YTSEJAM Digest 3360
Today's Topics:
1) LIE
by Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au>
2) (no subject)
by Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au>
3) DT live double cd sets for $25 (LONG)
by Marcel Berkhout <berkhout@xs4all.nl>
4) TV Broadcast of DT show
by Shai Yallin <Yallin@Netvision.net.il>
5) dt. and the future
by "Salvatore" <hondaa@iol.it>
6) dt. and the future
by "Salvatore" <hondaa@iol.it>
7) dt.
by "Salvatore" <hondaa@iol.it>
8) Emotion
by Seth Hatlelid <srhatlel@artsci.wustl.edu>
9) Fates, DR, MR last night
by Kevin Madden <kwmadden@pipeline.com>
10) DTIFC No. 15??
by dantemm@erinet.com (Dan Temmesfeld)
11) Stupid A** people! (Ranting!!)
by Chad Mitchell <kerensky@telepath.com>
12) What goes around...
by Chad Mitchell <kerensky@telepath.com>
13) FII
by CRAIG GRIFFITH <derfelt@usa.net>
14) milan gig
by Marco Petrini <mpetrini@tin.it>
15) My first DT Experience, Phish
by "Nick Giannotti" <nickg@gis.net>
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 20:23:55 +1000
From: Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au>
To: ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: LIE
Message-ID: <3492623B.65D5@winshop.com.au>
> There is a song on Acoustic Dreams called Long Island Expressway that
> has a bass line that sounds like Lie. The guitar part is acoustic.
Isn't LIE, an acronym for Long Island Expressway ? Wasn't the Lie clip
filmed on the Long Island Expressway ? That's the impression I was under
anyway...
-- Until the eleventh hour calls....Luke slslb@winshop.com.au
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 20:23:52 +1000 From: Luke <slslb@winshop.com.au> To: ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: (no subject) Message-ID: <34926238.524C@winshop.com.au>
> > Well it's really simple mate, a 'yankee' or 'yank'is am American.
> Son, I'm from the South. Call *me* a "Yankee", and ah'll hafta take > ye out behahnd tha woodshed and teach ya some manners. ;) > Chad Mitchell > Owner/GM - Oklahoma Outlaws
This can be interpreted in several ways. The one that unfortunately entered my head when I initially read this....uuurrrggghhh, (Pulp Fiction scene with the gimp). :-]
-- Until the eleventh hour calls....
Luke slslb@winshop.com.au
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 14:13:39 +0100 From: Marcel Berkhout <berkhout@xs4all.nl> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: DT live double cd sets for $25 (LONG) Message-ID: <34928A03.3C4E5ED4@xs4all.nl>
Hi everybody,
It's been some time since I posted a message to the 'Jam, but I think I have some interesting new material for you all! Here's what I have to offer:
Dream Theater in 'De Maaspoort' Den Bosch, Holland December 3rd 1997. It's a double cd set with a total running time of 147 minutes! The tracklist:
DISC 1: 01. Intro - A Clockwork Orange (2:46) 02. Lines in the Sand (13.36) 03. Burning My Soul (6:00) 04. Voices (10:25) 05. Under a Glass Moon (7:39) 06. Hollow Years (6:43) 07. A Crack in the Mirror / Puppies on Acid (3:12) 08. Just let me Breathe (6:06) 09. Peruvian Skies (7:31) 10. Pull me Under (9:02)
total running time Disc 1: 73:04
DISC 2: 01. Take Away My pain (7:20) 02. Scarred (11:58) 03. A Change of Seasons - The Darkest of Winters (3:49) 04. Ytsejam (6:14) 05. A New Millennium (8:06) 06. Metropolis - part 1 (14:16) --> Mike actually sings a couple lines from Metallica's 'ONE'!!
EXTRA TRACKS: 07. Trial of Tears (12:55) from Noorderligt, Tilburg, Holland April 16th 1997 (!!!) 08. Purple Rain (9:30) from a Drum & Guitar clinic, Orlando August 18th 1997
total running time Disc 2: 74:05
The soundquality is really good. It's comparable to the 'Caught in Amsterdam' or 'Carpe Diem' bootlegs. Absolutely great sound!
Besides this NEW double cd set, I also have some older material on cd.
1. De Melkweg, Amsterdam April 14th 1997 tracklist:
Intro, ACOS 1&2, Pup, The Mirror, Lie, Burning my Soul, Another Hand, The Killing Hand, Just let me Breathe, Caught in Alice's Nine Inch Tool Garden, Peruvian Skies, Pull me Under, Lines in the Sand, Take Away my Pain, ACOS 3&4, Ytsejam, Learning to Live, ACOS 6&7, Metropolis, PLUS 2 EXTRA TRACKS, DT playing Van Halen!
The soundquality on this on can't get any better! It's actually much better than the 'Caugt in Amsterdam' bootleg from this show.
2. El-N-Gee, New London December 12th 1995 (with 6 extra tracks!) tracklist:
Intro, Under a Glass Moon, Pup, The Mirror, Lie, Instrumental, Lifting Shadows of a Dream, Medley of covers, Innocence Faded, A Change of Seasons, Surrounded, Voices, Silent Man (electric), Pull me Under, PLUS EXTRA TRACKS, Pup/Take The Time, Bad (U2), Wait for Sleep (acoustic), Metropolis (incl. Long Island Expressway from Acoustic Dreams!), Keyboard solo Derek, Jailhouse Rock!
Soundquality is really good on this one, much better sounding than the 'Fix for 96' bootleg, not as distant.
3. Vredenburg, Utrecht, Holland February 14th 1995 (with 4 extra tracks) tracklist:
Intro, Pull me Under, 6:00, Take The Time, Caugth in a Web (incl. Drum solo), Lifting Shadows of a Dream, Guitar solo, A Crack in the Mirror, Pup, The Mirror, Lie, In the Flesh, Erotomania, Voices, The Silent Man, Perfect Strangers, Metropolis, PLUS EXTRA TRACKS, Damage Inc, Funeral for a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding (both from February 15th), Scarred, The Ones Who Help to set the Sun (from 'A Kick into a Dream')
Soundquality is really good on this one, also much better sounding than the 'Fix for 96' bootleg
The guy who recorded these shows (except El-N-Gee) also did the Carpe Diem recording. But Carpe Diem was recorded during a outdoor festival show. These shows were all recorded inside, which makes the overall sound a lot better. All the shows were recorded on a portable DAT recorder with some high-end mics (don't know which). I copied those DAT's directly onto the CDR discs.
The BIG difference between 'Carpe Diem' and these double cd sets is that I'm NOT going to include a full color booklet with these cd's. I will print b/w liner notes with a little tool called 'CDlabel' so you'll have a tracklist. I just want to keep it simple this time. This is also the reason that these cd set are relatively (sp?) cheaper than 'Carpe Diem' which was only a 1 cd set, and costed $20. These double cd sets wil only cost $25 US including postage to any place in the world!
---> How to order one (or more!) of these cd sets <---
1. If you dont' live in Europe, you can do the following:
Send a INTERNATIONAL POSTAL MONEY ORDER for f 50,- (fifty dutch guilders is equal to $25 US these days). to the address below. DO NOT send a 'normal' money order, because it will cost me $8 to convert those suckers! If you're not sure whether I can convert these money orders or not, please ask at your local post office. It can save both you and me a lot of time (and money).
OR you can send $25 cash the the address below. Which might look a bit dangerous to you, but don't forget it's also a lot easier. I always did it this way, and never had any troubles. A lot of people who ordered 'Carpe Diem' from me sent me cash too, never had any problems.
There is another way of doing this, but it may take some time. Find 1 person who collects all the 'normal' money orders or checks (made out to that person, NOT to me!) and when he/she has enough checks, that person will send 1 BIG 'normal' check or money order to me. That way it will only cost me $8 once! But like I said, this may take a while to organize.......I did it with Mike Bahr though, and it worked great (on my Carpe Diem project).
2. If you live in Europe (except Holland), you can do the following:
Send a Eurocheque for f 50,- (fifty dutch guilders) or f 50,- cash to the address below.
3. If you live in Holland, you can do the following:
Da's erg makkeijk! maak f 45,- (geen f 50,- i.v.m. verzendkosten die wat goedkoper zijn!) over op het volgende rekeningnummer: 13.50.20.409 (Rabobank) tnv Marcel Berkhout. Vergeet niet even een mailtje met je adres te sturen!
ok, here's the address:
Marcel Berkhout Thailandsingel 24 2408 HN Alphen a/d Rijn The Netherlands
Well, I hope you all like the offer.
Take care, Marcel Berkhout
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 17:21:40 +0200 From: Shai Yallin <Yallin@Netvision.net.il> To: Ytsejam Mailing List <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: TV Broadcast of DT show Message-ID: <3492A804.2F1915A3@Netvision.net.il>
Hi there!
Hey, Mike Bahr, waddya say about getting that show and dubbing it for us (for a small fee, ofcourse) like that Awake show you did? (hint...)
C-ya,
-- Shai Yallin - Kurush on #YTSEJAM
"I'm American, honey. Our names don't mean shit." - Bruce Willis on Pulp Fiction
"How can you keep your head and not go insane when the only light at the end of the tunnel is another train" - Mike Portnoy
Visit my home page at http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Palladium/3247
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 16:44:44 +0100 From: "Salvatore" <hondaa@iol.it> To: <bduesterhoeft@enter.net> Cc: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: dt. and the future Message-ID: <199712131607.IAA28537@odin.ax.com>
i thnk that the todays situation won't change since there'll be organizations like M.tv that flood us with temporary and trifling bands and never transmits sreious groups,like dream theater or others....never a rock moment, never metal, prog....nothing! how can we go on this way?OK, always backstreet boys...but what about 10 minutes of dream theater?
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 16:53:54 +0100 From: "Salvatore" <hondaa@iol.it> To: <bduesterhoeft@enter.net> Cc: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: dt. and the future Message-ID: <199712131607.IAA28535@odin.ax.com>
i think that todays situation won't change since there'll be organizations like M.tv that floods us with temporary and trifling bands and never transmits serious groups like dream theater or others.....never a rock moment, never matal,prog.....nothing! how can we go on this way? OK,always backstreet boys....but what about 20 minutes of dream theater??
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 17:38:52 +0100 From: "Salvatore" <hondaa@iol.it> To: <kerensky@telepath.com> Cc: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: dt. Message-ID: <199712131642.IAA28672@odin.ax.com>
hi, yankee:-) !! i'm joking,naturally! what about last dt.album? i love it....but i love all dt albums! let me heard your opinion about it.
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 10:57:28 -0600 From: Seth Hatlelid <srhatlel@artsci.wustl.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Emotion Message-ID: <l03130300b0b86d4da5b8@[128.252.105.105]>
With all this talk of Fates being so great due to their emotivemess (I know the Fates thread is a dead horse, but this really isn't about Fates it's about emotion and mood) I was curiou sto see people's replys to this statement. If Apsog is great and complex simply beacuse it brings about a certain mood and correspnding emotion. Is Sepultura's "Roots" great because it makes you feel angry throughout every song? Is Korn's self-titled great beacuse you get so !@#$%^ frustrated at life, the universe, and "the man" after you hear it. Is Lorenna Mckennet great because every song evokes infinate sadness and mystery?
This is not a flame or to trash any of the above people as I like them all. This thought made my question the validity of teh "mood argument" for complexity. As much as I love Sepultura, I would never consider them complex.
The Spice Girls are neither spicey nor girly, talk amongst yourselves.
Seth
Seth Hatlelid srhatlel@artsci.wustl.edu
Check out my web page at http://artsci.wustl.edu/~srhatlel/index.html
"After the confession of sins and before the Act of Contrition, the priest is supposed to ask, Do you sincerely resolve not to commit this sins again? But Father McSwain's hurry-up version was more like "Commit these sins again?-to which I could have sincerely answered yes." -Michael Ryan, Secret Life
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 12:03:58 -0500 From: Kevin Madden <kwmadden@pipeline.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Fates, DR, MR last night Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19971213170358.006a2654@pop.pipeline.com>
>Ok, it's just before noon on Saturday, and I am gearing down >from last night's show; and gearing up for tonight's! Last night: > >Mercury Rising: The sound was horrendous. I could hear the singer >for the first several songs, and when I could he didn't sound too >hot. He did mention he was sick, so I'll give him the benefit of the >doubt. Thay played a fairly short set, and I only recognized a few >songs from "Upon Deaf Ears." Small stage hurt them, too. The bass player >was pretty goofy. > >Divine Regale: Almost the highlight of the night. This is one TIGHT band. >Although on "Underworld" they had a few technical difficulties ;-) >I was front row center, and it was a good place to be for sight, but being >about as far as humanly possible from the sound board, the sound was >iffy. Notice a trend? The guys in DR seemed a hundred times more relaxed >at this show than they were back in August when they opened for Fates >in Virginia. They seemed a bit suprised that someone knew lots of their >lyrics (not all, I confess) being that this was their first time in MD. >It was cool though. The re-arrangement of "Fear the Storm" from "Horizons" >was a cool twist, especially when you are used to the original version. >They seemed like they were having a good time. Keyboard sound was a problem >and it would get worse.... > >Fates Warning: The unthinkable happened. One moron darn near ruined the show. >There was a drunk up front screaming "RAY" and "NO EXIT" the entire show. >Quiet parts in "APSOG?" - you got it. Ray was trying to schluff him off >by waving at him, but it wasn't working. Other front row denizens were >ready to kill him. He says to me something about his Flyers (as I was wearing >my Red Wings yzerman jersey) and then told me that he likes Fates Warning. >Gee, thanks. He kept screaming the whole show long, and it ruined the effect >of APSOG. Keyboards went kaput. Major problems. After APSOG, they came back >out for "At Fates Hands" which is very keyboard-intensive. oops. Major keyboard >problems. Did I mention that? It still ruled, though. Then came "11th Hour" which >was of course great, and then "Monument", which I still feel has problems without >a second guitar. That was it. We were all like, "WTF?" They only played about >85 minutes. No second encore. We were out of there at 1am. I really don't >blame them for cutting out early. Daytona's is a dive, and the crowd always >sucks there. There were several hard-core FW fans there, but most of the >people were just there because it was a ten dollar concert. I would have left early, >too. Speaking of ten dollars, why is the same show tonight 20 dollars? Someone, >and I know who, is making a killing. But I have to say that the sound at Jaxx >is 100% better, so it's worth double - plus the fans there are 100% better. >I can't wait for tonight. This time I will be wearing a Red Wings Red #91 >Fedorov jersey (punk-ass hold-out!) See you there. > > Green Bay Packers - The Quest to Repeat - Detroit Red Wings 11-3 19-8-5 at Panthers vs Phoenix
Kevin
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 12:10:36 -0500 (EST) From: dantemm@erinet.com (Dan Temmesfeld) To: images_and_words@compuserve.com Cc: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: DTIFC No. 15?? Message-ID: <v01520d03b0b829d0da97@[207.90.119.21]>
The last DTIFC mag I got was No.14 in Summer 1997. I'm still on subscription for No.15. Has it come out yet?
Also, with what mag # is the Xmas CD 1997 coming out?
Dan
---+ +--- Dan Temmesfeld - dantemm (at) erinet (dot) com Galactic Cowboys on the Web...muh!? http://www.cedarville.edu/student/s1133627/gcowboys.htm ---+ +---
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 11:18:07 -0600 (CST) From: Chad Mitchell <kerensky@telepath.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Stupid A** people! (Ranting!!) Message-ID: <199712131718.LAA06061@telepath.com>
I was scanning back a few issues of the list and ran across some of the most juvenile rantings I've yet seen. It's stuff like this that gives music fans in general, and fans of Metal/Prog/whatever especially.
>And if you can listen to anything Rush put out AFTER Hemispheres >and say they didn't go commercial then you're either not paying >attention or have an IQ of a turnip! They went from writing some >of the greatest rock songs of all time, prog or not, to becoming >a Human League/Eurythmics clone in the 80's. That shit from Signals >all the way through Hold Your Fire is all synth pop. I'm not saying >it's all bad, but most of it sucks
Son, *I* love Rush's music. *All* of it. And if you wanna compare me to a turnip, lets swap careers and see if you can keep up.
Attitudes like those expressed above only show that you fear change. Would you really be happy if Rush produced ten albums *exactly* like Hemispheres? I doubt it. You just wanna try and impress people with your attempt at a snobby opinion. Well, count me decidely *unimpressed*. Next time you feel like slamming people who've got more talent than you, *don't*. I'm sure everyone else here will appreciate it.
(pause to read some more...)
OK, it seems that everyone equates shorter tunes with "going commercial" I've seen this attitude for years. Hell, I *had* that attitude myself for years. Lately, I've come to a different conclusion. Songwriting is much like writing stories, articles, research papers, or any other creative process. When you start out, you struggle to meet the minimum requirements. As you become proficient, you start to increase the length and complexity of your compositions. Call it an "adolescent" phase of creativity. You write long, flowery, compositions, simply because you can. As you really begin to master the process, however, you become more concise, more able to express the creative thought in shorter statements. This is the mark of those who have mastered the creative art.
(looks back over what has been written...)
Well, I've obviously got a ways to go myself. So sue me :)
Chad Mitchell Owner/GM - Oklahoma Outlaws
"Doctors get to bury their mistakes, Architects can only advise their client to plant vines." -Frank Lloyd Wright
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 11:18:10 -0600 (CST) From: Chad Mitchell <kerensky@telepath.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: What goes around... Message-ID: <199712131718.LAA06066@telepath.com>
Well, I suppose it was inevitable that someone else call me on my own snobbery...
>> statioin listener and get them interested. There are unfortunately a ton of >> folk out there to whom Ozzy Osbourne and Ratt are "good music". > >I happen to enjoy listening to Ozzy and Ratt (although I recognize that they're >usually not very technically challenging). Does that make me a troglodyte? If it >does, than you can just bend over and "suck my ass." BTW, Randy Rhoads could >give just about any guitarist a run for their money, so don't tell me that Ozzy >was never "good music."
I was trying to make a point. Sorry if I stepped on a cherished pubescent memory. And I agree about the late Mr. Rhoads. THe man could definitely hang with any shredder out there. Frankly, though, I just have never understood the appeal of the Ozz. I find his vocal style downright grating. As for Ratt, I think I would rather "suck your ass" than be forced to listen to them for an hour. Of course, plucking my own eyes out would be preferable to either option.
Chad Mitchell Owner/GM - Oklahoma Outlaws
"Doctors get to bury their mistakes, Architects can only advise their client to plant vines." -Frank Lloyd Wright
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 10:26:17 From: CRAIG GRIFFITH <derfelt@usa.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: FII Message-ID: <19971213172617.2291.qmail@www07.netaddress.usa.net>
DISCLAIMER: This is all just MY OPINION. (notable emphasis on MY and OPINION)
Well, I think it's been long enough after Falling Into Infinity was released, so I'm going to put my two cents in. I've come to the conclusion that it is a very different Dream Theater album. That being said, I believe that on a whole, it is equal to Awake, which is probably my favorite DT album. I know, it's not super-prog, like most of you people seem to want. However, it is a damn good progressive rock and roll album. (Notice I said "progressive." I think there's a difference between progressive and "prog.") I know, there are some songs on it that aren't exactly progressive, "You Not Me", for example, but since when was Dream Theater strictly prog? Take a look at "Another Day" and "Surrounded"! Sure, they contain prog elements, but they are NOT strictly prog. How many people here would like Dream Theater if all they did was 8+ minute songs with numerous time signature changes? I'm sorry, but as interesting as those types of songs are, I would get tired of hearing! ! ! them if that's all Dream Theater did.
That being said, Falling Into Infinity could have been better. I would have removed "You Not Me" (which I believe was superfluous) and "Just Let Me Breathe", which would make a better B-side anyway. I would have included "Raise The Knife", which I heard at the show in DC and on Dr. Mosh's fine site, and perhaps some of the other ones which got axed in the final cut. ____________________________________________________________________ Get free e-mail and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 12:23:39 +0100 From: Marco Petrini <mpetrini@tin.it> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: milan gig Message-ID: <3492703B.C6822497@tin.it>
hi, the correct number of peoples in milano was 8500 !!!!!!!!!!!!!
-- Take the Time
Marco "Petrus" Petrini Rimini RN- ITALY
Hardware & Software Technical Support Web Programming
personal e.mail : mpetrini@tin.it unpersonal e.mail : petrus@ben.linknet.it
personal home page : http://ben.linknet.it/home/petrus (coming soon !!!)
old personal home page, still active : http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/alley/8482 --- --- ---
ITALIAN DREAMERS OFFICIAL FAN CLUB OF DREAM THEATER
e.mail : dreamtheater@ben.linknet.it (coming soon) please use now my personal email
Italian Dreamers Home Page : http://ben.linknet.it/dt
Italian Dreamers mailing list : to subscribe this list send a mail to: ytseitalia-request@stargame.dyn.ml.org with this body : subscribe ytseitalia (your e.mail) no subject is required... for any info send a mail to perix@cyberg.it
--- --- ---
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 13:44:53 -0500 From: "Nick Giannotti" <nickg@gis.net> To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: My first DT Experience, Phish Message-ID: <199712131839.NAA23851@home.gis.net>
I remember the first time I heard PMU on the radio. I was like, "Oh, my god. This is SICK." Went out that night and bought the tape and listened to it in my friend Jeff's truck with him, and when the bass solo in Metropolis came up we were both ready to sell our instruments and become accountants. :)
>Phish has such a dedicated and GROWING following. No two shows are >*ever* the same and no one knows what the hell to expect on a given >night (except a great show).
ANY band that has a working repertoire (sp?) of 600+ songs is impressive, IMHO. One of the guys I work with is a HUGE Phish head, and he's seen them about 28 times. They sometimes drop their instruments and go to the front of the stage to do an a capella version of The Beatles White Album... damn!
And to those who are complaining about Rush sounding like 80's synth-pop:
80's synth pop RULES!! :)
-Nicholas
"Anyone who believes in psychokineses, please raise my right hand."
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 3360 **************************
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