YTSEJAM Digest 777
Today's Topics:
1) Re: Ryche....(some DT content)
by jbako01 <jbako01@barney.poly.edu>
2) Re: THE DETERIORATION OF THE YTSE JAM LIST
by zack@lsil.com (Zack Gemmill)
3) nothing important...
by esa2@cornell.edu
4) a few topics...
by "L. Jason Hartman" <lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu>
5) WDADU recut, biology, and Horizontal Posts
by <cohen.132@postbox.acs.ohio-state.edu>
6) The Silent Man CD single, & other musings...
by edju@scf.usc.edu (Edward Ju)
7) Okay, got the vid anyway :)
by "Paul W. Cashman" <vanyel@crl.com>
8) Re: THE DETERIORATION OF THE YTSE JAM LIST
by drkhoe@netcom.com (Dr. Mosh)
9) Pavorotti, Domingo and Carerras???
by Rob Weychert <weyc9212@kutztown.edu>
10) Ytsejam #776
by Steve Borzilleri <silenzio@elwha.evergreen.edu>
11) WARNING! TIM LODGE SUCKS!
by alfredo.cappello@galactica.it (ALFREDO CAPPELLO)
12) Ytsejam #776
by Steve Borzilleri <silenzio@elwha.evergreen.edu>
13) Re: yo
by William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com>
14) Re: progressive
by William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com>
15) Re: THE DETERIORATION OF THE YTSE JAM LIST
by A Humble Dream Theater Fanatic <polzin@glibm11.cen.uiuc.edu>
16) Re: Horizontal Posts
by kbibb@arastar.com (Ken Bibb)
17) I erased the last jam digest someone forward it to me
by rinverso@cosi.stockton.edu (Ryan Inverso)
18) Re: YTSEJAM digest 776
by HuntNKill@aol.com
19) Re: YTSEJAM digest 774
by mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass)
20) Re: YTSEJAM digest 775
by mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass)
21) Re: YTSEJAM digest 775
by mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 21:46:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: jbako01 <jbako01@barney.poly.edu>
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: Re: Ryche....(some DT content)
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950407214517.22553E-100000@barney>
On Fri, 7 Apr 1995, Anthony wrote:
> you guys have been talking about JP doing ads....well, Derek did an add for
> Oberheim in Keyboard magazine...i think it is the same issue as the interview
> (March?)
Yes it was the March issue. I posted it here when it came out.
>
> funny...the big master keyboard they show him with and which he claimed to use
> in the article...he didnt use it when i saw him ;)
Which one? The Oberheim? or the Fisher Price? :)
(The Oberheim was there, I didnt notice the FP)
James Bako
jbako01@barney.poly.edu
Polytechnic University
Brooklyn, New York
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 95 18:40:29 PDT
From: zack@lsil.com (Zack Gemmill)
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: Re: THE DETERIORATION OF THE YTSE JAM LIST
Message-ID: <9504080140.AA03270@tengs1.teng>
> From: cashmadb@cleo.bc.edu
>
> This is directed to that "cool" asshole who calls himself Slick Doggy Shit or some shit like
> that. What kind of shithead posts on the DREAM THEATER list with references to some high
> quality lyrical genius rap asshole like Snoop Doggy Dog? I think you're the one, pal who should
> get off this list.
Hmmm... I must've missed this one.
> Also, I think its cool to say shit like 'oh I went to college too, so
> therefore I'm cooler than you are, Frank' and to say that I suck just because you assholes don't
> appreciate Type O. Dude, I was wondering if it was possible to like talk about Dream Theater on
> the list here, instead of other non DT related shit that you assholes keep bringing up.
I think this is an example of dramatic irony.
> Oh and special thanks to the jerk who informed us of his coolness by listing the many shows he
> has allegedly attended. I forget who it is but shut your mouth asshole, I really don't give a
> shit. Were you there at the Japan show with me? I highly doubt it shithead.
My, my--- after all these years, we still haven't learned to play well and
get along with others (or to limit ourselves to 80 characters).
> By the way, please direct any responses to me directly, and don't waste fucking space on the
> jammer board.
oops.
> Also, please note that this is a jammer board, so all you assholes who think you
> guys are cool, just get the hell off, we don't need your pathetic shit.
>
> FRANK (cashmadb@cleo.bc.edu)
>
And you don't think you're cool?
(I thought there was a treatment for Turret's (sp?) Syndrome.)
Zach
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 23:21:00 -0400
From: esa2@cornell.edu
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: nothing important...
Message-ID: <v02110102abab64cd6275@[132.236.236.41]>
> PS - Whatever happened to that poor guy that us girls yelled at because he
> addressed his post to his fellow brothers of the ytsejam? I hope that
> we (the women) didn't scare him away. Anybody know what happened to him?
Yeah, I'm still here babe, oops, I mean BABS. (kidding) I've been trying
not to jam up the list with useless stuff but it seems as if I'm being
urged to make a crowd-pleasing public appearance!!!! :)
I just wanted to say that although I don't agree with our friend Frank, I
too am a loyal Type O Negative fan and I can understand why he's upset.
Actually, I wasn't planning to go see QR until I heard the news about TON.
Anyway, it seems as though TON is Frank's favorite band. Although his
reaction was uncalled for, wouldn't you guys be a little upset if someone
said DT sucked, etc.? Please, if someone flames you, swallow your pride
and either ignore it or write back to him/her directly.
Hey, so a little about TON for those of you who have never heard of them
(and care):
They're different. The singer is huge (7 ft. a believe) and has a _really_
low and deep voice. You might have heard the song "Black no. 1" or
"Christian Woman" on the radio. There music is diverse, ranging from death
metal to a killer version of the song "summer breeze" at like 50 beats/min.
The subject of the album is similar to Kevin Moore and his break up (so
therefore TON is ALSO cool!)
The coolest part of the band has got to be the singer. He sings in such a
calm, passive voice that it's just like...soothing or something. I don't
know how to describe it. I don't want to take up too much space here but
if you want more info just write me. Look, buy this album, alright?
That's all I can say. It's called Bloody Kisses. ATTN: For those who
don't like anything except very progressive music, you might not like it.
Also, women who are *very* easily offended by certain female oriented
remarks ( <clear my throat> -hrmmph babs> ) you might want to steer clear.
Aside from Tool and DT, it's the only "heavy" album I really like.
>Wouldn't it be cool if WDADU was recut and rereleased with James as the
>vocalist!
Yeah.
- Eric (eagerly awaiting thank-you's for recommending TON!) :)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 00:41:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: "L. Jason Hartman" <lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu>
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: a few topics...
Message-ID: <199504080441.AAA25450@umbc9.umbc.edu>
HI guys and gals...
Let me continue along on the Wait for Sleep time sig thread. This
topic came up several months ago and I mentioned back then that
WFS could be written in just about any time sig. It could be in 1/8
or 5/4 or whatever, it would just looking REALLY strange when written
on a score. The music notation (ie the measures and time sigs) are
just there to help the musician count and follow along more easily.
You could write out a song with 1 big measure. Again, it would just
look REALLY crazy. I just so happen to have the I&W's book right
here with me (thanks Steve Z - he gave it to me for my B-day) and
if you would like to know the time sig THAT DT AGREED TO SCORE IT IN,
then its...
5/8 5/8 5/8 4/8 6/8 6/8 6/8 4/8 5/8 5/8 5/8 4/8 6/8 6/8 6/8 4/8 etc...
most of the song is like this except "she shuts the doors.."
is all in 6/8.
Next topic... Anyone know what DT is up to at the moment? Are they
still touring in Europe?
Anyone seen the Japanese Pay-per-view show from January?
Any Echolyn fans in the Baltimore area -> Echolyn is playing at
the 8X10 club on this Tuesday night. You can mail me for more
info...
And finally, I'd just like to thank Brian Wherry and Steve Borzilleri
for there kind words about my trading practices. It's been a pleasure
doing business with you guys!
BTW - everyone should just be warned that I'm ALWAYS leave words out
of my posts.... I've been working on proof reading them before I actually
send them but sometimes I miss something. Sometimes I wonder if
people think I'm from a foreign country because of the way that I
butcher the English language... :)
-- ************************************************************************** * Jason Hartman "I am the Killing Hand!" lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu * * * * You're fighting the weight of the world, * * and no one can save you this time. * * Close your eyes - you can find all you need in your mind. * * * * "Take the Time" - Dream Theater * **************************************************************************------------------------------
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 23:55:41 -0600 (CST) From: <cohen.132@postbox.acs.ohio-state.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: WDADU recut, biology, and Horizontal Posts Message-ID: <86149.cohen.132@postbox.acs.ohio-state.edu>
>Wouldn't it be cool if WDADU was recut and rereleased with James as the >vocalist! Yeah, that would be great! If they re-recorded, the sound quality would improve greatly also. IaW and Awake are among the best sounding CDs that I own, while WDADU is easily one of the worst (sound quality that is). Does anyone else out there just love "A Matter of Time"? That is one of my favorites, although I haven't heard a DT song that I dislike. Today in Biology class, my professor, who was in the middle of his lecture, stopped talking, pointed at me, noticed my DT shirt,and said "great band". I was floored by the responses that I got after class from the others. DT fans rule (except for that asshole that pushed me out of my second row "seat" at the Columbus concert). Anyway, I have two questions, first, are there any more Subconscious CD's left? Second, Why do some people's posts stretch into oblivion? That is really annoying. I hate scrolling to see what is written, only to find out that it has been cut off by the server. Thanks:)
P.S. Anyone else out there in columbus, maybe we could have a convention too! Oh, and by the way, Babs rules!
-Steve (the friend of Jeff, the guy from Columbus) /---\ -- ----| --\ --| ----| / / |_ | | | | __ \_ | |__ | | |__ | | | | | | | / | |___ | | |___ ---- | | __/ |
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Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 23:09:26 -0700 From: edju@scf.usc.edu (Edward Ju) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: The Silent Man CD single, & other musings... Message-ID: <199504080609.XAA23235@chaph.usc.edu>
I just found a copy of the German version of "The Silent Man" CD single after months of searching high and low for any DT singles! For those unaware of it, it has two bonus tracks: "Take the Time" (demo version) and "Eve". The demo of Take the Time is almost note-for-note from the I&W version. However, this one sounds faster and heavier than the wimpy production you hear in the I&W version. It's a little rough at some spots but overall I like it better.
Why is it that DT CD singles are so hard to find (even for imports)? Are there any domestic versions released in the U.S. at all? I just don't think East/West is behind DT at all... they weren't any better off then MCA.
A lot of interesting discussion about John Myung's contribution... does anyone know if Myung's of Korean or Chinese descendent?
Eddie
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 00:59:16 -0700 (PDT) From: "Paul W. Cashman" <vanyel@crl.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Okay, got the vid anyway :) Message-ID: <199504080759.AA26601@crl4.crl.com>
Got the Japanese TV vid anyway; heck, it was $20 and it's close to two hours and we get to see John M.'s birthday cake. :)
> sings like an adolescent
Yer not kiddin'. His voice may have been worse on DoE (a certain frog during "UaGM" comes to mind), but egads, this was nationwide.....
The instruments more than make up for it, though. Great jams after, as I recall, "LSoaD" and "CiaW." Derek's keyboards aren't mixed high enough at some points, but his solo is great!
Quality on the vid is pretty good -- just two major tape-pops and only a hair off original-broadcast quality. Glad I got it, and nice to see DT playing in a place where they're appreciated. :)
-- Paul W. Cashman, vanyel@crl.com Rush Dream Theater Queensryche ------------------------------- Metallica Hawkwind Enya Ministry Mutha's Day Out Sisters of Mercy Dead Can Dance Blue Oyster Cult OBJames: "Let me learn the language before ya talk to me, okay?"
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 03:29:51 PDT From: drkhoe@netcom.com (Dr. Mosh) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: THE DETERIORATION OF THE YTSE JAM LIST Message-ID: <199504081029.DAA05288@netcom16.netcom.com>
Errr... huh?
-The Doc
-- #$%*#$*@ REAL: drkhoe@netcom.com + VIRTUAL: drkhoe@gnu.ai.mit.edu *@#$*@#$ *$%&%#$* The Dream Theater Archives: ftp.netcom.com: /pub/dr/drkhoe/dt &*@#$*@$ **%^$#$% WWW: "ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/dr/drkhoe/www/dthome.html" #$**@#*$ *$*$*$*# Reality Enhancement Software - Engineering Reality *$&#*#@$
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 06:39:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Rob Weychert <weyc9212@kutztown.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Pavorotti, Domingo and Carerras??? Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950408063130.23486B-100000@atlantic>
This is in response to he who ranked James up with Pavorotti, Domingo and Carerras...WHAT??!! You've got to be kidding me!! I'm sure James would be flattered to hear such a thing, but he would probably laugh in your face, as I am doing right now (no flame intended, mind you, I just can't believe what I read...). I mean, C'MON! Even on Images and Words when James sounds terrific, he doesn't come CLOSE to those guys! And when he performs live, he doesn't even come close to how good he sounds on I&W! I don't have anything against James LaBrie's singing (other than the countless times his live performances have disappointed me and the 'rock star' vocal approach he took on Awake), but NO WAY could you rank him up there with greats like Pavorotti, Domingo and Carerras...
--ROb
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 04:59:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Steve Borzilleri <silenzio@elwha.evergreen.edu> To: Dream Thespians <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Ytsejam #776 Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504080131.D23083-0100000@elwha.evergreen.edu>
Well, it hasn't been five posts, but I have replies anyway! Deal with it! A man must learn to cope!!
1. Lazarus: Funny you should mention that line from Only A Matter Of Time. I was singing it as I logged on this evening...
2. Mats Rydstrom: The other vocalists were John Hendricks, Steve Stone, John Arch, and Chris Cintron. Here's what I thought, based on the vocal audition tape I recently received from L. Jason Hartman:
(1) John Hendricks has a nice, even voice, but I think that that's the problem. It's a bit _too_ nice and even. It seems he's just hitting the notes to pass the time. He doesn't growl or scream, just very calmly sings his parts, flawlessly but not amazingly. He had an impressive range, though, and excellent vibrato, and I can't imagine why he wasn't chosen. All I can suppose is that DT either didn't get along with him personally, or they wanted a vocalist with more flair. Remember that Dominici was known for NOT being able to carry the band as a frontman, so he was invited to leave the band. DT may have detected this factor early on with Hendricks, but personally I thought he was better than a lot of vocalists I've heard.
(2) Steve Stone clearly had a vocal style before he met up with DT. He sings "To Live Forever" completely his own way, as well as "Metropolis." Ex: the line, "The starvation has turned me outside in," from "To Live Forever." Pronounced by John Hendricks: "Thah star-vay-tion has turned..." real plain, normal english stuff. And by Steve Stone: "Thee stah-veh-shin has turned..." a real 80's rock "gothic" style of pronounciation. For more on this style, listen to Chris Collins on the live Majesty shows. 80's gothic vocals in their purest form. Anyway, Steve Stone had an extremely defined style, but I think, in an audition situation, that made it even more difficult. Good range and vibrato are impressive qualities in a vocalist, but if someone comes into an audition with a clear-cut style, it better be EXACTLY what you're looking for, otherwise they're among the first to be thanked and shown the door. Especially to a group that had been playing as long as DT. "Well, he's good, but I don't want to change our music just so we can have this guy as our vocalist." (Steve also had a real difficulty holding long notes, a DT staple in the vocals department.)
(3) John Arch is, at least listening to this tape, the epitome of the term "false vibrato." This guy forced everything, be it his range (which could have been greater had he not pushed his voice but just relaxed and sang) or his vibrato, which really surprised me at first because it's so extreme. Most vibratos waver evenly over one note, like John Hendrick's, for whatever note you happen to be hitting. Others, like James Labrie's, go over two, being extremely well-developed and obviously under control (a la Geoff Tate). John Arch is somewhat like Chris Collins in the fact that his vibrato sounds very forced, and is thus "uncontrollable," sometimes wavering over three notes, which sounds kind of silly at times. At certain points in the live Majesty shows, you can hear Chris Collins' voice just FLY into these absolutely amazing vibratos that basically cover ever note in the human range. I suppose grabbing one's genitalia and moving it in directions it is not supposed to move could produced this effect, but otherwise it's not exactly how natural human vibrato should sound!
(4) Chris Cintron did lots of harmonies with what he sang, which is an admirable quality with vocalists. He reminds me of John Hendricks somewhat, but he's got a bit more flair in his singing. Nevertheless, an excellent vocalist. One can only suppose that the reason he and Hendricks were not chosen was because they were in competition with Mr. James LaBrie.
(5) James LaBrie held all notes, hit all vibratos perfectly, and showed a lot of vocal style that did not frighten me like Steve Stone! What else is there to say about this guy? They picked him didn't they?! :)
3. "Market": I am a huge Steve Vai fan! Notice my signoff. I also saw Tony MacAlpine give a "clinic" here in Olympia last year, and it was l-o-u-d! That guy shreds like the devil! Or would that be "shreds like Paul Gilbert?" ;>
4. Petrucci's red eyes were intentional! It is not just the flash rebounding off his retinas and they printed it unknowingly! (the flash is what caused the red eyes, yes, but instead of cleaning it up they left it there on purpose) It was not a mistake. In fact, I think they were artificially colored even more red for the printing! I say this because both of his eyes are _completely_ red. Not just the pupil being a bright red, with the rest of the eye being slightly red. They are SOLID RED. They match the color of the red background! Red red red! It adds to his demon-ness!
Anyway, I don't know what all the fuss is about. Have you ever met John Petrucci? His eyes really are that color up close... :)
5. THE DETERIORATION OF THE YTSE JAM LIST = CORRUPTION IN THE GOAT HERD II I'm surprised he's showing his face here again, but this time I only have four words for the issue: tear him up, Ed.
So until I think up some more long, detailed replies to post, seeya!
Bafu Vai
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Date: Sat, 08 Apr 95 14:01:00 +0100 From: alfredo.cappello@galactica.it (ALFREDO CAPPELLO) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: WARNING! TIM LODGE SUCKS! Message-ID: <8A70349.0001025ECD.uuout@galactica.it>
I'm really sad, but I must tell to everyone from this Mailing List to keep away from Tim Lodge (e-mail address: Lodge_Tim@csusys.ctstateu.edu) he sells some CDs (like the first Portnoy Band, Majesty Demos, and Instrumental). I manage to trade with him one italian doubleCD bootleg called "A kick into a Dream" for The Portnoy and Instrumental Cds. I've send him the stuff in February and he told me via email he got the tape (at the end of February), and he's going to send me the two CD the day after. I still haven't received absolutely NOTHING, I've send many email to this guy, without reply. Tim Lodge Sucks.
a really sad italian trader Alfredo -+- alfredo.cappello@galactica.it
* Q-Blue 1.0 *
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 07:21:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Steve Borzilleri <silenzio@elwha.evergreen.edu> To: Dream Thespians <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Ytsejam #776 Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504080616.A27216-0100000@elwha.evergreen.edu>
Okay, there's more! Hee hee!
1. Brian Wherry: Yeah, it would seem that anyone with an @umbc.edu address after their name is very prompt in the trading business. (free plug for mbacko1 and lhartm1)
2. Pawly: I sing on occasion, but I'm not in a band or anything. It's funny, most people have written that driving while listening to Dream Theater is dangerous because they unknowingly speed! I'm too busy singing along with the vocals to really get into the double bass or the chugging riffage!
Anyway, my opinion of James' voice is a civilian one, since I'm not vocally trained and I've never sang in a performance-type situation. I, like you, put LaBrie up there with Jose Carreras and Luciano Pavarotti. His voice not only sounds good (I mean the actual sound), but he's got the most kickass vibrato and range in the business! (rock music that is) One could call his voice "noteworthy." (pun intended)
You mentioned the act of holding a high E or F for 15 seconds. The longest one James has recorded is in Metropolis, timing in at just under 9 seconds. That's impressive, and 15 seconds would be even more impressive, but now that you've brought it up, and since you asked about singers on the Ytsejams, I feel I have to comment. The only "nutshell" description I could give you of my vocal ability (what little of it there is!) is the holding of the long note in Metropolis, "I'm asleep yet I'm so afraaaaaaaaaaaaid," for 23 seconds. But don't expect me to talk afterwards, 'cause it can leave me out of breath! I can also hit the high notes near the end of "Learning To Live," a la "Whoah-ahh-HAAAAAAAAOW!" Now if I could just find a vocal trainer and unlock the mystery of Natural Vibrato...
Bafu Vai
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 10:00:25 -0500 (CDT) From: William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: yo Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504080954.C9674-0100000@galaxy.galstar.com>
On Thu, 6 Apr 1995, TDB wrote:
> Quoth Steve Z (to Babs): > > Thanks for the kind words, Babs. It's really not a bad > > situation. The main thing she hates is James, so during > > those long instrumental passages I can usually get away > > w/ it. :P > > Personally, I'd agree with you girlfriend. <g> No, that's > not quite true. I don't _dislike_ JlaB's voice, it just > doesn't do anything for me. I think he's very skillful, > but, to me, his voice just has a generic hard rock sound, > as if he were a white shirt with a blue stripe and block > lettering reading "rock singer". > > Funny things, opinions. Someone else said that they > thought he was the most irreplaceable member, while I think > he's the first one they could lose. (I don't count Derek, > because he's new and still finding his way, so he gets a > break. <g>)
I agree sort of. I feel that he's quite a good singer and he can be very effective at times. But about being replaces, I think they could find a replacement (better than James) pretty easily. I think they had a hard time finding one to replace Charlie because they were so unknown at the time, but now, they're semi-famous and I'm sure there are MANY singers in the same style as James who would love a chance of auditioning for his part (heck, I would!) :) (not that'd I'd make it.) But either way, there are some very talented singers out there. Now, on the other hand, finding such a great guitarist, lyricistis, and leader like Petrucci would be hard.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 10:18:36 -0500 (CDT) From: William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: progressive Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504081058.D9674-0100000@galaxy.galstar.com>
On Thu, 6 Apr 1995, Alex Lifeson wrote:
> Well, not that I listen to Greeenday or Metallica, but when Michael Van > Opstall wrote something about having to transcribe a song 'from memory' to > prove to his friend that they are not progressive. If progressive means only > that the music is technically hard, then some prog group aren't REALLY prog > groups, I guess? I guess that there are no good songs that have a I-V-vi-iv > chord patterns. I guess you have to be a musician to enjoy good music, and to > realize what is progressive. I am a music major, and also can transcribe "from > memory." What I'm trying to say here is that it takes more than complex music > to make a progressive band, and one doesn't have to be a music major to know > that. OK? Thanks. "Enough angry stuff" briaN M eichorN
Well... I think that the problem here is that we are failing to define what we mean when we say progressive. I used to this Dream Theater was a Progressive band. Now I just think they're a Semi-Progressive band, and a progressive band. (Notice the capitiaztions.)
Dream Theater has SOME progressive songs. Not ALL of their songs are Progressive. Pull Me Under leans more to the metal side of the spectrum, where Metropolis, while heavy at times, has a more Progressive edge. In fact it's very Progressive. I'm not saying Pull Me Under doesn't contain some Proggy-riffs and I'm not saying that Metropolis doesn't have some metal riffs... they just combine Metal and Progressive very well. Still, they have some flaws... some inparticular are Another Day, Surrounded, and Silent Man. Not that these aren't good, they're just not Progressive. (well the improvised sax is nice, but it's not them.)
So, that's why I call Dream Theater a Semi-Progressive band.
They however are VERY progressive. They always give us multiple styles on their albums, they are dareing enough to give us an instrmental now and then, they DO use some weird instrments in their songs (sax), they push the limits of production techniques (I just love fake drums.) And stylistically IAW and Awake are quite different. They DO progress.
However, let us take a Progressive band. Let's look at King Crimson. They might be consitered the ULTIMATE Progressive band, because in their 25+ year carrer they have never sold out. That in itself is quite a track record. One Fripp thinks he's worn out the style they've been playing, the just gets new band members (or just adds some.) They use some of the weirdest instrumentation (saxes, flutes, violins, mulitple guitars, multiple drummers, a drummer who just goes crazy (he samplex the band sloshing their hands in mud and used it in a song.)) They also deviated quite a bit from the style of the time. It was all progressive, but it was much more harsh, agressive, and heavier than the rest of the music at the time. And at the same time they could produce some lovely songs.
And all throughout their carrer they have always made sure to have their songs really complex and dissonant. King Crimson can only be described as being just plain WEIRD, and yet they have remained quite popular dispite this fact. These are the marking of a Progressive band.
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 12:25:55 -0500 (CDT) From: A Humble Dream Theater Fanatic <polzin@glibm11.cen.uiuc.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Re: THE DETERIORATION OF THE YTSE JAM LIST Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.90.950408122200.17273A-100000@glibm11.cen.uiuc.edu>
Is there anyway that we can get this asshole (FRANK) off the list? This is so stupid. A) My nickname has nothing to do with the rapper. B) Why does he care if it did? C) Dude, how much DT content have you sent to the list? All i know is that you got upset over someone not liking TON, bashing the list, and causing stupid arguememts. Dude, I think you are the one deteriorating the list. Get the fuck off it unless you have something intelligent to say about DT (or other RELATED info). I enphasize INTELLIGENT also. Later. > > > > This is directed to that "cool" asshole who calls himself Slick Doggy Shit or some shit like > > that. What kind of shithead posts on the DREAM THEATER list with references to some high > > quality lyrical genius rap asshole like Snoop Doggy Dog? I think you're the one, pal who should > > get off this list. > > Also, I think its cool to say shit like 'oh I went to college too, so > > therefore I'm cooler than you are, Frank' and to say that I suck just because you assholes don't > > appreciate Type O. Dude, I was wondering if it was possible to like talk about Dream Theater on > > the list here, instead of other non DT related shit that you assholes keep bringing up. > > Oh and special thanks to the jerk who informed us of his coolness by listing the many shows he > > has allegedly attended. I forget who it is but shut your mouth asshole, I really don't give a > > shit. Were you there at the Japan show with me? I highly doubt it shithead. > > By the way, please direct any responses to me directly, and don't waste fucking space on the > > jammer board. > > Also, please note that this is a jammer board, so all you assholes who think you > > guys are cool, just get the hell off, we don't need your pathetic shit. > > > > FRANK (cashmadb@cleo.bc.edu) > >
Ed Polzin
WWW: http://www.cen.uiuc.edu/~polzin/
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 11:07:22 +0800 From: kbibb@arastar.com (Ken Bibb) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: Horizontal Posts Message-ID: <9504081807.AA17075@anthor.arastar.com>
> From: <cohen.132@postbox.acs.ohio-state.edu> > To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> > Subject: WDADU recut, biology, and Horizontal Posts > > Second, Why do some people's posts stretch into > oblivion? That is really annoying. I hate scrolling to see what is written, > only to find out that it has been cut off by the server. Thanks:)
If you have a line that starts with the word "From ", the server will truncate the message at that point. (I didn't write the server, the code is a mess, and I've started work on a replacement which shouldn't have the problem, but it probably won't be available until summer.)
So don't start your lines with "From ". Put a tab or ">" in front of it and you should be fine.
-- Ken Bibb "Upon a wave of summer kbibb@arastar.com A hilltop paved with gold jester@crash.cts.com We shut our eyes and make the promises we hold" David Sylvian--"Wave"
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 95 14:01:47 EDT From: rinverso@cosi.stockton.edu (Ryan Inverso) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: I erased the last jam digest someone forward it to me Message-ID: <memo.438127@cosi.stockton.edu>
I mistakenly erased the last two jams. They were sent out between Apr. 7 and 8. If someone could forward them to me I would appriciate it. Also Babs I would like some info on reservations to the DT conv. in Long Island myself and a few friends want to attend. We are coming from the Atlantic City area. Thank You, Ryan Inverso
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 14:33:13 -0400 From: HuntNKill@aol.com To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 776 Message-ID: <950408143311_76345352@aol.com>
Dear jammers,
pawly@eden.rutgers.edu wrote:
>>>Anyway, the reason I'm posting is in response to a man named Tim stating something to the effect of JLaB's voice not doing anything for you. I'm just a _little_ curious how it doesn't affect you at all. I honestly could put him up with the likes of Pavorotti, Domingo, and Carreras. Though the styles are VERY different, the talent is the same. A friend of mine and I always manage to speed as we're driving along listening to "The Mirror." At the same time, I'm singing the melody, and he's creating some crazy harmonies. Next time you're listening to DT, think about how challenging it is to hold a powerful E or F for 15 seconds. Then think about James's voice again. A new viewpoint? Does anyone else out there sing? Please give me some input as to your thoughts on JLaB's voice. Thanks. <<<
I sing, but I have more of a broadway style of singing. The highest note I can hit with my chest voice is a high G. I really love James' voice, and I always wish that I could sing like him. I can only make it through songs like Surrounded, Silent Man, most of LSOAD, and the beginning of Pull me Under in my chest voice. Man, does James has a range!! And I like his voice better than Charlie's. Just compare a "Fortune in Lies" and "Another Hand - the Killing Hand" between the two singers.
Yours, Jeff =)
<<<==<==<==<==<==<==<==<==<==<<<</-\-/-\-/-\>>>>==>==>==>==>==>==>==>==>==>>> JEFF CHEW IS HUNTNKILL@AOL.COM "You are sunlight and I, moon ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ joined by the gods of fortune "The fool on the hill midnight and high noon sees the sun going down sharing the sky and the eyes in his head We have been blessed, see the world spinning 'round" you and I" - Lennon/McCartney - Lea Salonga (Kim) <<<==<==<==<==<==<==<==<==<==<<<<\-/-\-/-\-/>>>>==>==>==>==>==>==>==>==>==>>>
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 14:55:41 -0500 From: mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 774 Message-ID: <199504081853.OAA23768@nic.iii.net>
Michael Van Opstall <mavanop@grfn.ORG> wrote:
..Although they [Guitar World] did transcribe Erotomania...
Did they do the bass part too?!! What issue was it? I'd like to get the back issue (unless someone was into snail mailing me a copy or scanning it and sending it. I can't read tab, I need standard notation.)
Thanks
Marc Respass mer@sol.iii.net
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 14:55:46 -0500 From: mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 775 Message-ID: <199504081853.OAA23771@nic.iii.net>
Alex Lifeson <TRMD@grove.iup.edu> wrote:
> Well, not that I listen to Greeenday or Metallica, > but when Michael Van Opstall wrote something about having > to transcribe a song 'from memory' to prove to his friend > that they are not progressive. If progressive means only > that the music is technically hard, then some prog group > aren't REALLY prog groups, I guess? I guess that there are > no good songs that have a I-V-vi-iv chord patterns. I > guess you have to be a musician to enjoy good music, and to > realize what is progressive. I am a music major, and also > can transcribe "from memory." What I'm trying to say here > is that it takes more than complex music to make a > progressive band, and one doesn't have to be a music major > to know that. OK? Thanks. "Enough angry stuff" > briaN M eichorN >
Hmmm. Suddenly I'm trying to define progressive but I can't. I have every Rush album and every Yes album (except Talk - what is that?). Greenday, however, is definitely NOT progressive. They're not alternative either (and what is alternative. I like music. I don't need an alternative). They're just a band. I'm thinking of an article with Alex Lifeson (the real Alex ;) where he said something about the music always changing and growing otherwise they wouldn't be progressing. I mean DT writes some complex stuff but not always. The latest Rush album is awesome but not everything on it is hard. It is, however, different from what came before. AC/DC is a good example of non-progressive. The Greenday example, I think, just shows a lack of any attempt to grow. I mean that progresion and the powerchord accompaniment are not new in any way. I could write a song on that progression and make it interesting and maybe progressive but Greenday didn't even attempt it.
sorry this is so long.
Marc Respass mer@sol.iii.net
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Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 14:55:51 -0500 From: mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 775 Message-ID: <199504081853.OAA23774@nic.iii.net>
Also, I just said something about the KEY signatures for WFS. What the heck was I talking about? I didn't get a chance to prrofread. oops again. I meant the key of G with E Aeolian (or B Phrygian) feel. What a day...
M.A. VanOpstall mavanop@grfn.org +++++++++++++++
Because I'm a jerk who knows too much music theory I have to respond to this. Either the song is in G major or E minor (aeolian) or B phrygian. It can't be all three (unless it changes from one to another) and there's no such thing as E minor with a B phrygian feel. Modes are a wierd thing. You can't mix them if they all have the same key sig.
Marc Respass mer@sol.iii.net
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 777 *************************
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