YTSEJAM Digest 3282
Today's Topics:
1) Nightmare Cinema???
by Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
2) DT at the Roxy
by Misha Horowitz <mhorowit@ziplink.net>
3) Re: *The* FII Moment
by Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
4) Re: Live versions of DT songs...
by Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
5) goosebump dt moments
by Eric Desobe <edesobe@emory.edu>
6) Kuba, Clark, Marurity, and Barbara Walters
by someone@prognosis.com
7) Re: *The* FII Moment
by someone@prognosis.com
8) UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: All about Mike Bahr, DT Xmas CD '97, Anastasia,
by Graham.Boyle.149036@navy.gov.au
9) DT Chills
by calfaro@caribe.net (calfaro)
10) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3281
by Brian <DreamNDay@dreamt.org>
11) NDTC: Sevendust review in an Atlanta weekly
by Wes Foll <wfoll@america.net>
12) Extreme/Van Halen
by VAIMAN <vaiman@mindspring.com>
13) Re: King Diamond
by someone@prognosis.com
14) Re: Stop sending me stuff
by Matthew Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
15) FW FAQ, and Lunar Crush
by Eminense Grise <caber1@concentric.net>
16) It aint just prog...
by Jon Kretschmer <jkretsch@sdcc17.ucsd.edu>
17) inspiration, Fly by Night, falsetto, Extreme
by ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack)
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:41:55 -0200 (EDT)
From: Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Nightmare Cinema???
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.971123214049.25413B-100000@dijkstra.linux.ime.usp.br>
On Sun, 23 Nov 1997 CNG@tcco.com wrote:
> I'm sure a zillion people will post about the actual show, so I'll just say
> that the show was amazing. The best part for me was during the encore when
> everyone swapped instruments and launched into "Perfect Strangers", probably
> because I got closer to the stage.
How many times has Nightmare Cinema occoured? I think the first
time was during the Fix for '97 tour, right?
[]s very curious, Roger...
-- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 18:40:26 -0500 From: Misha Horowitz <mhorowit@ziplink.net> To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: DT at the Roxy Message-ID: <01BCF83F.48EAB260@bos-ip-1-72.ziplink.net>
Boston area jammers:
Does anyone know how tight the security is at the Roxy? This 18+ crap sucks... Replies via email, please... Thanks!
-Misha
P.S. Sorry about the clutter, I forgot the addy for the "boston jam"...
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:53:21 -0200 (EDT) From: Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: *The* FII Moment Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.971123214319.25413C-100000@dijkstra.linux.ime.usp.br>
On Sun, 23 Nov 1997 Coop42@aol.com wrote:
> I still can't understand why they keep playing that song as opener. It's just > too intense to play it that early, but nobody listens to me...
I agree. It was very, very nice that they've played that song in the middle of the show here in Brazil. In fact, since I'm very lazy and very anti-social, I just wished there were different prices for different places to attend DT shows (especially DT shows), since I love to be quiet on my place, sit and just staring at the artists. Its just *my* style of appreciating other's work. Also, it is much easier to tape the show if you're quiet in your place :-), but this isn't important.
And "Lines in the Sand is just the song for you to sit and reflect. As you can guess, its by ***far***, my favorite song off the album and I think it needs some preparation and quiet place after hearing. Also, I think that it must be played after BMS and HK, exactly as it is on the album.
> Take Care, > Andreas Berger
[]s, Roger...
P.S.: BTW, what is the order in which you play FII?? Do you maintain the tracks in their order or do you change it? I reserve the proggier material to the end. And I also think that one of the reasons why I&W is such a masterpiece is because the song order is perfect: from the more simpler material to the more complicated. Of course, it is just my opinion. I'm still deciding (experimenting) what is the optimum order of the songs to play FII.
-- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:59:00 -0200 (EDT) From: Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Live versions of DT songs... Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.971123215816.25413D-100000@dijkstra.linux.ime.usp.br>
On Sun, 23 Nov 1997, Shai Yallin wrote:
> What are the last 2 tracks on "Uncovered"? This isn't on no FAQ nor DT > Unofficial Songbook.
The Yes medley and the Big Medley.
> Thanx, laterz, take care and enjoy, > Shai Yallin - Kurush on #YTSEJAM
Hope this helps, Roger...
-- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:54:50 -0500 (EST) From: Eric Desobe <edesobe@emory.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: goosebump dt moments Message-ID: <Pine.WNT.3.95.971123195014.-482041A-100000@edesobe.resnet.emory.edu>
Have to jump for this one:
Original ACOS - Inevitable summer. JP solo is more dramatic than on EP, plus the doubling between Kev and JP added with Mike's double bass -- classic dt
Outro to Learning to Live from Dance of Eternity, just amazing closure to one of the great dt shows.
Moon bubbles from Live in Tokyo video - from beginning to end, simply amazing. JP's slow gutiar work with Kev's synth is compliments the visual spectrum on the video very well. Then Kev's piano under JP's guitar kick ass, and for me is why Derek will never be Kevin, he just can't match the understanding the four guys had between one another. Finally the building climax where JP just rips, Mike adds the double bass, and JM and KM hold it all together before they all fall off.
-Eric
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:16:33 +0000 From: someone@prognosis.com To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Kuba, Clark, Marurity, and Barbara Walters Message-ID: <199711240112.RAA28549@odin.ax.com>
> Perhaps I am wrong too but there is a an objective standard > which (telling the truth) is difficult to define or to discover.
I default to what Mr. Tedesco said so well:
> Fact is, it is natural to feel that somethings cannot be estimated objectively. > Take love. Write an objective story on the rights and wrongs of how to love > and be loved, and leave out no inconsistencies, no gray areas. NObody can, > so we feel like it's not possible. Kuba feels it is. However, until he can > demonstrate some proof that everything can theoretically be estimated > objectively, he's got no leg to stand on.
This is my final Ytseword on this subject, unless Kuba makes an attempt to justify his assertion (if I should deem a response necessary). You have to offer a definition for what "Good Prog Music" is, if we're to adhere to your concept of objectivity. If you can't offer said definition, then there is no reason anyone should take your position seriously. If you would prefer to start small, as all 3 terms (Good, Prog, and Music) will have to be objectively defined, you can start by defining "Good." I'll be waiting here with my copy of "The Apology" (one of Plato's works, based on the life of Socrates, for the culturally illiterate out there) ready to knock you down.
Regarding the Maturity/Progress discussion:
Clark and Ernie and a few others have brought up a few good points in the discussion, which lead me to believe that the definition of "maturity" when applied to music, may in fact be completely relative to your own perspectives. So while it's a cool discussion, there's no way to really succinctly lay out the facts. It seems like there are two sides: one side, which doesn't believe in overplaying or musically mature/immature pieces, and the other side, which believes that a song is a more delicate construct, which can be shattered by excess or by a lack of performance. Through further investigation, though, I don't know if I buy into the existence of the former. To say that you don't believe in overplaying or musical maturity, you'd have to be willing to say that every DT piece is equal, and that every Nirvana piece is equal to any DT piece. Clearly some of you who have said that you don't believe in overplaying have also said that you don't like the new DT album. What, then makes one like the older music and not the newer? A real "Hmmmmm..." as far as I'm concerned. :)
Chris Ptacek someone@prognosis.com http://www.prognosis.com/madsman Go Home and Practice!
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:19:11 +0000 From: someone@prognosis.com To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: *The* FII Moment Message-ID: <199711240114.RAA28562@odin.ax.com>
> P.S.: BTW, what is the order in which you play FII?? Do you maintain the > tracks in their order or do you change it? I reserve the proggier material > to the end. And I also think that one of the reasons why I&W is such a > masterpiece is because the song order is perfect: from the more simpler > material to the more complicated. Of course, it is just my opinion. I'm > still deciding (experimenting) what is the optimum order of the songs to > play FII.
PMU and TTT are easier than Another Day and Surrounded? I phear you!
Chris Ptacek someone@prognosis.com http://www.prognosis.com/madsman Go Home and Practice!
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Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 12:55:06 +1000 From: Graham.Boyle.149036@navy.gov.au To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: All about Mike Bahr, DT Xmas CD '97, Anastasia, Message-ID: <4A256559.000FB3CD.00@nschq-e-navy.navy.gov.au>
the '6th member' of DT said : :)
>It's good to see that the DT Xmas CD '97 is going to contain the >remainder of the FII outtakes.
I dunno if Mike has any 'inside information' about this, from what we have read recently I thought that the FC CD would be all live material, I hope your right about this Mike :)
graham
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:26:41 -0400 From: calfaro@caribe.net (calfaro) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: DT Chills Message-ID: <3478BBB0.D4AF13E3@caribe.net>
Well I have to add my 2 cents:
There are different moments ive gotten either chills down my spine, or tears to my eyes, or hardons! :)
For example... the passage of TAMP that goes "his final scene..the actor bows" all that part.. including the solo... and then the last verses that show like hes finally accepting the pain.. that brings tears to my eyes almost every time i listen to it.
Besides that.. in Hells Kitchen when theyre half way thru the buildup and the keys start doing the cool thing (im not technically versed) and then the whole bands starts doing it in unison.. that brings me chills
Most of new millenium brings me chills..
The old version of Burning my Soul ...specially a little part they do before going into "i say its green and then you tell me its red" that was cut from the album... it rules!
Theres soooooooo many moments... the other one that brings tears to my eyes..without failing ONCE.. is the end of acos... ..the lyrics to crimson sunset... "he is my only one,..now that my time has come,..etc" THAT part makes me weep like a little girl :)
Cya
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 20:56:20 -0800 From: Brian <DreamNDay@dreamt.org> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3281 Message-ID: <347908F4.29DE@dreamt.org>
> My personal favorite has to be "Them", but "Abigail" is a close second. > "Them" has such a great story... > > "Oooh I hate that bitch!" - KD
It time for tea, it is time again... GRANDMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!! WELCOME HOME!! Yeah, Abigail and Them are my favorites. I like The Graveyard too. The Spider's Lullabye kicks ass as well. Shit, I like all that is Diamond! After all, I did paint my face like him on Halloween this year, just for fun, to see what kind of reactions I'd get from the local rednecks. ========================================================================
"Are you gonna bark all day, little ----- doggie, or are you gonna ---- ------------- ---- bite?"-Micheal Madsen, ---- - ---- Reservoir Dogs -- - - - - - - - -- "Years of pain I will take and hone - - - - - - - Manifest with your broken bones - - -- - -- - - My heart bleeds for none but my -- - - - - - - - -- own"-Machine Head ---- - - - ---- "None But My Own" ---- ------------- ---- Brian ----- DreamNDay@dreamt.org ========================================================================
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 20:58:36 -0500 (EST) From: Wes Foll <wfoll@america.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: NDTC: Sevendust review in an Atlanta weekly Message-ID: <199711240158.UAA03183@web3.america.net>
Hi all...here's a great review of Sevendust that I read from this last week's Creative Loafing: an Atlanta entertainment and 'what's going on in Atlanta' weekly. Thought some here would dig it, since some here like Sevendust.... --------- Sevendust SEVENDUST TVT Records
With a pounding fury comes Atlanta's Sevendust. This self-titled release serves as proof that our city still has some breath in its often tired musical lungs. Sevendust powers through every track on this disc with a blend of hardcore, metal, and grind, punishing the ears for years of listening to weak music. Harder than a Carver Homes thug and more SMARTA than MARTA, these men bring rock back to a hard place. The disc opens with a furious trip down riff road on "Black." Thundering bass and pounding guitar action open the gates for intense vocals and agile six-string solos. Yes, Sevendust does guitar solos, as well. Following close behind is "Bitch," which opens witha shift in gears to a guitar melody so pure it might be acoustic. As the lyrics wander through "I can't imagine to be like you / the pain and the suffering you put me through." This peace is only the calm before the storm as Sevendust hits the turbos and rips through a guitar attack of titanic power. Other tracks experiment with rhythm, vocal qualities, and delays, but never leave enough room for a get-away. Just when you think all they're doing is making noise, Sevendust flexes its musical muscle, displaying frantic fret-work like Santana vs. Eddie Van Halen. The appropriately-titled track "Wired" is an excercise in hyper-tense treble tantrums. The fury that Sevendust's guitarists unleash lashes out with unchecked power. The sheer strength of Sevendust's power is almost beyond words. Vocals that sound like a caveman on fire. Guitar like a saltpeter sandwich with a side of Bert's chili. Guttural bass that seems to come from a crack in the earth's crust. In the van <typo here....VEIN> of Leverage, Knut and Bullhead Clap, Sevendust are pioneers of power. So git you some, punk!---Matthew Wright -----------------------------------
Beavis (Wes Foll) http://www.america.net/~wfoll/beavis.htm ++The optimist thinks this is the best of all possible worlds.
++The pessimist fears it is true. /| / ||\ / || \ ______________ _ ______ _ __ __ //| || \\_____ _____| ||___ // |\ \/ / //_| || \ | || || | | || |/ ///|| \ / / __ || |\ \ | || || |__| || <//_|| / \ / / | || | \ \| || || __ || |\ \__ |/ /\ \ /_/ |_||_| \ || || | |_||_|/\ \ || / \_\ \ || ||/ \_\||/ \ ||/ \|
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:03:27 -0500 From: VAIMAN <vaiman@mindspring.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Extreme/Van Halen Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19971124020327.006ba434@pop.mindspring.com>
> >Glad someone mentioned EXTREME. One of my favorite bands. Does anybody know >whatever happened to this band? >III Sides To Every Story <----This album kicks ass!!!
As most of us know...Gary S is the new singer for Van Halen. I'm not sure if Extreme broke up for this reason or if they broke up before the Van Halen deal.
Speaking of Van Halen, I am hearing a new VH cd will be out sometime in the first of the year. I think Gary S. will do just fine. I think he has a GREAT voice. I also heard that Eddie Van Halen said he is so sure that Gary will work out that if Gary doesn't work out, Eddie will hang up his guitar with Van Halen.
III Sides To Every Story is incredible!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Take care,
Todd s
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 20:19:13 +0000 From: someone@prognosis.com To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: King Diamond Message-ID: <199711240214.SAA28890@odin.ax.com>
> I have "The Graveyard" and it is excellent, although I hear from people > that it is his worst.
IMO it is (his worst, that is).
> I plan on getting "The Eye" next because the concept sounds cool and > I have heard some people say it's their favorite.
I recommend A Dangerous Meeting, Abigail, The Eye, and the live album. IMO his finest non Mercyful Fate work.
Chris Ptacek someone@prognosis.com http://www.prognosis.com/madsman Go Home and Practice!
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 18:58:19 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Stop sending me stuff Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.971123185753.2167A-100000@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
On Sun, 23 Nov 1997, Jeff Strinko wrote:
> >Please take me off the mailing list > >
no. (sorry, I had to...)
--Matt (original? me? ha!)
--------------------------------------------------------------------- "..." --James LaBrie, "Hell's Kitchen" ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 22:28:54 -0800 From: Eminense Grise <caber1@concentric.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: FW FAQ, and Lunar Crush Message-ID: <34791EA6.3476@concentric.net>
Hi everyone,
Well this will be my first post to the jam that wasn't about DT or something on the jam. I've been pretty busy lately with school work(not done), trades(not done), and some net stuff. Well I've just got two things of the net stuff done and I'm here to tell you about them.
One is, if you're into Fates Warning I've just finished making a FW FAQ. It's been awhile since I started making it but it's finally done and I would like some response back on it. Go check it out at http://www.concentric.net/~caber1/fwfaq.html
The other project I've been working on lately is the Lunar Crush page. You're probably saying to yourself, "who the hell are they?!?" Well to tell you the truth I'm not sure sure myself. ;) But I've heard some wav files of them and they sound quite interesting. From what I've heard I would say they're a cross between the Gathering and NIN with some progness throw in so no one will buy their stuff. :) Someone(hey Jeff) has already posted about them here on the jam but he didn't get to many responses back(what I'm trying to say is that he got zulch feedback...). All I'm asking of you is to give me money. Err, I mean just check out http://www.concentric.net/~caber1/lunar.shtml
John McCabe is maintainer of the Fates Warning FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~caber1/fwfaq.html And the maintainer of the Lunar Crush Web Page http://www.concentric.net/~caber1/lunar.shtml
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 20:03:01 -0800 From: Jon Kretschmer <jkretsch@sdcc17.ucsd.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: It aint just prog... Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19971123200301.007ffad0@sdcc17.ucsd.edu>
>You don't think they would stick a crazy jazz riff/line in the middle of >TAMP, do you? > >IMO there are sacred things that should never be changed, for example: > - Scarred (the whole song) > - The Killing Hand (The new version I've heard (CIA97) has been changed >and I prefer the Marquee/TDOE version) > - Voices
Good god, dont forget LtL.
Best song ever DT ever wrote, IMHO.
I keep thinking that MP must enjoy finally having something interesting to read, all these great parts of his songs being mentioned.
And to expand this goosebumpy topic more, try venturing into orchestral pieces.
Try Tchaikovsky, Shostakovich, Mahler, and R. Strauss on for size, and you dont have goosebumps, you have pterodactyl-bumps.
Just a thought.
Jon
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Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 23:14:45 -0500 From: ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack) To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: inspiration, Fly by Night, falsetto, Extreme Message-ID: <19971123181941.AAA12215@sni.pananet.com>
> But would you say that this works in reverse, too? Let's say I made > something like Met Part 2 (yeah right :) and I broke it up into several > songs. And all the songs had no relation to the other. Wouldn't I be > immature? >
Wellllll that would depend....sometimes you have a part in a song that you think is really cool (say because its in 31/8, or its in the mongolian minor scale or sumthin'), but it really isnt helping the song, and its just your ego keeping it there...but you could take that part and make into a really screwed up instrumenatl where it would fit. TADA!
> Of course, your last line leaves a pretty big door open, too. If you > have a thought about making a song more complex couldn't it be > considered inspiration? And if you didn't let inspiration guide you, you > would be immature. Therefore for the sake of my maturity I had to write > Met part 2!;-)
STOP SCREWIN' WIT MA BRAAAAAAIIIIN, MAAAAAAAAAAAN!!!!
:)
But seriously, in the end it's all relative...but I think *most* people would agree with me. But definitely not all:)
>I can get Fly By Night (digital remastered) very cheap and want to know, >if it's a good album ?
Well, I think its a great album, but it's their first step into the prog world, and away from the Led Zep clone sound. Its like Led Zeppelin with a prog drummer, and lyrics that arent about squeezing lemons down people's legs:) Its a lot different from any Rush you've heard so far (from what you tell me)...although it has that same 'hard rock' feel Counterparts has.
But if you're looking for prog, you should get their late70's/early 80's material... namely Farewell to Kings, Hemispheres (MP's fave, i believe), Permanent Waves, or Moving Pictures (considered their best by many)...or the immortal live album, 'Exit Stage Left'.
Just keep in mind that Rush is band that has changed a lot through time...you should give each 'era' a try and see if you like it. IMO all Rush CD's are good in one way or another...
>Uh... Forgive my ignorance, but what is falsetto? Could anybody
You know when men try to imitate girls with this really high, fake-sounding voice? Thats falsetto:)
>As most of us know...Gary S is the new singer for Van Halen. >I'm not sure if Extreme broke up for this reason or if they > broke up before the Van Halen deal.
Yes and no. The main reason they broke up is because Nuno wanted to dedicate himself to his solo music. But since Gary had landed the gig with VH also (apparently he intended to sing for both bands *and* do Jesus Christ Superstar:) everybody agreed it would be the best thing to do.
later, Ern
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 3282 **************************
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