by the rappers themselves....
But a Prince song? A song by the Police? Is that Pachabell's Canon I hear behind Coolio's atonal blather with no rythm? If you're going to get rich off of music, at least be the tiniest bit original....
God damned wannabe rap artists....(if yer gonna attack that argument, BRING IT ON! To eckie@asu.edu please. :))
Anyhoo, the GOOD experiences I've had this weekend were seeing BIll and Ted's Excellent Adventure on the Superstation, tuning into Beavis and Butthead talking about "If Iron Maiden went unplugged, they'd have to keep the explosion machine plugged," and tuning in just as the "Headbanger's Ball" logo bounced onto the screen (It was a clip from 1988, and they showed Great White right afterwards, but I still shitted in my shorts!)
Bribing DJ's? Ugh.
~Eckie's just glad the artists in the comic company are finally getting thier just rewards (at least at Image anyways)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 22:57:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Ed Smith <ecs88@voicenet.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Falling into Infinity (Japan cd) Message-ID: <199708190257.WAA02068@mail5.voicenet.com>
Does anyone know if the Japan version of Falling into Infinity with bonus disc is out, and if so where is it available? Please respond by e-mail. ecs88@voicenet.com.
MARILLION must be saved don't let their past or future go to waste!
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 14:53:39 -0400 From: ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack) To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: reply to my own incoherency - and commercialism... Message-ID: <19970819020716.AAB12531@sni.pananet.com>
> Personally - I remember when Iron Maiden was HUGE, and got no MTV or > radio support. That was before the brainwashing of the U.S. music > listener was complete. Now, I'm pretty sure that this kind of thing > would be impossible. Then again, it was supposed to be impossible when > Maiden did it... >
Hmm, well, correct me if I'm wrong, but both Pantera and Tool have achieved a lot of success w/o much MTV support. Well I gets Tool gets promoted a lot when they do Lollapalooza, but I think their success has been mostly word-of-mouth.
Of course, they haven't achieved the kind of success that IM got back then, but I think they're pretty happy with what they're getting:)
Ernie
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 23:02:43 -0400 From: "Carlos A. Alfaro" <calfaro@caribe.net> To: Ytsejam Mailing List <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Dt's ages Message-ID: <33F90CD2.92813CFC@caribe.net>
I was browsing thru itchy's page and i checked out the B-days and i noticed that JP turned 30 last month... and derek turns 31 or 30 this august...... cool (imitating dana carvey doing johny carson) "'i didnt know that""
--
"At the edge of chaos, unexpected outcomes occur. The risk to survival is severe." Ian Malcolm http://premium.caribe.net/~calfaro mailto:calfaro@caribe.net mailto:ytsekurt@geocities.com mailto:progboy@mindless.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 04 Aug 1997 07:34:56 -0300 From: Marcelo Vanzin <vanzin@geocities.com> To: Freaks R Us <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: YEAH! Got my order! =) Message-ID: <33E5B050.8A29F4B3@geocities.com>
Hey there jammanoids!
After a month and a half waiting, the post office finally decided to send me my CD Universe order. =) Now a brief review of what I just received:
Shadow Gallery: Carved in Stone - WHOA! I loved this album! Very piano-oriented sound, yet heavy sometimes, great work from these guys. If you haven't heard them yet, it's surely worth a try!
Fates Warning: The Spectre Within - My first dive in the older FW stuff, and I'm pretty impressed! My worst fear was about the vocals, but John Arch handles them nicely. Kick ass album! Reminded me of No Exit at first sight, but it has its own direction, and is a great work.
G3: G3 Live in Concert - I don't need to talk much about this one, it's amazing. Seeing Satch, Vai and Johnson playing together Frak Zappa, Hendrix, wow, incredible...
I also got the G3 video and R˙che's "Video: Mindcrime", but haven't had time to watch them yet.
-- []'s /**********************************************\ |* Marcelo Vanzin *| |* vanzin@geocities.com *| |* http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/6308/ *| \**********************************************/
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 2879 **************************
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