YTSEJAM Digest 490
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Petrucci hits a bad note!
by Tim Villa <tvilla@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
2) Re: Ytsejam 487?
by kbibb@arastar.com (Ken Bibb)
3) Re: YTSEJAM digest 489
by Peter Zondag <pzondag@vsl.ist.ucf.edu>
4) lie...MP2
by Matthew M Leger <mml@kepler.unh.edu>
5) Re: Petrucci hits a bad note!
by Eric Moegling <emoeglin@bigcat.missouri.edu>
6) Re: Petrucci hits a bad note!
by Eric Moegling <emoeglin@bigcat.missouri.edu>
7) Re: SDV stuff
by Michael Burstin <mikeb@cs.brandeis.edu>
8) Dream Theater, Hellborg, etc.
by "backof michael ( bs ifsm)" <mbacko1@umbc.edu>
9) Re: Kevin, me, who
by freak@salyko.cube.net
10) Waiting for DT
by wkriski@enci.ucalgary.ca (William Kriski)
11) Re: YTSEJAM digest 489
by "James Studnicki (HON)" <studnick@soleil.acomp.usf.edu>
12) more about AWAKE
by Kaoru Kobayashi <GCH06672@niftyserve.or.jp>
13) Re: Kevin, me, who
by zack@lsil.com (Zack Gemmill)
14) Re: Petrucci hits a bad note!
by EMRST2@vms.cis.pitt.edu
15) Re: SDV stuff
by EMRST2@vms.cis.pitt.edu
16) Re: Kevin, me, who (info on Jordan)
by Tymoteusz Altman <altman@sfu.ca>
17) Re: more about AWAKE
by William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com>
18) Re: SDV stuff
by William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com>
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Topic No. 1
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 12:23:54 +0800 (WST)
From: Tim Villa <tvilla@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: Petrucci hits a bad note!
Message-ID: <199408180423.MAA23995@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
I was listening to LATM last night and bugger me if I didn't hear JP hit
a bad note in the solo to AFIL (man aren't these acronyms getting a
little out of hand??). Please nobody flame me for pointing this out cos
I KNOW everyone makes mistakes, but once you actually pick it out you
never miss it again...it's awful!! Still, I recall there being a
discussion regarding bad notes a while ago and people always found them
interesting to know so I thought I'd point it out.
Tim
-- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim Villa tvilla@uniwa.uwa.edu.au Pantera Digest: mail subscription requests to pantera-req@uniwa.uwa.edu.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Connection closed by foreign host.------------------------------
Topic No. 2
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 1994 21:38:52 +0800 From: kbibb@arastar.com (Ken Bibb) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: Ytsejam 487? Message-ID: <9408180438.AA14498@anthor.arastar.com>
> ------------------------------ > > Topic No. 4 > > Date: Wed, 17 Aug 1994 00:18:19 -0700 > From: JWEST@MHZ.COM > To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com > Subject: Ytsejam 487? > Message-ID: <se515750.066@MHZ.COM> > > Is it just me, or did Ytsejam Digest 487 not get sent out? I never received > it.
It hasn't been announced officially, so I guess it's time :)
The listserv on arastar.com is automatically archiving all digests of ytsejam. So if you want a back issue or if you want to verify if a digest was created, you can send your requests to ytsejam-request@arastar.com (or listserv@arastar.com) and get the info that you want.
Here are the commands:
index ytsejam
This command will list all of the ytsejam archived files.
get ytsejam ytsejam.487
This will retrieve issue 487 from the archive.
I'll be putting all of the back issues (back to #1) out as soon as I get the other hard drive online.
-- Ken Bibb "Voices of angels filling our hearts jester@arastar.com With the truth of our blazing defiance" jester@crash.cts.com --Galadriel "The Gray Stones of Escalia"
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Topic No. 3
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 02:05:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Peter Zondag <pzondag@vsl.ist.ucf.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 489 Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9408180129.B19316-0100000@crash.vsl.ist.ucf.edu>
Jim Studnicki, how can you even compare John Petrucci's improvising to Miles Davis, John Coltrane, John Scofield, etc.? Obviously, there is not even one similarity between the two styles of music. I'm not angry at all, and I definitely DON'T want to argue, but to say that one of those guys is a better or worse improviser than Petrucci is pretty ludicrous. Trevor LaBonte
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Topic No. 4
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 01:17:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Matthew M Leger <mml@kepler.unh.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: lie...MP2 Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9408180107.A8091-0100000@kepler.unh.edu>
Howdy all,
I downloaded the 8 meg .wav version of Lie. The song kicks ass but the quality is far from what I desired. I then downloaded the lie#.mp2. This didn't work with my waveplayer or anything. What do I need to run this file??? I need the 44khz at 16 bit!!!!!
Thanks,
----------------------------------------------------------------------- || Matt Leger || || || mml@kepler.unh.edu || "Winning isn't everything... || ||------------------------|| it's the ONLY thing." || || || Chevrolet commercial || -----------------------------------------------------------------------
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Topic No. 5
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 01:33:24 -0500 (CDT) From: Eric Moegling <emoeglin@bigcat.missouri.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Re: Petrucci hits a bad note! Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9408180136.A27251-0100000@bigcat>
You want to talk bad notes? I got a ton of em...and they all have James LaBrie written all over them! (try UaGM on DOE..."Blackened summer sk<hack>i-eye...") more to come if you want em!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------- According to the circle of fifths, and the pattern of sharps and flats: If the alphabet continued as notes progressed (Using Major Key Sig's) (i.e A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, etc.) eventually the key of Z Major would have 4 sharps.
ERIC MOEGLING: emoeglin@freenet.scri.fsu.edu as297@freenet.hsc.colorado.edu
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Topic No. 6
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 01:48:47 -0500 (CDT) From: Eric Moegling <emoeglin@bigcat.missouri.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Re: Petrucci hits a bad note! Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9408180131.A27251-0100000@bigcat>
Oh yeah...it's way beautiful...I love it!!! (I'm taking about the last post)...it's at precisly 2:25 on the CD (track #3 for those morons who can't figure it out)...and Gosh it's just loverly <says in a Gomer kind of voice>. Later!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------- According to the circle of fifths, and the pattern of sharps and flats: If the alphabet continued as notes progressed (Using Major Key Sig's) (i.e A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, etc.) eventually the key of Z Major would have 4 sharps.
ERIC MOEGLING: emoeglin@freenet.scri.fsu.edu as297@freenet.hsc.colorado.edu
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Topic No. 7
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 09:35:49 -0500 (EDT) From: Michael Burstin <mikeb@cs.brandeis.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: SDV stuff Message-ID: <199408181335.JAA07060@rasp.cs.brandeis.edu>
> From: William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com> > Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 488 (a few) > > > SDV is not an instrumental... They just don't have them yet... SDV > > Just curious, but how did they get all the other lyrics from the other > songs except this one? >
This was one of Kevin's very personal songs... I guess that he never got around writing them down... perhaps for reasons why we all know by now... I just do KNOW that Kevin DID write lyrics for them.
> > was one of Kevin's own personal demo. Now, speaking of Kevin, and > > No, its very doubltful... who was the singer and why did he produce these > demos anyway? > Kevin was the singer on his own demos... As I said before, I this was all TOLD to me... I have not heard it... The demos were not really produced... Just something that Kevin did with a personal recorder...
>I'm glad he doesn't write lyrics like that for DT songs. >
Well, first off, check out Pull Me Under, Surrounded, Wait For Sleep, 6:00, Lie, and I am _guessing_ the sampled version of Eve... I don't really know how you can say that (or am I misinterpreting what you said).
> ------------------------------ > > From: Kaoru Kobayashi <GCH06672@niftyserve.or.jp> > Subject: Re:Space Dye Vest??? > > Yes, Space Dye Vest is an instrumental tune. It bigins with very beautiful > Piano sound, and the latter half, heavy guitar joins. This tune written by > Kevin. The very heartbreaking experence inspired him and he wrote this tune.
I am just wondering... Where did you hear that? I know you are in Japan... but I also know what I have heard about KEvin's demo for the song... There were DEFINATLY lyrics on his track.
> This is very personal tune, I think. I wonder DT play it after Kevin left... > I want to listen to all of AWAKE as soon as possible!!! >
I have actually been wondering about this, and discussing this with a fellow reader... My opinion was that they will play it, as a tribute to Kevin and everything that he has done with the band... (I am guessing that they keep WFS, but might dump Eve from the set list :( b/c it was done for most of the I&W tour, and was really soooo much of a key/Kevin tune... ) Again... I really don't have any clue... this is just a complete guess...
-- +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Caught In A Web | | Numb from the world | | Hanging on by a thread | | Scared of the life that fights in my head | | Dream Theater Caught In A Web Awake | | release date for Dream Theater's Awake: October 4, 1994 | +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Michael Burstin Brandeis University | +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ For info about Dream Theater, finger mikeb@cs.brandeis.edu
------------------------------
Topic No. 8
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 10:06:20 -0400 (EDT) From: "backof michael ( bs ifsm)" <mbacko1@umbc.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Dream Theater, Hellborg, etc. Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9408180924.A7718-0100000@umbc8.umbc.edu>
I picked up the Jonas Hellborg Group album yesterday and I was greatly impressed by the musicianship. Furious organ, agile bass, and exceptional drumming, I would recommend this album to even those of you who are solely metal and prog metal listeners, it is quite good. So far Dog Bar-B-Q is the song that has stood out as the best on the album, but I'll give it a few more listens. (Jonas Hellborg Group features Jonas Hellborg, Anders Johansson, and Jens Johansson). I also picked up a Mastermind album entitled Brainstorm, sounds like ELP from the old days jumping head first into prog metal with a MIDI guitar. Good stuff.
Since I was feeling good I also picked up Inside Out by Fate's Warning and I would like to put in my vote that so far it is more in line with Perfect Symmetry than Parallels, I am enjoying it and no bad vibes are surfacing so I'll say it is a good album. <grin> I'll join a million others and give a review in a few days.
Mike Bahr's Feel the Rush Music compilation has some really rare and amusing stuff on it, I like the late 70's and mid 70's video, Geddy was such a charming guy in his kimono and in his disco garb. Kinda scary, but it silences all of those who think he is a bad dresser now. I was disappointed how lacking the generation was on some of the 80's stuff and on the Presto concert footage, in some cases the 70's TV stuff has much better generation, odd but I bought it for the material and not to get a perfect studio video. I think all serious Rush fans will really enjoy it, thanks Mike for your time and efforts on this thing.
I would like to offer my best to Jens and hope that DT does decide to go with you after the first few gigs go through, though those chances seem slim now. Thanks for all of the info, that is why I love this list, complete anarchy but everyone seems to know something about what is going on.
Mike (AKA BRadbury) mbacko1@umbc.edu
BTW. I have a list if anyone on here wants to trade material, send me your list and I will send you mine.
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Topic No. 9
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 08:51:10 +0800 From: freak@salyko.cube.net To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: Kevin, me, who Message-ID: <9408181551.AA17589@anthor.arastar.com>
> for the time being, they have decided to go with a guy named Jordan > Rudess. He'll at least do the Foundations gig with them in a 'sideman' > type capacity. As far as I could tell that's what they wanted for now, > ie: not a full member, rather: a replacement to do the tour. And it > seems it's not decided that Jordan will do the tour, they want to try > out other people, and I suspect it'll probably take some time.
Well, by reading this letter I somehow got the feeling that some of our masterguys who have lots of contacts and so on should maybe do a little collection of mail who went around here last weeks concerning the kevin/jens/DT question and send them to DT/their office. Maybe some ideas need to be pushed a bit....
> writing and playing, and it's going to be interesting to see what he's > going to come up with. I heard some material very briefly in the > management office, stuff that "didn't end up on Awake", and it was > excellent. Hard to describe, very emotional. I hope he arrives safely in
Thats really sad for me, because what I liked most on DTs music was that was (in my eyes) the excellent expression of strong emotions and that it was very emotional inm spite of all the heavieness.....
Well, my last hope is, that after all things will turn out to be better this way, maybe DT will continue to give us brilliant music and maybe kevin will at the same time do something excellent as well....then we had two really cool ex-DT-bands.....
bye, Freak
this way, maybe DT will continue to give us brilliant music and maybe kevin will at the same time do something excellent as well....then we had two really cool ex-DT-bands.....
bye, Freak
(Well, must admit, thinking of saga, what they and the other people were in the separated phase....wasnt really good....)
( Alexander Reinelt from Munich/Germany ) freak@cube.net Alex_Reinelt@2:2480/66 ( fax: 49-89-689 18 71 mobile phone & tape: 49-171-622 03 40 ) "Love is not just a passing away...it`s a stay upon" (Dream Theater)
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Topic No. 10
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 10:25:06 MDT From: wkriski@enci.ucalgary.ca (William Kriski) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Waiting for DT Message-ID: <9408181625.AA13283@dragon>
If anyone is dying waiting for the new DT album (or Queensryche for that matter) and hasn't heard any Fates Warning, I would suggest you go out and buy it. I recently bought their newest one and I must say that it has really grown on me. I have four of their CD's now and even though at first it was to hold me until the new DT, I have really grown to like their music a lot. The newer ones are definitely mellower and less rhythmically complicated, but they are excellent. If your strictly looking for complexity (along with some heavy riffs), you'll get it with No Exit.
Also, I have a question regarding the digest. On digest 489 there was a letter from Jens describing the situation with him and DT, and on the same digest a response to that letter (topic 11). I was wondering how that is possible. Is the digest sent out at different times?
Just wondering,
Will
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Topic No. 11
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 11:56:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "James Studnicki (HON)" <studnick@soleil.acomp.usf.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 489 Message-ID: <Pine.3.87.9408180954.A11637-0100000@soleil>
On Thu, 18 Aug 1994, Peter Zondag wrote:
> Jim Studnicki, how can you even compare John Petrucci's improvising to > Miles Davis, John Coltrane, John Scofield, etc.?
I agree -- you can't. I didn't even attempt to -- it wouldn't be fair. These guys are in a class by themselves. You're right in respect to the fact that John Petrucci can't improvise as well as any of the above. They can play over anything thrown at them. Rock players tend to think more in terms of what arpeggios and scales/modes they can play over a given chord. Jazz musicians think in terms of chord tones (i.e. those notes in a given chord which give the chord its sound. Ex.: Over a major 7th chord the musician would target the major third and major seventh over the root and fifth, as these tones make the chord sound different from other chords. It really doesn't matter what notes you play in between as long as you end on the chord tones. Prime example: Allan Holdsworth.) The trouble with trying to use the rock approach over changes occuring every two bars is that by the time you've figured out what key you're in, and found the scale/arp in the closest available position, the song is already on the next chord!
Jazz improvisors, in general, phrase much more tastily than rock players. One of the things which totally infuriated me about seeing Petrucci play was the amount of overplaying that he was guilty of. The song that was being created seemed to take a backseat to his chops. There were no individual phrases. EVERYTHING was a steady stream of sixteenth notes or tripletted sixteenth notes. It was almost like standing on the stage and shouting, "Hey, I can do this! Don't all of you guys wish you could?"
> Obviously, there is not > even one similarity between the two styles of music.
You know I've got to rage about that one. There are very many similarities between the two styles of music. Jazz doesn't have to sound like Kenny G., fortunately. Lots of guitar players who are considered great jazz musicians have been known to play through a wall of Marshall stacks. There's a lot of jazz and fusion stuff out there that has tons of musical elements that a lot of prog. people think are cool -- lots of key changes, odd meters, exotic modes, arpeggios 'o plenty, big interval skips, etc. I believe that the majority of jazz musicians, with a few notable exceptions ( *cough* FG!!! ooops) consider all of that stuff to be the means to an end rather than the end itself. Metal players/fans (prog. and otherwise) have a tendency to get caught up in the physical aspect of guitar playing -- sweeping, two-handed stuff, ultra-fast alternate picking, etc.). Obviously, I don't have a problem with that stuff (I use all of those things in my own playing!), but the focus must always be on how the elements can contribute to the song and the vibe it creates, rather than "How can the song work to support my chops?"
Jim Studnicki studnick@soleil.acomp.usf.edu University of South Florida Tampa, Florida, USA
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Topic No. 12
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 04:26:00 JST From: Kaoru Kobayashi <GCH06672@niftyserve.or.jp> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: more about AWAKE Message-ID: <199408181925.EAA14629@inetnif.niftyserve.or.jp>
I've heard that AWAKE will be released with a bonus track in Japan... I don't know what song will be a bonus track, but this is decided.
I also heard that some lyrics of AWAKE. John(M) wrote Lifting Shadows Off A Dream. According to John, this song tells that all people have the duality exists between man and woman, and understanding it, it helps a couple help each other. 6:00 was written by Kevin. James told Kev about his friend working at a factory. He want to be a musician, but the situation don't permit. His life itself let him live. Kevin thought that life must not be like his life and people must live with they want to do, so wrote this song. James wrote Caught In A Web. This song about a person suppressed his/her feelings long time. How will be the person ? It's like caught in a web....so, people must express their feelings.
I've not listened to any tracks of AWAKE, and I have a question. I've heard that a track include "Puppies On Acid".Is it true? And which track is it? I want to listen to AWAKE as soon!! *********************************************************************** * " If spirit's a sign, then it's only a matter of time. " * * Kaoru Kobayashi gch06672@niftyserve.or.jp (from Japan) * ***********************************************************************
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Topic No. 13
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 10:25:46 PDT From: zack@lsil.com (Zack Gemmill) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: Kevin, me, who Message-ID: <9408181725.AA02223@fas2.lsil.com>
Thanks for the info Jens. What you said about your conversation with Kevin really got me down. I hope he finds what he's looking for. This has really given me a sense of foreboding about the future of DT (so many personnel changes over the past years)...
Zach
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Topic No. 14
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 17:29:26 -0500 (EST) From: EMRST2@vms.cis.pitt.edu To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: Petrucci hits a bad note! Message-ID: <01HG29L5KF4Y9SAVQ1@vms.cis.pitt.edu>
>I was listening to LATM last night and bugger me if I didn't hear JP hit >a bad note in the solo to AFIL (man aren't these acronyms getting a >little out of hand??). Please nobody flame me for pointing this out cos >I KNOW everyone makes mistakes, but once you actually pick it out you >never miss it again...it's awful!! Still, I recall there being a >discussion regarding bad notes a while ago and people always found them >interesting to know so I thought I'd point it out.
>Tim
Here's even more: In the same song, Portnoy misses one hit of the snare in the middle part (repetitive phrase on snare drum) about 2/3 of the way through. Also, I just noticed last night, but on the inner sleeve of WDADU in the credits for AFIL, it says "Music: Dream TheatRE .. " which is one of Petrucci's biggest gripes. Just more trivia for ya all. This song just seems to be a curse - but a damn great song at that.
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Topic No. 15
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 17:53:21 -0500 (EST) From: EMRST2@vms.cis.pitt.edu To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: SDV stuff Message-ID: <01HG2AD5QFQA9SAVQ1@vms.cis.pitt.edu>
>This was one of Kevin's very personal songs... I guess that he never >got around writing them down... perhaps for reasons why we all know >by now... I just do KNOW that Kevin DID write lyrics for them.
I had an idea about the whole situation, that struck me when Jens last posted. He said that Kevin was very hesitant to hear SDV after formal production. Do you think that maybe the band took this tune further than he ever intended for it. Or perhaps in the wrong direction. I'd be interested to hear the version on his demo and the version on Awake, and perhaps this could clear some of the "musical differences" up.
>I have actually been wondering about this, and discussing this with a >fellow reader... My opinion was that they will play it, as a tribute >to Kevin and everything that he has done with the band... (I am >guessing that they keep WFS, but might dump Eve from the set list :( >b/c it was done for most of the I&W tour, and was really soooo much of >a key/Kevin tune... ) Again... I really don't have any clue... >this is just a complete guess...
Eve was done for MOST? of the I&W tour? This strikes me weird since it only appears on one or two legs of the tour, according to the bootleg list (cass- ette) which divides the recordings by set lists. How many boots that we know of have Eve on it? Only 2 or 3, right? Also, is there 2 versions of Eve out there, 1 with vocals and one without? This is probably in the FAQ, so I'll go there next. I just can't remember.
KAI
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Topic No. 16
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 15:50:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Tymoteusz Altman <altman@sfu.ca> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: Kevin, me, who (info on Jordan) Message-ID: <9408182250.AA06869@malibu.sfu.ca>
i haven't been able to confirm this, but i think that Jordan appears on Vinnie Moore's Time Oddessey cd. is there anyone out there who has this cd and can confirm this? what do you guys think of his playing? i'll go home tonight, and put the cd on, and hear for myself. it's been a while since i listened to the cd.
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Topic No. 17
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 18:35:46 -0500 (CDT) From: William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: more about AWAKE Message-ID: <199408182335.SAA04393@galaxy.galstar.com>
> I've heard that AWAKE will be released with a bonus track in Japan... I > don't know what song will be a bonus track, but this is decided.
Hm... unless Japanese CD players can play longer than 75 minutes, I seriously doubt this. :) Awake will be almost 75 minutes.
> I've not listened to any tracks of AWAKE, and I have a question. I've heard > that a track include "Puppies On Acid".Is it true? And which track is it? > I want to listen to AWAKE as soon!!
Uhm... yes, its on there, however its renamed. Awake definetly sounds awesome and I can't wait for it....
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Topic No. 18
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 20:17:39 -0500 (CDT) From: William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: SDV stuff Message-ID: <199408190117.UAA05348@galaxy.galstar.com>
> >I'm glad he doesn't write lyrics like that for DT songs. > > > > Well, first off, check out Pull Me Under, Surrounded, Wait For Sleep, > 6:00, Lie, and I am _guessing_ the sampled version of Eve... I don't > really know how you can say that (or am I misinterpreting what you > said).
Uhm, I think you're misinterpreting what I said... heh. I meant I'm glad he doesn't use the word fuck in any of his lyrics for DT (unless he stuck them in there but you have to play it backwards to hear it! :))
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 490 *************************
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