YTSEJAM Digest 4728

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Date: Mon Mar 08 1999 - 23:57:33 EST

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                                YTSEJAM Digest 4728

    Today's Topics:

      1) RE: YTSEJAM digest 4726
     by "Trevor W. Hoit" <TrevorW@ms.kallback.com>
      2) headphones-take 2
     by "Trevor W. Hoit" <TrevorW@ms.kallback.com>
      3) anderson, bruford, wakeman, howe
     by "Raivo Hool" <raitz@estcard.ee>
      4) Fates Warning
     by "Al @ Switchcraft" <al@isd.net>
      5) Yes album
     by VWgirlieVW@aol.com
      6) mojoman beat me to it....
     by VWgirlieVW@aol.com
      7) JP clinic
     by VWgirlieVW@aol.com
      8) Right, I'm gonna vent.
     by "Simon John Dodd" <S.J.Dodd1@student.derby.ac.uk>
      9) Tori and Kate
     by Dave Ware <dave.ware@walker.com>
     10) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4727
     by Daniel Beziz <danjohn@club-internet.fr>
     11) Korg's thoughts on the "M" band (not Marillion)
     by "Stone Korg" <korgx3@safelink.net>
     12) Re: Good Head ~~~~~ phones
     by Jon Parmet <jon@parmetpc.volpe.dot.gov>
     13) Re: Tori and Kate
     by Frank Benenati <fmb@frontierlogic.com>
     14) Octobans
     by Mehmet Cevat Ozyildirim <e495368@eelab.itu.edu.tr>
     15) ABWH
     by "Rahul Ananda" <rananda@mcn.com>
     16) Some cool stuff I got that you'll like
     by Joshua Rasiel <jrasi@bigfoot.com>
     17) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4727
     by Brad Plumb <bplumb@pi-r-squared.com>
     18) Korg ALMOST gets it Right & MusicSnob follows closely behind.......
     by IceQD@aol.com

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 01:57:33 -0800
    From: "Trevor W. Hoit" <TrevorW@ms.kallback.com>
    To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
    Subject: RE: YTSEJAM digest 4726
    Message-ID: <E04FDFCFDC87D21194D300A0C9D4BAFA0F3D9A@ms.kallback.com>

    > Hi all,
    > I know a lot of you queers are audiophiles and musicians, and I was
    > hoping
    > someone could give a recommendation on a really nice pair of
    > headphones
    > ($150 or less please). Al? ...or should that be Big Gay Al (South
    > Park
    > trivia: did you know that George Clooney played the dog in that
    > episode?)
    > Thanks,
    > Biz
    >

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 02:01:47 -0800
    From: "Trevor W. Hoit" <TrevorW@ms.kallback.com>
    To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
    Subject: headphones-take 2
    Message-ID: <E04FDFCFDC87D21194D300A0C9D4BAFA0F3D9B@ms.kallback.com>

    > I know a lot of you queers are audiophiles and musicians, and I was
    > hoping
    > someone could give a recommendation on a really nice pair of
    > headphones
    > ($150 or less please). Al?
    Well, I'm no Al, but I heard the Sony MDR-V600 are decent.
    I've seen them in stores for $129.95 but are $89.95 at
    http://www.globe-mart.com/audvid/headphones/sony/index.htm

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 12:49:42 +0200
    From: "Raivo Hool" <raitz@estcard.ee>
    To: ytsejam@axnet.net
    Subject: anderson, bruford, wakeman, howe
    Message-ID: <199903091049.MAA16325@xyz.estcard.ee>

    > From: "Isaac Trumbo" <inferno_one@hotmail.com>

    > Bruford, Wakeman, Howe"..
    > great album, i've had it for a while now, but never could figure out why
    > it's not an official Yes album.. maybe cause chris squire isn't on bass?..

    It's because Chris Squire owns the copyright to the name "Yes" and, if I
    recall correctly, he didn't quite feel like joining the band again back
    then.

    =========================================================================
     Raivo Hool kontor raitz@estcard.ee
     ICQ 19980975 isiklik raitz@ircnet.ee
     Windows NT administraator istuv (+372) 6 711 450
     Pankade Kaardikeskus liikuv (+372) 51 43 567
    =========================================================================

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 05:31:29 -0600
    From: "Al @ Switchcraft" <al@isd.net>
    To: retaehT maerD <ytsejam@axnet.net>
    Subject: Fates Warning
    Message-ID: <36E50691.96B41B2D@isd.net>

    If anyone is interested in reading a good review of "Still Life" go here:
    http://www.amzmusiczine.com/11_98/newrel15f.htm

    --
    Al -  The Ytse-ProGtologist
                               ^
    Switchcraft Microsystems
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    "It's supposed to pack an awesome buzz" --Butthead
    

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 08:12:35 EST From: VWgirlieVW@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Yes album Message-ID: <2c9a0d6d.36e51e43@aol.com>

    In a message dated 3/9/99 4:04:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, ytsejam@ax.com writes:

    > in 1989, arista records released an album self titled "Anderson, > Bruford, Wakeman, Howe".. > great album, i've had it for a while now, but never could figure out why > it's not an official Yes album.. > maybe cause chris squire isn't on bass?.. i dunno.

    It isn't on the discography? i am assuming that's how you figured it isn't an "official" yes album....i think i head that it wasn't a while ago, something about how it originally didn't have one of them on it either, maybe Anderson, even...and then eventually that other joined in....umm....kind of like Union was, except at the end virtually EVERY member of Yes that had EVER been a member was a part of it. union was the first Yes album i ever bought and it still never ceases to amaze me....

    hey if you get a real reason for the officiality of ABWH let me know

    cheers Nicole

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 08:15:14 EST From: VWgirlieVW@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: mojoman beat me to it.... Message-ID: <9f89bdc6.36e51ee2@aol.com>

    In a message dated 3/9/99 4:04:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, ytsejam@ax.com writes:

    As a result, Chris Squire withheld the name 'Yes' from > ABWH's use. >

    well damn, there it is. at least i was correct about the Anderson joining ABWH part...

    > -mojoman >

    that's so odd that Chris Squire owns the rights to Yes...i would have assumed it was Jon Anderson but then again nothing is ever what it seems

    Nicole

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 08:16:51 EST From: VWgirlieVW@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: JP clinic Message-ID: <6e7d72f3.36e51f43@aol.com>

    In a message dated 3/9/99 4:04:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, ytsejam@ax.com writes:

    > I'm planning on attending the Petrucci clinic up in CT. How big af a > town is New Britain? Are there any hotels in town? I'd like to know > some info as I'll be driving up from Washington DC. Thank! >

    Apparently i wasn't on the Jam yet this time around, ould someone email me privately and give me a date and location for the clinic???

    thank you Nicole, in Connecticut and very much wanting to go

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 14:40:48 -0000 From: "Simon John Dodd" <S.J.Dodd1@student.derby.ac.uk> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Right, I'm gonna vent. Message-ID: <199903091446.OAA16392@mail1.derby.ac.uk>

    That's it, I can't take any more whining about how Metallica have sold out; I've been threatening this for ages, and now I'm gonna do it. First, let's establish something. This is the DREAM THEATER mailing list, DT being a PROGRESSIVE band. Let's look at what Joshua Rasiel's shirts have on them again, people. That's right, it's a definition of the term "progressive", and it says: "1a) Of, or relating to, or characterised by progress 1b) Making use of, or interested in new ideas, findings or opportunities 2) Moving forward or onward. I'm not gonna argue here, that's the best description I've seen of progressive music thusfar. Everybody on this list is a fan of progressive music, or we wouldn't be here, right? We love the fact that if you covered "A Fortune in Lies" and "Hollow Years", nobody would believe that it was the same band that had produced these two tunes. DT have PROGRESSED. Now let's look at the term "sell out". That would kinda imply that they were trying to make money by changing their style, right? DT are NEVER going to break into the mainstream, and that is a FACT. The music-buying public are as ignorant as pigshit (if anyone wants to debate this point, feel free to send private e-mail), and will never accept DT. They're never gonna sell millions of records. Metallica, on the other hand, HAVE sold millions of records, but they'll never cross over any further into the mainstream, for roughly comparable reasons: because of their "heavy" connotations, and because of public bigotry, and all the other irrelevant shit that stops DT being massive. Now we've established this, let's look at what "selling out would REALLY mean to DT and Metallica. It would mean catering to the lowest common denominator of their audience. Metallica selling out DOES NOT mean "Load/Re-Load", it would mean making another "Master of Puppets", and that is a FACT. DT selling out would mean making an I&W clone (which is why I suspect that many people on this list are a little aprehensive about JR joining, whether they admit it publicly or not). The fact is, Metallica are being PROGRESSIVE. And if I see one more complaint about how they've sold out on here, the guilty party is gonna get an expletive-heavy e-mail from me. Fine, you don't like Re-Load. I do, actually, I think it's a hell of a lot heavier than MoP - fast DOES NOT equal heavy in my book. Icon-era Paradise Lost are a hell of a lot heavier than Napalm Death in my book; it's agreed that Black Sabbath invented metal, and remember that the slower and more down-tuned they got, the heavier they sounded. But the point I'm making is that you're being as daft as those reviewers who slag prog by using incorrect + ignorant criticisms. Final point: true, Kirk Hammet's solo style has changed 180*. Fine. I don't like that either; but as an extension to the point, HE'S PROGRESSED. So will y'all kindly remove your heads from your arses, and make VALID criticism of bands, rather than bandying about terms like "Sell-outs", when it's self evident that they HAVEN'T DONE ANY SUCH THING.

    Si

    p.s. my e-mail program is asbestos-clad, and entirely flame retardant. p.p.s. BAFU! COME BACK!! WE MISS YOU!!!

    ------------------------------------------------------ "If there's a pensive fear, a wasted year A Man must learn to cope If his obsession's real, suppression that he feels Must turn to hope" -John Petrucci s.j.dodd1@student.derby.ac.uk lord_ibanez@hotmail.com http://members.tripod.com/Lord_Ibanez/Lord_Ibanez.html ------------------------------------------------------

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 09:29:06 -0600 From: Dave Ware <dave.ware@walker.com> To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Tori and Kate Message-ID: <82CD0BD64E68D211BDA00060975B3ACF03334D@BHAM-XCHG1.immpower.com>

    Hey,

    So I'm eating my breakfast and surfing throught the music channels and Tori comes on with Winter. And I sit and watch and enjoy. I've always liked Tori although I don't own any albums, just liked what I heard etc (long before knowing about the DT link). Anyway - get to the point, has anyone on this list heard of Kate Bush. I'm sure that most of the UK Jammers probably have, it's just that she's a very talented (slightly wierd and out there) female singer-song-writer-dancer who was very successful in the eighties, and if Tori isn't a big fan I'll eat my hat, there's just too many similarities in her style.

    If you like poppy, kinda strange, piano/orchestral oriented music with female vocal, check her out - I would suggest starting with "The Whole Story" - kind of a greatest hits package.

    Back to work,

    Dave (a UK jammer - now in Alabama).

    NP: Chroma Key.

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 16:32:05 +0100 From: Daniel Beziz <danjohn@club-internet.fr> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4727 Message-ID: <36E53EF5.C640818F@club-internet.fr>

    > Kubrick's new movie "Eyes Wide Shut" is due out sometime later this year. It > stars Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman, and took several years to complete > because he kept ordering reshoots. Unfortunately, he was so disorganized (he > was gettin old) that every time he ordered a reshoot he wanted to refilm > almost the entire movie, and none of the cast members were available. This > caused several cast changes and there are now at least 3 or 4 incarnations > of the film. Luckily he did complete it before he died, and the final cut > has been finished and screened by the studios.

    Please someone strangle the ignorant! First, Kubrick wasn't disorganised but perfectionnist. Second, in their contracts, the actors had to remain available at any moment if Kubrick had any desire to reshoot sequences. That's why the Cruise couple came back several times in England, even in the middle of the Mission: Impossible promotion. Kubrick found their skill as actors were perfectible, to say the least. As for Jennifer Jason Leigh, whose acting has completely been cut off and scenes reshoot with Mary Richardson instead, she simply didn't respect her contract. She had signed in the meantime in David Cronenberg's movie "Existenz", and refused to come back to England to reshoot a few scenes (in that way, she made a choice between Kubrick and Cronenberg. She chose Cronenberg, and Kubrick erased her from his film). So please check your information before saying such crap!

    -- "Truth is a three-edged sword" -Kosh ________________________ Daniel

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 08:56:02 -0700 From: "Stone Korg" <korgx3@safelink.net> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Korg's thoughts on the "M" band (not Marillion) Message-ID: <004e01be6a45$a024b340$0201010a@chuck>

    > Metallica, on the other hand, HAVE sold millions of records, but >they'll never cross over any further into the mainstream, for roughly

    How could they cross over more into the mainstream? They're completely immersed in it. I guess when you see it my way... I was your typical mainstream music listener back in 1990. Before then, I'd never even heard of Metallica whatsoever. So then the Black album is released. Suddenly Metallica is an overnight success (in the minds of the numb, considering we'd never heard of them before). MTV is playing Enter Sandman constantly. Bids are going out for them to make more. You actually hear Metallica on the radio. They suddenly manufacture 50 different T-shirts, hold all sorts of publicity events, etc. This from a band who swore they'd never get carried that far. BUT, there is a line to draw here. I don't think Metallica, at that time, would ever have conceived that they would even remotely be so popular. At the time I would have been very spiteful of them if they would have turned around and said, "fuck you all, we don't do this shit for you guys." IMO, Metallica didn't sell out themselves, they were sold out by their label. Fuck, of course the label's gonna milk them for every penny it can get.

    Unfortunately, though, I think they really let the money and popularity go to their heads. What with the makeup and all the shit that came with Load. I don't think it was the music in Load so much that I disliked as to what they'd let themselves become. Something I really don't think they would have become had they remained on the even course they were once upon. Not only did it affect them sonically, but it also seemed to affect them personally. This is what I think pisses alot of old Metallica fans off. They are no longer the same people they'd always known anymore. They look different, act different, and sound different. To most people who don't even bother to get to "know" and understand the people behind the music, it wasn't anything different and Load was well-welcomed. But for those of us who like to get to know the intimate details of the bands (like it seems most of us do here), it comes as a shock. The Metallica of 1990 and before is NOT the same Metallica of 1999. As far as I'm concerned, M are doing exactly the opposite of what I'd expect any good band to do. They're not maturing. They seem to be getting looser and more childlike as they go. They're progressing in reverse imo.

    Anyway, that about sums up the way I see it. Metallica was sold out by their label, and they all suffered (or we did) for it. Hell, I just wish DT would sell out and get it over with. hehehe. Why? -- Because Stone Korg said so. NP: Type O Negative: October Rust

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 16:51:38 +0000 From: Jon Parmet <jon@parmetpc.volpe.dot.gov> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: Good Head ~~~~~ phones Message-ID: <36E5519A.773C@parmetpc.volpe.dot.gov>

    Al the Ytse PROGtologist, makes it too easy. He'd ALMOST make a good straight man, MUHAHAHAHAHA:

    > [...] and I would rather not insert something in-line.

    And we thank you for it :)

    NP: some Zonder/Zimmerman samples from Mr. Kizer's site. Not bad, quite different than FW, but still enough of a ballsNchunk factor that I'll be picking that up :D

    Regards, Jon

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 11:56:25 -0500 From: Frank Benenati <fmb@frontierlogic.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: Tori and Kate Message-ID: <36E552B9.E229B4B7@frontierlogic.com>

    Dave Ware wrote: > > Hey, > > So I'm eating my breakfast and surfing throught the music > channels and Tori comes on with Winter. And I sit and watch and enjoy. > I've always liked Tori although I don't own any albums, just liked what > I heard etc (long before knowing about the DT link). Anyway - get to > the point, has anyone on this list heard of Kate Bush.

    A far better subject for this email would've been:

    Subject: Tori and Bush

    Imagine the possibilities.... :)

    -mojoman

    /\ /\ \_\/_/ / _ _ \ |\ \(*)(*)/ /| #-----------------OOO- \oo/--OOO------------# # Frank Benenati - fmb@frontierlogic.com # # "Some of the nicest people are dogs" # # - Richard Dean Anderson # #__________________________ooo______________# ooo (_) (_)

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 19:37:31 +0200 (EET) From: Mehmet Cevat Ozyildirim <e495368@eelab.itu.edu.tr> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Octobans Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.990309193409.7001A-100000@karga.eelab.itu.edu.tr>

    Does anybody know the length of the octobans MP used in the Awake era? (While he used Mapex drums)

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 9:35 -0800 From: "Rahul Ananda" <rananda@mcn.com> To: "ytsejam@ax.com" <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: ABWH Message-ID: <199903091817.KAA26994@knight.axnet.net>

    To whomever it was (Isaac?) that wanted to know why Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe (sounds like a law firm) is not an official Yes release, I recall reading an interview with Steve Howe saying that Chris Squire owned the rights to the Yes name, since he was the only one to appear on every Yes release. It was Squire who didn't allow the others to use the name, hence ABWH. -Rahul Ananda

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 13:36:38 -0500 From: Joshua Rasiel <jrasi@bigfoot.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Some cool stuff I got that you'll like Message-ID: <36E56A36.50AA7904@bigfoot.com>

    I ordered three things from amazon last week - Still Life, and two video collections - Tori's and Radiohead's. The videos came in yesterday and I crazy-glued my ass to the chair and watched them, many twice. No DT here, but I think there's lots of fans of these artists on the list, and lots of fans of the ever-elusive 'good' video. So I'll review them a bit.

    I don't know about the majority of the list, but personally, I love good music videos. The kind that MTV never ever plays except maybe occasionally on 120 minutes(There's exceptions to that. Korn's Freak on a Leash is great - that's Todd McFarlane's animation). I like innovative uses of animation, like in Bjork's Human Behaivor, or the classic A-ha video. I like freaky videos that make you think, or videos with really great special effects.

    Basically, 80% of tori's and 90% of radiohead's videos are like that, they're the good kind. I mean, the really good kind.

    It'd too bad Radiohead's offering - "7 Television Commercials" is indeed only 7 videos and 35 minutes long. Those are 7 great videos! I was most captivated by Just and High and Dry, both of which I'd seen before, so maybe I was biased.

    And on Tori's tape, you get a lot more, maybe 15 videos. They're all good, many are amazing. My personal favorites are Spark and Caught a Lite Sneeze, and also all the minimalist ones from the first album(all same director), and also all the others.

    Sorry, didn't get Still Life yet - I put the videos on overnight express.

    -- Joshua Rasiel jrasi@bigfoot.com www.j51.com/~mrasiel Churchill's description of history: "It's just one damn thing after another."

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 13:14:39 -0600 From: Brad Plumb <bplumb@pi-r-squared.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4727 Message-ID: <2.2.32.19990309191439.0129edc4@pi-r-squared.com>

    >Please someone strangle the ignorant! >First, Kubrick wasn't disorganised but perfectionnist. Second, in their >contracts, >the actors had to remain available at any moment if Kubrick had any >desire to reshoot >sequences.

    First off, I know that Kubrick is a perfectionist, the tales of him on the set are legendary. The fact of the matter is, however, he was disorganized. When he finished shooting he didn't even give the actors prospective dates, let alone specific ones, and his callings of the reshoot were random and on a whim. Compare this with another film which took a long time to shoot, I believe it was Thin Red Line though I could be getting mixed up, anyway Terrence Mallick told his cast: If you're going to be in this film, you must be available for reshoots, and then proceeded to outline all specific days in which the reshoots would take place. Therefore, among his humungous cast, almost all of them were able to make it back (it ended up being irrelevant with all the screen time that got cut from the movie but hey!)

    Anyway I had thought that Harvery Keitel had exited the project due to the reshoots problem as well, but upon further research into things in response to your letter, I learned that, yes, I was wrong. Fancy that, someone admitting they're wrong on the jam. Anyway, I had been given some exaggerated info by what I considered to be a reliable source, and may have drawn my own conclusions from this matter as well. As far as Leigh goes, if you'd been stuck shooting a movie for a year ( 15 months to be exact, though she probly wasn't there for the full time like the Cruises) you'd be pretty anxious to get out of there and go do other projects as well. However, I can see now, upon reading some more on the subject, that the problems with the movie were largely due to Kubrick's perfectionism, ie making Tom Cruise do 100 takes of one scene. Maybe he's hoping for another Impromptu singin in the rain (which I am told malcolm macdowell did not add till around the 42nd take of that scene in Clockwork though again I could be wrong).

    Please excuse me for cluttering the jam with this crap, and btw, I may have been wrong on this occasion but I am far from ignorant on these matters. Next time, try correcting me instead of insulting me.

    Palpatine Co Founder of Pi-R-Squared productions: www.pi-r-squared.com "Thank God I'm an aetheist" -Luis Bunel "What an incredible smell you've discovered" -Han Solo, Star Wars: A New Hope "Perhaps god gave the answers to those with nothing to say"- Savatage: Somewhere in time

    ------------------------------

    Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 14:20:08 EST From: IceQD@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Korg ALMOST gets it Right & MusicSnob follows closely behind....... Message-ID: <e591d4e2.36e57468@aol.com>

    Korg wrote:

    >Yah, really. Ice is actually a transvestite hermaphrodite with 12 wooden >legs and a prosthetic abdomen. Therefore Mosh must be a three-eyed, >duck-billed, tapdancing caterpillar named Dino. > >DTC: Mike Portnoy thinks we're all gay

    Almost - in actual fact I'm a schizophrenic bisexual hermaphrodite with homicidal tendencies (but I don't fuck piano stools, barstools perhaps - they tend to have holes in the seats)! Damn good try though Mr Korg ....

    Andy Pandy added:

    <<Actually, Ice, I believe that you have said that you are female. If you're not, then I must be misremembering something, but I seem to remember something about Ice being female and Fire being a male. But I could be wrong. Not to mention the fact that you named yourself after the "Ice Queen" so you're either female or in drag. :) >>

    Nope and yep, Fire & Ice are part of the same person, but you got the male AND female thing right (yin and yang) ;-)

    MusicSnob wrote:

    >>P.S. Some people sure don't get sarcasm, do they, Ice? Kevin<<

    Nope, it is a very British thing <g> like irony ....

    Ice (and Fire)

    PS: NOW do you get it MoshMan? Or should that be Dr Mojo? ;-)

    ------------------------------

    End of YTSEJAM Digest 4728 **************************



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