YTSEJAM Digest 5970
Today's Topics:
1) Wheee! Jordan vs. Derek...
by "Paul Evans" <evansp3@corp.earthlink.net>
2) Re: Wheee! Jordan vs. Derek...
by "Internet Solutions Inc" <calfaro@yunque.net>
3) More on Jordan's influence on old songs
by "Tony/Alexis/Axel" <alexis1@prtc.net>
4) Amazon DT
by schew@interzone.com (Steve Chew)
5) Re: Amazon DT
by Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
6) Live Scenes from NY available...
by schew@interzone.com (Steve Chew)
7) Re: More on Jordan's influence on old songs
by JamesAhab@aol.com
8) OT: fantasy league password
by JamesAhab@aol.com
9) Re: More on Jordan's influence on old songs
by "Carlos A. Alfaro Hernandez" <calfaro@yunque.net>
10) Re: More on Jordan's influence on old songs
by Eric George <edgeorge@geneva.edu>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 10:19:54 -0700
From: "Paul Evans" <evansp3@corp.earthlink.net>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: Wheee! Jordan vs. Derek...
Message-ID: <002e01c142c1$a24162c0$0401a8c0@timmy>
Well, for what it's worth, I think DT is a vastly improved live band with
Jordan rather than Derek. I saw DT twive with KevMo, and they were great.
Then, when I saw them with Derek (twice), and listening to 5 Years in a
Livetime) it just seems like they got sloppy. I was really disappointed
with the shows. I've noticed a huge improvement in the tightness of their
live performances with Jordan. Maybe it's because he is SO technically
incredible, he inspires the rest of them to greater levels. I don't mean to
blame Derek for anything, it's just what I've noticed, and it may be
entirely coincidence that the performances I've seen have been that way.
Anyway, there are some incredible versions of older stuff on LSfNY, most
notably Learning To Live. I also really like this version of ACoS. James'
vocals on the Chill of November are just outstanding. Gives me
goosebumps...
Has anybody else noticed less high-end on DT cd's lately? I guess it's the
same on all new discs coming out. Probably to compensate for all the
different lisening environments that exist now. The mix is great, you can
hear everything very clearly, but it just seems to lack high end. Compare
the sound of SfaM to Awake, and you'll see what I mean. Maybe it's an
artifact of all the compression done to make discs seem "louder" these days.
I don't know, but I prefer the older production.
Oh well, I'm done...
Paul
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 13:38:21 -0400
From: "Internet Solutions Inc" <calfaro@yunque.net>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: Re: Wheee! Jordan vs. Derek...
Message-ID: <000501c142c4$3547b680$39351ec8@atenas>
> Has anybody else noticed less high-end on DT cd's lately? I guess it's
the
> same on all new discs coming out. Probably to compensate for all the
> different lisening environments that exist now. The mix is great, you can
> hear everything very clearly, but it just seems to lack high end. Compare
> the sound of SfaM to Awake, and you'll see what I mean. Maybe it's an
> artifact of all the compression done to make discs seem "louder" these
days.
> I don't know, but I prefer the older production.
>
Im totally with you on this, I know my sound systems arent audiophile stuff
by any
means, but comparing Awake/Acos for example, to the newer discs, they seem
to better
represents all frequencies equally, while newer discs like 5Yial, LSFNY, etc
seem
very mid-range oriented and sound muddier, even though the instruments
themselves
are very present, and audible, SFAM, IMo, is not as bad, but still doesnt
sound as good
its hard to describe what i feel, its sort of like Awake/Acos had like this
"togetherness" in the
mix of all instruments, while the newer discs seem like a mix of all the
instruments but all
of them coming from different directions sonically, instead of one big aural
eargasm...
heheh... its hard to explain in text though...
-Carlos
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 14:43:06 -0300
From: "Tony/Alexis/Axel" <alexis1@prtc.net>
To: "ytsejam" <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: More on Jordan's influence on old songs
Message-ID: <002101c142c4$e1881660$0201a8c0@pavilion>
Hello! Alright, the sounds might change a bit from the ones used by Derek,
bu that does not mean that the song is changed. That just means that he
plays pretty much the same thing as before but with a somewhat different
sound. But if you take what DT did to old songs when Derek was in the band
and compare it to what they have done to old songs now that Jordan joined,
you can see that the difference is mindblowing. Take, for example, Another
Hand/The Killing Hand. When Derek was in DT they almost redid the whole
song. Look at the intros done to LSOAD. Look at the Electric Version of
The Silent Man. Look at ACOS. Look at Caught in a Web (transformed into
CIA9ITG). All of those songs were changed in significant ways when Derek
was in the band. Changes like that have not been made to songs since Jordan
joined. I have no idea how much of an influence Derek was in making these
changes, but at least they happened when he was in the band. And I'm in no
way comparing Jordan and Derek. I'm just making the observation about songs
being changed. Enough for now.
Alexis
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 16:44:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: schew@interzone.com (Steve Chew)
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Amazon DT
Message-ID: <m15kXAL-000JltC@mail.interzone.com>
>>
>> I successfully ordered Live Scenes from NY from amazon.com and
>> they sent an email to confirm that the CDs have shipped. So, if you're
>> still looking for it, try amazon.
>
>My copy arrived today from Amazon, so they ARE shipping it. --Or were,
>as of the 15th or so.
>
>Playing the first disk right now -- sounds great! I'd swear I heard
>some treble drop-outs (sounded like a tape problem) earlier; I'll have
>to go back in a bit and listen again.
>
I got mine from amazon today too but I can't seem to find it
on the amazon web pages any more. :(
Steve
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 17:06:45 -0400
From: Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: Amazon DT
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20010921170623.00a644e0@mail.avnl1.nj.home.com>
I found it about two days ago, I do hope they are going to ship it. They
said it would take 5 to 7 days or so, so I am holding my breath.
At 04:56 PM 9/21/2001, you wrote:
> >>
> >> I successfully ordered Live Scenes from NY from amazon.com and
> >> they sent an email to confirm that the CDs have shipped. So, if you're
> >> still looking for it, try amazon.
> >
> >My copy arrived today from Amazon, so they ARE shipping it. --Or were,
> >as of the 15th or so.
> >
> >Playing the first disk right now -- sounds great! I'd swear I heard
> >some treble drop-outs (sounded like a tape problem) earlier; I'll have
> >to go back in a bit and listen again.
> >
>
> I got mine from amazon today too but I can't seem to find it
>on the amazon web pages any more. :(
>
> Steve
-- Damon Fibraio Musician, comedian, lover, and public menace email dfibraio@home.com aol instant messenger screenname: nhblive MSN Messenger screenname: dfibraio@hotmail.com Yahoo messenger name: Damon_m_f, web site: http://frontpage.home.net/dfibraio/ coHost of No Holds Barred Radio: see http://www.nhbradio.com for details Band sites: Awake: http://www.geocities.com/awake6am: Mystify: http://www.mystify2001.com "If I die tomorrow, I'll be all right, because I believe that after we're gone, the spirit carries on."--Dream Theater, in dedication to those who lost their lives on 09/11/01 God Bless the U.S.A.------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 17:46:44 -0400 (EDT) From: schew@interzone.com (Steve Chew) To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Live Scenes from NY available... Message-ID: <m15kY8C-000JltC@mail.interzone.com>
Hi again, After finding that amazon.com doesn't seem to list the CD Live Scenes from NY anymore, I went to www.bestwebbuys.com and searched for "Live Scenes from New York" and found that both www.800.com and www.mymusic.com seem to be selling it. Also, amazon.co.uk is still selling it. The best price I saw was at www.buy.com where they had it for $17.48 (plus shipping). If those places stop selling it, I'd suggest trying other shopping agents (similar to bestwebbuys). Just search for "shopping agents" on Yahoo. Good luck.
Steve
-- Steve Chew - schew@interzone.com - http://www.interzone.com #!/usr/bin/perl -w Decrypt your DVD # 531-byte qrpff-fast, Keith Winstein and Marc Horowitz <sipb-iap-dvd@mit.edu> # MPEG 2 PS VOB file on stdin -> descrambled output on stdout # arguments: title key bytes in least to most-significant order $_='while(read+STDIN,$_,2048){$a=29;$b=73;$c=142;$t=255;@t=map{$_%16or$t^=$c^=( $m=(11,10,116,100,11,122,20,100)[$_/16%8])&110;$t^=(72,@z=(64,72,$a^=12*($_%16 -2?0:$m&17)),$b^=$_%64?12:0,@z)[$_%8]}(16..271);if((@a=unx"C*",$_)[20]&48){$h =5;$_=unxb24,join"",@b=map{xB8,unxb8,chr($_^$a[--$h+84])}@ARGV;s/...$/1$&/;$ d=unxV,xb25,$_;$e=256|(ord$b[4])<<9|ord$b[3];$d=$d>>8^($f=$t&($d>>12^$d>>4^ $d^$d/8))<<17,$e=$e>>8^($t&($g=($q=$e>>14&7^$e)^$q*8^$q<<6))<<9,$_=$t[$_]^ (($h>>=8)+=$f+(~$g&$t))for@a[128..$#a]}print+x"C*",@a}';s/x/pack+/g;eval
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 04:04:15 EDT From: JamesAhab@aol.com To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: More on Jordan's influence on old songs Message-ID: <7c.1bf534b5.28dd9fff@aol.com>
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In a message dated 9/21/2001 2:43:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alexis1@prtc.net writes:
>< Hello!=A0 Alright, the sounds might change a bit from the ones used by Derek, bu that does not mean that the song is changed.=A0 That just means th at he plays pretty much the same thing as before but with a somewhat different sound.=A0 But if you take what DT did to old songs when Derek was in the ban d and compare it to what they have done to old songs now that Jordan joined, you can see that the difference is mindblowing.=A0 Take, for example, Anothe r Hand/The Killing Hand.=A0 When Derek was in DT they almost redid the whole song.=A0 Look at the intros done to LSOAD.=A0 Look at the Electric Version o f The Silent Man.=A0 Look at ACOS.=A0 Look at Caught in a Web (transformed into CIA9ITG).=A0 All of those songs were changed in significant ways when Derek was in the band.=A0 Changes like that have not been made to songs since Jordan joined.=A0 I have no idea how much of an influence Derek was in making these changes, but at least they happened when he was in the band.=A0 And I'm in n o way comparing Jordan and Derek.=A0 I'm just making the observation about son gs being changed.=A0 Enough for now. ><
Sure there've been changes to songs since Jordan joined. Caught In a Web/New Millenium/CIA9ITG became Caught In a New Millenium (God, that sentence must be as good as Greek to anybody not on this list, and - I'm willing to bet - a lot of people who *are* on this list), a reggae section was added to Learnin g To Live, and a short section towards the end of ACoS was added (where they d o The Simpsons, John Myung's "Charge!" thing, and another one I can't think of). And if I recall correctly, there were a few noticeable changes/addition s to Met. 1 with this tour. And that's just with one tour and one CD since Jordan. Derek was around for 3 tours and 2 CDs. So there have been changes, and Jordan hasn't been around as long as Derek has just yuet, so I guarantee we'll see some major overhauls on the next tour as we always do. I just hope Jordan doesn't attempt to play Wait For Sleep or Eve. I'd rather DT not play them than to see Jordan detsroy them with over-playing.
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Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 04:05:39 EDT From: JamesAhab@aol.com To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: OT: fantasy league password Message-ID: <b8.1bb552b5.28dda053@aol.com>
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In a message dated 9/20/2001 4:15:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, keil.s@web.de writes:
>< Hi all, just saw the European tourdates...February isn't that far away, is it?? Can't wait. I hope the new album is out by then.
Ytsejam Hockey League To sign up for the league: League ID#=A0 15046 Password=A0 =A0 dreamtheater
Have fun and pass the word so that the spots get filled really quick. ><
Sebastien, I joined up, but why don't you change it from rotiserrie to fantasy scoring. I'd rather pick my own team than have my team auto-drafted.
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Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 08:17:30 -0400 From: "Carlos A. Alfaro Hernandez" <calfaro@yunque.net> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: More on Jordan's influence on old songs Message-ID: <3BAC815A.DBE03391@yunque.net>
JamesAhab@aol.com wrote:
> Sure there've been changes to songs since Jordan joined. Caught In a Web/New > Millenium/CIA9ITG became Caught In a New Millenium
Ill give you this one, and its really a cool mix ...
> , a reggae section was added to Learning > To Live,
Which IMO is ghey as hell, and its just a reason to extend the song so that jordan can solo over it.. i dont know , there is just something that feels WRONG about a reggae section with KB solo inside such a powerful song like LTL
> and a short section towards the end of ACoS was added (where they do > The Simpsons, John Myung's "Charge!" thing, and another one I can't think > of).
This part was really fun, but they didnt add anything here, they just replace each one's little "solos" that come in that part of ACOS... and again all Jordan does is another of his little ragtime dittys (i think its the same one at the end of universal mind) and again IMO it sort of clashes with ACOS intense themes...
> And if I recall correctly, there were a few noticeable changes/additions > to Met. 1 with this tour.
These changes i really like, they go into a nice groove while james does his stage talk sounds really cool....
> And that's just with one tour and one CD since > Jordan. Derek was around for 3 tours and 2 CDs. So there have been changes, > and Jordan hasn't been around as long as Derek has just yuet, so I guarantee > we'll see some major overhauls on the next tour as we always do. I just hope > Jordan doesn't attempt to play Wait For Sleep or Eve. I'd rather DT not play > them than to see Jordan detsroy them with over-playing.
Agreed on both counts. Dont get me wrong, i think Jordan is an awesome player nobody can deny that...and i love 95% of his playing on SFAM during the whole band sections, my general problem lies within two things: his solos (i think he needs some variety on his phrasing, derek also suffered from this, Kev had excellent phrasing) and his wacky sounds, which some i really really like (ie: beyond this life zappa-esque section) but some i dislike....
-Carlos A. Alfaro
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 11:37:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric George <edgeorge@geneva.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Re: More on Jordan's influence on old songs Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.1010922113224.1570A-100000@sparcy.geneva.edu>
> I just hope Jordan doesn't attempt to play Wait For Sleep or Eve. I'd rather DT not play them than to see Jordan detsroy them with over-playing. >
on this point i must agree wholeheartedly. at least when derek was with them, he stayed very true to those two songs, keeping them the way the were so as not to "break the spell" so-to-speak that's created by those two gorgeous songs. the best representation i have heard of this can be found on the 2cd "acoustic" Rotterdam fanclub gig. they play both of these songs, & they are just as powerful as they were back in the day. props to Kevmo for the songwriting, & props to Derek for realizing that if it's not broke, don't fix it. :) peace.
-eric
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