YTSEJAM Digest 5130
Today's Topics:
1) TFS Delivery Failure: YTSEJAM digest 5129
by administrator@itsyourlife.com
2) Poor Mike....
by "Christoph" <schroedhelm@gmx.de>
3) Ptacek's critique & the radio station thing...
by "Robert A. Jurado, MPH" <rojurado@pacific.net.ph>
4) Re: Connections......hahaha
by "Sasha" <sasa.cabaravdic@pu.tel.hr>
5) Re: YJam drug discussion
by Jonathan D Willey <willeyatc@juno.com>
6) Re: 93 X - let's move on
by MaxArbot@aol.com
7) Re: Connections......hahaha
by MaxArbot@aol.com
8) Re: Home-SPOILERS
by MaxArbot@aol.com
9) Re: radio
by "Brian Hayden" <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu>
10) Re: Rock on the Radio (was re: Radio Advocacy)
by "Pat Sullivan" <psull@ici.net>
11) Radio Give and Take
by "Christopher Ptacek" <someone@digitalrodent.com>
12) Re: radio
by Jonathan D Willey <willeyatc@juno.com>
13) X-mas cd idea (possible tiny spoiler)
by "Marcel Schot" <neuronix@writeme.com>
14) progNhockey mailing list
by Adam Perkowsky <perk1994@yahoo.com>
15) Re: amazon.com sucks
by Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
16) Re: amazon.com sucks
by Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu>
17) Re: READ: Radio advocacy - an analogy, and alternate approach to
by Lisa Marie <firegirl@flashcom.net>
18) And they called him... "Brian"
by "Chuck Reis" <korgx3@safelink.net>
19) Re: Rock on the Radio (was re: Radio Advocacy)
by "Brian Hayden" <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 11:57:58 -0400
From: administrator@itsyourlife.com
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Cc: administrator@itsyourlife.com
Subject: TFS Delivery Failure: YTSEJAM digest 5129
Message-ID: <TFSCOSWL@itsyourlife.com>
Your message to the following recipients was undeliverable:
mnawrath@itsyourlife=2Ecom=20=
*****************************************************
Administrator
Newton Memorial Hospital
Tel: 973-383-2121
Internet Address: a@itsyourlife=2Ecom
Home Page: http://www=2Eitsyourlife=2Ecom
*****************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 18:07:49 +0200
From: "Christoph" <schroedhelm@gmx.de>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Poor Mike....
Message-ID: <199910231614.JAA12584@fugazi.torchsong.com>
> copy?:)--------------------------------------------------------------=
--------
> ----------------------------------------- ------------- I'll do you all =
one
> better..... I don't even have a packaged copy yet!!!!!!!!!!! They shippe=
d
> straight to Europe and forgot about us measley band members.. (We only m=
ade the
> fucking thing!!!) Hopefully, my copies will arrive via Fed Ex tomorrow
> morning....
> ENJOY EVERYBODY!! and I'm looking foward to reading reactions starting
> Tuesday!
>
> Mike Portnoy
Hey Mike!
I am from Germany and I have had the CD in my hands and was allowed to
look at it, but they aren=B4t allowed to sell them until monday. So i had =
to give
it back! ;o((
But, let me tell you...it feels great! ;o))
Greetings from Germany,
Christoph
Schr=F6der=B4s World Of Music
Befindet sich zur Zeit im Neuaufbau!
Deutscher Spock=B4s Beard Fanclub:
http://www.thebearded.de
MONSTER=B4S OF PROG #2
27.11.99
mit ESTHETIC PALE, BRIGHTNESS FALLS und SCYTHE
Progrock-Dt & Babyblaue Progreviews proudly present:
PROGPARADE =B499
mit NO NAME, BRIGHTNESS FALLS, SCYTHE & ZENOBIA
4.12.99 Klangstation, Bonn / GERMANY
Infos unter: http://progparade.musicpage.de
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 00:58:31 +0700
From: "Robert A. Jurado, MPH" <rojurado@pacific.net.ph>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Ptacek's critique & the radio station thing...
Message-ID: <3811F747.68EE0093@pacific.net.ph>
Chris Ptacek intoned:
> It it were requests we were sending, that would be fine. But a lot of
> the posts seem to be attacks, more than requests. That makes it kind of
> obvious that this is something that's been organized. If they got that
Personally, I tried to make it as if I were completely independent ofAl. I kind of thought that's how we were supposed to do
it. I just
kind of--in a nice way--said, "hey...haven't heard that new DT even
though you said you played it. Hopefully, I'll hear it the next time.
I must not be tuning in at the right time." I definitely agree that if
we try something like this with some other station, we shouldn't
say that we're organized. We shouldn't say anything about
national/international newsgroups. I think we should all pretend
to just be individuals who want to hear a particular song.
I'm not saying that I necessarily disagree with how we went
about doing things with 93X. Maybe, we just need to alter
our strategy a little bit. Obviously, we have yet to be
successful. We messed up. Sorry, MP, if you're listening.
> the requests came from out of state. That makes it look less honest, and
> more like a cheesy attempt for airplay. I know that was not the intention.
what's kind of funny in my case is that my request comes fromthe Philippines. (With a .ph attached to the end of my e-mail
address, I imagined that I wouldn't be very successful, but I
had to give it a try.) That's how many thousands of miles
from the Twin Cities? I have no clue, but I figured that
would be better than my freemail address which happens to be
@dreamtheater.zzn.com. Something about that address just
didn't seem to be the wisest choice for sending a request.
> made was that some people quoted stuff that came from Al's private mail. I
> assure you, 100 requests will be more important to a station than a group of
> 100 people with an organized goal. The fact that we were such a group
> should have been masked.
This is correct, I think, in retrospect. Let's try that somewhere
else. Let's all be nice too. L.A., perhaps? N.Y.?
Regarding radio stations catering to their audiences. I
suppose that it is true that they are catering to their audiences, but
I only believe that to a certain extent. I am more inclined to
believe that they are there to cater to the record companies
and their advertisers more than their listeners. After all,
how do they make money? I would assume that much of it
comes from advertising revenues. If Korn makes people
tune in, that's fine from the advertisers' point of vew.
I'm sure they don't give a damn what the radio station is
playing as long as people are tuning in and able to hear
their ads every now and then.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 19:14:07 +0200
From: "Sasha" <sasa.cabaravdic@pu.tel.hr>
To: "Ytsejam Mailing List" <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: Re: Connections......hahaha
Message-ID: <001501bf1d7a$ea7decc0$3ded1dc3@sasa>
>From: Portnoy420@aol.com
>I'll do you all one better.....
>I don't even have a packaged copy yet!!!!!!!!!!!
>They shipped straight to Europe and forgot about us measley band members..
>(We only made the fucking thing!!!)
*lol* heehee...
well, I`m in Europe and god knows when will i get to hold SFAM in my
hands... *sigh*. I was at the store today to pick up ACoS and I asked the
clerk if they`ll have SFaM on the shelves at Tuesday and he sad "very
unlikely, god knows when will it arrive". So, that`s not a good thing... is
it?
NP: King Diamond [Conspiracy] - At the Graves
"Lifting shadows off a dream
Once broken
She can turn a drop of water
Into an ocean..."
John Myung of Dream Theater
["Lifting Shadows Off A Dream"]
sasa.cabaravdic@pu.tel.hr
http://chronosphere.zambizzi.com
ICQ UIN - 6098813
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 22:33:29 -0700
From: Jonathan D Willey <willeyatc@juno.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: YJam drug discussion
Message-ID: <19991023.223330.90.0.willeyatc@juno.com>
> > I'm not a drug user at all, but I do highly reccommend 2 or 3
> drinks at a
> > DT
> > concert, just enough to give a light happy buzz. I did that at
> Great
> > Woods
> > in MA with DT opening for DP, and lets just say I was singing
> along a
> > hell
> > of a lot louder!
>
> And probably annoying the people around you a hell of a lot more. ;D
>
> -Brian
Damn Brian, what crawled up your ass and died?? Brian, I agree with you
on some of your last post. Radio stations are in it for their own
benefit. And yes, Unfortunately people want to hear limp biskit and
nookie all the freakin time cuz it is a short buzz type of song.. But
there is no reason to flame everyone on this list who are just trying to
get DT's music to more listeners... Yep man, the majority of radio
listeners don't like DT or fates but we do and we are on this list
because of that. If we want to ****try**** and get the stations to play
it it's then for god's sake let us... And if the nick guy really is in it
for his own glory then why would he give a shit about you... which makes
me wonder why you are standing up for him anyway??? i don't know man.. I
agree with alot of what you said in the last post about the music
industry... but if some of us want to make a (feeble as it may be)
attempt to change it... then let us..... with that maybe we should just
move on..... I know I'm ready too...
ytseJon
Jonathan Willey, ATC
WSU
___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 13:36:44 EDT
From: MaxArbot@aol.com
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: 93 X - let's move on
Message-ID: <0.b927c2ad.25434c2c@aol.com>
JamesAhab@aol.com wrote:
<<Obviously, Al's campaign wasn't a success. I say we cut our losses and move
on to another radio station. Something in LA or NYC or something.>>
Hell, why not the radio station in my home town? It's listener base is
almost 3000 (3500 if you count all of the nursing homes that are forced to
listen to it over loudspeaker). They play songs older than I am all the
time. Surely they're in need for some new music :o)
[eriC]
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 13:40:20 EDT
From: MaxArbot@aol.com
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: Connections......hahaha
Message-ID: <0.4bd3ca30.25434d04@aol.com>
Mike Portnoy of all people, wrote:
<<ENJOY EVERYBODY!! and I'm looking foward to reading reactions starting
Tuesday!>>
Ohhh...I'm sure we'll hear one or two replies. I'll probably have to stop
studying just to read the excess 'Jam's that's be coming.
[eriC]
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 13:43:31 EDT
From: MaxArbot@aol.com
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: Home-SPOILERS
Message-ID: <0.c805ee86.25434dc3@aol.com>
Rob wrote:
<<Does anyone who has heard this thing think that the boys
really have learned how to groove. That riff that JP plays
during the early verses with James singing, "Shine...Light..."
is kicking me in the butt. Damn! Damn, forget just the verse!
Who am I kidding? It all kicks butt.>>
Amen, brotha...amen.
[eriC]
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 12:50:15 -0500
From: "Brian Hayden" <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: radio
Message-ID: <iss.2de2.3811f556.c664a.1@garnet.tc.umn.edu>
Responding To: Jonathan D Willey <willeyatc@juno.com>
Original Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 10:40:05 -0700 (PDT)
> Damn Brian, what crawled up your ass and died?? Brian, I agree with you
> on some of your last post. Radio stations are in it for their own
> benefit. And yes, Unfortunately people want to hear limp biskit and
> nookie all the freakin time cuz it is a short buzz type of song.. But
> there is no reason to flame everyone on this list who are just trying to
> get DT's music to more listeners...
If you want to get the music to more listeners, I'd say you're better off
making some polite requests and telling your friends about them. You didn't
gain DT a single listener by harassing some bozo DJ.
> Yep man, the majority of radio
> listeners don't like DT or fates but we do and we are on this list
> because of that. If we want to ****try**** and get the stations to play
> it it's then for god's sake let us...
Hey, nobody's stopping you. I'm just pointing out that it's
counterproductive to do it in such a confrontational manner, and that most
people, like it or not, don't want to hear the song anyway, so who are you
to say it should be played, you who won't even ever listen to the station?
This is a pretty obvious line of thought, I would think.
> And if the nick guy really is in it
> for his own glory then why would he give a shit about you... which makes
> me wonder why you are standing up for him anyway???
Who's in it for whose glory? Huh? Standing up? I just said he's one of the
people there that actually plays decent stuff, and harassing him isn't
helping your cause any.
> i don't know man.. I
> agree with alot of what you said in the last post about the music
> industry... but if some of us want to make a (feeble as it may be)
> attempt to change it... then let us
Like I said....harassing someone won't change a damn thing. Even getting
the song on won't change anything. PMU got big play in some places in 93.
Burning My Soul got a fair amount of play. It didn't cause any magical
change in the industry. If you want to change the world, baby, you gotta
start with the pocketbook, cause that's where the people in power think
from.
-Brian
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 14:02:32 -0400
From: "Pat Sullivan" <psull@ici.net>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com, ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: Rock on the Radio (was re: Radio Advocacy)
Message-ID: <199910231802.OAA13997@mercury.bidmc.harvard.edu>
On 23 Oct 99, at 9:01, ytsejam@torchsong.com wrote:
> You all just don't get. You don't have ANY right to hear ANYTHING on the
> radio...it's privately owned by some person or corporation and they can
> play whatever songs they damn well please, for any motivation. Sheesh. Get
> over it all ready.
Yes, but the purpose of owning a radio station is to make money.
They make money from advertisers who pay for that station to bring
in listeners of a certain demographic. DT fans fit that demographic
(in some cases). More listeners (or more *frequent* listeners) =
more money.
> There's something a little pathetic about people who are
> so utterly desperate to have their taste in music, clothes, movies, or
> anything else validated by someone else.
I don't think it's about validation. At this point, I'm more interested
in trying to counter that DJ's perception that DT is a "has been"
band. Don't you think that a little musical exposure and/or positive
word-of-mouth in the mainstream media would go a long way
toward countering that (false) perception?
Don't forget - to the majority of the people who listen to the radio,
DT was nothing but a one-hit wonder. Chances are, they haven't
heard them on the radio since PMU was big. I don't know about
everyone else, but I can count on one hand the number of times I've
heard DT on the radio since "Awake" came out.
We know DT never really "left", but it couldn't hurt to try and let
people know they're "back", and they kick ass.
__Pat Sullivan______________________________
Email: psull@ici.net
WWW: http://home.ici.net/~psull/psull.html
AIM: TOWHTSTS ICQ: 23499229
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 13:10:34 -0500
From: "Christopher Ptacek" <someone@digitalrodent.com>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: Radio Give and Take
Message-ID: <000f01bf1d81$e7a4ff00$013ca8c0@madstation>
I have to take exception with what Brian is saying about what radio is.
First off, maybe take a step back and objectively look at HOW you're saying
what you're saying... we're all friends here, and this isn't the kind of
debate that should burn that. Second, and more importantly, Radio IS
privately owned, as is Burger King. If they want to make it one way that's
fine, but if they refuse to make it your way, they lose customers. If you
lose enough customers, your business is through. In the radio market, when
stations don't appeal to their audiences, their ratings go down, and the
station is worth less money. This can mean that commercial spots go for
less or aren't selling well, and it can mean that purchase offers from big
conglomerates like Evergreen Media are taken much more seriously by the
station execs, who see that their business is not all that profitable.
DT's market in your area may be small, but more than likely, you don't
truly know what that market is. Do they play in MN? Do they sell out
shows? The main problem they've had since Awake has been underexposure,
whether or not you want to accept that. When they were getting played, PMU
and LIE both made major marks on Headbangers Ball. That in and of itself is
a small market, but it's the WHOLE market of a hard rock/heavy metal
station. When you combine the fact that a DJ is controlling the fact that
the band isn't getting play, with the fact that there are requests coming
in, I think that's a problem. If you think a DJ gets to play whatever he or
she wants, you simply don't have any experience with radio in the real
world. You don't get to play only things you like. Listening to Home right
now, I can't agree with your opinion that playing this music would cause
people to stop listening to a station that plays hard rock. How often do
YOU like EVERYTHING you hear on your station in an hour? Haven't you ever
heard something on the radio that made you take notice and buy an album? I
know I have... in just about every genre. I just don't think what you said
is accurate. I have never heard a full hour of radio in which something
wasn't lame. So if someone dislikes DT, so be it. It won't be the reason
they turn the station off forever. And I don't think you're leaving the
possibility open that someone might actually ENJOY it.
Lastly, I take offense to your statement regarding "trying to get your
opinions validated." That's a low shot, and it's also clearly not something
that someone who gives a shit about the band would say. I know, you don't
care whether or not anyone thinks you support the band. But this whole
thing has only been about getting them a chance with this new album. the
people requesting Home are trying to get DT played, A). because it's a cool
feeling to hear music you love on the radio, and B). because if they like
it, other people might too, and that would be good news for the band. You
don't have to try to help DT get airplay if you don't want to, but what kind
of person are you to supress people who are trying to get them played?
- Chris
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 23:20:41 -0700
From: Jonathan D Willey <willeyatc@juno.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: radio
Message-ID: <19991023.232042.90.1.willeyatc@juno.com>
>
> > i don't know man.. I
> > agree with alot of what you said in the last post about the music
> > industry... but if some of us want to make a (feeble as it may be)
> > attempt to change it... then let us
>
> Like I said....harassing someone won't change a damn thing. Even
getting
> the song on won't change anything. PMU got big play in some places in
93.
> Burning My Soul got a fair amount of play. It didn't cause any magical
> change in the industry. If you want to change the world, baby, you
gotta
> start with the pocketbook, cause that's where the people in power
think
> from.
>
> -Brian
Yeah, you're right man, it's all about who's promoters kiss who's ass and
who has the most money... it sucks that it's that way.... I'll just try
and see if the little podunk stations in my town will play it....
actually, I am getting the CD tuesday anyway, I think I will just put the
CD is my "damn CD player" and get a hell of a better sound anyway.... I
can wait.... I think we have sufficiently debated this issue..... moving
on.....
Does anyone know if those of us who "pre-ordered" the CD from CD Now will
get it on tuesday? i have been tracking it and it is still "being
processed" at their factory... I hopw I get it tuesday... if not I
willhave to go out and purchase it i think... two CD's would be
cool!......
ytseJon
Jonathan Willey, ATC
WSU
___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 20:21:10 +0200
From: "Marcel Schot" <neuronix@writeme.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: X-mas cd idea (possible tiny spoiler)
Message-ID: <199910232021100270.01B72782@Sylvester>
Hi all,
With the idea of the whole album being played live, wouldn't that be the
greatest possible x-mas fanclub cd? Metropolis Part 2.5 : Memories of a
Livetime :)
Marcel Schot
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 11:31:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Adam Perkowsky <perk1994@yahoo.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: progNhockey mailing list
Message-ID: <19991023183128.8765.rocketmail@web703.mail.yahoo.com>
Hello everyone,
On the Spock's Beard Mailing list, we recently had a
huge hockey discussion and that got me thinkin'. It
seems that many prog fans are hockey fans. So, I
created the Onelist mailing list called
progNhockey@onelist.com, where we can freely discuss,
well, prog and hockey. : ) So, if you want to join the
list, go to www.onelist.com and search for
progNhockey.
Take care,
Adam Perkowsky
=====
"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- Spinal Tap
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 14:38:35 -0700
From: Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: amazon.com sucks
Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991023143811.0096d7b0@mail.avnl1.nj.home.com>
Trent, i did open it, I had no sighted help around at he time, (I am blind)
and when I put it in the CD player, that ended any hope of a refund.
At 07:32 AM 10/23/99 , you wrote:
>--- Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com> wrote:
> >
> > I
> > got it today, and it turns outto be Once in a
> > livetime. Needless to say, i
> > am aggravated. Why sell an import of a CD you can
> > get domestically? What
> > the hell is that? Now, I have two cop8ies of OIALT
> > and don't know what to
> > do withthe second. I can't rade it for anything that
> > I don't have since it
> > is an official release and I bet all of you have it.
> > What do I do? How do
> > you prevent this kind of stuff from happening? And
> > thirdly, where do you
> > all find these bonus track type CDs and boots?
>
>Let me start by saying amazon.com does indeed suck. A
>lot. Now then, I sure hope you haven't opened your
>new copy of OIALT. If amazon.com are anything like
>BMG, they give you a grace period to ask for a refund
>or trade it or something. You could check into
>amazon.com's policy on this. I would advise you to do
>so b/c it might be worth your time and energy to do
>so. Good luck to you.
>
>=====
>*Trent
>
>"Life is like a nacho; you can put anything you want on it, but if it gets
>too cheesy, it's your fault."
>Me
>
>:: listen to music ::
>Metropolis-- http://members.xoom.com/metrotrent
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com
-- Damon Fibraio dfibraio@home.com computer consultant, musician, radio broadcaster, and public nuisance Listen to No Holds Barred Radio every Tuesday night from 8 to 11 p.m. Eastern time. go to http://www.nhbradio.com for more details or point winamp to 216.32.166.89:21944. Comedy on the Internet. "I can see much clearer, now I'm blind."--Dream Theater, Take the Time, Images and Words------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 14:48:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Re: amazon.com sucks Message-ID: <Pine.BSF.4.10.9910231444580.49199-100000@oz.plymouth.edu>
On Sat, 23 Oct 1999, Damon Fibraio wrote:
> Trent, i did open it, I had no sighted help around at he time, (I am > blind) and when I put it in the CD player, that ended any hope of a > refund.
Can't you use that as a disclaimer for being able to send it back? I mean, it would be awfully mean of a company to deny anything to a blind guy because he couldn't see the title on the CD. You could at least present your argument (the same way you did with us), explain that you thought it might have been a special CD that you didn't think you owned, and then tell them that you didn't have any help in determining which CD it was and so played it. I know if I were a company exec I could sympathize with an argument like this - it's a powerful thing.
Which brings me to a question for you: Do you put braille tags on all your CDs? I would assume that this is so, for you to be able to properly catalog and find all of them. Just a little bit of curiosity on my part... I've had a few blind friends in my past, but I never saw any of their CD collections. ;)
------------------------------------------------- Andrew Coutermarsh a_couter@mail.plymouth.edu http://cout.dhs.org/ Cloak on IRC ICQ: 2513441 ------------------------------------------------- The only stupid question is the one that is never asked, except maybe "Don't you think it's about time you audited my tax return?" or "But officer, isn't it morally wrong to give me a warning when, in fact, I was speeding?" -------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 11:40:06 -0700 From: Lisa Marie <firegirl@flashcom.net> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: READ: Radio advocacy - an analogy, and alternate approach to Message-ID: <38120106.3010F56E@flashcom.net>
Brian Hayden wrote:
> So quit bitching. >
Yes Brian, please do.
If you don't want to get involved, then fine... don't.
-- Lisa Marie Palma firegirl@flashcom.net
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 12:52:58 -0600 From: "Chuck Reis" <korgx3@safelink.net> To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: And they called him... "Brian" Message-ID: <004601bf1d87$dde7a700$590d84d0@safelink.net>
> so utterly desperate to have their taste in music, clothes, movies, or > anything else validated by someone else.
I agree, Brian. I am validating your opinion so you will be happy and be quiet. :)
You must be a spectacular representative of utopian humanity or a VERY anti-social person if you don't care what other people think about you. Everyone has a tendency to be offended in some way. It >is< a damn good feeling when another person compliments you on what you're wearing, playing, reading, etc. But this isn't about that for Al and I. It's about getting DT out to the public. I've been listening to the Home MP3 here at home (heheh) for a week now.
The thing is that 93-X plays stuff like DT. So they could play DT and not wig out their listeners. Some people might not like the single, but not everyone likes everything that a radio station plays. You're damn right. They don't HAVE to play anything, but like I said, to be a good business, they really ought to cater to everyone with reasonable requests. We're customers for hell's sake. Just like customers to any other responsible business, our opinions do hold weight to the management. They have to or else it's a bad reflection of their (not there, damn homonymns!) establishment.
You're also right. Alot of our requests were probably hostile. Al told everyone to be civil, but that's not always going to happen. Not everyone crusades like Ghandi. I think more people are like Ghengis Khan. hehehe. Fuckin people with H's in their names. hehehe. Doh! SO! Let's all rally and go after HARD ROCK, baby, yeah! Oh, wait, they're already playin' it. heheheh.
> people, like it or not, don't want to hear the song anyway, so who are you > to say it should be played, you who won't even ever listen to the station?
I'M A DREAM THEATER FAN, GAWDAMMIT, AND FUNKIN' PROUD OF IT!
Watch out, gang, it's Brian against The World. Be careful though, Kasparov just beat The World, too. :) hehehe.
BLEAT! BLEAT! Muthafuckas! -- Chuck thinks he could kick Kasparov's ass.
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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 14:02:43 -0500 From: "Brian Hayden" <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: Rock on the Radio (was re: Radio Advocacy) Message-ID: <iss.4bcc.38120652.c4f5d.1@garnet.tc.umn.edu>
Okay, unless someone comes up with anything new to say...this is it from me...
Responding To: "Pat Sullivan" <psull@ici.net> Original Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 11:14:26 -0700 (PDT)
> Yes, but the purpose of owning a radio station is to make money. > They make money from advertisers who pay for that station to bring > in listeners of a certain demographic. DT fans fit that demographic > (in some cases). More listeners (or more *frequent* listeners) = > more money.
Do you honestly think that playing DT is going to attract any more listeners to their station? Come on. People who are DT fans don't, for the most part, listen to the radio much. It would probably attract more fans to DT, which would be cool, but the station doesn't give a shit about doing that so it's a moot point.
> I don't think it's about validation. At this point, I'm more interested > in trying to counter that DJ's perception that DT is a "has been" > band. Don't you think that a little musical exposure and/or positive > word-of-mouth in the mainstream media would go a long way > toward countering that (false) perception?
And exactly how is calling people fascist and ignorant and unenlightened and blah blah blah going to get them on your side? Let's think about this.
> We know DT never really "left", but it couldn't hurt to try and let > people know they're "back", and they kick ass.
You're right, I think it's cool to request the stuff you wanna hear...but being antagonistic to them after they shut you down is NOT going to help you. What about that concept is so hard for people to understand? Think, think, think.
Now, on to Chris's post...
"In the radio market, when stations don't appeal to their audiences, their ratings go down, and the station is worth less money. This can mean that commercial spots go for less or aren't selling well, and it can mean that purchase offers from big conglomerates like Evergreen Media are taken much more seriously by the station execs, who see that their business is not all that profitable."
Obviously, and that's my point. Playing DT isn't going to help to expand their listnership at all. I doubt it would hurt either, that was some hyperbole on my part. But, most people, unfortunately, haven't heard of DT and don't care, so there's no reason for them to play the song just because 400 people sent them the same harassing email.
" DT's market in your area may be small, but more than likely, you don't truly know what that market is. Do they play in MN? Do they sell out shows? The main problem they've had since Awake has been underexposure, whether or not you want to accept that."
They play here once in a while. No, they don't sell out, and they're not playing a large venue. Yes, obviously their biggest problem is underexposure, why wouldn't I accept that? And once again, harassing some nobody DJ is NOT going to do a damn thing to help that problem. The exposure they get is basically entirely up to the label. Now, that's an oversimplification...there are independent reviews and such...but we all know that if the label doesn't put cash behind it, in general it's not going to happen. And bugging some DJ isn't going to do jack shit.
"When they were getting played, PMU and LIE both made major marks on Headbangers Ball. That in and of itself is a small market, but it's the WHOLE market of a hard rock/heavy metal station. When you combine the fact that a DJ is controlling the fact that the band isn't getting play, with the fact that there are requests coming in, I think that's a problem."
First, there were only a couple of requests, then there were a bunch of holier-than-thou mini-lectures on the state of music. Why should they cater to people who obviously don't like the station to start with? That's not part of their prospective listener base. Second, PMU and Headbanger's Ball was 7 years ago. We all hate to admit this, but we all know it's true: most of the people in that precious 18-34 or whatever demographic think it's a hoot to hear an old Ratt song, but they just laugh and ignore it when some band they consider a one-hit wonder of the hair age comes out with a new song. Look at the new singles over the last two years by Dokken, Crue, Scorpions, etc...they've all been complete stiffs, commercially. Yes, it's a sad statement on the attitude of Joe Radio Listener, but it's reality.
"If you think a DJ gets to play whatever he or she wants, you simply don't have any experience with radio in the real world. You don't get to play only things you like."
Uh, I never said that. I said the STATION as a whole plays what it wants; this is almost always dictated to the DJs. That Nick guy at 93x is one of the few exceptions...he does a hard metal show late fridays, and has quite a bit of latitude...which is why I think it would have paid to leave off the fascist commentary and all that other bullshit.
"How often do YOU like EVERYTHING you hear on your station in an hour?"
Never, and the stations know this. Studies have shown that the average listener will listen to talking for about 12 seconds before changing the channel, and will give a song less of a chance than that. People flip, the stations know that, and they try to avoid it as much as possible.
"I have never heard a full hour of radio in which something wasn't lame. So if someone dislikes DT, so be it. It won't be the reason they turn the station off forever. And I don't think you're leaving the possibility open that someone might actually ENJOY it."
Uh, I never said they'd turn it off forever. Don't put words in my mouth. I said they'd change the channel. And yes, a lot of people might enjoy it. What you all don't seem to get is that I'm not defending the way radio works, I'm just pointing out the reality. In this age of wholesale corporate conglomerate buyouts of radio, nobody gives a fuck about giving a single by what they think is some old hair band with no label support a chance. They want to feed people their AC/DC, Aerosmith and Limp Bizkit, and collect their dough. I think it sucks dick, but it's the way it is, and this little show of rebellion isn't going to change anything. Ya'll are only making enemies. That's my major point.
"Lastly, I take offense to your statement regarding "trying to get your opinions validated." That's a low shot, and it's also clearly not something that someone who gives a shit about the band would say."
What's your logic for this? Yeah, I think it'd be great if they had a platinum album and were on the radio. They make cool music, and it'd be cool to see 'em get some recognition for it. And yes it's cool to hear music you love on the radio. But, a) without label support it just ain't gonna happen, no matter how many requests hit some radio station and b) the tactics here were totally stupid and just antagonized the people that they were supposed to elicit help from.
"You don't have to try to help DT get airplay if you don't want to, but what kind of person are you to supress people who are trying to get them played?"
Again...I'm not trying to, and if you think I am, you're not reading carefully enough. As I keep saying, over and over and over, my point is simple...see the last paragraph, items A and B. I don't feel like typing it again.
-Brian
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 5130 **************************
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