YTSEJAM Digest 2997
Today's Topics:
1) King Crimson
by JB <beamup@vt.edu>
2) The Gods Have Simled
by Smoove D <dhplotki@students.wisc.edu>
3) Re: King Crimson
by ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack)
4) Falling Into Low-Fidelity
by Jason Hartman <lhartm1@ds1.GL.UMBC.EDU>
5) speaking of poseurs and selling out (NDTC!)
by Zack Gemmill <zack@lsil.com>
6) The Arizona Experience
by Eckie <eckie@asu.edu>
7) to uk jammers
by Steve <steve@dial.pipex.com>
8) Listen: JP's playing....
by Hans Petter Olsen <hans-petter.olsen@merkantildata.no>
9) Falling Into Infinity: The WORST...
by durnik <durnik@goodnet.com>
10) Anna Lee a.o.
by the great wazoo <jerry@muc.de>
11) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2996
by Sami Poimala <spoimala@itu.cc.jyu.fi>
12) My quickie on FII.
by Antti Nyrhinen <nyrhinen@leandra.ebs.ee>
13) Keyboards
by Sami Poimala <spoimala@itu.cc.jyu.fi>
14) Some comments
by "Neil Gallop" <nga@software-ag.de>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 01:19:22 -0400
From: JB <beamup@vt.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: King Crimson
Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19970923011922.007b8100@192.168.255.1>
Hey, I just picked up the King Crimson album "THRAK"... it was a special
limited edition gold CD (used for $5).
I was just wondering what kind of a sampling of their sound this is... is
it a good indicator of their style or not.? I'm not sure I like it that
much, and since I never have heard anything by King Crimson before, I was
wondering whether it was just the album I didn't like or the band itself.
Thanks,
J
---------------------------+++---------------------------------
notes from the desk of Virginia Tech
Jason Brindel Computer EngIneering
(540) 961-7262 & VT a cappella
beamup@vt.edu (JUXTAPOSITION)
www.vt.edu:10021/B/beamup www.vt.edu:10021/org/juxtap
FM 90.7 WUVT DJ (Tuesday mornings : 2-4am -- "The Dream Vault")
---------------------------+++----------------------------------
CD currently playing, "Dream Theater - Falling Into Infinity" (releases 9/23)
---------------------------+++----------------------------------
"Walk me across the water, and maybe you'll understand.
Once the stone you're crawling under is lifted off your shoulders,
Once the cloud that's raining over your head..... disappears,
The noise that you'll hear, is the crashing down of Hollow Years"
-Dream Theater (Hollow Years)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 00:38:31 -0500
From: Smoove D <dhplotki@students.wisc.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: The Gods Have Simled
Message-ID: <v03110701b04cf65970db@[144.92.96.11]>
Well, I guess in this world it's all about who you know. An OK friend of
mine works at a local record store here in good ole' Madison, so he hooked
me up with FII tonight at around 6. I suppose in retrospect it really
doesn't matter whether I got it tonight or tomorrow morning, but I've got
it in my possession and had the most absolute and distinctive pleasure of
listening to it through twice. I'm currently in the school library right
now with lots of work to deal with, but here's what comes to mind.
Ladies and gentlemen, this album they call Falling into Infinity is, simply
put, a GEM. Of course I consider only two times through to be a rather
cursory listen at best, however the music is sooooo incredibly DIVERSE. I
feel something completely and entirely different with each piece. I hate to
cite early faves, as more so with this album with ANY other, by ANY band,
but there are three songs which are simply over the edge, a Holy Trinity if
you will (and I'm not even religious): NEW MILLENIUM, HELL'S KITCHEN, and
TRIAL OF TEARS. The last of the three is quite miraculous; so muchYES it
isn't even funny-- AWAKEN to be precise, IMHO (AWAKEN is definitely in my
top three along with GATES OF DELIRIUM and SOUND CHASER-- sorry SYRINX....
Ok, you're darn tootin' that MACHINE MESSIAH is one of my faves too :) It's
ambiance sends shockwaves through me. HELL'S KITCHEN, for me, is RUSH pure
and simple, namely JACOB'S LADDER; the buildup is momentous, astonishing;
there simply isn't a superlative in existence to describe this one for me.
The short part immediately before the most JACOB's LADDER sounding of it
all-- you know, the bum-bum dah dah dah, bum-bum dah dah dah...-- is the
AMEN, the bridge, the crossover, whatever. It only lasts about three or
four seconds or so, but that, for me, provides finality as well as
departure into another realm, i.e. the "JACOB's LADDER section" and beyond.
NEW MILLENIUM is tough. Tons of YES, a bit of CRIMSON, no doubt ALICE IN
CHAINS, and yes, for me, even some LEMUR VOICE. James' voice is key in
making the song work. It really complements it for me, and ultimately, ties
together the song beautifully.
HOLLOW YEARS is wonderful too. It's so mellow, just the chill out song. It
would absoltutely be the ideal "change of pace" song on this tour.
Speaking of this tour, realizing how astounding this material is, it
befuddles me to think ahead to seeing these songs (hopefully) live.
Listening to the studio version is one thing, and listening to it on
headphones is another, but hearing DT do this live will be a wholly
different and awe-inspiring experience, to be sure.
Let's not be so rapid to jump to consclusions, saying that "this isn't
Metropolis" or "this isn't progressive" or "this isn't the DT I knew from
years past," yadda dadda da. Ladies and gentlemen, people change, mindset's
change, attitudes change, and hence the music will change. I believe all of
DT's instrumental prowess and virtuosity to be here on FII, and Derek
couldn't have put it better when he said, many moons ago-- (and I'm sure
he'll state the same within upcoming interviews where the question is asked
"what new directions, if any, did you provide for the band and for this
album?")-- that he wanted to "TRIM THE FAT." It's all here, fellows. It's
not excessive or rambling though as in the past. This is part of maturing,
this is part of changing, this is part of PROGRESSING. Simply, it's
NATURAL. We need, IMHO, to be more concise in our thoughts, more fluid,
more agreeable. Just as comprehensive surely, but I believe CONDENSATION to
be paramount to the process. Ultimately, we want to hear or read the stuff
that's INTEGRAL to the overall song or argument. We need to learn this, as
it doesn't come with the stroke of a pen or a pick. We acquire these skills
through trial, error, and experimentation. To paraphrase Neil Peart, "we
aren't great people trying to be perfect, but good people trying to be
great." I've also got to give big ups to Mies van der Rohe (as I'm studying
architectural history), for he states, "I don't want to be interesting. I
want to be good."
And good he was. And good this band we venerate as DREAM THEATER really is.
We wouldn't be on this list, this community after all, if they weren't.
So my moral is this: eat your spinich and you will grow. Eat Canned Ham,
and, well, I suppose it's anyone's guess :>)
Thanks everyone, just for being here. This music really speaks to me in
ways it never has before, and so too does everyone's presence on this list
give me further reason for sticking around.
See you out there....
Dave Plotkin
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 00:45:08 -0400
From: ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack)
To: <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: King Crimson
Message-ID: <19970922194107.AAA7274@sni.pananet.com>
> From: JB <beamup@vt.edu>
> Hey, I just picked up the King Crimson album "THRAK"... it was a special
> limited edition gold CD (used for $5).
>
> I was just wondering what kind of a sampling of their sound this is... is
> it a good indicator of their style or not.? I'm not sure I like it that
> much, and since I never have heard anything by King Crimson before, I was
> wondering whether it was just the album I didn't like or the band itself.
First of all, take your time with it. There's all of stuff in there that
takes time to discover. I see the THRAK KC as a more agressive version of
the 80's KC...and a lot more dense. They play alot with polyrhythms and
stuff like that.
I personally don't like the whole album, but I love the songs VROOM (both
versions of ot), Dinosaur, B,Boom, Thrak (kinda reminds me of 70's KC, but
more chaotic), and Sex Sleep Eat,etc..
Like many prog bands, KC cannot be judged on one single album. I recommend
to give a listen to an album from each era, since evrybody has different
tastes.
Ern
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 02:33:32 -0400
From: Jason Hartman <lhartm1@ds1.GL.UMBC.EDU>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Falling Into Low-Fidelity
Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19970923023332.006a78c4@pop.gl.umbc.edu>
Just picked up FII 2 hours ago at midnight. (Saw maybe 1 or 2
other buyers?) It's a little too earlier to post much of a music
review (Hollow Years jumps out as being very non-DT yet VERY cool!!) but
I just have to comment on the sound quality, or the LACK of sound quality.
All of those MP3 and Real Audio files weren't far from the truth. The
sound SUCKS on this album! Can hardly hear the snare in some places.
It has no brightness or airy-ness at all. It should be somewhere between
this sound and the ACOS coffee-can sound and it would be perfect.
Vocals get "blurry" in many places. Either too many effects or not enough.
Hard to understand the lyrics in many places. I guess guitar/bass/keys sound
decent for the most part but the drums and vox blow. Less treble then
WDADU - I didn't think that was possible! I usually have the treble set at
0 or 1 on my stereo in truck and that works just find but I had the treble
cranked and it still sounded like I had cotton balls shoved in my ears. I
think it sounds worse than QR's HitNF.
Lets hope the music grows on me. I'm gonna give it time.
Steve Z and I were sitting there in the parking lot at Tower Records,
listening
to it and we saw a bunch of cop cars and fire trucks ride buy. I said it was
probably a mass-suicide at a DT listening party. hehe
Also, DOUG PINICK (sp?) - DIE DIE DIE!!!! What a mistake THAT was. Ugh!
Welp, that's it for now. I can't wait to read the 87 ytsejams that
will be showing up in my box in the next 24 hours. :)
-- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \ / / L. Jason Hartman "And I'll smile and I'll learn to pretend \ \ lhartm1@gl.umbc.edu And I'll never be open again / / And I'll have no more dreams to defend \ \ Univ. Of Maryland, And I'll never be open again " / / Baltimore County - Kevin Moore : Dream Theater \ \ / / "Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot." \ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 1997 23:22:01 -0700 From: Zack Gemmill <zack@lsil.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: speaking of poseurs and selling out (NDTC!) Message-ID: <34276009.6634B491@lsil.com>
No, I haven't heard FII yet. Doubtless, there will be enough worthl...er, _while_ opinions floating around without me cluttering the 'jam. Anyway, I just moved from Kalifornia to the Portland area and found what I thought was a pretty cool station. They even have Craig, the Dog-faced Boy who used to be based in the Central Valley (Stockton, Modesto), but I've finally noticed that they seem to be like the other former AOR stations... the only old groups they play seem to be VH, AC/DC (waaay too much, if I didn't like 'em b4, I certainly loathe them now), and Rush... the groups that it's still "cool" to like. Oh, and they also play loads of Metallica, whom I used to love, but now kind of feel linear about since it became "cool" for said former AOR stations to play 100^100 times per day since about, what, two years ago? Well, I even tolerate that they don't let Craig play his barking dog clips during his announcements (short, but effective... you have to hear it).
Anyway, had said station on Sat. about noon. They play a "menage a troi" weekend, three songs per artist (like that wasn't hard to guess), and they played some old Def Leppard. Stuff from Pyromania and even something from H&D. So later that evening, listening to said station again, I heard DL come on. Yeah, pretty cool. Waitaminute... it was the same damn set in the same order! With all of the DL singles to choose from, this was no mere coincidence. I thought I had noticed this with Tool, but I dismissed it due to their lack of repertoire. Wtf? Same with the damn Aeorosmith. What the HELL? Is this some backwater station like the one in my hometown of Jackson, CA (well, near there) whose dj was whomever inbred reject great-grandchild of a gold-miner they hired to sit there and change tapes every few hours? I know we're too lame to figure out how to pump our own gas up here (unless you're a biker, such as myself), but c'mon! Is there no bastion of real radio left in this country?
Well, that being said. I don't miss CA :^)>
Zach (in Gresham).
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 02:47:02 -0700 From: Eckie <eckie@asu.edu> To: Ytse Jam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: The Arizona Experience Message-ID: <34279016.C64B1652@asu.edu>
Dream Fucking Theater.
I won't waist your time (too much) but I've rediscovered this band in a new way that's only happened about 2 times before. And when I heard these new songs blaring out of the SUV's speakers while we drove up to Prescott (almost) and back I experienced something magical, something as refreshing as the cool breeze and unhindered moonlight that shined through the poisonous fog of the valley's polluted air; I heard something new, refreshing, and best of all, I LOVED every fucking second of it!
Kevin Shirley deserve's many kudos (no, not candy dumbass) for his work--the production is absolutely EXCELLENT!!! I can hear everybody's lines loud and clear. If you can't pick out the basslines on this disc, you're deaf. Another thing (something similar to Awake) that I've noticed is that the album has such an integrity that each song is more of a movement than "another song slapped on the album." There's so much to adulate over this album for, and I have NO complaints. Well, 'cept "I like the old logo better." ;^)
If this album doesn't gain them their just mark in rock and roll history, nothing will. Commercially sell-out my ass, this album kicks ass in ways I've never heard ass kicking before! My rating? ******************************************************* out of *****. Best Album of the last 3 years.
~Eckie isn't gonna take this CD out of his player for a looooooong time
P.S. What a KILLER pic of Portnoy in the booklet!!!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 11:05:50 +0100 From: Steve <steve@dial.pipex.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: to uk jammers Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19970923110550.0084b600@pop.dial.pipex.com>
Hi,
Dunno if the UK release has been finalised yet.. but I ordered my copy of FII, and a copy for a friend from www.cdnow.com last week and it arrived yesterday. The price wasn't too expensive either.. worked out about =A312.50 each inc DHL worldwide delivery..
So.. if your stuck for getting hold of the new album, I recommend this way.. __ .-/--\-. .-"""-. / \ ,' `. | | / ___ \ ::| .-. .-. |:::::::Steve Wilson:::::::| ,':::`. |: ::|( o)( o)|:::steve@dial.pipex.com:::| |:::::| |: :( ` (__) ' ):::::::::::::::::::::::::| `.:::,' |: ::\ .' `. /:::::::"MMMMMMM ...":::::::\ /:: ( ---- ) "ASCII Donut!" `. ,'
See my page at =20 http://dialspace.dial.pipex.com/steve/ And check out some of my writing at these pages: http://www.purefiction.com/pages/slush/97vol6/slush25.htm http://www1.primenet.com/~noir/work.html http://www.az.com/~katrinat/essay15.txt
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 13:46:02 +0200 From: Hans Petter Olsen <hans-petter.olsen@merkantildata.no> To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Listen: JP's playing.... Message-ID: <c=NO%a=TELEMAX%p=MERKANTILDATA%l=STA-01-MSG-970923114602Z-2800@osl-01-msg.merkantildata.com>
After reading so much negative about FII, I have to speak my mind. I've been playing guitar since age 10 (now 32) and over the years I've learnd to value other things than speed when listening to other guitarists. Al di Miola once stated that he wanted to be the fastest player on earth. Dooh. OK, Tour deforce Live is a real classic.
In my book David Gilmore is a great musican. He know what it's all about. He don't play the guitar, he plays with the soul in his hands. On FII JP starts to close in on Gilmore. John's doing it all. He surely has one heck of a rythm style, wonderful solo's and if you listen closely to the guitar sounds -he really knows the equipment and how to fully use it. I think FII has alot to offer and will take time to really know. Please don't use words like "flop" when speaking of this album. Yes, it's different but thats progress, isn't it? And by the way, what a killer sound on the bass.....
Later DT lads
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 04:53:52 -0700 (MST) From: durnik <durnik@goodnet.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Falling Into Infinity: The WORST... Message-ID: <199709231153.EAA10486@goodnet.com>
..band name font logo I've ever seen used. :) What happened to our cool "dreamy" logo? At least the Majesty logo is in plain view all over the album, if not on the cover itself. It's actually on the jewel _spine_!
And that's about the only thing wrong with this album. I mean that. Anyway, time to listen to it again... I'm off the net... but first... my humble predictions for the FII tour setlist.
Now remember, for the FF96 shows they only played PMU and LTL from Images, and only Mirror and Lie from Awake. So I think it's safe to say that DT concentrates _heavily_ on rockin' out the new stuff, saving encores of old material for Holiday-like shows.
So here it is...
The Crimson Sunrise/Innocence Voices Peruvian Skies Take The Time New Millennium Burning My Soul/Hell's Kitchen/BMS Reprise (FF96 style) Just Let Me Breathe Falling Into Infinity Heavy Jam :) Hollow Years To Live Forever Trial of Tears Pull Me Under The Crimson Sunset
<encore> The Silent Man (electric) You Not Me Only A Matter of Time
After you've listened a bit to the new album, you may find that setlist very, _very_ plausible, especially if you're familiar with all the recent mini-tours. Although they played Lines in the Sand for FF96/97, they may drop it since Doug can't be there and John wont' do the background vocals justice. Doug Pinnick's emotional vocals on LitS are the peak of a fantastic song, which may go unplayed for a while, like Scarred. And Take Away My Pain may or may not show up live, since it already has, and since such an emotional song may take its toll on JP (like Afterimage did to Alex Lifeson, and they had to drop the song for Kid Gloves). I don't see Anna Lee getting played any more than Space Dye Vest has been. :)
FII is truly DT's "AFTK"...right on schedule. I won't review it in any further depth than that now, because everyone else is doing so anyway. Suffice it to say that the critics of FII must sure hate Rush, because DT is truly headed in the same direction at this point.
-Mike Bahr-durnik@_goodnet.com-http://www.goodnet.com/~durnik/
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 13:08:30 +0200 From: the great wazoo <jerry@muc.de> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Anna Lee a.o. Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19970923140830.006980b8@mail.muc.de>
Hi there,
I read comparisons of some of the new songs on the jam lately, but nobody seemed to hear the obvious :) Anna Lee sounds exactly like it were a song by Queen from the early 80s. Especially when J.Petrucci kicks in at ca. 1:40 into the song, he has that typical Brian May sound!
Whereas Hollow Years has that typical Sting sound, again I could swear I've heard that guitar before, can't remember the exact song, but I think it was on Dream of the blue turtle.
No if somebody can tell me why I keep thinking "Phil Collins" when I hear Take awy my pain?
Comments appreciated - jerry :--) --------------------------------------------------------------- Andreas Schaefer jerry@muc.de ...bei 200 Grad 15 Minuten backen, und keine Eier! - Tool ---------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 15:45:40 +0300 (EET DST) From: Sami Poimala <spoimala@itu.cc.jyu.fi> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2996 Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.970923154101.22605F-100000@itu.cc.jyu.fi>
> Subject: -NEW DREAM THEATER ALBUM SEPTEMBER 23- > The new Dream Theater album will be released Tuesday, September 23rd. > TITLE: Falling To Infinity > > Tracklisting: > Where Are You Now > Take Away My Pain > Raise the Knife > You Or Me > AnnaLee > Carnival > Cat's Tail > "Completely Untitled" > What the hell is this?!!!!! I bought my record on Friday 19th.9.1997 and it has the following tracks:
New Millennium You not me Peruvian skies Hollow years Burning my soul Hellīs kitchen Lines in the sand Anna lee Just let me breathe Take away my pain
And one track (I canīt remember the name by heart).
Sami
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 15:57:09 +0300 (EET DST) From: Antti Nyrhinen <nyrhinen@leandra.ebs.ee> To: Ytsejam Mailing List <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: My quickie on FII. Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.970923155057.24470A-100000@leandra.ebs.ee>
OK, it's Tuesday, so I guess it's completely safe to spill the beans on Falling Into Infinity. I love it!
Sure, it IS different. And there is a lot of diversity on the CD, some of it may sound like AOR or generic hard rock to some, but for me, it's DT all the way.
My favourites after a couple of listens (I actually got it on Friday, but only yesterday did I have access to a CD-player that works properly) are Hollow Years and Lines in the Sand. TAMP hasn't gotten me yet, but I think it will.
Trail of Tears was a bit disappointing, I expected something like Learning to Live or Scarred, but the instrumental part in the middle lets me down.. There's not enough band 'teamwork' in there, it's mainly just Petrucci's guitar wailing, and that's one part of DT's music that I have never learned to appreciate as much as the guy next door.
Associations: Hollow Years must be the best Sting cover since Puff Daddy's "I'll be missing you" .. *smirk* But really, it does sound a lot like Sting. The first verse with the tapping drum rhythm and stuff, you know what I'm talking about.
Anna Lee sounds like a mix between Elton John and Tori Amos :)
But, as I said, I really like Hollow Years, and Lines in the Sand is of course pure excellence, one of DT's best pieces ever. Doug Pinnick is the perfect guy for the job.
Oops, can't write more, there's a guy coming to my flat to bring a new fridge to replace the old broken one...
Looking forward to reading your 2 cents,
Antti, flyin' on FII.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Antti Nyrhinen -- nyrhinen@leandra.ebs.ee -- Tel. +358-40-5858611 - Student of Int. Bus. Admin. at the Estonian Business School - - - - Find all you need in your mind if you take the time - - -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 15:55:04 +0300 (EET DST) From: Sami Poimala <spoimala@itu.cc.jyu.fi> To: YTSEJAM <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Keyboards Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.970923155312.22605L-100000@itu.cc.jyu.fi>
Someone asked about keyboards DT used/uses. Moore used at least one Roland synth (and many others as can be seen on Live on Tokyo-video). Derek says he plays exclusivey Korg keyboards.
-Sami-
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 15:23:54 +0200 From: "Neil Gallop" <nga@software-ag.de> To: "The Ytsejam Crowd" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Some comments Message-ID: <9709231329.AA10181@server3.software-ag.de>
Hi all
first off, a big thank you to Mr. Ptacek for pointing out something that I was blissfully unaware of, i.e. that I am ignorant. I will be forever in your debt.
Secondly, I did not base my opinion of the new Dream Theater album 'Falling Into Infinity' on the fact that I was "looking for a wanky prog fest" (I forget who wrote that), but on the fact that I was expecting some songs that I liked, and in some notable cases this just didn't happen (Me Not You, Hell's Kitchen, Just Let Me Breath, Anna Lee).
Thirdly, one of the things about the Ytsejam that I have always valued is that other peoples' opinions were often respected, even if you didn't necessarily agree with them yourself. I only hope this attitude survives the next couple of weeks and that there are no witch hunts against those non-true believers who dare to say that they aren't knocked out by the new album, and that there even bits of it that they don't like.
stay safe and happy listening Neil Gallop (nga@software-ag.de) Currently playing: Dream Theater - Falling Into Infinity (there, that fucking surprised you, didn't it?)
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 2997 **************************
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Thu Apr 01 2004 - 17:59:53 EST