YTSEJAM Digest 2643
Today's Topics:
1) Re: Guitar thread
by WhiteWolf <prelude@autobahn.mb.ca>
2)
by jeremy reurich <jreurich@ozemail.com.au>
3) New totally unrelated mind-teaser (NDTC)
by Brian Wherry <bwherry@mathworks.com>
4) Guitar players
by "Brian Hayden" <Brian.D.Hayden-1@tc.umn.edu>
5) Spicy
by "L. Jason Hartman" <lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu>
6) Re: New totally unrelated mind-teaser (NDTC)
by Lauren Glenn <LGlenn@quadnet.net>
7) Ozzy's band
by Buck Stodgers <andrew.t.forcier@prudential.com>
8) WANTED:CDs...
by 0lli-Pekka Komonen <opk@hlti.fi>
9) Guitar playing thread
by Buck Stodgers <andrew.t.forcier@prudential.com>
10) re: "Holy Live" review
by <CNG@tcco.com> (Chung Ng)
11) Putting the JAM back in Ytsejam...
by Jon Parmet <jonp@mailstorm.dot.gov>
12) Mumblings and jumblings
by Paul Goracke <pgor@netcom.com>
13) Satch and Randy
by Eric Rodger <erodger@fore.com>
14) Re: Putting the JAM back in Ytsejam...
by Carlos Alfaro <calfaro@caribe.net>
15) Mape
by Jason Breitweg <breitweg@zeusa1.desy.de>
16) Megadeth Metallica Progressive ????
by Hein Vandenabeele
17) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2641
by Kappa <kappa_rock@iol.it>
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 06:26:47 -0600
From: WhiteWolf <prelude@autobahn.mb.ca>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Guitar thread
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19970617062647.0068a6d0@autobahn.mb.ca>
>exponentially since the days when RR ruled the roost. Can anyone else
>imagine a world where Jimmy Page is considered to be the be all, end
>all, as far as guitar playing is concerned? I cannot, since I am but a
>tyke of 23 years. But that was the case (I think) just before Rhoads hit
>the scene big-time. In the 15 years since his death, the average guitar
>player has improved drastically.
>
True. I've heard Jimmy Page reffered to as "old fumble-fingers". Randy was
the first to usher in a new style of playing, followed shortly by EVH. Back
then,
there was 2 schools - you either followed Randy or Eddie, but rarely both.
>I can physically play everything that RR played. Does that make me a
>great player, or does it make him any less great for coming up with the
>things he did? Of course not. But it does make me think about the
Techically speaking, alot of players, including myself, can play Rhoads
material...the deciding factor is the amount of emotion one puts into
his/her playing. With Randy, the man *felt* every note he played. Most
players playing Randy's stuff, to me, sound technically brilliant. The
music, though, sounds slick,
but lifeless.
>In my opinion, one of the great injustices in music is the fact that
>Rhoads was killed when he was just beginning to feel comfortable with
>his highly unorthodox style of playing.
>
The same can be said for the late Criss Oliva. Even though he'd been
around longer before his tragic death.
>There can be no question that Satriani became a more techinally
>accomplished player than Rhoads, if for no other reason than RR's
>unrealized potential. But JS broke as much ground as Rhoads did as far
>
Apples and oranges...Rhoads played a highly sophisticated brand of
classically-influenced hard rock. Both are great in their own right, but at
different styles.
>as guitar playing is concerned, if for no other reason than the fact
>that he had time to mature before our very ears. Neither RR nor JS is
>the perfect guitar player. Satriani built upon the fantasic and
>
RR not perfect? If not, he came the closest to it. He brought a surgical
precision to the genre that had been lacking before, and since. Randy did
more for technical proficiency in the '80's than any other player. He was a
perfectionist in the truest sense of the word. Where most guitarists would
punch in on a track to cover a mistake, Randy would re-record the whole
section. And he was fast!
========================================================
A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic. ~ Josef Stalin
========================================================
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 22:22:32 +1000 (EST)
From: jeremy reurich <jreurich@ozemail.com.au>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Message-ID: <199706171222.WAA13438@oznet11.ozemail.com.au>
>in 1967 Jimi Hendrix opened for the Monkees, does this mean he doesn't
know how to play the guitar or that if you're over 12 you can't enjoy his
music?
- are you THAT old scott???
-j
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 08:28:07 -0400
From: Brian Wherry <bwherry@mathworks.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: New totally unrelated mind-teaser (NDTC)
Message-ID: <33A682D7.3BC3@mathworks.com>
Okay, try this one on for size:
There is a room with three lamps in it. There are three switches
outside the room, each of which turns on one of the lamps. You cannot
see into the room at all from where the swithes are. You are only
allowed to enter the room once. Your job is to figure out which switch
turns on which lamp. How do you do it?
Kick it! :)
-- Brian Wherry bwherry@mathworks.com http://www.mathworks.com (508) 647-7724------------------------------
Date: Tue, 17 Jun 97 07:33:43 -0500 From: "Brian Hayden" <Brian.D.Hayden-1@tc.umn.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com, ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Guitar players Message-ID: <33a6842755b8206@mhub2.tc.umn.edu>
Just my two cents. I think Rhoads and Satriani cannot even be compared. Rhoads was a heavy metal riffmaster (I know he was trained in classical, but that's not what he's famous for), while Satriani is more melodic. I think both are great at what they do (or did). As for Jimmy Page, since someone mentioned him, he's still the best of all time. He can do a speed solo with the best of them, as shown on early songs like "Heartbreaker" and "Dazed and Confused," and in the later Zeppeling years his use of melody was consistently the best I've ever heard, and his solos were still great, even though they slowed down. That was another thing - even though he could play a speed solo, he had enough confidence to know he didn't have to show it off all the time. He constructed solos that fit the song beautifully, such as the ones in "Rain Song" and "Ten Years Gone." He also did two of the greatest guitar instrumentals ever, in my opinion: "White Summer/Black Mountainside" and "Bron-Yr-Aur."
That's enough on that.
-Brian
******************************************************************************** Official East Troy, WI Ozzfest (featuring original Black Sabbath!) countdown: T - 7 days and counting!
***************************** Quote of the Day *********************************
"Being miserable might work for your first album, but once you get your royalties, what are you gonna sing about on your second album? Then all you can do is blow your head off and become a legend." - Paul Stanley of KISS
I wanted the Best, I got the Best! 4-22-97 ********************************************************************************
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 09:08:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "L. Jason Hartman" <lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Spicy Message-ID: <199706171308.JAA04355@umbc8.umbc.edu>
>Don't get me wrong, I'm all for DT touring, and with Eternity-X, cool, >great.. But Spice Girls? Baaaarf...
Ah yes, one of my all-time favorite prog bands!! I just LOVE the way they can jiggle in odd times. ;)
You know, I think even Mike Portnoy would be sexy if he were to put on a pair of those red thigh-high leather boots. :) A girl in my office refers to them as FMB's (Fuck Me Boots). I'd have to agree.
-- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \ / / L. Jason Hartman "And I'll smile and I'll learn to pretend \ \ lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu And I'll never be open again / / And I'll have no more dreams to defend \ \ Univ. Of Maryland, And I'll never be open again " / / Baltimore County - Kevin Moore : Dream Theater \ \ / / "Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot." \ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 09:14:26 -0400 From: Lauren Glenn <LGlenn@quadnet.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: New totally unrelated mind-teaser (NDTC) Message-ID: <33A68DB2.31C248BA@quadnet.net>
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------C74291EDA274AC431F264B39 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Brian Wherry wrote: > > Okay, try this one on for size: > > There is a room with three lamps in it. There are three switches > outside the room, each of which turns on one of the lamps. You cannot > see into the room at all from where the swithes are. You are only > allowed to enter the room once. Your job is to figure out which > switch > turns on which lamp. How do you do it? > > Kick it! :) Go into the room with three different color bulbs, put one in each lamp, exit the room, and hit each switch.
Lauren --------------C74291EDA274AC431F264B39 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Glenn, Lauren Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf"
begin: vcard fn: Glenn, Lauren n: Glenn;Lauren email;internet: LGlenn@quadnet.net x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: TRUE end: vcard
--------------C74291EDA274AC431F264B39--
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 09:27:05 -0400 From: Buck Stodgers <andrew.t.forcier@prudential.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Ozzy's band Message-ID: <199706171326.AA08129@gateway2.prudential.com>
Hello, Pat Griffin said: >2) I'd swear I'd seen the guitarist (Joe? Jon? Holmes) performing with >someone else. Please somebody prove I'm not crazy here.
David Lee Roth's band after Jason Becker was diagnosed and had to drop out of the tour. Then Dave fired the whole band. And I knew I recognized the drummer! Thanks Pat! -- _____________________________________________________________ Andrew Forcier a.k.a. Buck Stodgers --List Manager-- The Peppermint Tribe, the Saigon Kick Mailing List For info, check out: http://garnet.acns.fsu.edu/~rfm5570/ for e-mail inquiries, mailto:andrew.t.forcier@prudential.com *************************************************************
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 17:02:36 +0300 (EET DST) From: 0lli-Pekka Komonen <opk@hlti.fi> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: WANTED:CDs... Message-ID: <199706171402.RAA24572@ds9.sci.fi>
Hi!
A friend of mine is lookin' for these CDs (new/used), if you can help, pliiiiz e-mail me... thnx!!! SAGA In Transit (live) KATE BUSH This Kick Inside JUDAS PRIEST Live (double) op777
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 10:04:15 -0400 From: Buck Stodgers <andrew.t.forcier@prudential.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Guitar playing thread Message-ID: <199706171403.AA11238@gateway2.prudential.com>
Hello, Swifty said this, and more: >Instead, listen and pay attention to everything you can get your hands >on.
Why do I ever bother saying anything when Swifty can says it ten times better. :) This is the second time you've scored with an incredibly thought-provoking post, Mark. All those who didn't read this and play guitar should go back to Jam #2641 and give it a once over.
>Yeah, we were in Zia records out here at midnight
Not one store in my area had a midnight release party for Megadeth, so it looks like I'll be heading out for lunch. Of course when the new DMB album was released last year, I had no problem getting it at 12:01. It sucks when your favorite bands just aren't given respect.
>A Pleasant Shade of What???
Hey, I'm all in favor of blasting this list with reviews like all the Fates fans did. But I don't think my server can handle the returned flamage.
>Hey, bud...who's Stuart?
Whoa! I guess your cable system sucks worse than TKR in New Jersey! :)
>I'm not wasting space arguing with you.
Nope, just wasting space. :)
>The first code of being a gangster is silence.
Spoken like a true Gotti. :)
>Usually, the criteria for an opening act is that they're at least the >same genre as the headliner.
Okay check this out (headliner:opener)- Rush:Candlebox, Rush:Primus, Cheap Trick:Saigon Kick, Megadeth:Korn, Joe Satriani:Rollover, and I could go on and on and on. There is little if any correlation between the types of music these bands play. Don't bother making an argument, cause in many cases the bands have no say, their labels or management set it up. From Nigel: >What's wrong? Can't handle new, extremely interesting new threads?
How long have you been here. This thread was around, what, threee months ago? At the outside...
>I can't believe how cynical this list has become since I was last here.
Not cynical. Jaded is the word...
>I'd rather read a jam full of jokes than what we're seeing now.
Methinks Skadz was referring to the ones that have no basis on the list. Like top twenty reasons I can't have a beer at Giants Stadium... :P >in 1967 Jimi Hendrix opened for the Monkees,
Hey! I like the Monkees!!! Then I saw her face, now I'm a believer... Neil Diamond's a genius... -- _____________________________________________________________ Andrew Forcier a.k.a. Buck Stodgers --List Manager-- The Peppermint Tribe, the Saigon Kick Mailing List For info, check out: http://garnet.acns.fsu.edu/~rfm5570/ for e-mail inquiries, mailto:andrew.t.forcier@prudential.com *************************************************************
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 97 10:31:04 EDT From: <CNG@tcco.com> (Chung Ng) To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: re: "Holy Live" review Message-ID: <vines.3hH8+WvddnA@tcx.tcco.com>
| I can't help but smell the evil stench of money in here | From what I've heard, this cd is outrageously expensive.
A friend of mine brought it back from Brazil for $13. I paid $12 from DreamDisc.
I agree, the quality is great, but I must say..."Where's the Beef?" Why just 35 minutes? I much rather pay $25 for a full CD (like Mike Bahr's).
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 14:54:55 +0000 From: Jon Parmet <jonp@mailstorm.dot.gov> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Putting the JAM back in Ytsejam... Message-ID: <33A6A53F.59E2@mailstorm.dot.gov>
> Eckie: > defend the band on a DREAM THEATER list.
Just a point of clarification. This is not _a_ DREAM THEATER list. This is _THE_ DREAM THEATER list :)
> ya know...the stuff crunching around ACoS really starts my fire!
Yessir! That key solo at the end shows that the other members of the band apparently had a clue during the selection process. The man can play. He's been around for a while, and has built up a bit of experience (for a related story, re-read Swifty's post) that you just don't get in the classroom. WARNING: Lack of profundity ahead: He's not Kevin. He has no desire to be Kevin. He's Derek. He even spells his name differently :) Move on, people!
> Swifty: [post on Guitar playing reluctantly snipped]
Very well thought out, Mark! Excellent perspective...
~~~~~~~~~~~
> I'm disappointed at the way DT's music is becoming more "ugly" sounding, > and I fear they're moving towards a more commercial and contemporary style > of songwriting, we'll never again see songs as complex and intricate as TTT > where the entire band is kicking ass simultaneously.
I don't have a as much of a problem with it, I guess. I see nothing wrong with change. There's nothing wrong with putting food on the table every now and then. I just don't see the connection you're attempting to make with putting out a few commercial hits and _never_ playing anything complex and intricate again. That's kind of extreme. Metro II is still up their sleeves, and who knows what else.
The album's not even out yet and you're already digging the style a grave. Give 'em a chance to be who they are... I imagine the standards they set for themselves will be quite apparent in the new stuff. Come to thing of it, I think DT can 'do' commercial tunes better than most. It's just another boundary to explore. I heard some of the new stuff live at the end of '96. Those versions were still being fed by the nipple :) and still received a warm welcome by the crowd. There's no doubt in my mind that they've gone back and made improvements to that.
Remember one thing: "Ugly" songs need love too :)
> If you don't agree, then too bad, because you're not going to change my > opinion.
Actually, it's quite good that I don't agree. I feel much better now :) And you know what? DT will do just fine, irrespective of your opinion...
Regards,
Jon
*------------*------------------------*--------------* | Jon Parmet | jonp@mailstorm.dot.gov | 617-494-2851 | *------------*------------------------*--------------*
Make up your mind to be happy. Learn to find pleasure in simple things.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 08:05:14 -0700 From: Paul Goracke <pgor@netcom.com> To: Nigel Bridgeman <nigelb@powerup.com.au> Cc: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Mumblings and jumblings Message-ID: <l03102803afcc56a66cc5@[128.95.235.96]>
Nigel Bridgeman <nigelb@powerup.com.au> wrote:
> Some chap wrote about the NWOBHM cd: > > >It has the original "Sanctuary" by Maiden, from the Soundhouse tapes, > >with Di'anno, Murray, and a bunch of guys you've never heard of. > > Hey, I've heard of Steve Harris. He's still in the band, you know! :)
So's Dave Murray, isn't he? (I haven't been paying attention to their last couple albums.)
> I don't have the cd with me - who was on drums - Doug Sampson?
Yup.
> I don't think it was from the Soundhouse tapes, I think it was from a > radio show...
"Originally recorded on 14th November 1979 & transmitted on 14th December 1979 for the BBC Radio One 'Friday Rock Show' previously unreleased."
pg
--------------------------------------------------------------- Paul Goracke | "To do is to be" - Aristotle pgor@netcom.com | "To be is to do" - Plato | "Do be do be do" - Sinatra ---------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 11:12:08 -0400 From: Eric Rodger <erodger@fore.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Satch and Randy Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19970617111208.00f02100@pophost.fore.com>
>>>I couldn't agree more, however, Randy made more of an impact on guitarists, >>>musicians, and fans in 2 short years, and 3 albums (including Tribute), >>>than Satch has in six albums. Don't get me wrong, I like Satch, but he >>>can't hold a candle to Randy. The man was a genius. >>> > > Yeah, and Satch had all the exposure, ya know, touring w/ Ozzy and such. >Come on dude. Satch recorded his first real album on a credit card. He is >an instrumental rock player, not a lead guitarist for the most widely known >heavy metal figure at that time. Joe is a legend. So was Randy. Why say >one is better than the other. >
Sorry man, I just don't think Satch has achieved 'legend' status. That's my opinion, of course, but I think Satch won most of his popularity on the piggyback of Steve Vai. I do agree that without Ozzy, Randy would still be unknown. But Ozzy obviously saw his potential and ability, and Randy deserves every ounce of notoriety he receives. Steve Vai, legend. Randy Rhoads, without a doubt a legend. Satch, I wouldn't say so. Again, that's all my opinion, but I think many others would agree. Satch just hasn't done anything truly remarkable and unforgettable like a 'Diary of a Madman'.
KAI
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 11:08:55 -0400 From: Carlos Alfaro <calfaro@caribe.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: Putting the JAM back in Ytsejam... Message-ID: <33A6A887.2E8B@caribe.net>
Jon Parmet wrote:
> > > I'm disappointed at the way DT's music is becoming more "ugly" sounding, > > and I fear they're moving towards a more commercial and contemporary style > > of songwriting, we'll never again see songs as complex and intricate as TTT > > where the entire band is kicking ass simultaneously.
4 words.. :JUST LET ME BREATHE
kicks ass all over w/ instrumental section and all
"At the edge of chaos, unexpected outcomes occur. The risk to survival is severe." Ian Malcolm http://premium.caribe.net/~calfaro mailto:calfaro@caribe.net mailto:ytsekurt@geocities.com
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 97 17:43:04 +0200 From: Jason Breitweg <breitweg@zeusa1.desy.de> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Mape Message-ID: <9706171543.AA26822@zeusa1.desy.de>
Mape are you out there? I tried to e-mail you and the thing got bounced back to me. Drop me some e-mail please.
Jason
-- Jason Breitweg --> breitweg@amzeus.desy.de, jbreitwe@hep.physics.wisc.edu http://www-zeus.desy.de/~breitweg, http://lobelia.physics.wisc.edu/jbreitwe "The Gods Made Heavy Metal And It's Never Gonna Die!" - MANOWAR
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Date: 17 Jun 97 16:13:00 EDT From: Hein Vandenabeele To: ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Megadeth Metallica Progressive ???? Message-ID: <9706171857.AA8137@NYC-NTGW-N01.ny.jpmorgan.com>
People thinking that M or M are progressive (in the sense used in this list...), did not get the point... They were progressive in the sense "being ahead of the others" but as far as I can see this is not really the meaning of "progressive" in this list... Here it stands for complex song structures, elaborate solo's and so on...
They were(for Metallica)/are(for Megadeth) excellent (heavy) metal, but DEFINITELY NOT PROGRESSIVE...
Sorry guys, you just did not get it. As someone wrote around here, Spice Girls are also progressive !!!!!!
H.
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Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 18:28:22 +0000 From: Kappa <kappa_rock@iol.it> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2641 Message-ID: <3.0.32.19970617132906.00698420@popmail.iol.it>
>>Anyway, I just got off the phone with Mike Portnoy, and he said to let >>everyone know things are going well in the studio. The new CD should >>be >>out in the fall, followed by a dual-headline tour with DT and >>Eternity-X >>sharing the stage, and The Spice Girls opening. >>=20
>Don't get me wrong, I'm all for DT touring, and with Eternity-X, cool, >great.. But Spice Girls? Baaaarf...
Maybe they're the Groupies! :)))))))))) bye Alf
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 2643 **************************
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