YTSEJAM Digest 782
Today's Topics:
1) Silent Man vid
by kkish@selu.edu
2) URL Pointer... (WEB)
by drkhoe@netcom.com (Dr. Mosh)
3) Dub Site Listing 4/10/95
by AirDance@aol.com
4) A burning question.
by Andrew J Feyder <afeyder@gac.edu>
5) Re: YTSEJAM digest 781
by BABS@sgenva.cc.geneseo.edu
6) Dream Theater Fan Club
by WarrenDW@aol.com
7) Re[2]: 16/9
by jjens@site.gmu.edu (John Jens (CS 112))
8) hardest tunes to play
by William Kriski <wkriski@enci.ucalgary.ca>
9) Re: YTSEJAM digest 781
by Paul Tullo <pawly@eden.rutgers.edu>
10) PROGRESSIVE
by Alex Lifeson <TRMD@grove.iup.edu>
11) WFS
by Alex Lifeson <TRMD@grove.iup.edu>
12) Re:Portnoy- Hot Sticks??
by "David John Baranski" <djbarans@eos.ncsu.edu>
13) YTSEJAM digest 779
by rinverso@cosi.stockton.edu (Ryan Inverso)
14) Re: Progressive debate...
by Hailey <pass@u.washington.edu>
15) this silly progressive debate
by Dave Snyder <snyderd@umich.edu>
16) Re: YTSEJAM digest 781
by "TDB" <tdb@SMTPGwy.microsim.com>
17)
by
18) progressive
by Michael Van Opstall <mavanop@grfn.ORG>
19) progressive
by Mats Rydstr\vm <d94-mry@nada.kth.se>
20) Re: What is Prog..?
by "Adam m. Cook" <adamc@shore.net>
21) Re: YTSEJAM digest 781
by kad@iris122.biosym.com
22) Vox
by Stone <fraser@stolaf.edu>
23) Change of seasons
by Markus_Pfeifer@citybox.fido.de (Markus Pfeifer)
24) Echolyn NOT touring with DT...yet
by Randy Haskin <strega@u.washington.edu>
25) Re: LaBrie's Singing
by Lazarus - aka Simon Smith <sjs@st-andrews.ac.uk>
26) Helloween, vocalists and some DT.
by Simon Asselin <raika@LLC.org>
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 00:02:50 -0500 (CDT)
From: kkish@selu.edu
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: Silent Man vid
Message-ID: <01HP6XZ08H6A90OT4L@vega.selu.edu>
Greets all,
Theres a way all of us stateside could see the video for The Silent Man, since I've given up on seeing it on MTV. On the cable channel F/X there is a music show called SoundF/X that accepts requests via email. If everyone on the ytsejam were to mail them chances are good they might play it. We tried it on the Megadeth list to see the A Tout Le Monde video which MTV had banned and they played it on Sound F/X tonight (even though i missed it).
The address is SOUNDFX@delphi.com everyone write and lets see it.
Kevin Kish
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 00:58:58 PDT
From: drkhoe@netcom.com (Dr. Mosh)
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: URL Pointer... (WEB)
Message-ID: <199504110758.AAA01578@netcom12.netcom.com>
Those of you who have links or pointers to my archive... please update
them... I sent this out a while ago, but I'll send it out again just in
case...
Please make sure you point to:
ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/dr/drkhoe/dthome.html
and not the old one without the /dr in front of /drkhoe.
Thanks!
-The Doc
-- #$%*#$*@ REAL: drkhoe@netcom.com + VIRTUAL: drkhoe@gnu.ai.mit.edu *@#$*@#$ *$%&%#$* The Dream Theater Archives: ftp.netcom.com: /pub/dr/drkhoe/dt &*@#$*@$ **%^$#$% WWW: "ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/dr/drkhoe/www/dthome.html" #$**@#*$ *$*$*$*# Reality Enhancement Software - Engineering Reality *$&#*#@$------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 20:48:24 -0400 From: AirDance@aol.com To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Dub Site Listing 4/10/95 Message-ID: <950410195807_78619117@aol.com>
Here it is!
This is the final posting of the list of dub sites for Kevin Moore's demos! Just e-mail the site nearest you for your copy:
-Northeastern USA-
Connecticut: lodge_tim@ccsua.ctstateu.edu Massachusetts: panther@mit.edu Massachusetts: mikeb@cs.brandeis.edu Massachusetts: utz@pcbuoa.enet.dec.com New Hampshire: parallels@aol.com New Hampshire: martino@ctron.com New Jersey: jmastin@motown.ge.com New York: jbako01@barney.poly.edu New York: smb9733@sjfc.edu New York: huntnkill@aol.com New York: merwich@ic.sunysb.edu New York: akeegan@liii.com or mozo21@aol.com New York: robnpam@delphi.com
-Mid-Atlantic USA-
Maryland: mbacko1@umbc.edu Maryland: schew@tis.com Maryland: lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu Maryland: sdobay@wam.umd.edu North Carolina: godsize@aol.com Pennsylvania: emrst2@vms.cis.pitt.edu Virginia: jks2x@fermi.clas.virginia.edu
-Southern USA-
Florida: merrell@cs.fsu.edu Florida: jpeele@unf6.cis.unf.edu Florida: severine@acc.fau.edu Missouri: emoeglin@bigcat.missouri.edu
-Mid-West/Central USA-
Illinois: starr@fnal.gov Indiana: kryt@expert.cc.purdue.edu Kansas: rycher@unix.ksu.edu or vetmed97@aol.com Minnesota: dayx0017@gold.tc.umn.edu Nebraska: sloan@creighton.edu Ohio: akozar@uoft02.utoledo.edu Ohio: dave.cackowski@tri-c.cc.oh.us Wisconsin: larkows3@nes.nersc.gov
-Southwestern USA-
Arizona: markt@getnet.com Arizona: garion@indirect.com Texas: reverend@genesis.tamu.edu Texas: bvc8995@tam2000.tamu.edu or lerxst@tamu.edu Texas: jskewes@iadfw.net
-Western USA-
Southern California: srvrip@qualcomm.com Southern California: drkhoe@netcom.com Southern California: warmwetos@aol.com Washington: pandora@u.washington.edu
-Canada-
Nova Scotia: rmacausl@linden.msvu.ca Ontario: 4mjk@qlink.queensu.ca Saskatchewan: pjhollow@microcity.com
-UK/Europe-
Germany: goebel@inf.fu-berlin.de Italy: alfredo.cappello@galactica.it The Netherlands: v932407@si.hhs.nl UK: mtiplady@cix.compulink.co.uk UK: bean@dcs.rhbnc.ac.uk UK: jcl1008@cam.ac.uk (closed for now, reopens April 18th)
-Asia-
Japan: gch06672@niftyserve.or.jp Japan: takaaki.higuchi@japan.sun.com
-Australia/Pacific region-
Melbourne, Australia: 930377@edna.cc.swin.edu.au Western Australia: gillius@tartarus.uwa.edu.au New Zealand: g.sands@esv1.auckland.ac.nz
That's it! As usual, if I missed anyone, your address is incorrect, or you want to close your dub site, yell at me by e-mail. :) Thanks!
It's truly been a pleasure doing this for you all. Thanks for all your help & support. :)
Take care everyone,
Jennifer <airdance@aol.com>
"You'll never make it. Go back to Liverpool." - Decca record company executives to The Beatles, 1962 :)
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 09:28:23 (CDT) From: Andrew J Feyder <afeyder@gac.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: A burning question. Message-ID: <199504111428.JAA11585@hermes.gac.edu>
A thousand apologies for no DT content here, but I've been pondering a question. I used to be a big fan of Guns N Roses, and two years ago they absolutely dominated the rock industry and MTV. But since their tour with Metallica a few summers ago, they haven't done a damn thing! Does anyone know what happened to this once mega-band? I saw that Slash has a new album with a different band called Snake Pit or something like that, so I was wondering if maybe they broke up. Maybe I'm just barking up the wrong tree asking on a DT list, but I was curious, and someone just inquired about Bang Tango for God's sake! __________________________________________________________ | Andrew Joseph Feyder | "You know, life moves pretty | | Gustavus Adolphus College | fast. If you don't stop | | 800 West College Ave. | and look around, you could | | St. Peter MN 56082 | miss it" | | (507)-933-8715 | -Ferris Bueller. | |___________________________|______________________________| (O) - (O) / \ \_/ \_________/ \_______/
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 11:57:33 -0500 (EST) From: BABS@sgenva.cc.geneseo.edu To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 781 Message-ID: <01HP7MSVFW6S001BFK@sgenva.CC.GENESEO.EDU>
Good morning everyone, it's Babs. This is a response to the ytsejammer who asked "Who is Lou Gramm". I can tell you! He is the lead singer of Foreigner. He grew up just 40 minutes away from where I live. He is a native of Rochester New York. He still lives in the area as well. His career has had a lot of ups and downs, and I admire his persistence and ambition. If anyone has access to VH-1 on their cable you can catch their new video. Unfortunately, I can't remember the name of it. Anyway, I hope that this helps! -BABS
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Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 22:15:34 -0400 From: WarrenDW@aol.com To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Dream Theater Fan Club Message-ID: <950410221513_78816124@aol.com>
I sent a check to join the fan club in January...it was cashed...still nothing in the mail. I read in a post several months ago that the fan club was going through some changes and would soon be up to speed.....can anyone enlighten me on the currnet status of mailings...or maybe someone to contact in this forum so I can bitch a little... Thanks Warren Williams
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 12:15:38 +0500 From: jjens@site.gmu.edu (John Jens (CS 112)) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re[2]: 16/9 Message-ID: <9504111615.AA03393@rhodium>
> But I agree--the writer should be shot since it's not natural to think > in terms of 9s.
Ken, i thought part of being (Pp)rogressive was to be UNnatural/different/innovative?? personally, i think in 9th's all the time ;) the time ;) the time ;) the time ;) the time ;) the time ;) the time ;) the time ;) the time ;)
::::::::::John C. Jens, Jr.:::::::::::::::::::"You could make a choice,:::::::: :::::::::::jjens@gmu.edu:::::::::::::::::::::but you never learned to think.":: ::http://www.site.gmu.edu/~jjens/:::::::::::::::::::-Fates Warning:::::::::::::
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 10:33:13 -0600 (MDT) From: William Kriski <wkriski@enci.ucalgary.ca> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: hardest tunes to play Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504111020.A25662-0100000@casual1>
First a note to Bafu Vai:
The I&W tab book is out which helps me be able to play a lot more of his stuff. The hardest thing is figuring them out. With regards to Pull Me Under, that riff isn't that hard once you see it tabbed. You mentioned weird timing of that riff, but it's tabbed as 32nd note in nice groups of 8. The other nice thing as you mentioned is that it's not exactly the same each time. The last few notes are chromatic, so you must ensure you get the last note.
I think a brutal part is in Metropolis but I can't describe it without tabbing. Scalar riffs are not as difficult as say sweep picking riffs, but when the sweeping is short (not a full sweep arpeggio) and there is a lot of reversals of stroke. I agree that one TTT riff w/keyboards is hard but it's playable after much practice. Even the UaGM solo isn't bad after some practice (again, the tab helps tremendously).
These tabs were supposedly done by Petrucci, so I believe most of its accuracy.
To the guy who asked about the difficult tunes, try playing some Erotomania (that cool string skipping solo). But I spent a couple years back in high school arguing about Van Halen vs. Yngwie Malmsteen and it got us nowhere. Some people prefer that real bluesy/funky melodic soloing that Eddie does, over more technical scales, sweeps, etc. All you can hope for is that he appreciates Petrucci's talent.
Will
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 95 13:12:25 EDT From: Paul Tullo <pawly@eden.rutgers.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 781 Message-ID: <CMM-RU.1.4.797620345.pawly@er6.rutgers.edu>
Whoa! I've just spent an hour reading the last 5 jams. I had a crappy weekend, and couldn't get to the comp.lab to read anything. I wasn't expecting such a plethora (I be in college, gettin' edumacated) of responses. I did exaggerate with James's ability to hold high notes for long periods of time, but I'm sure he could. Jumping to a vocalists defense was just a reaction. >Tim, I understand you view< Unfortunately, I've erased the last few jams, but, as a vocalist I admire James's ability, and his chest voice seems to blend into his head (sim. to Geoff Tate, another VERY admirable man). As a singer, I try to combine broadway and hard rock, and it has a tendency to kill my voice. I put IaW on repeat, and tried to sing it 3 straight times, and today, I'm croaking(ribbit :) One last, quick question. I recently picked up the guitar book for IaW, and I was wondering if anyone could explain the 5+7/8 time sig. in Metropolis. Thanks. Paul Tullo pawly@eden.rutgers.edu
"I'll take seven lives for one and then my only father's son as sure as I did ever love him, I am not afraid." -Pull Me Under
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 13:14:48 -0500 (EST) From: Alex Lifeson <TRMD@grove.iup.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: PROGRESSIVE Message-ID: <01HP7PFPNH4291X292@grove.iup.edu>
William Wright wrote in with about 20 supposed defintions of progressive, and went on to say that Another Day has none of these. 3 minute bird chirping intro? I guess those nature tapes must be progressive. I think that progressive has more of a definition than all of the things that you wrote. Another Day can be considered progressive to me, because it is done by a progressive group, not a 'semi-progressive' group, or whatever. The "quote" of Holst's Mars? I don't think that's QUITE a definition of prog. Not to mention the two songs i mentioned were Surounded and Silent Man. Are you saying that Another day is pop? Metal? How WOULD you describe it? Wierd shit? I think the words itself are progressive. Note: "They took pictures of our dreams, ran to hide behind the stairs And said maybe when it's right for you they'll fall...", etc. Those are progressive lyrics--
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 13:27:44 -0500 (EST) From: Alex Lifeson <TRMD@grove.iup.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: WFS Message-ID: <01HP7PPJ59ZC91X292@grove.iup.edu>
Michael Van Opstall wrote: >For whoever asked about how to play the begining - it's like this: >there's a B A B thing and after each B there is a quiet low E, later when >..oh never mind, I can't explain it in words.
Actually, NO FLAME INTENDED, Michael, it's a B an octave below the first B each time, not an E, from what I can remember. Try it this way: (b is octave lower than B, c is octave lower than C, etc.) B b A B b, B b A B b, B b A B b, D E C A; 5/8 4/8 B c A B E c, B c A B E c, G a F# G b, F# E a D b. 6/8 5/8 It SHOULD be right, from what I rememeber. I have also figured out SDV for keys, LtL for guitar, some keys, and a few other parts and whole of songs. I don't know how to write them up on the computer, but I will try sometime.
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 14:21:14 -0400 From: "David John Baranski" <djbarans@eos.ncsu.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re:Portnoy- Hot Sticks?? Message-ID: <9504111421.ZM5730@eos.ncsu.edu>
On Date: Mon, 10 Apr 95 17:54 EST kwerner@holli.com (Kevin Werner) wrote:
>Has Mike been featured in Modern Drummer yet? Mentioned? I saw an ad for >Mapex, anything else?
Mike has been in MD quite a few times, and a few months ago he and some other drummers (among them Mark Zonder, Dean Castronovo (sp?), and Bobby Rock) did the first MD Metal drummers Conference where they talked about their endorsements, equipment, soloing, etc. I don't remember exactly what issue that was, but I have it at home and I _think_ it was the one with the MD Readers' Poll Awards. Portnoy won one of those (I believe it was "Up and Coming.")
-- +-------------------------------------------------------+ | Six o'clock the siren kicks him from a dream | | Tries to shake it off but it just won't stop | | Can't find the strength but he's got promises to keep | | And wood to chop before he sleeps | | - "6:00", Dream Theater, from _Awake_ | +-------------------------------------------------------+ |David John Baranski | |"One of two known Polish-Koreans on this Earth" | |djbarans@unity.ncsu.edu | +-------------------------------------------------------+
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 95 14:44:52 EDT From: rinverso@cosi.stockton.edu (Ryan Inverso) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: YTSEJAM digest 779 Message-ID: <memo.439972@cosi.stockton.edu>
Hello Jammers: I recently saw a band in Newark New Jersey. They were called: Act of Vengence. THEY KICKED ASS. The point I'm making is that these guys are one of the best unsigned bands in Jersey. I just recently found out that you can purchase thier demos over the internet. I made this post because I think that this is one unsigned band that is definitly worth checking out. I have a copy of this demo and I love it. To purchase a copy of the demo send e-mail to:aov@softwords.bc.ca and just ask about purcahsing info. Again I think these guys rule. Sorry about the no DT content.
Later Ryan "Strat" Inverso
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 12:31:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Hailey <pass@u.washington.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Re: Progressive debate... Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91c.950411121237.49938A-100000@homer03.u.washington.edu>
On Tue, 11 Apr 1995, Brian M Polka purported that: > Whether or not Dream Theater is > progressive is irrelavent to the fact that we are fans of their music
true
> labeling it does more to make people avoid it
of course the opposite could be true
> (How many of us without > actually hearing the music first would have picked up the CD if we heard > a person say Dream Theater was a grunge\alternative band?)
I confess that I would not have but then that's because I have taste big smiley
on the other hand the label progressive would be enough to make me chance it
chris no the other one
* r.christopher hailey pass@u.washington.edu * * steal this album: egostatic@aol.com * * -----> the hellcasters: "escape from hollywood" * *---------------------------*--------------------------*
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 17:00:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Dave Snyder <snyderd@umich.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: this silly progressive debate Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950411165825.3880A-100000@qix.rs.itd.umich.edu>
Ok, why is it so determine what is 'progressive' and what is not? If you like something, listen to it. There's no need to justify it with a meaningless, amorphous label. Let's stop clogging up the jam with this extraneous stuff...
**************************************************************************** "It's six o'clock in the tower blocks, the stalagmites of culture shock, and the trippers of the light fantastic, bow down, hoe down, spray the pheremones on their perfumed uniforms..." -fish, "Heart of Lothian" ***************************************************************************** David Snyder Room 3235 Markley/Reeves Ann Arbor, MI 48109-2015 snyderd@umich.edu (313) 764-9748 Patiently Waiting For Summer
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 95 14:07:25 PST From: "TDB" <tdb@SMTPGwy.microsim.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 781 Message-ID: <9503117976.AA797634620@SMTPGwy.microsim.com>
Quoth Steve Borzilleri: > 5. Tim: you know someone with a vocal range an octave wider > than James'? I don't know what James can do off the albums, > but he sings from low A an octave below middle C ("he used > to say to *me*" --Voices) to high F ("whoah-ah-*haaaaaaaow!* > --Learning To Live). Hmmmm.... That means that this person > can sing not only an octave lower than that A, which makes > their voice deeper than Billy Sheehan's(!), but an octave > higher than high F, which makes their voice higher than the > lead vocalist from Stryper! Is this person male or female? > Either way that's a pretty inhuman vocal range! I applaud > such ability!
Hmmm... When I first read that I thought it was pretty sarcastic and snotty. But my interpretation could easily be wrong, so I'd better try to give you benefit of the doubt.
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I meant an octave total, not one on either side. Also, I meant _singing_ that entire range as opposed to screaming (not just a once-in-a-lifetime fluke in the studio and then screaming in concert). And being able to get the C above that high F (without any warm up) gives you more than half an octave right there.
Male or female? I guess "lyric coloratura soprano" didn't imply gender sufficiently. I'm sorry. She's (very) female. As for an incredible range, her opera coach used to use her as a demonstrator for her other students. And she could get _every_ note in her range - I seem to recall that James has a weak spot where he switches to his falsetto.
And I'd much rather look at her than James, too. <g> (Babs will disagree on this one, but that's okay. <vbg>)
-- Tim
*** I know lots of guitarists who can play fast, but how many can play *slow*? Some of the most fun things in life are best some slowly... ;-> ***
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 16:43:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Van Opstall <mavanop@grfn.ORG> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: progressive Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.90.950411164014.7537A-100000@freenet.grfn.org>
I think technique is also important in prgressive music, which would exclude Soundgarden. I don't know what the heck that moronic messis at the end of Black Hole Sun, but I think its a guitar solo and I'm pretty sure I could play it with one hand. Sorry if anyone is offended, but they brag about not practicing in interviews. If that's good for them, OK, and I'm not telling anyone not to listen to them, but I don't like it.
Technically, 16/9 is an OK time sig, its just bizarre and can be achieved in a different way. If you want to be really progressive, try it.
M.A. VanOpstall mavanop@grfn.org
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 23:03:25 +0200 (MET DST) From: Mats Rydstr\vm <d94-mry@nada.kth.se> To: Ytsejam <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: progressive Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91N2.950411225650.24918A-100000@mumrik.nada.kth.se>
Hi!
A final note on this 'progressive'-subject: My band's got songs in 5/4, 7/4 and one chorus-section in 23/16 (yes, it's true!) and I don't consider us progressive! It's not enough to fool around with different time-sigs. Some people do it just to distract from the music otherwise being so boring and unexpressive. While some bands use it in more intelligent ways, because it fits the songs. I'm more impressed with something in 4/4 with strange accents like the well-known 6:00 or 'foreclosure of a dream' by Megadeth, than just fooling around for the sake of it in 23/16 like we do!
:-#
________________________________________________________________________ / Mats Rydstrom - d94-mry@nada.kth.se - http://www.nada.kth.se/~d94-mry / /-----------------------------------------------------------------------/ / "We can hope for the future, though there may not be one" - ACOS / /_______________________________________________________________________/
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 17:18:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "Adam m. Cook" <adamc@shore.net> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: What is Prog..? Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504111742.A28618-0100000@shore.shore.net>
I think a lotta people don't realize how versitile Prog rock is. Ie. saying Pull Me Under isn't prog but metal because it has a metal "edge" to it. I think you need to look at the name, unlike "Alternative" prog rock stays true to its name :) It's progressing in different directions all the time, dream theater sometimes has a more metal-progression to their songs, such as PMU. Well just MHO. cya
adam
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 95 16:59:14 -0700 From: kad@iris122.biosym.com To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 781 Message-ID: <199504112359.QAA10571@iris122.biosym.com>
Timo Haanp{{ UPR <thaanpaa@ra.abo.fi> writes:
> Well, am I the only one here DOESN'T think Pavarotti and > Carreras aren't that good singers. They have strong, > trained voices, but I really really don't like the way > they sing, so why would I rank them up there with > Geoff and James? :) > > Traditionally, operatic singers don't "project" with > their voices, the tone is the same all the time. They > don't "use air" like James in Wait for Sleep......
Ok, I've been watching this discussion for quite a while now and I have a hard time comprehending why such comparisons are even made. This is comparing apples to oranges, as I hope everybody realizes it. As Timo put it, he doesn't like that much opera style of singing that much and does not consider operatic singers comparable to Geoff or James. This is personal preference so there is no reason he should be flamed for it. :)
On the other hand, if you consider how rigid the operatic singing style is and try to realize it's difficulty, you will see that to achieve such level of excellence as Pavarotti or Lanza or Caruso. James is singing according to some not as strictly defined outlines and rules, he has a freedom of going on stage and cracking quite a few notes during one night. Most people won't be bothered with that (of course I will cringe :) Now, imagine Pavarotti performing on stage of La Scala and his voice cracks ONCE! I would be interested to see what it does to his career. :) I saw a man singing live once as well as numerous of his TV appearances and I have *never* heard him crack a single note. This is perfection.
But then, I know a lot of opera lovers who hate Pavarotti because of his lack of emotion (which is why I prefer Domingo, knowing that his technique is much inferior to Pavarotti's). This was always one of my problems with James's singing as well. Yes, he can sound angry, I agree but I've never heard him to convey pain or saddness as well as Geoff does. The other thing is James' diction. I see A LOT of room for improvement in this department. Also I don't think it's fair to say that Geoff's inability to hit crazy-high notes makes him a worse singer.... lets wait until James is 36 and see how his voice holds up after all the screaming he is doing now. Geoff is wise enough to realize his limits (but not wise enough to quit smoking!), he uses his voice very beautifully, he won't hit those insanely high notes anymore but I've never heard James singing in such deep sounding low baritone register either. Which probably goes to show that Geoff is a baritone while I would classify James as a tenor, so it makes it harder to compare the two. :)
Anyways... I don't want to sound like I don't like James and just keep on criticising him but the tendency on this list is to make some singing god out of him, which in my opinion he is not and he has a lot way to go. And please don't give me that bit "can you do any better?" because I think everyone of us has a right to make their comments, even if they are not the most positive ones.
I think I'm done with my monthly posting now :)
Kinga
_______________________________________________________________________________ "Wow! Wow! Wow! Wow! Wow! Wow! Unbelievable!" - KaTe Bush Kinga "Tatehead all the way :)" Dytkowska - kad@biosym.com _______________________________________________________________________________
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 17:01:28 -0500 (CDT) From: Stone <fraser@stolaf.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Vox Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.90.950411165437.14498A-100000@lars.acc.stolaf.edu>
There seems to be quite a few singers coming out of the wood works to tell us about their favorite notes (and I thought we were all guitarists here... 8^)). I'll have to join the lead singers club though, since I couldn't play more than four chords to save my ass...
I personally think Goeff Tate's voice has improved with time. Sure, he's lost a few notes off his range (check out the note toward the beginning of Take Hold of the Flame -- YEEEEEOOOOOWWWWW!! I dare anyone to even hit that, let alone hold it that long), but I think he's got a fuller tone now... jus' my thoughts.
As for James's stuff, yeah, he's good too. I don't even try most of his stuff (although I love to sing along with LSoaD), but if you want a no range challenge, try singing the end of voices (starting with "Don't expect your own Messiah...") in one breath. I can almost do it...
Cheers, Alex
***************************************************************************** |"Adesso che ho perso la vista, ci vedo meglio e di piu." --Dream Theater | |Alex Fraser St. Olaf College e-mail: fraser@stolaf.edu | *****************************************************************************
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Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 16:59:00 +0200 From: Markus_Pfeifer@citybox.fido.de (Markus Pfeifer) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Change of seasons Message-ID: <MSGID_242=3A1000=2F553.50=40fidonet_b749ec60@Fido.DE>
Hi ! I'd bought me today the 2 Set CD from Dream Theater (Comdey, Tragedy). These two CD's were recorded live in New York '93. The CD Comedy includes the tracks Eve, Pull me under, Another day - Another hand, The Klilling hand, Change of seasons, Wait for sleep and Learning to live. The cd Tragedy includes the tracks Metropolis Part1, Fortune in lies, Under a glass moon, Surrounded, Ytse Jam (incl. Drum Solo), Forever and Take the time !
Ciao... _ _ /---------------------------------------\ //\_/\\ / Fido : 2:2457/315.50 \ // \\arkus \ E-Mail : Markus_Pfeifer@citybox.fido.de / \---------------------------------------/
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 16:24:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Randy Haskin <strega@u.washington.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Echolyn NOT touring with DT...yet Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.91a.950411162252.28611A-100000@saul5.u.washington.edu>
Hi Jammers -
A friend of mine wrote to the Echolyn email address asking if there was any fact to the possibility of them touring with Dream Theater anytime soon. Here's the response from the band...
Randy Haskin strega@u.washington.edu
---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 11 Apr 95 10:36:07 PDT From: outbox@interramp.com To: orion@u.washington.edu Subject: Echolyn
Ryan-
There is no official word on us touring with Dream Theater. We have met the manager and drummer (and they have seen us play). There is definite interest on both ends, and there have been some unofficial offers, but nothing is set in stone.
Echolyn echolyn@delphi.com
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 00:27:19 +0100 (BST) From: Lazarus - aka Simon Smith <sjs@st-andrews.ac.uk> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: LaBrie's Singing Message-ID: <Pine.3.87.9504120017.C6647-0100000@pasta>
William Wright wrote: > > Really? I guess the smoking finally cought up with him. That's too bad. > He sounded fairly good on Promised Land. ButI think Geoff has/had more > power than James does... James tends to scream live. (of course, maybe > Geoff does too. I've never heard anyone say otherwise.) >
Geoff certainly hits a cleaner high note than James, but I don't think that clarity and power are necessarily the same thing. I will readily agree that James screams live, but I think there is more energy in his voice than Geoff's. This is not the same as energy in their performance. In that department, it's very hard to separate the two. I guess, when it comes down to it, they have two different vocal styles and James's voice does more for me than Geoff's; although I LOVE both bands!
Don't flame too hard, guys.... :)
Lazarus
______________________________________ \ \_______ Lazarus - <sjs@st-and.ac.uk> \ How come you don't understand me? _____________ \__________ And how come I don't understand you? \__ \_________ Thirty years says we're in this together \_____ \_____________________ So open your eyes.... \ Keys, backing vox \______________ DT - Scarred \ & crap jokes for Ex Machina. \_________________\
Ex Machina WWW Page at: http://iamac.st-and.ac.uk/ExMachina/
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 19:55:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Simon Asselin <raika@LLC.org> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Helloween, vocalists and some DT. Message-ID: <199504112355.TAA14133@biko.llc.org>
To Raistlin: Cool, one more Helloween fan on the 'jam. By picking up Keeper Part I, you really made the best choice. That is simply the best they have been. As for Kai Hansen though, he's not the singer for Keeper Part I (he's been singer for the first Helloween album only), it's Michael Kiske. People who are fighting over whether or not James Labrie bests Geoff Tate should listen to Kiske on Keeper I. While Labrie certainly sounded good in studio, he has a 'certain' difficulty to reach the same clarity and tone on stage (and moving a lot is not an excuse), example: listen to the end of TKH on LaTM. He doesn't even have the right note! As for Tate, like some guy said, he was good before in and out of studio, but he has a problem live with some songs. That is not just recent, just listen to Rock in Rio II when they do Empire, you don't need to have perfect pitch and opera training to know he messed up! While they are still favorites of mine, they do not compare to Kiske the in live performance area. It would have been great if Kiske was given an audition with DT when James was hired, he would certainly have done the job right! He may not like prog metal, though.
Back to Raistlin: If you think Master of the Rings sucks, listen again to songs like 'Where the Rain Grows' and 'Sole Survivor'. Also, the instrumental at the end is great! If you have problems picking up other Helloween material, you should try TELNETting to cdnow.com or cdconnection.com, they have it all. I would recommend against going for Cameleon, because it's very commercial and it's not very much like their other material. Try Keeper part II...
To DT maniaks: 1) Anyone knows what is the small weird symbol below the message from the band in the LaTM CD? 2) Anyone has a complete version of the 'To Live Forever' lyrics? It's been requested a bit and I thought it would be cool for DT fans to have a complete version... 3) Has Kevin Moore done any industrial stuff yet? If so, what is it like?
Sorry you all for the length of my post, but a band like Helloween deserves attention. Albeit their stupid :) name, they are a great european metal band inspired from the new wave of british metal. Vocalist fans should espiecially check out Kiske, as I would like very much to know a 'professionnal' opinion on his performance ... Lates!
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 782 *************************
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