YTSEJAM Digest 2354
Today's Topics:
1) Re: the problem with prog
by "KorgX3" <ibanez@mailhost.cyberhighway.net>
2) Re: Spock's Beard query...
by jusenkyo@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Shane Liebling)
3) Re: an additional comment on one's ignorance
by petedz@interaccess.com
4) stuff
by alexis1@prtc.net (alexis1)
5) why did i join this list???
by prmrkstx@hotmail.com (Dex Mex)
6) judges
by "Dale R. Newberry" <Dale.R.Newberry@MO.NET>
7) where to find spock's beard....
by "Andrew Miller" <subtlerage@subtlerage.com>
8) Wow. You still get pissed easy, that's for sure.
by Ben Laussade <laussade@m5.sprynet.com>
9) Re: rippin' a new hole
by "Dale R. Newberry" <Dale.R.Newberry@MO.NET>
10) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2353
by "Richard A. Rivera" <rrivera@zoo.uvm.edu>
11) New Material
by Ryan Webb <ryanwebb@earthlink.net>
12) Ben!
by Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu>
13) that festering bubble on our heads
by "Rip, Cow Virtuoso" <ripzero@dreamt.org>
14) This *can't* be right... (NDTC)
by Brian Henderson <Cyberburlap@icdc.com>
15) Re: mainstream BS
by petedz@interaccess.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 19:38:47 +0000
From: "KorgX3" <ibanez@mailhost.cyberhighway.net>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: the problem with prog
Message-ID: <199703170250.SAA10114@odin.ax.com>
> Several people have mentioned the fact the majority of prog bands coming=
out
> today resemble either a) DT too much or b) 70's prog too much. Albeit t=
he
> statement is somewhat true, what people seem to overlook remains where w=
e are
Hrm. I try not to believe in musical boundaries such as alternative,
progressive, metal, etc. Of course there are the one's that make
ultimate divisions sucha as rap, country, rock, classical, etc...
that you really can't come around easily, but I don't understand why
someone would pinhole themselves into liking only "prog." They won't
listen to anything other than prog and completely shun everything
else. Some people see it as a violation of their pristine
musicianship, others see it as a trendy, talentless pile of crap. I
listen to what I like and have my reasons for not liking others.
Everyone griping that, "This band sounds like Dream Theater! Get me
some real prog!" makes me laugh my ass off. What else is prog?
You can't easily define prog. Prog is an intangible "thing" subject
to different definition by different individuals. One person will
say that Queensr=FFche is prog, the other will say they are metal and
another will say they are glam. Some people could classify Smashing
Pumpkins as prog, others will say they're alternative, and others
will say they're pop. What it all boils down to is that we're all
different. We all have different tastes in music. We all have
different ideas about what's cool and what's not and those of you who
let others do your thinking for you oughtta Open your Eyes. I think
the Enchant song says it best.
I remember getting back on here about 6 months ago and hearing people
discuss KoRn and other bands. I remember doing the same thing and
severely ridiculing the people who brought it up. I feel real stupid
now. I got my ass chewed all around. It wasn't long after that I
came to realize that people who listen to Dream Theater don't have to
listen to nothing but. I've changed alot since then. I see people
raving about bands I don't like and I even encourage people to do so.
One man's dream is another's nightmare and vice versa. I recommend
that we all open our minds enough so that this jam will no longer be
full of people griping about what sucks and what does not. This is
getting too long so I'll end our little lecture here. Just remember
that there are 900+ people are on this list and that only one of them
is going to like everything you like and dislike everything you hate.
Think twice before you say something you know is going to be taken
the wrong way. It saves you the frustration of getting several
flames in your mailbox alot of the time.
Nuff said. Can't we all just get along?
KorgX3 a.k.a. ibanez@cyberhighway.net
Disclaimer:
The content expressed in the previous document is
not the opinion of the author. The author is exonerated
of anything written therein. Viewer discretion is
advised.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 18:52:20 -0700
From: jusenkyo@uclink4.berkeley.edu (Shane Liebling)
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Spock's Beard query...
Message-ID: <v02130505af5253d8a994@[128.32.100.59]>
Hey for the guy who was looking for SB stuff, go to the Ultimate Band List
(www.ubl.com?) and type in Spock's Beard. The only Spock's Beard site is
the company who puts their stuff out, Radian Records, you can send for
stuff directly from them.
-Shane
______________________________________________________________________________
I Shane Liebling I You can call me Kennedy, you may have I
I jusenkyo@uclink4.berkeley.edu I killed him, but you cannot kill me. I
I http://www.earthlink.net/~mariachi I - Spock's Beard "The Light" I
I____________________________________I_______________________________________I
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 21:08:38 -0600
From: petedz@interaccess.com
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: an additional comment on one's ignorance
Message-ID: <2.2.32.19970317030838.0069117c@pop.interaccess.com>
>I saw Marty do a clinic for
>Jackson at NAMM. He is musically illiterate. He has absolutely no theory
>knowledge at all. OK- but for those of you that disregard that when rating
>someone as a musician- he has no muting technique at all. He never plays a
>muted note in his leads. He has this funky technique that pulls his palm as
>far away from the bridge as possible. It looks like its being completely
>detrimental to his playing. So- he can pretty much only use his left hand to
>change articulations. I watched him play up close for about ten minutes. (I
>got bored and left well before he finished) He is not at all impressive to
>me. He is extremely overated.
Hmmm.... I have to wonder whether we're talking about the same Marty Friedman.
Have you listened his solo album 'Dragon's Kiss' lately? If you can listen
to that and then make the same comments, then I want to hear YOUR solo album,
Mr. Washkevich!
>The fact that you compared Mustaine and
>Petrucci makes me feel queasy. Listen to his playing. Those are some weak
>leads. His rhythm playing isn't enough to even make me compare him.
No arguments here. I was very disappointed when Marty joined Megadeth, but
I guess everybody has to make a living somehow. :)
-- Pete Dziadzka------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 23:04:29 -0800 From: alexis1@prtc.net (alexis1) To: "ytsejam mailing list" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: stuff Message-ID: <19970317041120.AAA38242@alexis1>
Hello people! A few short things I'd like to say. First, I got some CDs the other day and they all rule. They are: Angra: Holy Land 2 CD set -> it took me a few listens to get used to it, but now I can definitely say these guys kick ass. Fast at times, slow at others, very catchy melodies all the time, and I don't think they sound much like DT. These guys are great musicians. The lead singer has a great voice, but he somtimes sounds a bit whinny, especially on the live acoustic CD. Still, great band. Symphony X: Damnation game -> Again, these guys kick ass. The music is not as complex as DT's, but it definitely shows great musicianship. Very catchy too. The lead singer is great, and he sometimes reminds me of Dio. Blind guardian: Imaginations from the other side -> Fast, aggresive, melodic, helloween-reminding solos, just great music. Michael Kiske: Instant Clarity -> Not very complex music, but the songs are really catchy and Kiske just has an incredible voice. Great as well. Jason Becker: Perpetual Burn -> This CD kicks so much ass. i can't believe i waited so long to get this. I love that Cacophony sound.
I finally got to hear the X-mas CD, and i think it's great. James sounds incredible on Red Hill Whatever. BTW, did he again re-record the vocals for these? I think he sounds different on Tears, so i think he did. It's weird, 'cause i thought he sounded well on that song originally. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Well, that's it.
Alexis
P.S. Ben, I like you; you're a funny kid. Just take out your frustration on the good ol' drumset.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 22:18:29 -0500 From: prmrkstx@hotmail.com (Dex Mex) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: why did i join this list??? Message-ID: <v01520d01af5265c4d622@[205.184.11.119]>
>Well, hate to put it really bluntly...but maybe it's because you suck. Get >over it. Write something else. > >Just because you like Dream Theater doesn't mean you rule all piss. Maybe >it means you want to be cool for liking a band that nobody else has heard >of, and you couldn't care less what's in the music. > >> Our music is biting >>and aggressive, and they just can't seem handle it. > >Kinda like the English language is biting and agressive, and you just can't >seem handle it? > >>If you guys can think of any way to help us make our >>final show be something really special, then let me know. > >Play naked. > >Mark Smeets and Lars Hellsten......Just shut up. Nobody cares. > >>Oh..and to show I'm having fun...Lars...a personal invitation. >>I am on irc, in fact, I am on the DT server/channel etc...If >>you like, you can meet me there and you can confront me and >>see just how stupid I actually am. > >Hey Mr. Smartypants...Lars Hellsten used to come on IRC before any jammers >ever knew who you were. He left for probably the same reason I'm thinking >about it. It's boring as hell there too. People just fight.
Well I am kind of new here and am wondering now why i subscribed to this, I was under the impression that This was supposed to be a DT and related music list, but apparently it seems like it is asshole jam. Guess you just realy have to watch out for people like this Ben person, I don't know, would someone please give me a reason why I should stay around? cause this kind of shit can get real old real fast.
Dex Mex
Dexter McGonigle
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 21:24:00 +0000 From: "Dale R. Newberry" <Dale.R.Newberry@MO.NET> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: judges Message-ID: <199703170336.VAA19202@Walden.MO.NET>
Man, about that percussion ensemble thing of Metropolis, that sucks about the judges not recognizing greatness (assuming it is really that good (which I'm sure it is :)). I remember being in marching band in high school. We did all the cool, kick ass songs (we did Roundabout and Bohemian Rhapsody in the same show one year, kicked ass, and scored low). Seems like those judges just wanted marching concert bands. Eh, as long as you all did well, that's what matters.
Dale R. Newberry
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 21:20:30 +0000 From: "Andrew Miller" <subtlerage@subtlerage.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: where to find spock's beard.... Message-ID: <19970317032039.AAA4235@subtlerage.avalon.net>
someone asked where to find their discs. i got mine from the laser's edge... lasercd@aol.com.
i've gotten tons of other things from them as well. they're very fast. (usually get my stuff in a week to week and a half)
-Andrew
Andrew Miller - keyboardist/vocalist - subtlerage http://www.subtlerage.com - subtlerage@subtlerage.com "first impressions" released. .wav files available
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 19:43:58 -0800 From: Ben Laussade <laussade@m5.sprynet.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Wow. You still get pissed easy, that's for sure. Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19970316194358.0068db74@m5.sprynet.com>
>Quite a long post from Ben LDOAD.
Lifting...Dildos? off a Dream? :-) Sounds fun, but I'm a little shy with the kinkier stuff, if ya catch my drift.. <wink>
>Ben, I'm not sure if you're aware of >this, but the jam does have its high and lows. Right now it's at a low. >But trust me, it will get better.
I'm aware of it. Just that this has been an especially long low. I don't doubt it'll get better when (if?) the album comes out. But until then...
>Can we say troll?
Can we say get off my bridge, goat? (yeah, i know what you meant, but it ain't true, so it doesn't bother me)
>o were you one of the people who sent off a real nasty email >a few months ago, detailing how much the Jam sucked back then, and how >you were leaving and never coming back?
No. I just said I was sorta bored, and I'd probably be back later. And whaddya know..here I am! <thwap>
>While this may be how the whole alternative revolution started I don't >think it connects much to DT's music.
Sure it does. It's the same thing, only nobody likes prog, so it all doesn't get played on MTV like alternative stuff.
>Maybe you're the one who wants to be >cool for liking a and nobody else has heard of.
Hey, maybe! Maybe I'm also the bearded man on the front of Awake! Maybe I'm the little girl on I&W! Maybe I'm Pee-Wee Herman's left nut! You never know.
>Not really. I do remember coming home and reading a jam that was 50% posts >from some loser 13 year old kid from Las Vegas who never shut up.
I never claimed to have any validity. I'm full of bullshit, in fact. Besides...I never saw anyone try to start the Adam Cook Fanclub, where everybody tried to play guitar and be conceited just like the club's namesake.
>Wow, you must have been a real loser if you got all excited about checking >your email everyday, and it wasn't even for looking at new porno.
Hell yeah. Loser supreme, and proud of it. But, my point was that...I'm still a loser, but checking my mail doesn't excite me anymore. Good idea nevertheless, though..gotta get me on one of those porno mailing lists.
>I agree with this.
HAHA! You agree! I tricked you! CONFORMIST! CONFORMIST!
>However listening to a lot of prog bands that sound the same is a >hell of a lot better than a buch of alternative bands that sound the same.
All this means is that you're an ignorant alterna-basher. POWER TO THE GINBLOSSOMS AND FOO FIGHTERS! WOOHOO!
>Since you're a drummer/loser I don't >know if you write songs, but it's hard to come up with a real original >sound.
Yeah, it sure is. But that doesn't mean I have to like stuff that sounds like something else just because the artist is too lazy to REALLY think up something original.
>People just write what they think sounds good, they're not trying to >start a music revolution.
Well, then quit bashing alternative...and there's nothing wrong with starting a music revolution.
>owever, you also need to realize you're >potentially offending an entire mailing list, whereas in this response I'm >only offending you :)
No offense here.
>Maybe you should unsub again, eh?
Are you insane? You can't just unsub after you flame 700 people.
>Some real words of wisdom here (NOT!).
Heh..alright Wayne. Sock it to 'im.
>This is childish. Maybe while you are criticizing others (like it seems >you have a penchant for), you should make some baby steps towards mastery >yourself by learning how to spell "aggressive" correctly.
Mastery myself. That's gross, man. You should see the blisters I already have! Don't want them to pop or anything. Besides, I only left out a letter, and he left out a whole word. Ha. My dad can beat up your dad.
>This is sarcasm, we hope. Why don't you list just ONE of your >multi-platinum album titles.
No way, I'm serious. I've played on many platinum albums.."Bob's Porno Polka Supreme"..."Music to Masticate Marmots By" and many others (available by mail order at 1-800-WANK-BEN $19.95 +S&H, if you're under 18 ask your parents)
>You didn't like it, fine, but what you spewed > out was not critique, but an offensive attack.
I got plenty of flames for my story. Then again, maybe I just suck at writing. :-)
>Anyone with brains could've seen that the percussion ensemble > dude was a little distrought with the judges's response to > their effort. Takes a moron to flame that the way you did.
Also a little conceited to automatically assume it was corrupt judges that made them get 2nd to last place. If he had said.."Well, our arrangement of Metropolis didn't do too well. Any ideas?" I'd be glad to help. But instead he said (in so many words), "It's the judges fault we lost, people who don't like prog suck, it can't be US that's doing something wrong..." then that sucks big hairy salty one.
>Go back and see Rip's post to find out how what you said > could've been put properly.
That was good constructive critcism. But I didn't want to criticize constructively, or i would have.
>So you wanna make the list 'fun' again. What I remember none of > your posts had any informational value. About 10% of them were > vaguely homorous though.
I didn't hear anybody complaining.
>Man, you're showing your age.
Uh huh, yep. I got two more pubes today. *WOOHOO!*
Ben Laussade
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 21:46:29 +0000 From: "Dale R. Newberry" <Dale.R.Newberry@MO.NET> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: rippin' a new hole Message-ID: <199703170358.VAA21704@Walden.MO.NET>
>...your brother, i'll kill your grandpa, ill kill your aunt, i'll >kill your uncle, i'll kill your cousin, i'll kill your niece, i'll >kill your nephew. >peace out. Hey, Rip, you forgot "I'll kill your cat," and "I'll kill your cow and make meatloaf out of him and actually like it." :) And I do agree with you about people having minds of their own. Unfortunately, some take a little longer to realize it. I do know some people who seem to be mindless trend followers (I dated one for a little while), but they just don't realize what's out there, because it's so convenient. That's why we (being fans of bands that don't have a great deal of exposure, prog or not) need to expose these people to some of this great music and stuff. And I would like to hear this percussion ensemble version of Metropolis, too. Oh, and wasn't Metropolis originally inspired by the story of Romulus and Remus? Isn't this in tha FAQ?
Dale R. Newberry
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Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 22:44:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Richard A. Rivera" <rrivera@zoo.uvm.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2353 Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.91.970316224159.27368A-100000@gnu.uvm.edu>
On Sun, 16 Mar 1997 ytsejam@ax.com wrote:
> Not really. I do remember coming home and reading a jam that was 50% posts > from some loser 13 year old kid from Las Vegas who never shut up.
LOL!
Richie
(not taking sides, just thought that was pretty funny)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 19:55:09 -0800 (PST) From: Ryan Webb <ryanwebb@earthlink.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: New Material Message-ID: <199703170355.TAA00030@hungary.it.earthlink.net>
> >Well, the main reason for my post is a few jams ago, Jeremy Kube mentioned >how he'd like to make a CD boot of the Toad's Place Fix show. I was really >shocked at the lack of responses to this post. (I don't recall seeing a >single response on the Jam!) Well, if I am the first to respond, let me >respond with a resounding "HELL, YEAH!!!" I think that would rule, seeing as >the Fix gig was the best DT show I'd ever seen!!! So, I, too, am pleading >for the individual with the DAT from the show to get in touch with Jeremy, >and make this thing a reality. I'm chomping at the bit!!!
Hmm.....A CD would be a good idea, however, I sure wouldn't make it of the Toads Place show. I have both Toads and Mulcahys, and the toads has a serious problem with bass distortion. Mulcahys comes across clearer, but more distant, like it was recorded in a jacket. If someone does do this, they'd have to be prepared for a huge influx of requests for it. Several hundred, I'm sure, if not more. Just a warning :)
I recorded 9 new DT songs and put them up on my web page for any of you who are interested. They are all in Real Audio 3.0 format, most of them are from the Toads Show, so the bass problem is there (I lent out my copy of Mulcahys, I might replace some of the files once I get it back). But anyway, the URL is: http://www.earthlink.net/~ryanwebb/sounds/newmusic.html
As I said, there are 9 samples of new DT songs, most around 2.5 minutes in length, some more, some less. There is also 3 new songs by Whitesnake, 2 new Mr. Big, and 1 new Sammy Hagar on there as well. I hope you like them.
Ryan
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 19:56:21 -0800 From: Chris Oates <aspect@cats.ucsc.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Ben! Message-ID: <3.0.32.19970316195618.006ae9e4@cats.ucsc.edu>
Hi Baldy, welcome back to the Jam. :)
__ /\ __ +-------------------------------------+ __\/__\/__ | ~Chris |-+ \_||_/ | | | /__||__\ | http://www2.ucsc.edu/people/aspect/ | | // \ | \\ +-------------------------------------+ | \| +-------------------------------------+
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 22:07:11 -0600 From: "Rip, Cow Virtuoso" <ripzero@dreamt.org> To: Heavy Metal Computer Nerds <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: that festering bubble on our heads Message-ID: <2.2.32.19970317040711.0073cfdc@mail.inlink.com>
>Hey, Rip, you forgot "I'll kill your cat," and "I'll kill your cow >and make meatloaf out of him and actually like it." :)
dang, i did forget the cow! i dunno if he has a cat though, wouldnt want to threaten something i could stand up to =)
>And I do agree with you about people having minds of their own. >Unfortunately, some take a little longer to realize it. I do know >some people who seem to be mindless trend followers (I dated one for >a little while), but they just don't realize what's out there, >because it's so convenient. That's why we (being fans of bands that >don't have a great deal of exposure, prog or not) need to expose >these people to some of this great music and stuff.
i dont think its a matter of realization, it *is* truly a matter of exposure. our minds our static, we have the same mind throughout our whole life. what our minds are subjected to is dynamic, its a constantly changing world and we constantly experience new things. i know from what i've experienced on this list my mind has openeing and grown and become a lot more open, and exposure to new music is always a great thing for people.. i could probably expose a lot of people on this list to pearl jam <clears his voice about the sighs and questioning voices> yes, how many of you PJ bashers have ever really sat down with a record? you say you liked ten but hated vs when you put it on? hey, i hated awake when i first put it on. vs is now one of my favorite albums.. it just takes a bit of looking at things with a respect for its aspects, even if you dont yourself appreciate it yet. and i hope that this post or any of my others or any of anyone elses will help to change people's experiences and get them to look at things in a new light, even if its just one guy out there. yeah, my last post was a bit fired up, i'm calm now <grin> but just try and at least give some respect to everything, cuz i've found something to like in everything. ~Rip
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Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 23:27:18 -0500 From: Brian Henderson <Cyberburlap@icdc.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: This *can't* be right... (NDTC) Message-ID: <199703170427.XAA27195@darkstar.icdc.com>
Yngwie Malmsteen "Fire and Ice" -- to any of you owning this album, I ask of you a favor. Listen to the song "I'm My Own Enemy". At 0:59 into it, there comes a line which, in the official lyrics, reads "All that we had but now again". However, Mr. Goran Edman sings a line which sounds a lot more like "Hacking robot power"... Maybe I'm just robot-crazy.
It's just buggin' me... House of Buggin' John Leguizamo The Pest Pestilence Horseman of the Apocalypse Apocalypse Music Warning - avoid at all costs
See how it all gels?
Brian Henderson, Cyberburlapo neanderthalis Cyberburlap@icdc.com
"I want to be good. I just see things that need bad done to them..." -- R. Rowe
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Date: Sun, 16 Mar 1997 22:23:37 -0600 From: petedz@interaccess.com To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: mainstream BS Message-ID: <2.2.32.19970317042337.00691404@pop.interaccess.com>
>people have their own god damn minds and i'm sick of hearing >people tell me they dont.
..and then you say...
>its all a matter of exposure.
Make up your mind. It's one or the other.
>so some people's lives dont revolve around music and they just >listen to whats easily acessable and sounds good to them.
Yep, and that's fine for them.
>people sit here on their pedastols and preach to the world how >things are and it makes me sick
For me, music=religion. That's why I was preaching. Sorry it's making you sick, but this is a music mailing list. DT isn't exactly a mainstream band. I want to see musicians with talent get "exposure" and I believe the world would be a better place if musicians without talent did NOT get "exposure". That's all. As you said, "its all a matter of exposure."
>i broke out of that, and i can truly appreciate all music. if you cant, >then you cant appreciate any music truly. maybe someone should kick a hole >in your head and open your mind.
Here in Chicago, there's this homeless retarded guy (I mean retarded in a literal rather than a derogatory sense) who writes songs which are essentially him yelling the same lyric over and over for between 4 and 5 minutes on top of a tape loop of some simple riff. He's got two albums out, and apparently has listeners and fans. If I could remember the name, I'd love to point him out to you...to see whether you truly appreciate ALL music. :)
Look, there's a lot of music out there. Some of it is quantifiably good and some quantifiably bad. There are objective standards. Deal with it.
Heck--this was fun, but I'm getting over the flu and I'll have to go back to work tomorrow. I didn't get called an elitist, but "maybe someone should kick a hole in your head and open your mind" sounds pretty cool. I think it might make a great T-shirt. Any entrepreneurial types on the list?
<returning to lurk mode> -- Pete Dziadzka In the CD changer: 1. Radakka - Malice and Tranquility 2. Edwin Dare - Can't Break Me 3. Thought Industry - Songs for Insects 4. Steve Morse Band - Stressfest 5. Vanden Plas - Colour Temple 6. Varga - Prototype
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 2354 **************************
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