YTSEJAM Digest 6523
Today's Topics:
1) RE: RE: pre-studio writing
by "Stephen Gervois" <stephen.gervois@free.fr>
2) RE: Subject: Current Dream Theater/Queensrche Tour Dates
by Scott Hansen <schansen@cts.com>
3) RE: pre-studio writing
by Scott Hansen <schansen@cts.com>
4) SFAM NOT prewritten....
by Eric George <drizzt@sdf.lonestar.org>
5) RE: Subject: Current Dream Theater/Queensrche Tour Dates
by "Niall Connaughton" <ytsejam@bigpond.net.au>
6) RE: SFAM NOT prewritten....
by "Niall Connaughton" <ytsejam@bigpond.net.au>
7) RE: Subject: Current Dream Theater/Queensrche Tour Dates
by Eric George <drizzt@sdf.lonestar.org>
8) Tour Dates ...
by Ryan P Skadberg <skadz@dreamt.org>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 08:57:43 +0200
From: "Stephen Gervois" <stephen.gervois@free.fr>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: RE: RE: pre-studio writing
Message-ID: <000a01c30640$fa7d86f0$08b6fea9@cyco>
> Do you count that as
> pre-written?
Niall,
OK You have a point :
But I guess there sometimes is a very thin line between pre/post-written
material.
A definition is needed as I suppose there's always ideas between the DT
members before a studio session.
So if the definition is :
Pre-written material is demos of finished songs (like "TaMP" on FII for ex)
before the studio sessions.
In this respect I agree that SFAM was not pre-written as the met2 demo was a
string of ideas and not a "finished" entity.
Well thanks for showing me the correct track I could've gotten lost ;)
ACBLF
> If you are going to say that SFaM was pre-written, you have to acknowledge
> that it was pre-written about 5-6 years before the album was released, and
> most of what was pre-written is not found in the actual album. For the
most
> part, they wrote that album in the studio as they recorded.
>
> I think their whole write while recording thing started off with LTE.
> Everything from LTE onwards was written in the studio. I don't count the
Met
> 2 demo as a demo for the album. Neither does MP, I think, because he tried
> so hard to stop it getting out because it wasn't intended to be a polished
> demo.
>
> I'm sure I remember MP saying something along the lines of after FII, they
> asked the record label to give them the chance to do things their way, and
> they didn't make any demos, didn't give anything to the label, they wrote
it
> all in the studio. Sure, they used some of the themes they'd done before,
> but not too much. Also, you can hear some of Beyond This Life in one of
JP's
> live solos from some time before SFaM was released. Do you count that as
> pre-written?
>
> Niall
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ytsejam@torchsong.com [mailto:ytsejam@torchsong.com]On Behalf Of
> > Stephen Gervois
> > Sent: Friday, 18 April 2003 4:45 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list
> > Subject: pre-studio writing
> >
> >
> > >I believe all albums up till FII were.
> > >SFAM and 6DOIT were written in the studio.
> >
> > No : I believe 90% of the ideas on SFAM were written beforehand.
> > 6DOIT was written in the studio.
> >
> > As far as I know (correct me if I'm wrong):
> > WDADU; IAW; CoS; Aw; FII; SFAM were all pre-written => as I've heard
DEMOs
> > from them all except Awake.
> > 6DOIT was the only studio written.
> >
> > DT has heard the critics from the fans on this way of writting.
> > So they've brought back, what I think of being, their best way of song
> > writting, after reflection on this criticism ! :)
> >
> > But the most important question is :
> > HOW ARE WE GOING TO WAIT THE WHOLE SUMMER ! ?
> >
> > See ye soon,
> > ACBLF
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 01:55:53 -0700
From: Scott Hansen <schansen@cts.com>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: RE: Subject: Current Dream Theater/Queensrche Tour Dates
Message-ID: <BAC65D29.622F%schansen@cts.com>
In a mind-blowing e-mail sent on the extremely historic date of 4/18/03 9:06
PM, Niall Connaughton thusly spaketh:
> Hmm, this got me thinking... DT should dump MP and get Virgil.
>
> Or even better, just add Virgil, I dig the two drummer sound. Then they will
> have to play in Australia!
While I know this comment was tongue-in-cheek, I have to give a resounding
"NO"! While Virgil might be able to play some things MP can't, as someone
else pointed out, MP can probably play some things that Virgil can't - after
all, Virgil *was* in a DT tribute band before moving to the US to make it
big on his own...
More importantly, MP *is* DT. While he is not the only one in DT, he is most
certainly the driving force behind DT and it is he you can thank for all the
extra goodies that we as DT fans have begun to take for granted (FC CDs) and
will take for granted (official bootlegs - both audio and video).
Scott
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 02:06:35 -0700
From: Scott Hansen <schansen@cts.com>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: RE: pre-studio writing
Message-ID: <BAC65FAB.6230%schansen@cts.com>
Well, Niall's right and Stephen's smoking crack! Stephen, I dunno *where*
you got your info that SFaM was written beforehand, because it has been well
documented that SFaM was the first album that was simultaneously
written/recorded in the studio. Granted, they had written the original 96
version of Metropolis pt 2 with Derek, but the only things that really
carried over from the original 96 demo to SFaM were Overture 1928, The Dance
of Eternity and One Last Time - the rest (which is certainly more than 10%)
was written in the studio.
Need more proof? How abooot this quote from the interview I did with MP last
year:
SH: Have you or will you ever combine using the older method of bringing a
demo in and combining it with the spontaneous writing style you now use?
Because I know in TransAtlantic, there were certain ideas that were brought
in from Neal and from Roine originally in demo form, and then you guys
worked on that. Did you ever do that with Dream Theater or would you do that
in the future? Was everything in Scenes and Six Degrees completely fresh?
MP: I don't know about the future, anything's possible. We generally work in
the studio, and with both Scenes and Six Degrees, there was very little that
we pulled from the past. The only exceptions that I can think of were the
1928 Overture, which was taken from the original Metropolis part II the 20
minute version from 1996. But other than that, for Scenes we pretty much
started fresh. And then with Six Degrees, one of the main heavy riffs from
The Glass Prison: da da digidada digidada dadadada [recites guitar riff
found at 1:45 in The Glass Prison] that was something that John Myung and
myself jammed on back on the Falling Into Infinity sessions, and I had it
sitting around on a DAT. We tried to work it in while we were doing Scenes,
but it got brushed aside; and once again when we started Six Degrees, I
pulled it out and we finally utilized it. But for the most part, those
albums were pretty much written fresh. There are cases where John Petrucci
will come in with a progression or an idea - that's the way Regression, The
Spirit Carries On, Through Her Eyes and Solitary Shell began. Or Jordan will
have some bits and pieces, and he'll bring them in. But they're not demos;
they're progressions, riffs and things like that, that we'll develop
together.
Scott
In a mind-blowing e-mail sent on the extremely historic date of 4/18/03 9:06
PM, Niall Connaughton thusly spaketh:
> If you are going to say that SFaM was pre-written, you have to acknowledge
> that it was pre-written about 5-6 years before the album was released, and
> most of what was pre-written is not found in the actual album. For the most
> part, they wrote that album in the studio as they recorded.
>
> I think their whole write while recording thing started off with LTE.
> Everything from LTE onwards was written in the studio. I don't count the Met
> 2 demo as a demo for the album. Neither does MP, I think, because he tried
> so hard to stop it getting out because it wasn't intended to be a polished
> demo.
>
> I'm sure I remember MP saying something along the lines of after FII, they
> asked the record label to give them the chance to do things their way, and
> they didn't make any demos, didn't give anything to the label, they wrote it
> all in the studio. Sure, they used some of the themes they'd done before,
> but not too much. Also, you can hear some of Beyond This Life in one of JP's
> live solos from some time before SFaM was released. Do you count that as
> pre-written?
>
> Niall
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: ytsejam@torchsong.com [mailto:ytsejam@torchsong.com]On Behalf Of
>> Stephen Gervois
>> Sent: Friday, 18 April 2003 4:45 PM
>> To: Multiple recipients of list
>> Subject: pre-studio writing
>>
>>
>>> I believe all albums up till FII were.
>>> SFAM and 6DOIT were written in the studio.
>>
>> No : I believe 90% of the ideas on SFAM were written beforehand.
>> 6DOIT was written in the studio.
>>
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 09:45:42 +0000 (UTC)
From: Eric George <drizzt@sdf.lonestar.org>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: SFAM NOT prewritten....
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.33.0304190940030.16998-100000@norge.freeshell.org>
well, we've had a lot of stuff pointing out the fact that SFAM was NOT
prewritten. to add to that list of proofs, in MP's Liquid Drum Theater
videos, he flat out says that he didn't have a whole lot of time to work
out his drum parts & refine them because they were writing as they
recorded, only taking a couple of days to write certain sections, record
them, and move on to other things. if that's not definite enough of an
answer for someone, i don't know what is.
-- Best Regards, Independent Computer Consultant, Eric George -Tech Guru's"The least important things in life get the most appreciation. The most important things in life don't seem to get enough." -me
Proud "Trillian" user http://www.ceruleanstudios.com AIM screename: Ryften13 ICQ #: 163843613 drizzt@sdf.lonestar.org (text-based email) schnerck@hotmail.com -or- peruvian@dreamtheater.zzn.com (HTML-based email) SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org Progressive Musician's Forum - http://www0.org/cgi-bin/YaBB/YaBB.cgi#general
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 01:01:02 +1000 From: "Niall Connaughton" <ytsejam@bigpond.net.au> To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: RE: Subject: Current Dream Theater/Queensrche Tour Dates Message-ID: <OPEJJAPFDGDMCLAHLLIMIEKPCOAA.ytsejam@bigpond.net.au>
> -----Original Message----- > From: ytsejam@torchsong.com [mailto:ytsejam@torchsong.com]On Behalf Of > Scott Hansen > Sent: Saturday, 19 April 2003 6:52 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: RE: Subject: Current Dream Theater/Queensrche Tour Dates > > While I know this comment was tongue-in-cheek, I have to give a resounding > "NO"! While Virgil might be able to play some things MP can't, as someone > else pointed out, MP can probably play some things that Virgil > can't - after > all, Virgil *was* in a DT tribute band before moving to the US to make it > big on his own...
Yeah, it was tongue in cheek :P There's certainly no DT without MP. Virgil is the most amazing drummer that I've ever seen. I watch his shows like a circus act, almost :P But I wouldn't want his style of playing in DT. Kinda the same as Steve Vai is an amazing guitarist, but I'd never buy one of his albums ;P
> extra goodies that we as DT fans have begun to take for granted > (FC CDs) and > will take for granted (official bootlegs - both audio and video).
I want the chance to take live shows for granted like so many in the US seem to (*cough cough Kurt* :P)
Niall
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 01:07:06 +1000 From: "Niall Connaughton" <ytsejam@bigpond.net.au> To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: RE: SFAM NOT prewritten.... Message-ID: <OPEJJAPFDGDMCLAHLLIMOEKPCOAA.ytsejam@bigpond.net.au>
In further news..
Happy Birthday to Mike :P
Niall
> -----Original Message----- > From: ytsejam@torchsong.com [mailto:ytsejam@torchsong.com]On Behalf Of > Eric George > Sent: Saturday, 19 April 2003 7:53 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: SFAM NOT prewritten.... > > > well, we've had a lot of stuff pointing out the fact that SFAM was NOT > prewritten. to add to that list of proofs, in MP's Liquid Drum Theater > videos, he flat out says that he didn't have a whole lot of time to work > out his drum parts & refine them because they were writing as they > recorded, only taking a couple of days to write certain sections, record > them, and move on to other things. if that's not definite enough of an > answer for someone, i don't know what is.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 00:16:32 +0000 (UTC) From: Eric George <drizzt@sdf.lonestar.org> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: RE: Subject: Current Dream Theater/Queensrche Tour Dates Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.33.0304200014410.18329-100000@norge.freeshell.org>
On Sat, 19 Apr 2003, Niall Connaughton wrote:
> Kinda the same as Steve Vai is an amazing guitarist, but I'd never buy > one of his albums ;P
hmmmmmmm......
> I want the chance to take live shows for granted like so many in the US seem > to (*cough cough Kurt* :P)
BWWAAAAAAAHHHAAAAAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
-- Best Regards, Independent Computer Consultant, Eric George -Tech Guru's
"The least important things in life get the most appreciation. The most important things in life don't seem to get enough." -me
Proud "Trillian" user http://www.ceruleanstudios.com AIM screename: Ryften13 ICQ #: 163843613 drizzt@sdf.lonestar.org (text-based email) schnerck@hotmail.com -or- peruvian@dreamtheater.zzn.com (HTML-based email) SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org Progressive Musician's Forum - http://www0.org/cgi-bin/YaBB/YaBB.cgi#general
------------------------------
Date: 19 Apr 2003 21:23:36 -0400 From: Ryan P Skadberg <skadz@dreamt.org> To: Ytsejam Mailing List <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Tour Dates ... Message-ID: <1050801815.17449.2.camel@codewarrior.stigmata.org>
I said CURRENT, not FINAL :P
Skadz
-- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ryan P Skadberg E: skadz@dreamt.org Ytsejam Moderator U: http://www.dreamt.org/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- GPG fingerprint = 0B97 F771 E7D2 69B2 FF5C 5693 4E25 7E77 DEF0 CA4B -----------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
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