YTSEJAM Digest 783
Today's Topics:
1) Re: Oberheim.
by jbako01 <jbako01@barney.poly.edu>
2) Fucked by Jeremy Club
by PARALLELS@aol.com
3) LatM
by bda109@psu.edu (Brian Anderson)
4) LatM
by bda109@psu.edu (Brian Anderson)
5) I want out.
by THE ANIMATED NIPPLE <csaroka@yorkcol.edu>
6) Re: Bang Tango. NO DT CONTENT
by "Olaf Peters" <olf@informatik.uni-bremen.de>
7) Jeff Scott Soto
by basmer@med-rz.uni-sb.de (Bernd Basmer)
8) To Live Forever/Kevin
by Boo-ba Fett <jmh@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu>
9) Mike Portnoy stuff
by Elliott Kim <milkman@wam.umd.edu>
10) Kevin and classics
by "Mark A. Parker" <parkerma@nextwork.rose-hulman.edu>
11) Kev.Moore-words.
by q94hg@thn.htu.se
12) Sustain?!
by John Mastin <jmastin@motown.ge.com>
13) Act of Vengence
by EMRST2@vms.cis.pitt.edu
14) IAW TAB
by COOLONAP@CAA.MRS.UMN.EDU
15) Again w/ the Singers...
by zebrowski steven <szebro1@gl.umbc.edu>
16) Progressive (again)
by Lazarus - aka Simon Smith <sjs@st-andrews.ac.uk>
17) On vocal preferences
by "TDB" <tdb@SMTPGwy.microsim.com>
18) Re: YTSEJAM digest 781
by mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass)
19) Metropolis 2
by Richard.Gullo@e-tech.havr.ma.us (Richard Gullo)
20) Re: YTSEJAM digest 782
by YBBX10C@prodigy.com (MISS JAIME K KIMPTON)
21) Guitar & LaBrie
by Steve Borzilleri <silenzio@elwha.evergreen.edu>
22) Ytsejam 780
by "HARGIS SHON M" <183500@sbuniv.edu>
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 01:09:15 -0400 (EDT)
From: jbako01 <jbako01@barney.poly.edu>
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: Re: Oberheim.
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.950412010806.2169A-100000@barney>
On Sat, 8 Apr 1995, Brian J. Wherry wrote:
> In the Japan video there's a camera angle in which the backs of all of
> Derek's keyboards can be seen. The bottom one is an Oberheim
> (spelling?). It's not black like most keyboards are. It's like grey or
> white. Is that the one he was endorsing?
>
Yes it is, like a light tan kinda color.
James
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 01:18:02 -0400
From: PARALLELS@aol.com
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: Fucked by Jeremy Club
Message-ID: <950412011801_80297626@aol.com>
Well It's been brought to my attention that we have a big time rip off artist
on our hands(thanks James the tapes in the mail should arrive Fri). I myself
also did a trade with Jeremy Haynes back at Christmas time. About 10 audios
2 vids. Never recieved one fucking tape in return. Does this seem right. I
dont think so. This has kind of got me out of doing trades. Ive never had
problems in the past and with that big of a trade you would think the guy is
legit. But it seems he organized all his trades at once. Got a few things
some of us didnt have and ripped us all off. If your reading this
Jeremy...send me my tapes...and everyone else on this list that you owe tapes
to. I was kind of blowin my stuff off..but since it seems like about 10
other people are missing shit you better fes up you fuck.....
all for now...
chris
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 23:13:10 -0400
From: bda109@psu.edu (Brian Anderson)
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: LatM
Message-ID: <199504120314.XAA12639@genesis.ait.psu.edu>
Hello Jammers,
Question: Is there any difference between the LatM made in Japan
and the LatM made in the UK? I was looking through cdnow and noticed that
there were two of them and that the one from Japan was about $5 more. So is
there an extra song on the one from Japan or is it just the price?
Also, thanks to whoever mentioned bands like Skyclad and Amorphis. I
picked up both of their CD's and love them. Especially Skyclad with the
violin incorporation.
Oh yeah, I picked up this list off of the alt.music.progressive
newsgroup that lists a bunch of prog rock/metal groups and their albums, and
what the person who compiled it thought of each band. I'm finding it very
useful in picking out new CD's to buy. If you can, check it out. If not
email me, and I'll send it to you. (bda109@psu.edu).
Later,
-Brian
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 08:56:36 -0400
From: bda109@psu.edu (Brian Anderson)
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: LatM
Message-ID: <199504101357.JAA06000@genesis.ait.psu.edu>
Hello Jammers,
Question: Is there any difference between the LatM made in Japan
and the LatM made in the UK? I was looking through cdnow and noticed that
there were two of them and that the one from Japan was about $5 more. So is
there an extra song on the one from Japan or is it just the price? Thanks,
-Brian
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 00:35:04 EST
From: THE ANIMATED NIPPLE <csaroka@yorkcol.edu>
To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com
Subject: I want out.
Message-ID: <0098EBF5.B7CB7960.3@yorkcol.edu>
Hello all,
This will be my final post. I have lurked for months and posted on
rare occasion. Those rare occasions being when there is actually something to
talk about. The current "progressive" debate is, at times, interesting, but
settled. Labeling makes little difference. However, DT is a hard rock band.
They certainly have prog. influences and certainly have prog. songs, but, above
all, even according to band members, are hard rock.
Maybe this list is lacking because DT doesn't have that much content to
discuss. They're history is relatively short, and shorter still if you're
talking about _Dream Theater_ (WDADU - present). Maybe because they only have
three albums (less imports and boots) to speak of, material runs dry. I don't
know.
I commend the "owner" of the list. This must be more trouble than it's
worth, sometimes. I have witnessed the deterioration of the list, however.
The current flame war has really turned me off.
I would post directly to the owner, but I felt some of this needed to
be heard. I would like to be taken off this list. Mail space is short, and
rarely does this list offer me anything I would want in that space.
Please, if anyone has anything to say, please contact me personally. I
would really appreciate mature input. Agree/disagree? I don't care, really.
If you want, let me know what you think.
"It's been real..."
-Chris at York College
csaroka@yorkcol.edu "What - sarcasm? Nope, never heard of it."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The giant, savage So-ut is especially bloodthirsty and cruel, making it
a crowd favorite against unarmed opponents.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Major League Baseball players...keep playing!
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Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 18:17:37 +0100
From: "Olaf Peters" <olf@informatik.uni-bremen.de>
To: "Ytsejam.ML" <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com>
Subject: Re: Bang Tango. NO DT CONTENT
Message-ID: <30914153@indigo.biba.uni-bremen.de>
Hi Jeff!
> I can't believe there is another Bang Tango fan on here!!!!
Yeah and another one here! :-)
> had gotten rid of one guitarist and found a new one. Their album was
> called New Generation, i think, and was slated for January of '94 or
> something. What happened?
I also heard they had a new album out. I bought one yesterday which I
though it would be the new one, but at home I discovered a "(P) (C) 1994
Music For Nations." on the cover. The album is called "Love after death",
with the first song being your "New Generation". Nevertheless it's a great
album, really great! More powerful than "Dancing on coals" and some songs
even harder than on the "Psycho Cafe".
Bang Tango also should have done a gig here in Bremen/Germany last thursday
(Apr 6), but rumours said the tour has been canceled. As I went to the
D:A:D gig in Hamburg that day, I don't know if they played or not.
If there is really an album never than LAD, I would really like to here
about!
Greeting, Olf
-- Private: op@hb2.maus.de (no mails >15 KB, please!) University: olf@informatik.uni-bremen.de, olf@IRC------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 10:09:19 +0200 From: basmer@med-rz.uni-sb.de (Bernd Basmer) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Jeff Scott Soto Message-ID: <9504120809.AA05055@krzsun.med-rz.uni-sb.de>
Hi Jammers!!
Well, this is just my 2 cents to this singers-thing:
I think (MHO!) that Geoff is the one with more feeling in his voice. I don't want to say, that James has NO feeling in his (I like his voice very much!!) , but IMO Geoff can express feelings better by changing his style of singing. But James is the one with the more aggressive voice. He can do better this rough singing. Goeffs voice is much clearer. So they both have their advantages...
Have you guys ever heard of that guy called JEFF SCOTT SOTO?? He sang on one (or two?) early Yngwie-records and is now in a band called - uh - damn, I forgot the name. But this singer rules!!
Bye.
Bernd.
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 01:40:59 -0700 (MST) From: Boo-ba Fett <jmh@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu> To: ytsejam <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: To Live Forever/Kevin Message-ID: <Pine.ULT.3.90.950412011936.14205B-100000@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu>
> Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 19:55:23 -0400 (EDT) > From: Simon Asselin <raika@LLC.org> > Subject: Helloween, vocalists and some DT. > > To DT maniaks: 1) Anyone knows what is the small weird symbol below the > message from the band in the LaTM CD?
No. No one has any clue :) Or at least I don't...
> 2) Anyone has a complete version of the 'To Live Forever' > lyrics? It's been requested a bit and I thought it would be cool > for DT fans to have a complete version...
I have a copy of these lyrics, that I made by listening to the studio version on the _Lie_ single and the live version on the Live In Tokyo video. The endings are different, and I have both of them. These are also on Mark Tedham's Dream Theater WWW page... (his main page is at: http://gn2.getnet.com/~markt/ )
> 3) Has Kevin Moore done any industrial stuff yet? If so, > what is it like?
The demo dub sites posted by Airdance@aol.com in this same ytsejam digest (#782) were for Kevin's new material. It is semi-industrial, not all that hard, but really very hard to describe, except maybe by saying that I love all of his stuff! I really have nothing similar but I listen to Kev's stuff all the time...
Boo-ba Fett - aka John Haveman --------------------------------------------------------------- I jumped on a meaningful wave that carried me right to the shoreline. I laughed when my face hit the sand and swam out again for the joyride. I told you the things that I want and you gave me just what I needed. It's just like my father would want, but I couldn't smile when he did. - Kevin Moore BLANKET (I Buried Me Wife And I Dance On Top Of Her)
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 05:03:29 -0400 (GMT-0400) From: Elliott Kim <milkman@wam.umd.edu> To: Dream Theater Mailing List <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Mike Portnoy stuff Message-ID: <Pine.NXT.3.91.950412045213.2604E-100000@next11pg2.wam.umd.edu>
Hey there fellow YtseJammers!
A magazine called _Talking Drums_ is published quarterly or bimonthly by Baltimore area drummers. The most recent issue that I saw had a picture of Portnoy's monstrous kit on it, and within its pages, a damn fine interview with the man. Having spent literally hundreds of dollars on stuff related to Dream Theater, I of course had to up that by $3.95 and I purchased the magazine. And yes, the guy does hit every fucking little piece of percussion that he has at least once during a show!
The interview was just the basic stuff, about the new album, why he chose Mapex, etc... and as an added bonus, it has a 2 page spread of the kit from behind! Just before I showed it to a drummer friend of mine, I warned him to have a fresh pair of boxers ready. It also went on to list every little piece of percussion on his set.
When I get around to it, and if I am faced with no objections from all you Ytsejammers, I will list every single drum and cymbal on his kit. But the basic gist of it is, 6 toms, 2 bass drums, 3 hi hats, 4 octabans and a shitload of cymbals and various toys all supported on a Mapex rack. I have also seen complete descriptions of both Petrucci's live setup and Myung's live setup as well. Interested parties should proceed to hound me and I will get around to typing it all in. :)
Later!
Elliott Kim milkman@wam.umd.edu University of Maryland @eng.umd.edu College Park
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 05:19:14 -0500 (EST) From: "Mark A. Parker" <parkerma@nextwork.rose-hulman.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Kevin and classics Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504120509.A245-0100000@o231-09>
I have yet to see someone else make this connection, so I thought I would share it. Do these lines sound familiar?
"The woods are lovely, dark and deep. But I have promises to keep, And miles to go before I sleep..."
These words (from "Stopping by Woods on a Snowy Evening" by Robert Frost) are mirrored in 6:00. Hats off to Mr. Moore for incorporating works with a similar theme... It would seem he put definite thought into the snippets of things he places into his work, whether it be Joyce quotes or samples of the OJ saga (slight grin). "Hamlet" is all over PMU; James Joyce pops up in Eve and 6:00. I haven't had any real chance (or the knowledge of literature...) to go over his demos with a fine toothed comb and pick out other references, but has anyone else spotted anything in his work?
truly a test for the intellectual ;) Kevin - still God Dom'ny
................./////////"""""""""\**/"""""""""\\\\\\\\\.................. Vere, sum Azrael Animservor, angelus mortis; sum Jasmynne Dirae -Draconanima '##` ' # # ` "People in prayer for me . /##\ . Everyone there for me : / \ : Sometimes I feel I should face this alone : / \ : - my soul exposed : / \ : It calms me to know that I won't" : ## ## : "Scarred" Dream Theater :# #________# #: .## ##. Dom'ny Luminis - the Archseraph Domine ` .. .. ' angel, unicorn, minstrel, and wanderer .... aka Mark Parker
adteneo Urielem Archseraphem Solis, ac sum et Dominus Luminis et Tenebris parkerma@nextwork.rose-hulman.edu unicorn@fuzzy.dialup.access.net anon-2356@twwells.com
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 95 15:10 DFT From: q94hg@thn.htu.se To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Kev.Moore-words. Message-ID: <m0rz2Bc-0000KvC@tellus.thn.htu.se>
Hi there !
Here I am asking about these favours again. But I just got the KevinMoore demo-tape, and I am eager to have the lyrics. It's so hard to get them, from plain listening, at least for me. I do believe any of you has them, and I would be eternally thankful if you would send them to me priavately. q94hg@thn.htu.se
I still are so confused about the songs, that I really have no opinon about them yet.
Thanks in advance and have a happy Easter. I'm going home in a couple of hours for the holiday.
Henrik Gustafsson q94hg@thn.htu.se Dream Theater Drottninggatan 62c7 +46 (0)520-155 98 Toni Holgersson S-461 33 Trollha:ttan 070-814 24 38 Just D
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 09:24:14 -0400 From: John Mastin <jmastin@motown.ge.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Sustain?! Message-ID: <199504121324.JAA03675@cybertron.MOTOWN.GE.COM>
I am a few posts behind....
To echo Hairball's statement:
> You wanna hear vocal sustain? Steve Perry on "Winds Of March" from the > Infinity album. Holds that sucker FOREVER. Go listen to it.
Another sustain that goes on forever is Dennis DeYoung during *Suite Madam Blue* off of Styx's *Caught In The Act* album. It must go on for about 30 seconds!!!
(The part that goes, *You've conquered the world and mooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooooooooorrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!)
Shame that Styx ain't what they used to be! :)
-Johnny
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 10:23:18 -0400 (EDT) From: EMRST2@vms.cis.pitt.edu To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Act of Vengence Message-ID: <01HP8XT2798Y9X6APH@vms.cis.pitt.edu>
Hey, Whoever posted about the band Act of Vengence, I tried e-mailing them at aov@softwords.bc.ca and had my mail returned because it didn't recognize this user. Could you check on the e-mail address and repost please. Or if the info is incorrect, is there a way you could find out the correct information?
You can e-mail the response direct to me if you'd like.
KAI
ps. I'm still accepting unsigned material to play on WPTS at Pitt, so anyone in a band, send me CD's or tape, AND promotional package. Send to:
WPTS c/o KAI 900 Crestwood Dr. N. Huntingdon, PA 15642
I have everything sent to my residence because of the theft problem at WPTS.
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Date: 12 Apr 1995 09:46:30 -0600 (CST) From: COOLONAP@CAA.MRS.UMN.EDU To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: IAW TAB Message-ID: <01HP8WJ9GVXU8YCQOS@CAA.MRS.UMN.EDU>
Hey, DT fans! I just found this list yesterday, and I'm pumped!! I've never heard a band like DT, and I can't tell you how long I've spent figuring out Petrucci's riffs (forgive me, I'm human). Anyway, I saw someone elude to a IAW tab book...Is this really true? That would really make my day! Can someone help me out? Thanks a ton in advance, Adam Coolong University of Minnesota Morris (insert cool sig here) coolonap@caa.mrs.umn.edu
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 12:26:17 -0400 (EDT) From: zebrowski steven <szebro1@gl.umbc.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Again w/ the Singers... Message-ID: <199504121626.MAA08122@rpc15.gl.umbc.edu>
I can't agree more w/ the jammers who said that you really can't compare the respective voices of someone like Tate or LaBrie w/ those of Domingo or Pav- arotti. I know I jumped onto the Fave Singer thread and posted, but it's apples and oranges. As far as Rock singers, I say LaBrie--hands down. When it comes to the Three Tenors, my favorite is Pavarotti, but it is Placido Domingo who has managed to retain the light, lyrical, innately "tenor" quality to his voice, in spite of both his years and...well...girth?... circumfrence? Well, I think we all know Pavarotti wins in that department!:P Pavarotti's voice has become more rich, and gotten a Baritone quality. Not a bad thing, mind you. Being a Baritone myself, I could never say that that is bad.
As far as the Tate/LaBrie debate; I think that LaBrie is the most technical singer out there, as well as one of the most emotional, along w/ Tate, Gary from Extreme, and Weiland from STP. But one thing about Tate: I can sing Images & Words and Awake straight through w/ minimal problems, but if I pop in Operation: mindcrime...I can barely get through Revolution Calling w/o getting seriously worn out.
See Ya
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <"...Thought disorder; ___ ___ ___ _ _ ___ ___ "Balls and chunk is > <Dream control. Now | __||_ _|| __|| V || __| |_ | where it's at." > <they read my mind on |__ | | | | __| \ / | __| / / --Mike Portnoy, LiT > <the radio...But where|___| |_| |___| V |___| |___|"I think SpontanUity!"> <was the Garden of Eden?" szebro1@gl.umbc.edu --John Petrucci, X103> <--John Petrucci, Voices Radio Show> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 17:24:25 +0100 (BST) From: Lazarus - aka Simon Smith <sjs@st-andrews.ac.uk> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Progressive (again) Message-ID: <Pine.3.87.9504121722.A23294-0100000@pasta>
Evenin' all,
Just Lazarus here again to mumble on about life in general.
Dave Snyder <snyderd@umich.edu> wrote: > > Ok, why is it so determine what is 'progressive' and what is not? If you > like something, listen to it. There's no need to justify it with a > meaningless, amorphous label. Let's stop clogging up the jam with this > extraneous stuff...
In my opinion, it's debates like this that set Ytsejam above most other lists/newsgroups. They are well-informed, intelligent and don't degenerate into pointless flame wars. A much better read than most other stuff.
Having said that, I don't think there is an answer to what is/isn't (semi-(P(p)))rogressive. I actually had this discusion with a friend a few days ago and after three hours, we reached no firm conclusion. Maybe the defintion of progressive is that: "The band cannot be defined and labelled in any 'popular music' category" :)
Having said that there is no answer, to this question, I'll now put in my two cents worth about the time-sig thing. I know, I contradict myself, but who cares? I don't... yes I do... no I don't....
Mats Rydstr\vm <d94-mry@nada.kth.se> > > A final note on this 'progressive'-subject: My band's got songs in > 5/4, 7/4 and one chorus-section in 23/16 (yes, it's true!) and I don't > consider us progressive! I'm more impressed with something in 4/4 with > strange accents like the well-known 6:00 or 'foreclosure of a dream' by > Megadeth, than just fooling around for the sake of it in 23/16 like we > do!
I'm inclined to agree. The stuff that we're writing is mostly 4/4, but we do use the odd time signature when the song justifies it. There's a song I've got half-written which has alternate bars of 7/8 and 8/8 in the verse and the accents are well off the beat. The only reason for this is that I wanted to give the singer a chance to breathe at the end of every other bar, otherwise I would have written the entire verse in 7/8 and left it at that. Weird time sigs just for the sake of it don't do a great deal for me. (Admittedly, I've written stuff like that, but none ever made it into finished songs...yet.)
DT have the skill to make it all gel together, even when they do change sig unexpectedly. Their music benefits from the changes and that's the most crucial factor in justifying time changes (IMHO). I've heard several 'prog' bands using odd time sigs and the whole thing just sounds disjointed. Strange sigs are not an essential part of progressive music. They are certainly used more by bands labelled that way, but there's no real need to put them in just for the sake of it. If it works, fine! (e.g. the 13/8 at the end of 'Ryche's Best I Can) But I try to write to make the song sound good, not to get the band labelled 'progressive'.
What I'm trying to say is that, while unexpected and odd time signature changes are generally considered a part of progressive music, they are not essential in every song and can often destroy the fluidity and feel of a song in some cases. Don't try to define progressive by saying it must have twenty-seven different time singature changes in one song and at least one must be 27/13. =:} (This wasn't inteteded as a flame, it's just my opinion).
Sorry for the long post....
Lazarus
______________________________________ \ \_______ Lazarus - <sjs@st-and.ac.uk> \ How come you don't understand me? _____________ \__________ And how come I don't understand you? \__ \_________ Thirty years says we're in this together \_____ \_____________________ So open your eyes.... \ Keys, backing vox \______________ DT - Scarred \ & crap jokes for Ex Machina. \_________________\
Ex Machina WWW Page at: http://iamac.st-and.ac.uk/ExMachina/
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 95 09:27:17 PST From: "TDB" <tdb@SMTPGwy.microsim.com> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: On vocal preferences Message-ID: <9503127977.AA797704204@SMTPGwy.microsim.com>
Kinga "Tatehead" Dytkowska sent a post that is too long for me to quote, but it summed up a couple things about opera vs. rock and James' voice that I was having trouble putting into words. Thanks for sending that! The technique vs. emotion issue pops up all over the place. I was at a flamenco dance concert and the program notes said that the greatest artists may not have perfect technique, but their ability to convey emotion...
Quoth Simon "Lazarus" Smith: > I guess, when it comes down to it, they have two different vocal styles > and James's voice does more for me than Geoff's; although I LOVE both > bands!
Makes perfect sense to me. Though my personal preference is the other way around, I agree it's a matter of whose style touches your heart / grabs your gut / whispers to your soul. (And my God, it would be a boring world if everyone had the same tastes! <g>)
Except, of course, that there is _no_ guitarist to compare with Nigel Tufnel... <g>
Later,
-- Tim (who needs to proofread himslef more carefully)
The woods would be silent if only those birds sang who sang the best.
*** I know lots of guitarists who can play fast, but how many can play *slow*? Some of the most fun things in life are best done slowly... ;-> *** (this SIG is for Kryt)
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 16:03:48 -0500 From: mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 781 Message-ID: <199504122001.QAA11367@nic.iii.net>
kbibb@arastar.com (Ken Bibb) wrote:
> From: mer@sol.iii.net (Marc Respass) [ME] > > > a band doesn't have to write every song in 16/9, and in a Lydian
> Anyone who writes in 16/9 should be shot!! (16/9 is not a valid time > signature :)
> I didn't write the original, but I thought I would point out that > 16/9 *is* valid, just extremely difficult. It's saying that there > would > be 16 9th notes (that's the tricky part) per measure. You'd probably > count it > > 12345 1234 1234 123 > or > 123456789 1234567 > > (or some other really funky thing). This would be extremely > difficult > without a computerized metronome... > > But I agree--the writer should be shot since it's not natural to > think > in terms of 9s.
I hate to keep getting into music theory discussions but NO, 16/9 is NOT a valid time signature, but you got half way there in your defense. You explained how to count 16 beats to a bar. Here's the easiest example: 1234 1234 1234 1234 - not funky at all. No harder than playing in 12.
You are right that 9th notes would be tricky but it's because they don't exist. In order to have 9th notes you would have to invent your own system of musical notation. So far, I've never heard of anyone coming up with any different divisions than the standard system in use. In 4/4 you would divide a whole note into 16 16th notes or 8 8th notes or 4 4th notes or 2 half notes. Notice the divding by 2. In your proposed 4/9 a whole note would be divided into 18 18th notes, 9 9th notes, 4.5 4.5th notes, 2.25 2.25th notes. I think you get the point. It's not that it couldn't exist, it's just that you would have to invent it yourself and teach it to people. If I ever got a piece of music that said 16/9, the composer would have to explain it to me. I couldn't just play it because it's non-existant therefore invalid. I just thought it was funny (16/9) because it was either a typo (still funny) or someone who was just making up something that sounded right (like d flat minor - a non-existant key sig (puh-leese let's not continue that it is a key. A key sig can't have more than 7 sharps or flats.).
We now return to our regularly schedule program.
Marc Respass mer@sol.iii.net http://www.iii.net/users/mer.html
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 10:04:00 From: Richard.Gullo@e-tech.havr.ma.us (Richard Gullo) To: Ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Metropolis 2 Message-ID: <797703777.AA06831@e-tech.havr.ma.us>
Hi Ytsejammers,
I was wondering if anybody knew if there was going to be a Metropolis part 2 on "ACoS".I met with John Petrucci at their October "94" concert at his Alma Mater,Berkley College at the Center of Performing Arts.I inquired why there was no "M2" on the Awake album,he responded with "Don't worry,there will be."I thought maybe it would be on ACoS.Anybody know?
Lata Yours truly, Rick
* Origin: E-Tech Systems BBS, Haverhill, MA, USA (1:324/132)
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 16:18:25 EDT From: YBBX10C@prodigy.com (MISS JAIME K KIMPTON) To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 782 Message-ID: <013.05421731.YBBX10C@prodigy.com>
Hey Babs ---
My mother GRADUATED with Lou Gramm, in fact, I also went to the same high school he did. <G> I like Foreigner, they're a big 96 WCMF staple. Not that I ever listened to it much <although they DID play "Pull Me Under" quite a bit in late '92>, 90.7 WGCC was way better as far as metal was concerned. Remember the Hillside Strangler? Me mum also dated HIM briefly in high school! I wasn't born for approximately another 8 or 9 years, relax everyone! <VBG>
DT content? Does anyone know where promo flats for I&W and Awake can be obtained? You know, the 24"x24" light carboard with the album covers that record stores put up to promote the CDs? I haven't seen any around here...
"God sometimes you just don't come through..." TORI AMOS - Jaime the Dragon
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 15:58:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Steve Borzilleri <silenzio@elwha.evergreen.edu> To: Dream Thespians <ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com> Subject: Guitar & LaBrie Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9504121517.A1521-0100000@elwha.evergreen.edu>
Time to piss some people off because I can't reply any other way:
To Whom It May Concern: (Pull Me Under) I don't think it matters much how Petrucci tabbed his riffs for the transcriptions of anything. Analogy: lots of vocalists write out the lyrics to songs, and those lyrics are printed on the album coverslip or j-card. It is very rare that they actually sing the exact words on those sheets. Same thing with guitar. Petrucci might have tabbed that riff a particular way, he might have written it a particular way, but he does not play the same riff live as he does on the album. I can play what is on the album, and I have transcribed it. Three of the notes in that run are played twice, which is very awkward for the fingers, having to "hold" the spot on three of the notes so they can be picked twice in the middle of a fast single-hit run like that. Yes, there are 13 notes in that fast run, but three of them are played twice, and at such a speed, it can be called oddly-timed. As for the I&W tab book, I will have to see it before I can comment.
To Tim: I transcribe. I'm a musician. If someone makes an offhand remark like, "a whole octave higher than Mariah Carey's highest note," my mind clicks on the highest note she has ever sang on an album, then calculates the note an octave higher. That gets analyzed, then I speak. So if someone says something like that on here, my reply is not in sarcasm but honesty. You posted your friend's range, and I misunderstood you, but what I said was in utter disbelief. I was serious when I said I applaud such ability, because such people do exist, but I have never heard of such a range going that low AND that high. Okay, you meant something different, just letting you know I wasn't sneering at you when I made my reply.
Yeah, I read a lot of things on here that I think are "sarcastic and snotty" too. Big fucking deal. I read a lot of stuff that I think doesn't relate to Dream Theater, such as posts about Helloween or Bang Tango. As much as I would like for this list to be purely about Dream Theater, I know that other stuff will appear, and I'll read through it, and people will flame other people, and I'll read through it, and assholes will come out of the woodwork at times, and I'll read through that too. As difficult as it is sometimes to say, "Uh, sir, did you INTEND to flame my ass a minute ago?" it sometimes helps to just ignore what you think is a sarcastic remark in your direction. And EITHER of those is better than posting a bunch of shit to slander the other person, because that helps no one. If this were all e-mail, we could all go ahead and argue all we wanted. Unfortunately, it's public, and not everyone on the list is involved in the argument. Take all that personal shit along with all the stuff you don't like on this list and skip it. Roll with the clouds.
On James, the two times I saw him, he hit every note cleanly. The only screeching I have ever heard him do is on various bootlegs. So if I ever decide to comment on this silly war between the Tate Union and the LaBrie Confederacy, it will be to support both of them. I've never heard Paganini play live, but I know what he wrote and I am positive he could play it live and in person. Why? Call it faith, call it a hunch, call it an understanding of the gleam in his eye, but quite frankly I think that if James would calm down and not get so pissed off when does his thing, he could sing like I heard him every time.
Oh, while we're here, I might as well go back to Tim, who referred to James' singing as a "once-in-a-lifetime fluke in the studio." If I were the sort to get into net-wars, a la Portnoy vs. Peart, I'd flame you to hell on that comment. Not that I care about the welfare of James LaBrie, but I think that's a really silly thing to say. Anyway...
When I saw DT in Seattle, at one point, someone threw a tape up on the stage. It was probably a demo. This was during a solo part, and James had dashed off to the side of the stage. He came back out, saw the tape, and executed a brilliant kick which sent the tape flying to the other side of the stage. Petrucci did a little hop to get out of the projectile's path, as it probably would have done him harm. Not to mention the wonderful scowl and hunched shoulders James displayed as he marched out from the side of the stage...
I have seen Labrie perform other acts such as this at other shows, and I have heard of him doing stuff like this all over the place. Maybe this is why his singing suffers, maybe he's pissed off at the audience or something. He just does not ever seem to be enjoying himself. I've heard people say Kevin never enjoyed himself live, but at least he was indifferent about it when he performed, whereas LaBrie really seems to get angry an awful lot.
Bafu Vai
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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 22:17:43 CDT From: "HARGIS SHON M" <183500@sbuniv.edu> To: ytsejam@anthor.arastar.com Subject: Ytsejam 780 Message-ID: <4F035F6789@sbumast.sbuniv.edu>
Hello fellow jammers!!! This is my first post, even though I have been reading the list two or three months. I've been enjoying the discussion of progressive music, but have no comment on that as everyone else has exhausted every definition that I could of to describe Prog music.
Now to the actual DT content. In Ytse 780 William Wright <wwright@galaxy.galstar.com> wrote: About >Geoff Tate. . . he is much much more > natural sounding than James. James seems to force the high notes...
This is NOT a flame, but I do not agree with you. Even though I like Geoff's singing, there is no way that he could sound more natural than James, because Geoff is a falcettist (hope I spelled it right). That basically means he is singing in a very high head voice, that is not even produced by the real vocal chords. Confused yet? All I'm saying is that Geoff does not sing in his 'real' voice, not that there is anything wrong with that. On the other hand, James voice is more powerful because he uses his 'real' or 'full' voice. He probably is reaching for the high notes, but that is most likely because he wants to keep the fullness in his voice. Enough said.
Also in #780: William T Bajzek <impaler+@CMU.EDU> >i love james's voice, and he's a great singer but i think he may be >overrated in the sense that he's not very consistent. he's awesome on >the albums but live he cant do it nearly as well. it kinda bugs me, i >wish they'd give that a little consideration when they write stuff >just so it sounds better, is easier on his voice, and he can do it >longer...
Again, not a flame, but IMHO there are very few singers who sound as good in concert as they do on tape. IMO, the reason is the length of time spent on the road. Touring for months or even just weeks is very difficult for any singer, not to mention the rest of the band, but it is most noticeable in the singer's voice. Try singing over loud instruments or even a stereo for a few hours every day, and I think you too will find that you don't sound that well. The only singers that I know of who have consistent voices are trained and PRACTICE that training -- it is sometimes too easy to forget what you learn in voice lessons. Nough said.
Sorry for the long post, but Heh, its my first!
Shon: 183500@sbuniv.edu
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 783 *************************
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