YTSEJAM digest 3621

From: ytsejam@ax.com
Date: Fri Mar 06 1998 - 15:53:56 EST

  • Next message: ytsejam@ax.com: "YTSEJAM digest 3624"

                                YTSEJAM Digest 3621

    Today's Topics:

      1) economy picking
     by Jonathan Robertson <s1028419@umsl.edu>
      2) Re: Raise the Knife
     by eckie@asu.edu
      3) Where can I get the black pics?
     by "Vaughn, Brandon" <VAUGHNB@CHIPOLA.CC.FL.US>
      4) Re: Yes vocals...
     by Steve Chew <schew@tis.com>
      5) DT gig, stuff
     by "Ville Rassi" <vilzu@hotmail.com>
      6) Crystal Planet, Jon Anderson, trademark sound
     by Phil Carter <satriani@negia.net>
      7) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3620
     by Andrew Embler <aembler@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
      8) Myung Bass Video!
     by "JEFFREY T CLINE" <JCLINE@toltec.astate.edu>
      9) Working Man ? WTF ?
     by Rick Audet <Ytse@concentric.net>
     10) re: Yes - the vocals are painful.
     by cluesump@sirius.com (Charoenkwan Luesumphan)
     11) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3616
     by Angellaa <Angellaa@aol.com>
     12) Bass on FII
     by "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com>
     13) Re: Yes - the vocals are painful.
     by cluesump@sirius.com (Charoenkwan Luesumphan)
     14) Picks and Strings
     by someone@prognosis.com
     15) Yes - the vocals are NOT painful!
     by "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com>
     16) Re: Alternica on MTV March 21st (fwd)
     by Der Herr Bodinger <bodinger@rocketmail.com>

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 06 Mar 1998 11:16:13 -0600
    From: Jonathan Robertson <s1028419@umsl.edu>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: economy picking
    Message-ID: <35002F5D.6374@umsl.edu>

    I'm still not convinced about that economy picking thing. For example,

    how would play something like this

    --15--12----12----------
    ---------15----15--12---

     
    or the end of innocence faded

    -----------------------------------------------------
    ---------------------5--9------------8--12--8---------
    --------------------------8--11--8--------------------
     --9--6---6--9---6--9--------------9----------12--9---
    -------7------7-------------------------------------10
    -------------------------------------------------------

    or a simple pattern like this
    ---------9-------9-------9-------9
    ---7--10---7--10---7--10---7--10----

    without using alternate picking. I just don't think you could get the
    same
    kind of speed.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 06 Mar 1998 10:52:47 -0700 (MST)
    From: eckie@asu.edu
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
    Subject: Re: Raise the Knife
    Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.980306104705.2779A-100000@general1.asu.edu>

    On Fri, 6 Mar 1998, Matthew Smith inquired:
    > I've asked and asked in different places but never received an answer as
    > to what "Raise the Knife" sounds like. Hopefully some ytse-jammers can
    > help my curiosity. Thanks!

    Well, the copy I have off of Precious Things, it fades in with Petrucci
    pickin' some harmonics as he's slidin' up the neck, so imagine his guitar
    goin',
    plink Plink PLink PLINK, DA DUNT DAAAAA DADUNT DA crunch crunch duh duh DA

    and it's not too long before the drums kick in with
    badiloom BAH, boom chickachick, boom boom chickalachick....

    and then the keyboard go over that riff with

    Ding, dingding doodily ding badoom bah, DING, dingding doodily ding
    badoom bah...

    then Petrucci goes into this really greasy solo and well...I'm sure
    somebody out there's got this puppy in mp3...if not, I have an mp3
    producer and the CD...so mebbe I could make one for ya?

    ~Eckie knows diddly

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 11:59:01 -0600
    From: "Vaughn, Brandon" <VAUGHNB@CHIPOLA.CC.FL.US>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Where can I get the black pics?
    Message-ID: <41303F74D60DD111B56500609778A79C11EDE6@chipola.cc.fl.us>

    All of the recent discussions about pics lately brought a startling
    revelation: there are black Jazz III pics. I've only found the red
    ones (through mail order...Musician's Friend). None of the local stores
    seem to carry them.

    Does anybody know where I can order (through mail) to get the black Jazz
    III pics? Is there much difference between the black and red?

    Feel free to email since this really isn't Dream Theater content.

    Thanks for any help!

    The MadTabber
    bvaughn@snowhill.com

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 13:13:37 -0500 (EST)
    From: Steve Chew <schew@tis.com>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Re: Yes vocals...
    Message-ID: <199803061813.NAA19019@clipper.hq.tis.com>

    >
    >> I bought Yes' Drama about 6 months ago having heard all about their
    >> progressive roots and technical ability. The music is brillient but the
    >> vocals... dear God the vocals are rotten. Chris Squire is a class
    >> bassists; I regularly play along to that album from beginning to end but
    >> the vocals.....
    >
    > Hey, I'm trying to get into Yes also, and I agree that the worst
    >part about it are Jon Anderson's vocals and the vocal harmonies. I don't
    >know exactly what is the point that makes it very hard to get into, but I
    >think that the falsettos are the main reason.
    >
    > But I keep wondering, because I like a lot of music that has
    >falsettos...
    >
    > I really, really prefer those wicked, weird instrumental passages.
    >The weirder, the better. :-))) Yeah!
    >
    > But I think that J. Anderson's vocals can get more and more
    >acceptable with some listens, but I definitely think you won't end up
    >loving his vocals -- only accepting them.
    >

            Oh geez, can I weep now? I absolutely love Jon Anderson's vocals...
    I have to admit though that when I first heard them they kind of turned me
    off. But, after listening to more Yes I came to love his vocals--and they're
    especially powerful live. His voice fits the Yes music amazingly well
    (IMHO) and takes it to new heights.
            Just FYI, Jon Anderson's vocals are *not* falsetto. That's his
    natural voice--it's just very high pitched. Also, Jon did not sing on
    Drama so the vocals on that album are a bit different than on the other
    Yes albums.
            Give it some time. Try their albums like "Fragile" or "Close to
    the Edge" or if you like newer style stuff, "90125" or "Keys to Ascension 2".
    Jon Anderson's vocals aren't for everyone, but I think that if you give
    them some more time, you'll come to enjoy them.

                                    Steve

    P.S. I do also enjoy the covers of the Yes tunes on "Tales from Yesterday",
            especially the Robert Berry cover of "Roundabout".

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 06 Mar 1998 10:36:19 PST
    From: "Ville Rassi" <vilzu@hotmail.com>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: DT gig, stuff
    Message-ID: <19980306183619.28685.qmail@hotmail.com>

    Although James said at the end of their gig that they´ll be playing in
    Finland again in next year, I chatted with Portnoy after the show and he
    said that they´ll play here again this summer. :-)
      This has probably been posted before but it can´t hurt to say it
    again:John M. said after the gig that Metropolis pt.2 will be on their
    next album, not as an EP.

    -Vilzu-

    "Johnny go go, I am, Johnny go go, I am , Johnny go go, I am fishface"
    Mike Portnoy at his clinic in Helsinki.

    ______________________________________________________
    Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 13:38:58 -0500 (EST)
    From: Phil Carter <satriani@negia.net>
    To: Under a Glass Ytse <ytsejam@ax.com>
    Subject: Crystal Planet, Jon Anderson, trademark sound
    Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.95.980306131550.29616G-100000@peach.negia.net>

    Greetings ye 'jamanoids...

    Nick G told us:
    > I bought the new Satriani last night. Honestly, even though I *love* the
    > man, and think he's one of the most talented musicians ever, this album is
    > terribly disappointing. The only songs that grabbed me were 'Raspberry Jam
    > Delta-V' and 'Ceremony' - other than that, nothing really stood out at me as
    > being the Satch that I know and love. Maybe it's his sound that's turning me
    > off of him (his sound, IMO, is really bad)

    I find this interesting because this is the main complaint I had with the
    "Joe Satriani" album. "Crystal Planet" is so much better in that respect,
    because Joe's trademark tone just blasts at you in every song. Listen to
    the emotion and feel of "Love Thing" or the pure wailing shred of
    "Ceremony" or the heavy groove of "Up in the Sky" -- it's all purely,
    uniquely Satch.

    >, or maybe it's the fact that the
    > songs just kinda wander aimlessly without making a point...

    Are you *sure* you didn't pick up the self-titled disc by mistake? :) :)

    Rogerio remarked:
    > But I think that J. Anderson's vocals can get more and more
    > acceptable with some listens, but I definitely think you won't end up
    > loving his vocals -- only accepting them.

    *Bzzt*. Thank you for playing. I do happen to love Anderson's vocals -- he
    puts a lot of feel and passion into them, IMHO.

    Rogerio also commended me on my choice of music :)
    > > Currently playing: Steve Morse Band -- "Coast to Coast"
    >
    > I listened to this album only once and was completely blown away
    > by the music! Really incredible stuff, with that "Petrucci Sound" (of
    > course, I know that Petrucci has borrowed a lot of elements from Steve
    > Morse, but hey, everyone makes comparison to already known elements and
    > that was the first time I heard Steve Morse:-) ).

    That's also kind of funny, because I think that Morse is one of the few
    players out there with a fingerprint sound that is absolutely and
    completely his own. I also include Satch, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Eric
    Johnson, Steve Vai, Eddie Van Halen, Joe Perry and Tony MacAlpine in this
    group -- but I don't think that Petrucci has quite developed his own sound
    yet. He's damn close, though.

    > From: Matthew Smith <ktulu@arches.uga.edu>

    Cool, another Athens ytsejammer. And a Metallica fan...oops, I said the
    M-word. :)

    Ta,
    Phil

    =====================================================================
    Phil Carter -- satriani@negia.net (work), carter@negia.net (personal)
    Senior Tech, NorthEast Georgia Internet Access, 546-5787
    "Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life."
       -- Berthold Auerbach
    Currently playing: Rush -- "Hemispheres"

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 98 10:50:18 -0800
    From: Andrew Embler <aembler@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
    To: "A daily dose of Ytsejam..." <ytsejam@ax.com>
    Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3620
    Message-ID: <199803061848.KAA18054@network-services.uoregon.edu>

    >> I bought Yes' Drama about 6 months ago having heard all about their
    >> progressive roots and technical ability. The music is brillient but the
    >> vocals... dear God the vocals are rotten. Chris Squire is a class
    >> bassists; I regularly play along to that album from beginning to end but
    >> the vocals.....
    >
    > Hey, I'm trying to get into Yes also, and I agree that the worst
    >part about it are Jon Anderson's vocals and the vocal harmonies. I don't
    >know exactly what is the point that makes it very hard to get into, but I
    >think that the falsettos are the main reason.

    Now...just a few clarifications, but they've probably been dealt with.
    Drama does _not_ have Jon Anderson on it...and it's the only Yes album
    that _doesn't_ have Anderson, so buy something else before judging Yes.
    They take awhile to get into. I would recommend buying the album
    "Fragile" or "Close to the Edge" (CTTE for the real prog fans) Chris
    Squire _is_ great. The album "The Yes Album" is also great...but it
    doesn't feature Rick Wakeman, so, be that as it may. If you like live
    material, buy "Yessongs," which is a great 2CD set. Oh...and by the way,
    I'm almost positive that Jon Anderson _doesn't_ use falsetto. His voice
    is naturally that way :) Scary! Actually, I really like his voice, but it
    does take time to get into. Just some thoughts.

    Andrew

    +-------------------------------------------+
    Andrew Embler - aembler@gladstone.uoregon.edu
    http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~aembler/
    +-------------------------------------------+
    Random Frank Zappa Quote:
    "Jazz is not dead...it just smells funny."

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 13:08:55 CST
    From: "JEFFREY T CLINE" <JCLINE@toltec.astate.edu>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Myung Bass Video!
    Message-ID: <22CC52A4BC7@TOLTEC.astate.edu>

        Hey fellow jammers. I am a bass player in a Progressive Metal
    band named Immortal Soul. John Myung is without a doubt one of my
    biggest influences. So obviously when I heard that he had an
    instructional video coming out I was thrilled. I've called several
    mail order companies and no one seems to have it. If anyone owns this
    video please e-mail me personaly at jcline@toltec.astate.edu and let
    me know what this video is like and where you got it from. Thanks,
    .

    Jeff Cline
    jcline@toltec.astate.edu
    www.immortalsoul.com
    _________________
         / |
       / |
     /______|_______
            | /
            | /
    ________|_/______
                                                        
                                                        
                                                        
                                                        
                                                        
                                                        
                                                        
                                                        
                                                        
      

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 14:01:26 -0500 (EST)
    From: Rick Audet <Ytse@concentric.net>
    To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
    Subject: Working Man ? WTF ?
    Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.96.980306135807.24389B-100000@voyager.cris.com>

    Joshua B. Wingell wrote:

    > Hey, any idea why Working Man is listed as $35.99 on CDNOW? Is it a
    > 2 CD set, or just out of print?

    Looks like you found yourself an import verion on Bullet Proof Records,
    whatever that's all about. Interestingly, CDUniverse has the domestic
    version (US) for $12.93 and a UK version on Sequel Records for a whopping
    $36.95. It's a single CD and is still in print (I assume) to answer your
    question.

    Rick Audet

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 11:53:45 -0700
    From: cluesump@sirius.com (Charoenkwan Luesumphan)
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: re: Yes - the vocals are painful.
    Message-ID: <v01540b03b125f60338f4@[205.134.227.235]>

     "Robert O'Doherty" <r.odoherty@mvt.ie> wrote;

    >I bought Yes' Drama about 6 months ago having heard all about their
    >progressive roots and technical ability. The music is brillient but the
    >vocals... dear God the vocals are rotten. Chris Squire is a class
    >bassists; I regularly play along to that album from beginning to end but
    >the vocals....

    Drama is the only album that does not have Jon Anderson. Trever Horn (Art
    Of Noise) does all vocals and Chris Squire does the backing vocals. Horn is
    not that bad but you may get used to Jon Anderson's trademark for Yes.

    >Yesterday, I bought Magna Carta's Tales of Yesterday. This is alot
    >better. All the magic of their music with passable vocals. Robert
    >Berry's "Roundabout" is excellent. I didn't like Shadow Gallerys cover;
    >the vocals were probably accuratley recreated but it hurt me to listen
    >to them - the music was excellent though.

    A lot better than Drama or a lot better than Yes?

    >Is this a common complaint of Yes' music?

    I would not think so.

    Take care,
    AE

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    "Prog Maniac" homepage: http://www.sirius.com/~cluesump

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 14:49:10 EST
    From: Angellaa <Angellaa@aol.com>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3616
    Message-ID: <c2017e9d.35005338@aol.com>

    In a message dated 98-03-05 16:05:39 EST, you write:

    <<
     And anybody who lives their lives according to the names other people
     give 'em immediately goes "BA A A A A A AH" whenever a nearby electric sheer
     is turned on. Kevin Moore's cool. Ask any female Dream Theater
     fan. Derek Sherinian..well, he needs some work, but he could be just as
     cool, if not cooler }:^). I have a lot of respect for anybody who can
     play well on any instrument and convey whatever emotions effectively, and
     you should too! :) I've even heard some damn fine bagpipe work that
     made me a little teary eyed.
    >>
    i totally agree with you
    Angella

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 11:49:58 -0800
    From: "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Bass on FII
    Message-ID: <199803061951.LAA20676@baygate.bayarea.net>

    > Bass - This is a hard one. The worst is definitely WDADU (did he use a pick
    > on this one?), but that is the case with most of the instruments on that
    > album. FII has some good bass sounds, but so does Awake and IAW. I would
    > have to research this one a bit more.

    Even though you're talking more about tone than about the mix, I have
    to jump in here and say that I think that FII is the first full
    length DT album on which the bass is mixed properly. As much as I
    love Images & Words, you really have to strain to hear the bass
    through most of the album. Awake is a little better, but the bass is
    still a bit too far back in the mix for my tastes. WDADU also has
    the bass mixed a bit low. But on FII, the bass is right where it
    should be. It is loud enough in the mix to be easily heard, but not
    so loud as to dominate over the other instruments. The very first
    time I listened to Falling Into Infinity, I said to myself "finally,
    a Dream Theater album where you can really hear John Myung play!"
    Also, I like the tone of John Myung's bass on FII a lot better than
    on previous albums (and I think that it is a tone that has more of a
    tendency to stand out, which would partially explain why the bass is
    easier to hear on FII). Overall, I think that the mix on FII is the
    best of any DT album. My only complaint is that I would like the
    keys to be louder in places.

    (I didn't comment on A Change of Seasons here because I haven't
    listened to it in a while.)

    -Paul

    -----------
    Paul Humm
    humm@levy.com

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 11:56:38 -0700
    From: cluesump@sirius.com (Charoenkwan Luesumphan)
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Re: Yes - the vocals are painful.
    Message-ID: <v01540b04b125f6f170bd@[205.134.227.235]>

    Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br> wrote;

    >> I bought Yes' Drama about 6 months ago having heard all about their
    >> progressive roots and technical ability. The music is brillient but the
    >> vocals... dear God the vocals are rotten. Chris Squire is a class
    >> bassists; I regularly play along to that album from beginning to end but
    >> the vocals.....
    >
    > Hey, I'm trying to get into Yes also, and I agree that the worst
    >part about it are Jon Anderson's vocals and the vocal harmonies. I don't
    >know exactly what is the point that makes it very hard to get into, but I
    >think that the falsettos are the main reason.

    You may have to check again that Drama DOES NOT have Jon Anderson on
    vocals, Roger.

    Take care,
    AE

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    "Prog Maniac" homepage: http://www.sirius.com/~cluesump

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 14:08:01 +0000
    From: someone@prognosis.com
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Picks and Strings
    Message-ID: <199803062005.MAA25181@odin.ax.com>

    > From: ALI ABBAS <a.abbas@lancaster.ac.uk>
    > Subject: picks and strings

            Most shredders use heavy/extra heavy picks, because they give you
    more control (You control the dynamics by the pressure you use,
    instead of by the flexibility of the pick). I use Fender Extra Heavy
    because they're cheap, decent, and readily available just about
    anywhere (and I don't much like little picks).
            You can shred on any strings. I use .009's on my 6 string with the
    tremolo, and .010's on my 7 string (on which I don't use the trem).
    Todd Duane uses heavy strings and shreds at lunatic speeds on a
    Fender Telecaster, just to scare people. It all depends on how much
    you work at it.
            Oh... and I think I found a common lick that forces even economy
    pickers to alternate pick... but I'll discuss that with Cal, later.
    It's not monumental, and we've beaten the dead horse out of that shit
    already. :)

    "Apathy is the "suckbird" on cynicism's bloated carcass."
                                           - Dennis Miller

    Chris Ptacek
    someone@prognosis.com
    http://www.prognosis.com/madsman
    Go Home and Practice!

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 12:06:33 -0800
    From: "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Yes - the vocals are NOT painful!
    Message-ID: <199803062008.MAA27111@baygate.bayarea.net>

    > I bought Yes' Drama about 6 months ago having heard all about their
    > progressive roots and technical ability. The music is brillient but the
    > vocals... dear God the vocals are rotten. Chris Squire is a class
    > bassists; I regularly play along to that album from beginning to end but
    > the vocals.....

    Well, you know what you did, don't you? You went out and bought the
    one and only Yes album that does not feature the amazing vocal
    talents of Jon Anderson. I strongly recommend that you listen to The
    Yes Album, Fragile, Close to the Edge, Relayer, or Going for the One,
    and then re-evaluate your opinion.

    -Paul

    -----------
    Paul Humm
    humm@levy.com

    ------------------------------

    Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 12:44:27 -0800 (PST)
    From: Der Herr Bodinger <bodinger@rocketmail.com>
    To: ytsejam@ax.com
    Subject: Re: Alternica on MTV March 21st (fwd)
    Message-ID: <19980306204428.25788.rocketmail@web2.rocketmail.com>

    ---Rogerio Brito <rbrito@ime.usp.br> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > Hi, there...
    >
    > This is some information about "that" band (below my signature).
    > Some of you may be interested, some of you may not.
    >
    > If you are interested and end up taping this, I'd really love to
    > get a HiFi videotape of this show... If you're interested in getting
    > something from me, let me know and we can surely work out a trade.
    >
    >
    > []s, Roger...
    >
    >
    > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
    > Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 09:56:07 -0500 (EST)
    > ]From: Jeff Holland <jeholla2@vt.edu>
    > Subject: 'alternica' on MTV March 21st
    >
    > Just saw this on the MetClub website in the "MetNews" section:
    >
    >
    > *90 minute live show on MTV, March 21st.
    > *Show will be shot in the Bay area during Metallica's rehearsal for
    the
    > upcoming
    > Pacific Rim tour.
    > *Show will air at 10 pm EST and again at 10 pm PST.
    >
    sorry, roger, I just have to say that i wouldn't want to waste a tape
    that could be better used to record pro wrestling...

    an alternica show, plus it's on eMpTyV...as if i needed more reason
    not to record it...hee hee...

    this alternica bashing brought to you by chuck...

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    ------------------------------

    End of YTSEJAM Digest 3621
    **************************



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