YTSEJAM Digest 3331
Today's Topics:
1) DT Rareties, Prog cliches
by "Ken McWatters" <kmcwatters@hotmail.com>
2) Favorite Albums
by Rick Booth <hellion@shell.busprod.com>
3) FW, ASSPOG
by "Paul W. Cashman" <vanyel@crl.com>
4) FII Production
by Isaac Sabetai <isabetai@bu.edu>
5) Re: ** A Tribute to FATES WARNING **
by Isaac Sabetai <isabetai@bu.edu>
6) Re: Nothing into Nothing (nothing like NDTC)
by jOHN jENS <jjens@darkhorse.triad.net>
7) Help needed...
by "Jani Liimatainen" <sirjani@hotmail.com>
8) NDTC - FOR SALE
by Dave <buster@ee.net>
9) re:psych101
by RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU
10) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3330
by RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU
11) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3329
by "Richard A. Rivera" <rrivera@zoo.uvm.edu>
12) New Opinion
by drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh)
13) Re: The Progressive Dream Theater & the Progressive Metallica
by drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh)
14) John Myung's Brother?
by PERCGR8 <PERCGR8@aol.com>
15) FW
by Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au>
16) (no subject)
by Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au>
17) Japanese DT CDs
by "TheCowGod" <dmc@dreamt.org>
18) Letting nothing bleed into nothing
by Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 07 Dec 1997 22:16:40 PST
From: "Ken McWatters" <kmcwatters@hotmail.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: DT Rareties, Prog cliches
Message-ID: <19971208061641.5917.qmail@hotmail.com>
This isn't probably the rarest DT item out there, but I'm still kicking
myself for passing it up. Back in early '94 or so, I was browsing
through the bargain bin at Hastings like any college student would, and
this one was full of cassette singles. I decided I wasn't going to blow
money on two cassingles, and I had two to choose from:
DT, Another Day and Rush, Nobody's Hero (it has Stick It Out on the
b-side). I chose Rush, and I'm glad to have it, but I wonder if I'll
ever see that DT item again.
Chris Merlo wrote:
>Speaking of rare stuff, I happened to come across the "You Not Me"
>promo single today (Ged, I love college radio! :) Two tracks: "Edit"
>(4:16) and "LP Version" (4:58). The edit does some *very* weird >stuff
in the chorus, and the end is slightly chopped (like 2x instead >of 4x
or something).
Did you hear the 3-song "metal sampler" on HardRadio before FII came
out, which had You Not Me, Burning My Soul and Peruvian Skies? I know
the version of YNM was an edit, but I dunno if it's the same one you
have. Just thought it'd be interesting to see if it's the same edit.
As for another prog cliche? Pot smoke pervades every concert (in
medium-to-large venues, anyway). :)
Ken
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 00:27:16 -0600 (CST)
From: Rick Booth <hellion@shell.busprod.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Favorite Albums
Message-ID: <199712080627.AAA06229@shell.busprod.com>
Hola Jammers,
I've seen a lot of posts regarding Metallica, Fates Warning, and Iron
Maiden. It seems we have a lot of different people on this list with alot
of different musical tastes. I personally hate the new Metallica (although
I own AJFA and MOP) and some of FW.
Here is a list of some of my favorite non DT music:
Rush -- Permanent Waves, A Farewell To Kings, Hemispheres
Ozric Tentacles -- Arboresence, Jurassic Shift, Afterswish
King Crimson -- In The Court of the C. King, Larks Tongues in Aspic
Yes -- "Classic Yes" and Fragile
Frank Zappa -- Hot Rats, Waka/Jawaka
ELP -- Brain Salad Surgery
Van Der Graaf Generator -- H to He Who Am The Only One (anyong have any
reccomendations for other VDGG albums?)
Rage Against the Machine -- RATM & Evil Empire
Clutch -- Clutch
Fates Warning -- Inside Out
Another thing on my mind is DT and radio play. Back in 1995 we used to
have a cool radio station called Z 104.5--they played rock and roll such
as Pearl Jam, Nirvana, Neil Young, Gary Hoey, Dream Theater, Rush,
Metallica, Soundgarden, etc. I did not like some of the music they played
but they did play some of my favs--Rush and DT. In 1996 the station
changed managment and is now called Z104.5--THE EDGE. Now they suck,
all they play is minimalist trendy garbage. You would never heard DT
on there anymore wheras they used to play PMU, LIE, Caught in a Web, and
Take the Time! Now, you flip on the station and hear the same crap that
is played on MTV--Fiona Apple, Wallflowers, etc--whatever is trendy.
NP: Rush "Different Strings"
# "The great thing about playing for this band as opposed to other #
# bands is that these guys encourage me to actually play the keyboard, #
# not just hold down pads. #
# --Derek Sherinian (Dream Theater 98: Petrucci/Portnoy/Myung/Sherinian #
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 7 Dec 1997 22:51:23 -0800 (PST)
From: "Paul W. Cashman" <vanyel@crl.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: FW, ASSPOG
Message-ID: <199712080651.AA01488@crl.crl.com>
I've taken out this CD in anticipation of the show here on the 14th,
dusted it off, played it through. Umm, it's good. As someone said,
it's nothing I'd want to throw a party over. The song really doesn't
seem to go anywhere and 'tis true, some parts sound.......well,
"minimalist" sounds kinda harsh, so let's say...."less-enhanced."
I'll continue to spin it -- it'd be nice to "grok" at least part of
Fates' set, and ASS-POG (to use the fond #ytsejam reference) comprises more
than half of it.
-- +-- ...once the cloud that's raining ---+- Paul W. Cashman ---+ | over your head / disappears | vanyel@crl.com | | the noise that you hear | www.crl.com/~vanyel | +--is the crashing down of Hollow Years.... --+---- ICQ #4151223 -----+------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 02:13:40 -0500 From: Isaac Sabetai <isabetai@bu.edu> To: Ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: FII Production Message-ID: <348B9E24.BEA75236@bu.edu>
> > I know that we're all skewed toward our favorite band, DT, but it seems > > like many of you are being blind sighted! How can all of you go on and > > say that the production is great on FII?? > > I never said it was great...but im not saying it sucks either. You have to > remember that ppl have different ideas as to what 'good production' is. > Some ppl think I&W has great production...i think its horrible...Some think > Awake has the best production ever...I think it has way too much reverb, > and the guitars are too up front. > With all this talk about the production, it's kind of funny that people most happy with Kevin Shirley's job were the members of DT. Was not it posted that Shirley is re-doing Liquid Tension Experiment? Someone must have been pleased. :)
Isaac -- "It sounds diminished ... but it's not"- John Petrucci
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 02:24:56 -0500 From: Isaac Sabetai <isabetai@bu.edu> To: Ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: ** A Tribute to FATES WARNING ** Message-ID: <348BA0C8.2F1E0DE5@bu.edu>
Carlo D'Angelo wrote
(long boring post snipped)
> Its funny....I unsubbed a few months ago and what do I see when I > return...same shit, different day. Good ole' jam....god bless the Page > Down Key. Bring back the days of arastar.com......please! > Well you have two options: A) Get a Delorean (or an equally good time machine) and go 88 MPH. or B) subject: asdf message unsubscribe (your name) ytsejam.
Isaac -- "It sounds diminished ... but it's not"- John Petrucci
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 02:11:13 -0600 (CST) From: jOHN jENS <jjens@darkhorse.triad.net> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Nothing into Nothing (nothing like NDTC) Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.971208020612.1465B-100000@darkhorse.triad.net>
On Sun, 7 Dec 1997, Kevin Madden wrote: | | As for Mr Longshot's question about "let nothing bleed into nothing" | you have to add the implied first person pronoun for it to make | sense: (I) let nothing bleed into nothing, and (I) did nothing at | all - which goes along with one of Fates' most predominant themes | of being frozen by indecision and being unable to make differences | that would change things for the better. See "nothing left to say" and | "chasing time" (among others) for more examples of this recurring | theme.
one could also read it as a command, with an implied "you": (You) let nothing bleed into nothing, and (You) did nothing at all." it's all context though. ah, ambiguity. ain't it swell? :)
any Pynchon readers on here? email me privately or use WASTE (hahahah).
alter, john (mastah procrasntinatah)
-- jOHN jENS + jjens@shell.webzone.net + www2.webzone.net/~jjens
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 00:38:22 PST From: "Jani Liimatainen" <sirjani@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Help needed... Message-ID: <19971208083822.19155.qmail@hotmail.com>
Does anybody know how I could get my hands on When Dream and Day Unite?I'd like to buy it,but I don't know how to get it,since I live in Finland.Any Finnish Jammer who'd like to help?
~Jani~
______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 03:44:13 -0500 From: Dave <buster@ee.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: NDTC - FOR SALE Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19961208034413.00693698@ee.net>
Hi all, NDTC:
Had a MAJOR accident Friday night. I was in an icy parking lot with my computer in my hands when I slipped and took a terrible fall. I've banged up my knees pretty bad, twisted my back, and of course broke my computer. Which brings me to the reason for this post...I am using a friends PC to send this message out.
I'm trying to raise money for a new computer, so I have a CAR CD PLAYER FOR SALE. It is a PIONEER DEH-40DH, single CD player with stereo tuner and detachtable face. It was in my 95 Dodge Neon with a perfect fit, 5 minutes to hookup. It is in PERFECT condition and I am asking $150 for it (paid $420 for it new).
Since I am not sure when I'll have a computer, please call me at 614-442-8716 if you're interested.
Thanks, Dave (aka buster)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 04:12:03 -0500 (EST) From: RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: re:psych101 Message-ID: <01IQX1QD10L60002HR@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU>
>>nightmare is over... NEVER, EVER, *EVER* take a Psychology course if you >>can help it! Especially if you're a CS major!)
>Uhm, actually, psychology courses are QUITE interesting and >informational. I recommend that everyone take some sort of psycology >course during their stay in whatever educational system they may be >residing in.... You can learn a lot about why people do what they do, what
Yeah, if it's taught right. I took this sort of "Psychohistory" class that dealt with pyschologically analyzing things like why Nixon acted the way he did, stuff like that. It changed my life. I didn't learn any cool tricks about what advertising to avoid, but I *did* learn that stuff in my propaganda class. (btw, subliminal advertising=hoax).
I bet lars just got stuck with a crappy teacher or something.
josh rasi2290@splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 04:19:16 -0500 (EST) From: RASI2290@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3330 Message-ID: <01IQX1YLL9G00002HR@SPLAVA.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU>
>can't say I don't mind some catchy myself! I like Bid Wreck, actually. GO >agead, flame me for likeing them. I'm not a prog-only music fan. :) >Granted, I"m pretty picky, but, hey, I actually LIKE Big Wreck.
Me too, don't get so defensive. I sincerely hope that there's nobody on this list who's loyalty to prog is so strong that they would flame someone for not liking prog-only bands. We're not THAT pretensous, are we?
I don't even like prog that much. I have two FW cd's, a galactic cowboys tape, some early genesis, lots of QR and some IM. I like DT because...I don't know why. Prog's cool but it's not the main reason I like them. And I like all sorts of top 40 stuff. I like radiohead, U2, Beck, Bjork, Paula Cole, the Cure, lots o' stuff.
I didn't spell pretensous right, did I? oh well
josh rasi2290@splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 04:20:43 -0500 (EST) From: "Richard A. Rivera" <rrivera@zoo.uvm.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3329 Message-ID: <Pine.A41.3.96.971208041248.37856A-100000@elk.uvm.edu>
On Sun, 7 Dec 1997 ytsejam@ax.com wrote: > FII is great?! yeah right....the only thing its good for is curing my > insomnia. If the new DT had an ounce of creativity that FW has then it > would have been the masterpiece everyone hear was hyping it to be (too > bad "hype" is all I got)...I bought it...got bored...forced myself to > listen because this "WAS" DT of course....got bored some > more....realized that DT are but a shadow of their former > selves......sold it back and spent my money on better things. > Quick question: why are you on this list if the "new" DT sucks? Not everyone has to love every album the band puts out...that's fine. But why would someone spend their time reading three or four e-mail digests (assuming your not in ack mode) about a band that now suddenly sucks?
Bring back the days of arastar.com......please!
Yeah, I'm in the mood for religious debates, top ten lists, definitions of "progressive" (oh yeah, we're still on that one).
> I'm sorry for the people who can't appreciate the deep rooted > complexities of FATES...you don't know what you're missing. > I'm sorry for the people who can't appreciate the deep rooted complexities of FII...you don't know what you're missing.
Richie
P.S. You're .sig looks like one big phallic symbol
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Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 01:09:57 -0800 From: drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: New Opinion Message-ID: <199712080909.BAA03906@gms.gmsnet.com>
You, know you can bash Fates, but it's really not effective... BUT...
I hereby declare that Blind Mellon is better than the new Metallica...
-The Doc
At least Blind Mellon didn't sell out...
-- #$%*#$*@ E-MAIL: drkhoe@gmsnet.com #$%#$#$% _+_+_+_+ Unix, Internet, Intranet Engineering _+_+_+_+ [][][][] Dr. Mosh's Progressive Feast [][][][] #$@#$#@# http://progmetal.gmsnet.com @#$@##@$
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Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 01:05:16 -0800 From: drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: The Progressive Dream Theater & the Progressive Metallica Message-ID: <199712080905.BAA03865@gms.gmsnet.com>
On the Eve of Destruction, Jason Keis - DRulz said: > >Well, last night I watched Metallica play on SNL (who should also one day >get fuckin' Dream Theater on!!!) and I thought it completely rocked (with >the exception of the flat Marianne Faithful, but I'll give her the >benefit of the doubt and won't judge Metallica's performance on this at >all. Then afterwards I started thinking... "How come Mike Portnoy >doesn't really seem to support Metallica's new direction?" I always
AlternicA is by no means progressing... they are playing rockabilly with a little crunch... That SNL performance was the biggest spectacle of how far a band can go down... that isn't METAL... that's a load of dung...
>thought Dream Theater was based on "Progressive" music, and I am a >diehard supporter of both Load and ReLoad... I believe Metallica has
That's fine... I'm a die hard subscriber to the "Retardica has sold out" school... Portnoy is correct in his judgement...
>always been a progressive band, but not on the same technical level as >Dream Theater. It's different music, definitely, but Load and ReLoad is >excellent music nevertheless.
Excellent in your subjective opinion... Kirk Hammet's solos have gotten even more tasteless as of late...
>to album. This is what I want to focus on. Every one of Dream Theater's >albums only belong on the albums which they are on, and not on any >other. The same goes for Metallica. Thus, both bands are doing the >right thing... because who the fuck wants to listen to the same shit over >and over again? Talented bands must progress... and both Dream >Theater and Metallica fall into this category.
Ok... I've been trying to control myself... but now I'm laughing really hard...
That's like saying Queensryche become more progressive on HitNF...
-The Doc
-- #$%*#$*@ E-MAIL: drkhoe@gmsnet.com #$%#$#$% _+_+_+_+ Unix, Internet, Intranet Engineering _+_+_+_+ [][][][] Dr. Mosh's Progressive Feast [][][][] #$@#$#@# http://progmetal.gmsnet.com @#$@##@$
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Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 04:42:16 EST From: PERCGR8 <PERCGR8@aol.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: John Myung's Brother? Message-ID: <49f334c2.348bc0fe@aol.com>
i had this weird experiance in an AOL chat room..... i was in my DT chat room all alone, as usual unfortunatly, and this guy comes in and says his kid brother plays for them. He said he played bass. I said "Your brother is John Myung!!!" and he responded " yea last time i checked, i suppose you are Mike Portnoy's brother. LOL" Confused i simply stated no. Then he said " C'mon Mike i know its you, all you do is play stupid games online." and i said " you think im mike portnoy?" then he freaked out and said" Sorry dude my mistake i thought you were someone else" im not John Myungs brother and im just another nut on AOL, sorry to bother you." and when i tried to respond he had signed off. I may just be paraniod but i really think he was serious until he realized it wasnt Mike and then he freaked and didnt want the attention so he left. But i dont know too much about John's brother or if he even has one. Can anyone tell me if John has a brother and what his name is if he does. And does anyone know if Mike is on AOL sometimes. As i said im probably just reading to much into this but things like that dont happen often. Thanx fellow jammers.
Dave "Gather ye Rosebuds While ye may" "Old Time is Still a-Flying" "For that same Flower that Smiles Today" "Tomorrow will be Dying" - Dream Theater
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Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 19:48:33 +1000 From: Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au> To: ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: FW Message-ID: <348BC271.3BE7@winshop.com.au>
To all those jammers who continue to confess they just can't get into FW, then do this;
- Buy Parallels or pull out your old, neglected, "bought on a recommendation" copy of it from the bottom of your closet and wack it in your CD player.
- Sit down and listen to it and try real, REAL hard NOT to make the subconscious DT comparison and .....*magic* - you may just come to appreciate it for what it IS instead of what it ISN'T compared to Awake or I&W. (Same goes for all albums in FW's fine post-No Exit quiver).
Try this, please.
Until the eleventh hour calls....
Luke.
PS. Of course, you may still feel dissapointed with 'em. In that case forget it, FW are definately a very select, acquired taste.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 19:48:38 +1000 From: Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au> To: ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: (no subject) Message-ID: <348BC276.52EA@winshop.com.au>
> PS-the remix of Almost Honest on the Mortal Combat soundtrack SUCKS. > I can't believe Megadeth let that jerk turn a great song into second > rate techno bullshit. And that song is the first single from the > soundtrack! Oh well, at least it's good publicity for Mustaine and > crew.
Hehe, check out For Whom The Bell Tolls on the Spawn soundtrack. The remix is by some f**kwit called DJ spooky. Bloody joke...
Until the eleventh hour calls....
Luke.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 07:10:16 -0500 From: "TheCowGod" <dmc@dreamt.org> To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Japanese DT CDs Message-ID: <01bd03d2$3e91cd00$2ac95bd1@emc.caribe.net>
>From: Mike Stoner <mdstoner@pcocd2.intel.com> >Subject: Rare stuff? > >Coincident with all this talk about DT rarities, I happened to see the >Japanese Awake CD going for $36 at my local Dimple records. I'm not gonna >buy it since it doesn't have any music I haven't already heard, and I'm >not a diehard collector, but if anyone thinks that's a good price or just >cannot find this CD, send me a reply and I'll grab it for you.
Hehe, I got 2 of these CDs, i na ddition to my american copy - my grandparents went to japan last year (they're all rich and stuff :) and i asked em to get me WDADU - so they brought me 2 copies of awake and one of I&W. Hehehe, bless their souls they don't know shit about DT :) Oh well, it enhanced my DT collection, i can't complain. And then i broke my american I&W, so i pla the japanese one now, and my american awake got all scratched, so i listen to one of the japanese awakes. An interesting factoid: both the japanese awakes and the I&W CDs are printed lighter than their american counterparts. I mean the actual CD - for example, on the japanese awake, most of it looks actually kind of grayish, and the majesty logo is readily apparent. same with I&W. I can scan coth versions of each CD if people actually care but i'm sure no one really does. But that's the beauty of e-mail, you can give unsolicited information and most people can't do anything to stop you :) Heehee. Well, I'm off. Moo!!
--
"Have you ever been used or will this be the first time?" - Dream Theater, "Light Fuse And Get Away"
Dan McCormack dmc@dreamt.org http://premium.caribe.net/~emc/
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Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 03:16:23 -0800 From: Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Letting nothing bleed into nothing Message-ID: <3.0.32.19971208031607.006cfd5c@cats.ucsc.edu>
My APSoG is in thecar, so I'm doing this from memory.. forgive errors of memory, please
I always felt that the "Let nothing bleed into nothing and do nothing at all" reprise was part of the response to the "When the lines are all drawn, what should we do today?" reprise lyric from the end of part 6. So more of an implied "We should" than an implied "I"
I hear the implied "I" more in the first time: "Let nothing bleed into nothing and did nothing at all" which corresponds with the "Mudered in Munich, Crucified in Rome" -- the implied I is there as well.
And for those who don't think that Fates can move an audience didn't see them in Fremont, with a small club singing along with nearly all of APSoG. That was a cool sight to see. Yet, I can see how Fates can be hard to get into. They are a subtle band. They don't hit you over the head with technical playing or blazing solos.
__ /\ __ Chris Oates: aspect@cats.ucsc.edu __\/__\/__ +---- \_||_/ | "Still awake, I continue to move along, cultivating my | /__||__\ | own nonsense" -Dream Theater, "Trial of Tears" | // \ | \\ ----+ \| http://www2.ucsc.edu/people/aspect/
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 3331 **************************
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