YTSEJAM Digest 3349
Today's Topics:
1) cohesiveness
by RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU
2) Learning to Live
by Bruce Dickinson <0_mnedell@FAIR1.FAIRFIELD.EDU>
3)
by "Neal Brown" <nealus@hotmail.com>
4) Top 5 of the year - ends December 31st!
by "Syrinx" <syrinx@mindspring.com>
5) UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: Loreena McKennitt
by Graham.Boyle.149036@navy.gov.au
6) UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: you're a weener
by Graham.Boyle.149036@navy.gov.au
7) WOW!!! OH MY !@#$%^& GOD!!!
by Seth Hatlelid <srhatlel@artsci.wustl.edu>
8) Re: Prog cliches etc./ Lits
by ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack)
9) Buses.
by "Jeremy C. Hallum" <jhallum@bu-ast.bu.edu>
10) ProgWeek Boston
by "Ryan P. Skadberg" <skadberg@wicked.stigmata.org>
11) re: Roxy show 12/13
by AEllis1222 <AEllis1222@aol.com>
12) agony in the UK (ndtc)
by Scotch <anthem@virginia.edu>
13) Fix trading...
by Adam <alpineone@mindspring.com>
14) The YTSE Whiners
by AL <al@isd.net>
15) Rick Allen
by "D. Frantz" <dfrantz@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
16) Re: missing arms
by jOHN jENS <jjens@darkhorse.triad.net>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 22:16:29 -0500 (EST)
From: RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: cohesiveness
Message-ID: <01IR0W74NOKW001J3E@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU>
>work to make songs that long to keep a flow. When I heard APSoG the first
>few times, it seemed very "broken-up". The more I listen to it, though, the
>more it gels for me.
I have the album and I'm not taking sides on this one. But I would like to
point out that one could listen to dogs barfing in various pitches and rythems,
and if recorded and heard enough times, it would begin to gel nicely. Pattern
finding is human nature, whether or not there's an actual pattern. I have no
problem with songs that need several listens to get into, but there needs to
be a line between songs that take several listens to get into because they're
complex, and songs that need several listens to get into because they're...
fragmented.
I make no statement about the album in question(who's acronym I HATE typing,
it's a real bitch), just the pleasant little observation that the need for
several listens to enjoy something does not prove anything.
josh
rasi2290@splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 22:24:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: Bruce Dickinson <0_mnedell@FAIR1.FAIRFIELD.EDU>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Learning to Live
Message-ID: <Pine.PMDF.3.91.971210222258.53385A-100000@FAIR1.FAIRFIELD.EDU>
Anyone know if DT has played LTL on this tour. I have been to four of
the shows and have not had the plaesure of hearing it. Thanks for your help.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matthew G. Nedell
0_mnedell@fair1.fairfield.edu
1-203-256-6222
"If it's not in 2.35, I'm not watching it."
Words to live by as proclaimed by James LaBrie-
"I won't give up till I've no more to give, NO MORE TO GIVE!"
"I said, 'I love you........................good-bye'"
"So speak................I'm right here!"
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 19:32:11 PST
From: "Neal Brown" <nealus@hotmail.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Message-ID: <19971211033231.27223.qmail@hotmail.com>
Here's a big "FUCK THE MAN!!" to everyone immersed in finals week. May
the force be with you, other platitudes, etc. etc.
>Do DT fans and followers of other 'PROG' (Yuk) bands agree with me
>that the initial appeal of albums like I&W was the escapism value.
>The fact that they talked of ivory towers and beautiful women in
>bedrooms with shutters on the windows etc (well you get my drift..)
>was a great selling point for me.
>Don't get me wrong I really like FII (like not love yet) but I feel
>the angry socially-aware lyric of JLMB is something I expect from
>other bands. This isn;t to say I think the band should stagnate and
>become a parody of their former selves but progression doen't have to
>equal reality and it's perception.!!!!!!!
Actually, I agree with this to an extent. (LTL is *very* based in
reality.) Somebody griped about Big Wreck already being more marketable
than DT. Then someone pointed out that DT sings lyrics you generally
have to interpret ("Someone told me/Light fuse and get away/no gain no
pain/and when it's lust to dust you can crawl from the wreckage").
That's what's so cool about bands like DT...there's an air of mystery.
Doesn't just apply to the lyrics either--the psychotic instrumental
passages are the same way. ("13/8?!? What?") I think DT's at their best
when they're doing abstract lyrics (Metropolis, TOWHTSTS, PMU) and
abstract music (ACOS, LTL, Erotomania/Voices).
>than doing weird things to equally weird 303s and 606/707/808/909s,
>but...
What the hell are those anyway?
>Enya is pseudo-new age, sugary, sticky, gooey, sweet, sickly, tacky,
>bland pap.
One of my roommates has that one Enya album...Memory of Trees or
something. The second track has the most unbelievably trite melody I've
ever heard that didn't originate in a children's song.
(Da-da-Da-da-Da-da da Da-da-Da-da-Da-da Da...you can almost hear it when
you read it.) It's the kind of melody they use to teach you about
phrases and cadences in Music Theory classes. Is it a variation on
Camptown Races, by any chance? </vent>
>in these last few jams, this has got to be the most times that Ron
>McGovney's name has been mentioned. anywhere. ever.
Ever wonder if Chuckie D's ever been mentioned on the mailing list for
that band?
Wow. Gotta sleep more.
>-anyone know exactly why dt has never opened for a larger band?
Did DS go to Berklee? I don't remember hearing if he did or not.
I fall asleep listening to just about anything good, from Le Sacre du
Printemps to Images And Words. If I've been up for 48 hours I'll fall
asleep in a tornado. Can't fall asleep to anything that sucks though.
It's like nails on the chalkboard...Enya keeps me awake.
Okay....minimalism, as I understand it, was started by Phillip Glass.
Take something and make it repetitive and simplistic as hell, and keep
doing it. Take King Crimson's "Discipline" (the song, not the album) and
make it about four times as long without adding anything new to the
composition. That's minimalism. From the little I've heard of FW, I
think they're just playing sparsely, not minimalistically.
>I like Zonder b/c he plays economically... he leaves out some stuff
>that I usually would be tempted to expect to replace it w/ something
>more interesting... That is not to say that I didn't like MP or Neil
>Peart, but guys like Zonder and Bill Bruford are maybe harder to
>fathom to me, more suprising from one moment to the next, and simply
>fascinating for this reason...
Again, from the teensy-weensy bit of Fates I've heard, Zonder and
Bruford are not even on the same plane. Sure, MZ's good, but Bruford?
Heh heh. The man completely changed drumming. Listen to Crimson's
Starless....the man makes a temple block sound apocalyptic. It's
incredible.
BTW, I'm skipping anything that even mentions FW for the next couple of
days. Talk about a thread that got beat into the ground...
>I wasn't really paying attention to it, and I heard a band playing >and
I thought "That's a little hard for Garth Brooks" then I went >over to
the TV and it was really that M band playing.
I read this and laughed really hard....and then I thought about it some
more, and cried.
>Is it just me or do you think that You Not Me is the worst DT song
>ever, musically, it is not bad, but lyrically, it is so mindless and
>just sounds like a stupid top 40 song.
Heh heh. I think that this has been posted before, but it appears to be
yet another jab at the music industry, just like MP's lyrics on FII are.
"There's not enough tiiiiime to live/with all the things you're
expecting me to give"..."that's alright, I'm okay/happens every sing;e
day/I'm not blind/something something"....I don't remember lyrics off
the top of my head very well, sorry. But it seems like JP took the stuff
Desmond wrote and messed with it. DC thought he was writing yet another
Aeroshit song, and JP turns it into Burning My Soul. Clever. P.S. I'm
starting to like YNM musically now, for some reason. That wah
pedal-on-steroids stuff doesn't bother me as much as it did when I first
heard it.
Anyway, time to go drink some coffee. Tis the season, ya know. (Bah
humbug.)
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 22:36:29 -0500
From: "Syrinx" <syrinx@mindspring.com>
To: "A Ytse Besides Itself" <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Top 5 of the year - ends December 31st!
Message-ID: <01bd05e5$f7d19880$3cdfcdcf@w-ostrich-1>
That's right! BE SURE to email me your top 5 CD's of 1997 (remember - they
HAVE TO HAVE BEEN RELEASED IN 1997) to include it in the poll!
the poll (the ytsejam's second annual!) is finished on December 31st.
The turnout this year has been AMAZING! Thanks to everyone who has
entered, and those who hasn't - SEND THEM IN ALREADY. :)
- mike.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
e-mail: syrinx@dreamt.org / syrinx@mindspring.com
erotomania! = http://www.mindspring.com/~syrinx
offical lemur voice hompages:
http://www.cobweb.nl/mcoenen/welcome.htm
http://www.mindspring.com/~syrinx/lemur.htm
maintainer of the genesis frequently asked questions list:
http://www.mindspring.com/~syrinx/genesis/genesis-faq.htm
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 12:53:14 +1000
From: Graham.Boyle.149036@navy.gov.au
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: Loreena McKennitt
Message-ID: <4A25656A.000F6D82.00@nschq-e-navy.navy.gov.au>
>good to see that Loreena is now getting the recognition that she deserves.
>But please do me a favour and refrain from comparing her to Enya: Enya
>is pseudo-new age, sugary, sticky, gooey, sweet, sickly, tacky, bland pap.
Yeah well some of us like to think otherwise, Enya's music is far from
'bland pap' as you so elegantly put it. Just cos you don't appreciate
Enya's stuff dosen't mean you have to put shit on her music.
If you don't like it that's your tough shit, don't listen to it :)
graham
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 14:05:02 +1000
From: Graham.Boyle.149036@navy.gov.au
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: you're a weener
Message-ID: <4A25656A.0015DE0A.00@nschq-e-navy.navy.gov.au>
>You are a big pussy. Your inability to tolerate hyperbole and
>figurative language is indicative of your obviously insufficient
>intellect and genitalia. No one here is going to kill Bjork.....but
>they should.
ROTFL :)
Yep I do agree, some on this list take what is said far too
seriously and should as QR said 'Get A Life'
Another problem is different personalities from different countries
have trouble with some of the humour on this list too.
After all this is an internet mailing list, NOT the world
according to thou :)
graham
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 22:02:30 -0600
From: Seth Hatlelid <srhatlel@artsci.wustl.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: WOW!!! OH MY !@#$%^& GOD!!!
Message-ID: <l03130300b0b514d6ddd4@[128.252.105.105]>
To all of you who suggested that I try out Loreena McKennitt's new
album THANK YOU!!!!!! I just boght the "Book of Secrets" today.
WWOOWOWWOWOWOWWOW! I know that someone didn't want me to compare it to
Enya but you just can't help it. This osunds like a cross between Enya's
"Shephard Moons", The Braveheart Soundtrack, and some Middle eastern music
but with better lyrics/vocals. The uneddited version of the Mummer's Dance
is SOOOOOOO much better than the radio edit. I have a feeling that I'm
going to go broke buying all of her backlog of C.D.'s. I'm not even
through with track 4 yet (it's playing now) and I just can't get over how
cool this is.
I also heard Big Wreck's the Oaf for the first time today. It was
my first expereince with them. OK, not too bad. Couldn't hear the bass
but the slide guitar and vocals were cool, but it wasn't anything that I
havn't heard before. Not bad though.
I say someone speaking of Days of the New earlier. I dig the song, except
that it sounds like a TOTAL Alice in Chains rip-off.
Thanks,
Seth
Seth Hatlelid
srhatlel@artsci.wustl.edu
Check out my web page at http://artsci.wustl.edu/~srhatlel/index.html
"After the confession of sins and before the Act of Contrition, the
priest is supposed to ask, Do you sincerely resolve not to commit this sins
again? But Father McSwain's hurry-up version was more like "Commit these
sins again?-to which I could have sincerely answered yes." -Michael Ryan,
Secret Life
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:16:08 -0500
From: ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack)
To: <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Prog cliches etc./ Lits
Message-ID: <19971210181145.AAA6403@sni.pananet.com>
> a bit late possibly, but none the less valid: people intensely wanting to
> get into some music that they clearly don't like ("Oh shit, what's wrong
> with me, I don't like A Pleasant Shade Of Grey, somebody please help me
> to understand this album").
If you were referring to me, i was trying to appreciate what other ppl were
seeing in it, not to like it...of course if end up liking it becuase of it,
well i cant complain. As i said before, it can only help me grow as a
musician (and listener)
Moving on...
I pretty much unserstand what LITS is about, but there are various phrases
that i've heard a lot, but have never known what they mean...
First of all, the very phrases 'lines in the sand'...does that imply one is
carrying a weight on his shoulders, like JC carrying the cross?
Then theres 'enlist the den of thieves' and 'sewn upon our sleeves'...i
truly have no idea what that means...
And while I'm on the subject of lyrics..there's that song on Enchant's BotW
thats about a friend that died..dont remember the name. But there's this
line in it: "Like a clock left in the rain". I just dont get that analogy
(if there is one).
toodle-do
Ern
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:17:43 -0500 (EST)
From: "Jeremy C. Hallum" <jhallum@bu-ast.bu.edu>
To: "Yzerjam: the Mailing list for DT/Red Wing Fans Worldwide" <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Buses.
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.971210231205.25809A-100000@bu-ast.bu.edu>
On Wed, 10 Dec 1997 ytsejam Digest 3347 people wrote:
> From: RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU
> Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3336
>
>
>
> Well, I just happened to ask a friend how cliff burton died, and it seems
> it has something to do with falling out of a bus. My friend then mentioned
> that the Def Leppard drummer *also* fell out of a bus and had to have his
> arm amputated, but he's still the drummer. So:
> What does it say that Def Leppard's drummer uses one hand less then he used
> to, and it's not enough of a difference that they need to fire him?
Well, Cliffy died in a bus accident (not alcohol related) in
Germany.
Rick Allen got his arm mushed in a New Year's Eve Car accident in
1987(alas, alcohol related). To compensate, he plays with both feet and a
synthesized setup, I used to somewhat how it worked, but alas, that
knowledge has been overwritten in my brain. He has played with that
setup since Hysteria, to my knowledge, and quite adequately
-jeremy(who suddenly feels a great urge to go
home and listen to his old Def Leppard albums)
+=====================================================================+
Every man, you see, is born beneath the sword Damocles,
For young and old are all alive on that next beat on which we ride,
And that beat is such a fragile thing, in both old men and youthful king,
And that beat stands all alone, you see, between us and black eternity,
And until that time, when death won't wait, let each man rage against,
his fate.-- Savatage _The Wake of Magellan_
+=====================================================================+
Jeremy Hallum Grad Student, Astronomy, Boston University
jhallum@bu.edu:::jhallum@dreamt.org
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:28:59 -0500
From: "Ryan P. Skadberg" <skadberg@wicked.stigmata.org>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: ProgWeek Boston
Message-ID: <199712110428.XAA29260@wicked.stigmata.org>
WooHoo!!
It's finally here. ProgWeek. Thursday night (aka tommorrow) is the
Fates Warning show and Saturday is that Nightmare Cinema band!! So,
for all you locals not in constant contact with me, here is the deal.
If you see a long-haired, Jesus-looking hippie freak with a green
sweatshirt that says ytsejam across the front and has a HUGE majesty
symbol on the back, come and say hello to me. I swear I will not bite
(won't go there again, been there before, go read back issues). I'm
really a damned nice guy, I swear!! (ask anyone except Dr Mosh) And
for an added bonus, the DT show is in my town on a Saturday night, so
I will be in a DAMNED good mood and probably a bit on the alcoholed up
side by the time the show starts, so I will be EVEN nicer :)
See ya soon!
Skadz
PS - Big Brother is watching again :)
--- Ryan Skadberg | "feed my head, with some real thoughts, Ytsejam Moderator | and let me think instead of being taught, skadz@dreamt.org | i'll say things you won't believe, http://www.dreamt.org/ | just stand back, just let me breathe..." | "Just Let Me Breathe" -Dream Theater------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:44:28 EST From: AEllis1222 <AEllis1222@aol.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com, totikus@HOTMAIL.COM Subject: re: Roxy show 12/13 Message-ID: <c7ae7f8.348f6fae@aol.com>
As for the age limit thing, I've found Boston to be strict. They've ALWAYS checked my ID. And, there's been a lot of crap on the news about underage drinking at clubs, so it might be tough to get in. Did you know that DT is booked at The Strand in Providence on 1/3/98? Strand shows are usually all ages, and it's a cool club. If you have any questions, e-mail me!
Art
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:53:32 -0400 From: Scotch <anthem@virginia.edu> To: Delirium Tremens <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: agony in the UK (ndtc) Message-ID: <l03110703b0b512aa88c9@bootp-231-167.bootp.virginia.edu>
> Well it's really simple mate, a 'yankee' or 'yank'is am American. > We also have another term that we use when we are referring to > Americans (mostly USN sailors), we call them 'Gary Goobers' > don't ask me where this one came from, it's been round a while. > What I do know that this term is not exactly 'complementary'.
Hmm, looks like some blokes still a little sore from having those Yankee Goobers administer some serious limey-ass-whupping 200-some years ago...
=)
"Well, would you like to know what you'd be without us, the good old U.S. of A. to protect you? I'll tell you. THE SMALLEST FUCKING PROVINCE IN THE RUSSIAN EMPIRE, THAT'S WHAT!"
-- Otto, _A Fish Called Wanda_
Yank this,
Scotch.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 00:11:13 -0500 From: Adam <alpineone@mindspring.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Fix trading... Message-ID: <3.0.32.19971211001111.006870e0@pop.mindspring.com>
Hey folks...
If anyone has any of the Fix for '96 tapes, the Spring Euro mini-tour, or any recordings from the FII tour, please get in touch with me for a trade. I really need to get some new material since I'm installing a deck/changer in my car instead of the CD only. Check out my list at: http://www.mindspring.com/~alpineone
Thanks...
DT in Atlanta = 5 days!!!
Adam
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:25:34 -0600 From: AL <al@isd.net> To: YTSE Jammers <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: The YTSE Whiners Message-ID: <348F794D.5F00C091@isd.net>
Hello ytsejamer=92s, This is only my second posting here, but I have to admit that I have read every digest posted in the last month and I can=92t take it anymore without commenting.
FIRST=85 Who is the poor soul in Florida that had a hard time finding a friend to go with him to a DT concert? Is there something wrong with the water there? The day tickets went on sale here in Minnesota for the Minneapolis show on Nov. 2nd I recruited 12 people in less than one hour! Then, I discovered that DT was doing a show on the 18th in Madison WI. Within one day I was able to get two other friends to take off work and drive 250 miles to make that show. We had a blast at both shows, but the Madison show was much better, the sound system at the MPLS. Show was less then stellar, plus, we arrived early enough in Madison to meet all the members of DT and Big Wreck behind the theater. To say the least, it was a day to remember.
SECOND=85 What is all the Derek bashing about? Kevin is gone, live with it. Besides that, Derek kicks ass! I love that Deep Purple gurgling Hammond sound. Flame me all you want, Kevin was great but I don=92t view Derek as a lesser musician, just different, and change is good. To me, Derek adds a new element to DT that I really like.
THIRD=85 Quit f***ing whining about FW & DT, it=92s getting old. The wonderful thing about music is we have enough people making it to allow us to pick and choose what pleases "us", who gives a damn what other people listen to. Shut up and enjoy what "you" like. As far a the people posting their "favorite" album, here is some food for thought=85=85 I don=92t have a favorite, I like all of it. Ask you= rself this, would you be willing to give up every disk you own to keep only your favorite? I wouldn=92t. Again, shut up and enjoy.
Well anyway, enough rambling on from me. See ya, AL=85
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:37:49 -0600 (CST) From: "D. Frantz" <dfrantz@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Rick Allen Message-ID: <Pine.A41.3.95.971210233319.89814H-100000@red.weeg.uiowa.edu>
>Well, I just happened to ask a friend how cliff burton died, and it seems >it has something to do with falling out of a bus. My friend then >mentioned that the Def Leppard drummer *also* fell out of a bus and had >to have his arm amputated, but he's still the drummer
Actually he was racing someone in his car w/ his girlfriend, lost control, crashed, and was thrown from it, losin the arm.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 23:47:26 -0600 (CST) From: jOHN jENS <jjens@darkhorse.triad.net> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: missing arms Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.971210234017.20803B-100000@darkhorse.triad.net>
On Wed, 10 Dec 1997 RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU wrote: [...snip...]
| Why are so many musicians falling out of buses?
lack of seatbelts
| What does it say that Def Leppard's drummer uses one hand less then he used | to, and it's not enough of a difference that they need to fire him?
sounds to like he was slacking off when he had both arms, but was clever enough to cover it up. kinda brings a whole new meaning to "i can do that with only one arm (tied behind my back)." ever heard that Bloodhound Gang song? :)
*puff* *puff* *give*
alter, john
ps. for all you NIN fans, i met the man, TR, at the LoA show last sat. we chatted for a few mins about the new album. kool.
NP: Lords of Acid -our little secret
-- jOHN jENS + jjens@shell.webzone.net + www2.webzone.net/~jjens
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 3349 **************************
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