YTSEJAM Digest 2569
Today's Topics:
1) dream theater new album
by saut@dns.diel.it (saut)
2) YTSEJAM digest 2568
by <09422587@mail3.dlsu.edu.ph>
3) Top 500 and Therion NDTC,
by "Jeremy C. Hallum" <jhallum@bu-ast.bu.edu>
4) Ytse Jam - serves 1200
by mrkizer@CCGATE.HAC.COM
5) Birthdays, loudness, vocalists, prog pages
by Phil Carter <carter@negia.net>
6) The old ones, the ones who made us :)
by Jon Parmet <jonp@mailstorm.dot.gov>
7) Re: Cancelation
by drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh)
8) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2568
by Chris Ptacek <someone@enteract.com>
9) FUCK!!!
by drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh)
10) "Is Metal Dead? Hibernating?"
by "Dave Neff" <dneff@maaco.com>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 21:32:51 +0100
From: saut@dns.diel.it (saut)
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: dream theater new album
Message-ID: <1347958525-5437244@diel.it>
Hello!
Please tell me about the Dream Theater new album.
|----------------------------------------|
| !!! Progressive will not dead !!! |
|----------------------------------------|
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 May 97 3:22:02 GMT+8
From: <09422587@mail3.dlsu.edu.ph>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: YTSEJAM digest 2568
Message-ID: <22483B0836@mail3.dlsu.edu.ph>
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Should you need assistance, please mail helpdesk@mail.dlsu.edu.ph
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 16:09:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Jeremy C. Hallum" <jhallum@bu-ast.bu.edu>
To: "Distributor of fine NDTC: Ytsejam Inc" <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Top 500 and Therion NDTC,
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.91.970520155710.13779A-100000@bu-ast.bu.edu>
>
> From: Walter Semerenko <walter@orlinter.com>
> Subject: Re: Therion.
>
> At 07:12 AM 5/20/97 -0700, you wrote:
> >Did I see a band called "Therion" appear ????? Excellent German / Polish metal
> >(I do not like all these different classifications, like Death, Doom, Dark,
> >Black,...).
> >
> >On their last album "THELI", they use plenty of choirs and the result is
> >marvellous !
>
> I'll second that. Thanks to Trevor Hoit for taping me some songs; I'll be
> getting this CD in the future.
Need input: What do these guys sound like? Are they progressive
death metal? Or just Death Metal? :) I saw their album at a record
store near here, and I'm thinking about buying, but a description would
be nice. Not that death metal is bad, mind you, but I'm kinda curious.
band comparisons would always be nice, as well.
> ------------------------------
>
> From: Jon Parmet <jonp@mailstorm.dot.gov>
> Subject: A topical solution
>
> > I'm 100% serious. 30% of the time.
>
> 86.4% of all statisics lie :)
No, no, NO! 140% of all statistics lie. Your assumptions are all
screwed up! :)
> Channel surfing yesterday usually right by MTV (as part of SOP, I don't
> watch it) I noticed a top 500 countdown. They apparently had just
> started it (mid 400's), but has anyone noticed if DT have made an
> appearance yet? This is important to me as I have to make a choice as to
> whether to go shopping for food or fertilizer :)
>
> By the way, Mr. Wendle by Arrested Development was playing and as simple
> a song as it is, guess what: my head started moving.
Heh, anybody see any good pop metal songs from the good ol 80's
in there? I was watching through the 430's before the Red Wings game
started (GO WINGS!), and saw the Black Crowes, and some (c)rap video by
Pimp Daddy, somebody I'd actually never, ever, heard of. And a
really, really, old Beastie Boys video that I saw once(not Fight for
Your Right). I wonder how biased THIS Countdown is...old 80's tunes like
Tom Petty's Take Back, and Duran Duran, but no good "She's only
seventeeeeeen". *sigh* The world is coming to an end.
-jeremy(who thinks that the early 80's was fun, but the
late 80's were better. :)
+=====================================================================+
# grad student, Boston U. # "Some people fly, and some of us worry #
# Boston, MA 02134 # I'd risk it all to have wings #
# Astronomy # I know if I try, I'll get where I'm going #
#<*> Jeremy Hallum <*># keeping my eyes on the sky" #
#<*> jhallum@bu.edu <*># -Queensryche, "Some people Fly" #
#<*>jhallum@dreamt.org <*># http://bu-ast.bu.edu/~jhallum/ #
+=====================================================================+
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 97 13:00:10 PST8
From: mrkizer@CCGATE.HAC.COM
To: c675311@everest.cclabs.missouri.edu, ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Ytse Jam - serves 1200
Message-ID: <9704208641.AA864158832@CCGATE.HAC.COM>
>For Jeff Keifling and anyone else keeping track, the word "fuck" or a
>variant thereof is used 69 fucking times in this fucking post, including
>this fucking sentance. Pretty fucking impressive, huh?
Pat,
Well, when my boss came over to tell me that this email redlined our
email obscenity meters, he wondered why I was laughing so damn hard I
was crying... Well, luckily for me he has a good sense of humor and a
weak bladder <G>.... That was too fookin' hillarious....
~Mike
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 16:36:33 -0400
From: Phil Carter <carter@negia.net>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Birthdays, loudness, vocalists, prog pages
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19970520163633.0069fa50@pop.negia.net>
Greetings ye 'jamanoids...
Dale Newberry sez:
>Damn. I'm 23 a week from Friday. The 20's really suck (except for
>that 21st and 25th. :).
Hey, who *needs* an excuse for a party? My group of friends was bored one
day and looking for an excuse, so when we found out that Friday was the
birthdate of Captain Morgan (feared pirate and namesake of Captain Morgan's
Spiced Rum) we had a Pirate Party, costume optional. With, of course,
plenty of rum.
Jon Parmet remarks:
>> I'm 100% serious. 30% of the time.
>
>86.4% of all statisics lie :)
And 99.5% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
Jon also said:
>Uh, any of you oldies (you know, the ones who mades us :) remember going
>to ELP in the 70's? I thought The one I went to was pretty loud and just
>to make sure everyone would suffer damage, they put speakers in the back
>of the Civic Center. I remembered hearing they got up around 110db at
>one show.
The loudest concert I've been to was a Metallica show. I read somewhere
(probably the Guinness Book, and I don't mean a book about beers) that the
Castle Donnington Monsters of Rock show (headlined by Iron Maiden, if I
remember right) hit 138 db during Maiden's set. If your ears weren't
bleeding after that one, you must have been out of the country. And I'll
bet even that wasn't a guarantee. :)
Adam remarks:
>>Which brings me on to another singer who has come in for a lot of criticism
>>lately, Geoff Tate. Did you know (or even care), that 'Hear In The Now
>>Frontier' is an anagram of 'throat wherein inferno'? (Must be all those
nasty
>>cigarettes). I find that 'Hear In The New Frontier' is like a wart: it
>>grows on
>>you with time.
>
> Hehe. I'm not sure that anagram is intentional, but I've got something to
>say about Tate. I personally believe that Tate is one of the best rock
>vocalists ever to hit the scene.
[some other remarks about Tate snipped]
Geoff Tate's long been one of my favorite vocalists. Tate has been one of
only two or three vocalists to capture my attention IMMEDIATELY upon
hearing one of their songs for the first time (I was channel surfing,
happened upon the chorus from "Eyes of a Stranger", sat bolt upright and
went "Who is THIS????", then waited frantically till the end of the video
so I could find out).
I'm curious: what's everybody else's opinion of the top 5 most powerful
vocalists in metal? I'd have to list KJLB (of course), Bruce Dickinson,
Tate, Michael Kiske, and Ray Alder, I think.
On another note, I've just added a prog page to my website. I'd welcome
feedback from the oh-so-knowledgeable Ytsejammers, so if you've got a
minute check it out. The URL is http://www.negia.net/~carter/prog.html.
Cheers,
Phil
=========================================================
Phil Carter -- carter@negia.net http://www.negia.net/~carter
"Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life."
-- Berthold Auerbach
"Music brings peace to the restless, and comforts the sorrowful. They who
no longer know where to turn find new ways. And those who have despaired,
gain new confidence and love." -- Pablo Casals
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 20:28:34 +0000
From: Jon Parmet <jonp@mailstorm.dot.gov>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: The old ones, the ones who made us :)
Message-ID: <33820972.5656@mailstorm.dot.gov>
> The 20's really suck (except for that 21st and 25th. :).
Wait till ya hit the 30's! You'll be begging for them thar 20's :)
Larry, anyone, care to back me up on this one?
Regards,
Jon
-- *------------*------------------------*--------------* | Jon Parmet | jonp@mailstorm.dot.gov | 617-494-2851 | *------------*------------------------*--------------*I'm astounded by people who want to "know" the universe when it's hard enough to find your way around Chinatown. Woody Allen
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 14:01:56 -0700 From: drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: Cancelation Message-ID: <199705202101.OAA08700@gms.gmsnet.com>
On the Eve of Destruction, Momotaro Hatanaka said: >Thank you for sending a bunch of e-mails so far, but , I am afraid I >want to be thrugh with my membership. Please cut the line.
Cut the line.... Mail isn't always on time....
-The Doc
-- #$%*#$*@ E-MAIL: drkhoe@gmsnet.com #$%#$#$% *$%&%#$* Global Micro Solutions #$#$#@@# *$*$*$*# Reality Enhancement Software - Engineering Reality *$&#*#@$ #$@#$#@# http://www.gmsnet.com/progmetal @#$@##@$
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 16:07:35 -0500 (CDT) From: Chris Ptacek <someone@enteract.com> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2568 Message-ID: <Pine.BSI.3.95.970520145536.10935A-100000@enteract.com>
> - black metal;
Harsh on the ears (purposely so). Poor recording quality (also on purpose), a great deal of speed (not technique) and a lot of emotion (read: Anger). The vocals are usually very unique... a sort of growl... similar to, but not the same as death metal (usually in higher frequencies, and more bizarre. Bands: Emperor, Satyricon, Mayhem, Immortal, etc. Most black metal seems to originate in Norway, Sweden, and surrounding countries.
> - doom metal;
Clear vocals (usually with some talent) or gritty vocals. Some level of technique on most instruments. Apocalyptic lyrics. Usually slower music (many an exception, though). Often very listenable, though somewhat depressing (rarely a positive message... it's DOOM after all...) Great Doom bands: Solitude Aeturnus (All DT fans should hear their first 3 albums), Candlemass (The Ozzy Osbourne of the Doom world), Paradise Lost, etc. I think this originated in Europe, but now it's coming from all ends of the earth.
> - death metal.
Low gutteral belching vocals (except when they sound like Cookie Monster), THE FASTEST double bass drumming genre (kicking circles around Portnoy, though many of the drummers don't do much else of note). Very fast guitars... sometimes mindless, and sometimes extremely technical (Cynic, from my perspective, is more difficult, instrument for instrument (minus vocals and keys) than DT). Lyrics range from Mutalations, crimes, and Satanism, to thoughtful commentaries, and even history lessons. Bands: Morbid Angel, Cannibal Corpse, Cynic, Death (These last two are hard to really pigeonhole into this genre) etc. Florida seems to be the current Death Metal breeding ground. > Any more information that I should know?
Yes.
Gothic Metal: By default, anything that involves Vampires. Glam Metal: Any band with more makeup than Avon Thrash Metal: Anyone trying to be Anthrax, Slayer, Old Megadeth, or Old Metallica. Honorable mention to Testament. Neo-Classical Metal: Any band with one or more guitarist, that plays as many notes as possible in a given interval of time. Progressive Metal: A figment of our imagination. Bafu Metal: Any music played by Nuno Bettencourt or T-Ride, that plays like the Spice Girls, but really means well. Madsmetal: Any band that sucks, but can out-shred a crippled goat. Must throw rubber gonads at any and all fans live on stage.
> From: "Nicole R. Stachowicz > I've been unable to read many of the 'jams recently because I've been > busy getting a 4.0 in my classes this semester. <Evil grin> But when I > came back to the 'jam this morning, eager to start reading again about > the new album and other prog rock stuff, I find this:
Get over it. Seriously, and no offense intended. If you don't like things the way they are, then brainstorm up a thread that can elevate the jam. I've tried what you're doing here... it will never work. > or this: > > fucking thing one can fucking do to make a fucking point, ok?
This got on everyone's nerves. But it's over.
> or even this: > >Isn't it a bit hypocritical to make fun of someone's grasp of the > >English language, only to ignore grammar completely in your own post?
Taken out of context, I certainly hope this quote helps to prove your point.
> I've been wondering why I've been getting up to 6 'jams a day, and now I > know why.
Yeah. I've been wondering why it's been so slow myself. The volume of jams we're getting is significantly lower than usual.
> (steps on soapbox) > You kids still can't quit flaming each other over which band sucks/rules, > whether MTV/MuchMusic sucks/rules, who's grammar is better than who's, > and who deserves to be the captain of the Ytsejam Debate Team (debating > an issue to the point of absurdity). No wonder several people have left > the 'jam in a blaze of glory.
We're not all kids, your perfectness. Some of us care to get involved in discussions and yes, even debates. Why not focus on your 4.0 rather than whining to everyone.
> I was recently introduced to several members of the Kansas mailing list, > People of the South Wind, and they seemed to be very polite They even > invited me to hang out with them (and the band) even though I wasn't a > member. I also looked in on their IRC channel, and I was impressed that > they weren't cussing each other out or trying to be better than one > another. (Get the hint?)
We see your hint. Now get a clue. You're not in Kansas anymore. This is the Ytsejam. It's one of the most diverse lists on the planet, and overall, it is a very positive thing. If you don't like it, take an action to make it better, or disappear.
- Chris Ptacek
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 14:09:23 -0700 From: drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: FUCK!!! Message-ID: <199705202109.OAA08745@gms.gmsnet.com>
ONE MORE FUCK AND I'M CLOSING DOWN THE ENTIRE JAM!!
:)
-The Doc
-- #$%*#$*@ E-MAIL: drkhoe@gmsnet.com #$%#$#$% *$%&%#$* Global Micro Solutions #$#$#@@# *$*$*$*# Reality Enhancement Software - Engineering Reality *$&#*#@$ #$@#$#@# http://www.gmsnet.com/progmetal @#$@##@$
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 18:28:53 -0400 From: "Dave Neff" <dneff@maaco.com> To: "The Black Metal Mailing List" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: "Is Metal Dead? Hibernating?" Message-ID: <199705202229.PAA27792@odin.ax.com>
Hi All,
Here is an (NDTC) article about the current state of heavy metal, written by a friend of mine recently, that you may find interesting. WARNING: IT'S LONG (150 lines!), so don't incinerate me!
- Dave (dneff@maaco.com)
================================================================= .c The Associated Press
By KIRA L. BILLIK PHILADELPHIA (AP) - It wasn't scary seeing a bare-chested Pat Boone at this year's American Music Awards wearing a leather vest and fake tattoos and hyping his latest record, ``In a Metal Mood.'' But it was scary seeing Metallica, who had just won for favorite heavy metal/hard rock act, show up at the awards show looking like a bunch of choirboys - with short hair, jackets and ties, and frighteningly well-mannered dispositions. And it seemed no one cared about the reunion of notorious bad boys Motley Crue. Does all this mean that heavy metal music as we know it is dead, buried and beyond resuscitation? Maybe so. The facts: MTV, after being metal's champion throughout the 1980s, won't touch it now. They canceled their ``Headbanger's Ball'' show in the United States three years ago after a seven-year run. Rock radio stations have jumped the metal ship en masse, changing to ``modern rock'' formats. Major record labels have trimmed or eliminated their metal divisions. The kids who once thrived on Kurt Cobain's deeply personal songs of self-doubt and despair have graduated to the anarchist industrial rock of bands like Marilyn Manson, Nine Inch Nails and Tool. But the most concrete evidence of metal's decline is sales figures. Bands like Def Leppard and Queensryche, after having multiplatinum albums in the 1980s, haven't been able to hit even platinum in the '90s. Metal still makes up 23 percent of the market, according to Soundscan, which charts record sales. Depending on whom you ask, there are many reasons why the metal meltdown. One theory is that heavy metal is going through a name change, from the frowned-upon ``metal'' to the more accepted and more encompassing ``hard music.'' ``If you just use the word `metal,' I think there's no question that metal is not in vogue at all,'' said CMC International president Tom Lipsky. ``If you say `hard music,' that covers a broad base.'' Many observers say bands like Nirvana evolved from changes in the nation's mood in the aftermath of the conservative Reagan-Bush era. ``People got cynical (and) jaded, and the generations that were growing up had to express their angst,'' said Marty Maidenberg, vice president of marketing at Mercury Records, home of Def Leppard and Bon Jovi. Kids could no longer identify with metal's message of power and self-confidence, according to sociologist Deena Weinstein of DePaul University, author of ``Heavy Metal: A Cultural Sociology.'' ``I think partly why some metal lost its audience (came) with the designation of the young generation as slackers, as weak, as people who are stressed out,'' Weinstein said. ``That self-definition really conflicts with a lot of what metal offers.'' Some say the so-called ``hair'' bands - like Poison and Warrant - ruined the credibility of more thoughtful bands like Megadeth, Queensryche and Pantera. The pretty boys got all the airplay and the splashy MTV videos, while others toiled anonymously on the road. ``When people think about metal, they think of '80s metal,'' said Monty Connor, vice president of artists and repertoire at Roadrunner Records. ``They think of the hair spray, the clothes, the stupid fake attitude, the big arenas, the silly image.'' When all-powerful MTV stopped playing metal videos, the genre lost one of its biggest supporters. ``(That) hurt, and I guess everything else just followed suit,'' said publicist and label manager Marco Barbieri of Century Media, a German label with U.S. headquarters in Santa Monica, Calif. Def Leppard's 1992 album ``Adrenalize'' sold 3.3 million copies, but their 1996 effort, ``Slang,'' has only sold 289,000 units to date, according to Soundscan. Queensryche's 1990 record ``Empire'' sold 2.2 million copies, while 1994's ``Promised Land'' managed only 710,000, Soundscan said. Only Metallica continues to sell in the millions with their latest, ``Load,'' which has sold 3 million records to date. But they have a long way to go to match the success of their 1991 self-titled album, which sold 9.3 million copies, according to Soundscan. It's not that the quality of metal music declined, either; most bands were into their third or fourth albums and putting out their best material when the slump hit. On the radio front, Los Angeles' revered hard rock station KNAC became a Spanish-language station several years ago. New York metal pioneer Q-104 now plays classic rock. But in Europe, Japan and Latin America, metal remains a viable force that sells well. MTV's ``Headbanger's Ball'' still airs. And England's renowned Castle Donington Festival draws thousands of raging metalheads each year. Roadrunner's Connor says it's because those countries are a few years behind the United States and fans there are less fickle and trendy. Weinstein sees it differently. ``They haven't bought into the `I'm weak' thing of the American '90s teen-ager,'' she said. ``These are people whose lives have a lot more stability than our young people; they know what they're going to be when they grow up. People know that they're going to be slotted into the same social class as their parents, so the (metal) tradition hangs on.'' Despite the lull in metal's U.S. popularity, there are many outlets keeping it alive. Large independent label Roadrunner has made its name with heavy bands like Sepultura, Type O Negative, and Fear Factory and vows to stand behind them. ``Just because metal right now is not the flavor of the month, that doesn't mean it's not going to make a comeback,'' Roadrunner's Connor said. CMC, a 6-year-old independent label based in Zebulon, N.C., and distributed by BMG, is a haven for homeless '80s pop-metal bands like Slaughter, Warrant and Dokken and has become the new home of three well-traveled metal pioneers - Motorhead, Deep Purple and Iron Maiden. It sells anywhere from 40,000 to 200,000 copies of its various artists. ``There a lot of indicators that there's a slight turn back toward what I call arena rock, whether it's hard, soft, heavy, or in between,'' said CMC's Lipsky. Mercury's Maidenberg agrees. ``The mood with Clinton in office and people feeling better about the economy ... all creates more of an upbeat, less antagonistic, less cynical view of what's happening,'' he said. ``That feeds right into what Bon Jovi and Def Leppard are about.'' Century Media has put out two Judas Priest tribute albums and signed several young European headbangers. Sweden's Tiamat, who toured the United States with Black Sabbath several years ago, is their biggest seller, with sales around 150,000 worldwide. ``Metal has always had its peaks and valleys,'' said Century's Barbieri. ``It's kind of a good time (now) because it weeds out a lot of the people that really aren't into it, whether it's the bands or the companies, ... because there's not a lot of profit to be made.'' In Chicago, programmer Scott Davidson is mounting a single-handed effort to get metal back on the radio. He co-founded Rebel Radio in 1994, which airs on FM (WVVX) and AM (WKTA) bands and on the Internet. Rebel Radio plays new and classic metal, new and established bands. And its fans are varied. ``Everyone thinks heavy metal is the teen-age kid in a black T-shirt,'' said Davidson, who plays drums in his own metal band, Stonehenge. ``I disagree. We have at least six or seven different police forces listening, which really surprised me, but a lot of them grew up on this stuff. It's a wide variety.'' He's comfortable with metal's current status. ``I really don't want to see metal in the mainstream,'' he said. ``I want to see it sell more and I want to see more bands come out and do better, (but) I don't want to see it selling out either.'' And he is, in a perverse way, grateful for the Pat Boone album. ``It's terrible, but it's just bringing the name metal back into the picture,'' he said.
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 2569 **************************
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