YTSEJAM digest 1624

Date: Sat Jun 15 1996 - 14:06:41 EDT

  • Next message: "YTSEJAM digest 1629"

                                YTSEJAM Digest 1624

    Today's Topics:

      1) Re: YTSEJAM digest 1622
     by (Ernesto Schnack)
      2) Re: Funky Bass Medina
     by "Paul W. Cashman" <>
      3) Metallica (NDTC)
     by Monty Newberry <>
      4) Maturation Miasma
     by Gilbert Thetgyi <102346.2730@CompuServe.COM>
      5) Whose Band Is This Anyway?
      6) ELP, LTL
     by (Ernesto Schnack)
      7) This is dtc, I am the content!
     by "D_TiCian" <>
      8) MD.45 and Night Ranger (NDTC)
     by (Keiji Nishihara)
      9) peacocks
     10) Good Times & PKZIP300 viruses
     by Michael Burstin <>
     11) peacock, part 2
     12) LOAD SUCKS, get over it..
     by (Joe Guiles)
     13) Re: YTSEJAM digest 1623
     by Jeffrey David Olson <>


    Date: Fri, 14 Jun 1996 23:42:52 -0400
    From: (Ernesto Schnack)
    Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 1622
    Message-ID: <>

    > I wonder, if you were a brass player, if a musical orgasm evolved
    >the ejaculation of valve oil or slide grease....oh well.

    Ben, you are sick.

    > A band can keep their oldest fans without selling out. I don't believe
    >Metallica fits that argument. They have changed so drastically in such a few
    >number of releases (i.e. AJFA to TBA) that the "maturing" argument is
    >extremely hard to swallow for the longer term fans.

    Well, there *is* one point to ponder... consider the amount of time that
    went between each of those releases. And wouldn't you expect them to come
    up w/ some different stuff during that huge tour in which they basically
    played the same stuff every night? (well as far as I know)...

    and BTW, I got into Metallica w/ AJFA, and got all their previous stuff
    (including Garage days & Cliff em all) way b4 TBA came out... so I'm well
    aware of how much they changed. (yes I know you weren't talking to me, but I
    wanted to say that :P )


    Funky Cold Medina
    Ernie :)


    Date: Fri, 14 Jun 1996 22:19:36 -0700 (PDT)
    From: "Paul W. Cashman" <>
    Subject: Re: Funky Bass Medina
    Message-ID: <>

    > Does anyone think John Myung can get funky?

    "Hear the bassist get funky! Hear the bassist get funky!"

    Hope the 'Tallica threads are dying out.... I've been a fan since
    1988 and more than that since 1989, but sheesh. You'd think they'd
    released a country song or something--

    Oh. Wait. Ooops.

    +----  Paul W. Cashman ---+
    | Publications Director                   Charter member,      |
    | Dragon*Con '96,  June 20-23                     T.I.K.K.     |
    +----  "Let the Light Surround You"   Dream Theater  ----------+


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 00:27:24 -0500 From: Monty Newberry <> To: Subject: Metallica (NDTC) Message-ID: <>

    Oh man. I just heard something that I thought I'd never hear. The local alternative station (105.7 KPNT St. Louis) is playing "Enter Sandman" right now. What has this world come to ;)? They also just played a commercial for a Lollapalooza contest and didn't play any new Metallica in the background. Just stuff from AJFA and MOP (I thiknk).

    Dale R. Newberry


    Date: 15 Jun 96 01:51:08 EDT From: Gilbert Thetgyi <102346.2730@CompuServe.COM> To: ytsejam <> Subject: Maturation Miasma Message-ID: <960615055108_102346.2730_HHQ58-2@CompuServe.COM>

    >From: "Steven Johnson" <> >Subject: YTSEJAM digest 1620 >*** Reply to note of 06/13/96 09:15 >Ben,

    I know I'm not Ben, but I had to jump in the fire.

    >Don't take this wrong, but....have you ever thought that Metallica jus isn'tt >as good as they were before TBA?

    No, I think they're better. I can hear the blues and jazz influences in Kirk's playing. Newsted is also a big blues fan. Just because the only old metal they care for is Sabbath and New Wave of British Heavy Metal (NWOBHM), that's they're prerogative. With the exception of Anthrax, I don't care for much metal either. And don't infer that because I don't like it, it must be bad: it's just not my cup of tea.

    > I mean the bottomline could just as well be that their creativity in the metal genre >has run out so they have brought in a new influence--commercial success on a >large scale.

    What's wrong with bands doing what they want to do AND enjoying success?

    >Is it any wonder Jason Newsted --the newest member of the band--allegedly >wants to move in a new direction?

    You forget what being the "newest member" of the band means. Kind of like Hagar and VH. These guys have been in their bands for years, and people still think that their newbies. Metallica has a structured, disciplined creative and recording process. When you do things a certain way for years, you don't re-write the book overnight. Kirk is finally getting input in the creative process...and he's been in the band since Mustaine got the pink slip. The combination of Hetfield and Ulrich is a precise machine, and they have every right to be perfectionists. For "Load", Jason was able to come up with his own basslines, as opposed to James or Lars giving him suggestions. That's a step in the right direction.

    >It seems so many people on the Jam want to equate "oldest fans losing interest" >with the inability of those fans' to mature and grow with the band as well. > A band can keep their oldest fans without selling out. I don't believe >Metallica fits that argument.

    To quote you, Steve: "Cut the crap" _You_ think Metallica sold out. Fine. I don't think they did. If they're doing what they want to do, they have my respect. I'm getting tired of your anti-Metallica sentiment: you're more than entitled to it, but it's getting repetitive. For example, I can't stand Megadeth or Pantera. You don't see me whining about "Trendkill" or whether either of those bands sold out. When "Trendkill" came out, I read all of the reviews. I didn't waste my or anyone else's time, by "venting". If you want to continue this Metallica debate, please reply to me via e-mail. I'm sure the Metallica haters grow weary of our ramblings.

    > They have changed so drastically in such a few number of releases (i.e. AJFA >to TBA) that the "maturing" argument is extremely hard to swallow for the longer >term fans. Not saying 14 year olds can't appreciate and get crazy to the stuff that >came out when they were 4, but they haven't GROWN with the band. It is a >relationship over TIME as well as musicalappreciation or BELONGING to a certain >image.

    I first heard "Justice" in eighth grade. I became a fan and worked my way backwards. I saw the "Damaged Justice" tour that summer, and it would be my second concert ever. I was blown away. The energy, delivery, stage presence, and musicianship killed me. For a week after the show, I WAS James Hetfield singing "The Thing That Should Not Be". That was the beginning... The Black Album came out when I was a junior in high school. I was now listening to lots of Queensryche, King's X, Living Colour, and Rush in addition to Metallica. Just like now, people had already formed opinions about the album before actually hearing the whole damn thing. I didn't like it upon first listen. But, the more I listened, the more I could hear things they were trying to implement and use. When I saw the "Roam" show in December of 1992, I had high expectations. I had eighth row, and was expecting to be blown away. I was right. "An Evening With Metallica" was that and much more. No opening act, and a true test of endurance. Metallica had re-affirmed their status as one of my favorite bands. Which leads to today. I've finished my junior year of college, still listening to Living Colour, Ryche, Rush, King's X, but also to Crimson, DT, Seal, Matthew Sweet, FNM, Seal, Harry Connick, Jr., Helmet, Rollins, Fishbone, and lots more jazz. "Load" has more than exceed my expectations. It's not perfect, but the vibe is still there. If you want "Puppets" or "Lightning", listen to those albums. If you want growth, both physical as well as musical, give "Load" a chance.

    >...It has nothing to do with how many others' like it, it has to do with who I believe >DESERVES the notoriety and WHY. I have no problem admiting ANYTHING. And >anyone who does wouldn't read your post and all of the sudden say, "Wow. This >kid's right!"

    Believe what you will. I'll believe otherwise.

    >The bottom line is Metallica as I know it isn't Metallica anymore. Metallica >as YOU know it is the same. You were 9 or 10 when TBA came out. Fine, so you >appreciate the early stuff and other teens do, too. But you haven't seen the >band change through the years.

    As I've said, I have. And I'll embrace change; not reject it.

    >Metallica and Anthrax have grown and changed and I still loved them. But as far >as I,a long term fan, and many others care, they have ceased growing and are >only changing--and not for the better. It's emotional as well as musical. If they >started playing like U2 in 1987, I'd have started to hate them, too...AND I LIKE U2.

    What the hell is the problem with Chicago? Must be something in the water...

    >But Metallica has to grow as Metallica, not as some generi-incarnation that is "hip >today" (another Extreme may want to check 'em out. They've >remained true to their art as well as being exceptional musicians.......something >Metallica can't claim.)

    Yeah, and that's why Paul Geary left...if they remained true to their art, they'd be releasing Extreme albums: not solo albums, doing musicals, playing with Robert Palmer, etc. Don't get me wrong, I like Extreme, but you could have provided a better example. I hope this anti-Metallica backlash continues, I picked up the "Sad But True" and "Roam" import (UK) singles used for $3.00 and $2.00 respectively. To quote 'Harvester Of Sorrow': "Your loss becomes my gain".

    The House I Built,

    G. Jack Thetgyi


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 02:39:44 -0400 From: To: Pimp Style <> Subject: Whose Band Is This Anyway? Message-ID: <>

    Jam 1623:

    > From: Pat Daugherty <> > Subject: various stuff

    > 3. I guess it is not good for DT to produce their own album DT has so > many talented musicians and each would want their parts intensified, etc. > > But with a band like Van Halen for example, I am sure Eddie has a mega > say in what is done, since it really is his band.

    (Especially with David Lee Roth gone... but we won't get into that)

    I'd say that when you get down to it, Dream Theater is really John Petrucci's band. It's just that "Petrucci" as a band name sounds kind of dumb.

    Just look at him in the group photos for Awake and ACOS... what a smug-ass muthafucka. He's standing there all big & bad, with that look on his face like Yeah, you just know I'm the Man. Who's your Daddy.

    I mean, all 5 guys in the band obviously do collaborate... but I would think that certain members' ideas would carry a little more weight; namely, Petrucci's and probably Portnoy's. Guitar and drums-- that's where the Balls & Chunk are. What puts the HEAT in Dream tHEATer (and the REAM, for that matter...).

    I really don't mean to give short shrift to the other 3; but Derek's the New Guy, JM's the Silent Man, and James is... well, the Singah. Don't get me wrong, they all rock, (particularly if they're reading this) but let's be realistic. (And with the very influential KevMo gone, there's going to be a large gap in the songwriting force, but they said he didn't have a large hand in Awake, which is why the album is so guitar-heavy.)

    Before I start a war between instruments here, I'd best try a little diplomacy. In a perfect world, all 5 guys would have an equal say, they'd all possess an equal talent and vigor for songwriting (musically & lyrically), and every song they wrote would showcase each of them equally and appropriately.

    But the fact of the matter is-- or should I say my *conjecture* of the fact of the matter is-- that JP (and maybe MP) probably has Veto Power over the other guys. Guitarists tend to do that, the rat bastards. (Isn't that some form of discrimination? Instrument-ism? Guitarrorism?)

    And so you have your songs where Derek sits out (or just plays String triads). Where James sits out (or just plays tamborine or goes "Whoooaaaa... yeaaah"). Where Myung is just doubling JP's leads (or just playing low B or E over & over). IT'S NOT FAIR. The Truth Ain't Kind.

    I'm not exactly sure what my point was here. Um... something about who wears the pants in Dream Theater. And man, that leather gets tight.

    Ah, well, who cares who wears the pants, it's what's inside that counts...!

    (Um, uh, <cough cough> that didn't sound too good... I think I'll stop now before BABS makes another Finger Laken' joke... or before someone else brings up "Balls & Chunk" in an entirely unwarranted context...)

    Scott. Wears The Pants


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 01:57:34 -0400 From: (Ernesto Schnack) To: Subject: ELP, LTL Message-ID: <>

    I just found out that DT covered Karn Evil 9 by ELP.... is this on any boot? Does anybody have a recording of this?

    A little comment about LTL (Whoah! I've actuall been having DTC in my posts) you know the part on LTL from 7:50 to 8:10? I'm I the only one that detects an oriental feel in there? I know the notes are basic E minor stuff, but it just sounds'oriental to me... maybe I got my ethnic sounds mixed up...

    And while we are on the subject of LTL... on the part that goes "On ce again we dance in the crowd, at times a step away...etc" I always get this urge to hop backwards on one foot... I guess it's because of the 'a step away' line and the beat MP does there... silly, dontcha think? :)

    Funky Cold Medina Ernie :)


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 18:27:14 +8GMT From: "D_TiCian" <> To: Subject: This is dtc, I am the content! Message-ID: <>


    _dtc_on_ndtc_ Okay, so I spent an entire evening going thru search engines, and stealing from other people's page. I must have been thru 80% of DT pages on the web. And I put together a whole lot of links to DT pages. I can't claim tt it's the biggest list of DT links, but hey, it's quite a bit. So wanna see it? or visit the whole dang thing

    I probaly broke some copyright laws or unlawfully linked some folks pages. Sorry. Oh, can I link your page? Heh. Anyone want to add more links?

    _dtc_ So we all know DT probably isn't going to release an album this year.

    Now I was wondering if anyone could record boots for me, I'll pay for shipping and misc charges. We don't get to see much DT boots here, very few. And I was wondering u know... "Oh trade!? It's my only one."

    /me quit (ytsejamming is fun...)

    ===================================================== Chan Zhi Hong, Darryl = D_TiCian = dtc || ~Are you thinking of me whe you fuck her?~ -Alanis Morissette


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 96 23:06:56 +0900 From: (Keiji Nishihara) To: Subject: MD.45 and Night Ranger (NDTC) Message-ID: <>

    Hi! I'm Keiji from Japan.

    Megadeth's Dave Mustaine's solo project MD.45 was released in May. This is a bit punkish hard rock/heavy metal album. Vox.Lee Ving (Fear) has the style of Blaze Bairy (Iron Maiden),so sometimes reminds me of Iron Maiden and Megadeth("Killing.....","Peace Sells...." days).

    Original Night Ranger will play 2 shows in Japan. 1996-07-08 Liquid Room,Tokyo 07-09 Liquid Room,Tokyo

    Thanks. -Keiji Nishihara Kyoto,Japan


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 11:27:28 -0400 From: To: Subject: peacocks Message-ID: <>

    i still think that porntoy and petrucci should be doing their own producing.................

    and's the air dance chick (as mentioned by the motown guy). and vpk- yeah, she's what i would call ffidh.

    speaking of funky fresh in da house, someone PLEASE check out the new vernon reid album. i've just gotten throough the first song, and my colon exploded! nice groove stuff, and there's like horns and stuff goin' on. and hey, even better, i'm gonna go see him monday night! yay!

    just imagine,

    1998 grammy for best hard rock/heavy metal performance: dream theater (name of album here, which i shall arbitraily call "blow the load")______________, produced my mike porntoy and john petrucci.

    kinda has a nice ring (i feel like a genius, tying sellouts and grammies with dt!).

    peace out, g! ffidh

    *****************************************************************david kobayashi

    "turn off your mind, relax, and float downstream...."

    -j. lennon

    "...funk not only moves, it removes..." -g. clinton *****************************************************************


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 11:54:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Burstin <> To: Subject: Good Times & PKZIP300 viruses Message-ID: <>

    Sorry for the non-DT content, but I want to clarify some things

    As several have posted, the "Good Times Virus" is not a virus at all, unless you consider the bandwidth stolen by messages transmitted about it and disk space used on mail servers to save it.

    The PKZIP300.??? is, however, a very real Trojan Horse, not a virus. PKWare, Symmantic's Anti-Virus Research Center, and even the NCSA Virus center have mentioned it on their web page. The file alone will not do anything uuntil executed, when executed, it will proceed to attempt to format your C drive. I beleive standard unformat programs will recover the volume, but I am not certain. What it all comes down to is, if you have a PC, don't download any files called PKZIP300.??? (either ZIP or EXE).

    Again, sorry for the non-DT content... although its not like most of the other posts have anything to do w/ DT anyway

    -- +----------------------------+---------------+---------------------+ | We can learn from the past | Dream Theater | Michael Burstin | | But those days are gone +---------------+ Brandeis University | | We can hope for the Future | A Change Of +---------------------+ | But there may not be one | Seasons | LET'S GO PENS | +----------------------------+---------------+---------------------+ For info about Dream Theater, finger


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 12:02:41 -0400 From: To: Subject: peacock, part 2 Message-ID: <>

    to pam wheaton (methinks). same greg lake. same ol guy, yesyes.....and crimson is indeed touring i believe. i don't know if they're doing their own tour, but i know that they're playing the h.o.r.d.e. festival (which i think is crazy) festival in nyc in august.

    still think they should produce themselves.if prince and trent reznor can, why can't they?

    waiting for this concert billing to happen: shmuckopalooza- with headliner l7, foo fighters, metallica and the dave matthews band. nuff said.

    oh, so i posted stuff about the new vernon reid yesterday. well, i've heard some more of it, and it is real sick. i mean REAL sick. great stuff all around.

    also of note, the craft soundtrack features some good tunes and some cool people. andy summers, greg bissonette (remember the bissonettes/satriani thread from ages ago?), doug wimbish, and covers of "i have the touch" (gabriel) and "tomorrow never knows".

    peace out. happy father's day to all those applicable.

    ***************************************************************** david yoichi kobayashi the wild and magical koba.

    "i bring truth and understanding, i bring wit and wisdom fair. precious gifts beyond compare."

    until the circle breaks, and wisdom lies ahead, the faithful live Awake, the rest remain misled."

    binghamton university, music and philosophy *****************************************************************


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 96 13:26 EDT From: (Joe Guiles) To: Subject: LOAD SUCKS, get over it.. Message-ID: <>

    For all of you out there that think LOAD is good.. your an idiot.. and you think Metallica is still good... your a fuckin idiot.. LOAD is the worst Metallica has sounded in ten years.. That was for Grinder.

    Sledge Sledge..


    Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 12:58:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey David Olson <> To: Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 1623 Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.91.960615124242.24208B-100000@shamu>


    I know this list isnt moderated and by me even POSTING this message is complete hypocrasy, BUT....

    I dont wanna hear anymore about 'Tallica. I dontt care who likes it and who doesnt I want to hear about Dream Theater<- (DTC) or Progressive stuff in my opinion Metallica is not Progressive.

    Even if its not about DT at least argue about somthing Progressive.


    On a lighter topic...

    My band Angelkill just got signed to Wild Rag Records in Montebello, CA

    (our music is in the vein id Death, Sepultura, and yes DT is a big influence in my personal writing)

    We currently have our "Beyond the Black" and "Artist of the Flesh" Cassettes distributed through Wild Rags and Nuclear Blast and several other distros, but the "Beyond the Black" and "Artist of the Flesh" CD's will be out in late Sept, or early Oct.

    If you would like to check it out immediately, you can buy the cassette for $6.00 payable to:

    Wild Rag Records 2207 W. Whittier Blvd P.O. Box 3302 Montebello, CA 90640 Both tapes are not demos, they are full length releases with 10 songs each so your not paying $6 for a 4 song Ep


    "All Angelkills recordings are..."

    C L O S E D C A S K E T F O R T H E H E A L I N G I M P A L E D /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

    ..shameless plug, sorry :)

    Jeff Olson


    End of YTSEJAM Digest 1624 **************************

    This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Thu Apr 01 2004 - 17:55:33 EST