YTSEJAM Digest 3736
Today's Topics:
1) re: Prism Records, bad trading, playing becker's songs.
by Alan Estrada <al766074@mail.mty.itesm.mx>
2) Stratovarious, Bahr
by Markus Stahl <stahl@inreach.com>
3) Bahrtending
by "KorgX3" <korgx3@safelink.net>
4) Mike and Prism Records, Um... hello people?
by "Mark Philpot" <griphiam@ccnet.com>
5) re: Prism Records / Mike Bahr (Take Two) & DeTroit
by HseJackBlt <HseJackBlt@aol.com>
6) Tix for L.A. House of Blues
by rjurado <rjurado@eiger.com.ph>
7) Re: Bahr?
by "Robert Hogan" <hogan_r@hotmail.com>
8) Megadeth, new CDs, NDTC
by Matt Evans <bmajik@abeln621a.unl.edu>
9) I guess I'm not welcome here?
by Michael Bahr <durnik@goodnet.com>
10) Re: Bahr?
by Matt Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
11) Eldritch and converts...
by Luke Bateup <slslb@winshop.com.au>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 01:10:26 -0500
From: Alan Estrada <al766074@mail.mty.itesm.mx>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: re: Prism Records, bad trading, playing becker's songs.
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980413011026.007d4a60@academ07.mty.itesm.mx>
yes I know yhat is not a good thing to be known as a bad trader, as far as
I know everyone who was complaining before got their tapes, i have 3 more
to send to carlo, robert rivers got his videos too, now calvin is waiting
for his stuff, but as far as I remember Im not ripping anyone, but i happen
to be on the list. anyway I havent been trading since calvin's trade and I
havent even updated my list because Im not very interested in trading right
now, i've got lots of new shit and they are unlisted...I think Im going to
take some trading vacations, I was expending a lot of money there...I still
have to pay mauricio 15 bucks...
anyway on other subject...
I got 2 questions:
how many demos did majesty released? how many demos are from each album?
well, in fact they are 3:
in total how many songs are there which are not on regular albums?
nobody answered my question about who could play any jason becker
tune...can anybody play any becker tune? "air" maybe?
Im going back to school tomorrow so I wont be posting so often now...
the shredder lair's wants your copperation go to:
http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Theater/7842/
and check what does it needs.
thanks
At 11:02 PM 12/04/98 -0700, you wrote:
>
>On Sun, 12 Apr 1998, Alan Estrada wrote:
>
>> si it seems that Im not the only bad trader (=
>
> So, are you actually proud of being a bad trader? Hey, c'mon, man
>wouldn't you like to have a clean name instead of being known as "Alan
>'The Bad Trader' Estrada"??
>
> Not intended as a flame, just as a hint that it's not a good thing
>to be a bad trader (IMO, IMO, nothing else than IMO).
>
> []s, Roger...
>
>--
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito
> Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!"
> Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 23:12:36 -0700
From: Markus Stahl <stahl@inreach.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Stratovarious, Bahr
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980412231236.007c0960@mail.inreach.com>
To those of you looking for Stratovarious's live 2 disc album "Vision's of
Europe" Knight's of the Round has it for $19.99 and also the new symphony
X for 13.99, You have to look under the "New Releases" link on the main
page because they are not in the regular listing.
On the Bahr issue, I just have one question that maybe Mike himself can
answer. in you updates you are still 100 or so discs backlogged on Vitual
Songs and over 150 backlogged on SoC so how can you say you are almost
caught-up. Both of these (if I'm not mistaken) are multiple discs sets so
you should double those numbers at least. And now I read that you are
already opening up new orders. Now If I were in business and I was backed
up that much I would clear out by backlog and give myself some breathing
room before I took more orders in! Mike why do you consistently do this?
I seen you do this numerous times already and you never get yourself out of
a backlog situation.
Think about it, If I order Virtual Songs and I'm waiting over a year for
it and then you open up ordering for a new title and you ship it out right
away, how fair is that to me who has been waiting for it for so long. Plus
if you had time to make copies of this new title couldn't you have actually
made copies of Virtual Songs?
Didn't mean to ramble(and it turned out to be more than one question), but
I've been wondering about this for a long time and decided to finally write
something about it. Personally I've had no problems with Mike in getting
his CD's. I think the longest I have ever waited is 6 months. I'm just
questioning the way he does business, I think there is a better way to get
the turnaround time down!
-Mark (Patiently waiting for SoC)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:28:22 -0600
From: "KorgX3" <korgx3@safelink.net>
To: <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Bahrtending
Message-ID: <01bd66a5$5b4c3580$1b0d84d0@korgx3>
> I don't know what point you're trying to make. What I said, I
>had a reason to say. You need to grow up and realize this isn't just
>Me vs. Bahr.
This is true.
>You trivializing this scam is tantamount to you ripping
>off the people Bahr is ripping off.
Yah, so there! :) That's kinduv like saying that if you don't care that
Clinton was sleeping around with other women then you must be, too.
>"Ptacek"
Geshundheit! My golly.
>sycophant
Bless you! Holy Moley, cover your mouth when you do that!
One sneeze is lucky, two sneezes are queer... Egad, Chris, you better
sneeze again before the imposter gets here.
Three sneezes use my hanky, dear, dear, dear...
--KorgX3 the Bahrtender
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 23:28:56 -0700
From: "Mark Philpot" <griphiam@ccnet.com>
To: <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Mike and Prism Records, Um... hello people?
Message-ID: <01bd66a5$6fde0460$d01c15d1@markphil>
Um, can we say "reality check?"
Point 1: Last time I checked, Mike did not run an establisment like Magna
Carta records, or Warner Brothers. He doen't claim to either. YOU CAN'T
GET THE MATERIAL HE'S GIVING US ANYWHERE ELSE. Sure there are other
bootleggers, and if you have a stick up your ass and can't sit still and
wait, then sure, go! Mike has acknowledged his backlog and is working on
it. How many bootleggers will offer a triple CD's worth of material. Not
that many.
And I'm also not one of those ones who has got everything he's ordered
from Mike! But I like his products and I'm willing to wait however long it
takes. I'M NOT SCARED THAT I'M GOING TO RECIEVE IT!
And lets look at another point. Mike established Prism in 1994. It has
only been recently that he has hit a real serious turn around problems. He
hit some rough luck, and he got in over his head a little. He'll pick
himself out and be up again.
There are people who are willing to wait. If you wish not to patrionize
Prism, so be it. But lets not kick him while he's temporarly down, now
PS. Just incase you want to know, I had a large order of about 9 CD's that
I've ordered, I've recived 2, one is in the mail, and I've been waiting
about 8 months, but I tell you, it's been worth the wait.
Mark
griphiam@ccnet.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 03:01:43 EDT
From: HseJackBlt <HseJackBlt@aol.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: re: Prism Records / Mike Bahr (Take Two) & DeTroit
Message-ID: <66b07b5.3531b859@aol.com>
>I know I'm not the only one who's had this kind of problem, either.
No, not at all. My check for 2 Precious Things and 2 Darkest of Winters was
cashed on January 23, 1997. To date, I have only received 1 Darkest of
Winters. My check for Experience to Extremes was cashed on June 27, 1997. No
CD received yet. And the thing that burns me up is that he has the nerve to
"sneak the first few of his new Rush 'Anything Can Happen' orders out a month
early," according to his Web page. Come on, you've got a backlog of orders
from who knows when, and you sneak out a new project? Where are your
loyalties? Before the downfall, I had ordered every Prism boot but the Tori
disc, and was quite pleased with the results. But Chris Merlo hit the nail on
the head ("...memories flow, like a river...") in 'Jam 3735. What started as
a fans-for-fans project is currently an operation to avoid a day job.
>but for those who spend $40+ on something, shouldn't accept receiving things
so >late...oh well...maybe it's worth it for them...if they're serious
collectors...i guess >the wait is worth it...but i don't think anybody should
wait if they don't have to...
I doubt the $175 that's in limbo right now will justify the wait for my CD's.
I just hope I get them before the next DT studio release is out.
Does anyone know when the Detroit tickets go on sale? It's not listed on
the TicketBastard Web page yet, and I'm not going to miss out again. Awake
tour: Columbus show was the night of a biology exam that could not be made
up. FII for Cleveland: constitutional law midterm that also couldn't be made
up. Good thing that I've graduated, eh? I was planning on the Cincy show,
but the Detroit show works out better as I can crash at my alma mater after
the show.
Naga-noonch,
Jack
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:11:39 +0800
From: rjurado <rjurado@eiger.com.ph>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Tix for L.A. House of Blues
Message-ID: <3531BAAB.3E4023C4@globalcafe.com.ph>
Hey, everyone,
Anybody out there know how I can get tix for the HOB shows? Can I get
them through
Bass? Or is it TicketBastard?
-Rob
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:22:58 PDT
From: "Robert Hogan" <hogan_r@hotmail.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Bahr?
Message-ID: <19980413072258.8826.qmail@hotmail.com>
someone@prognosis.com wrote:
> I'm surprised, with all of that, that no one has noticed that
he's
> doing copies of the music from commercial releases now too.
Yes I noticed and made me wonder how low will this
guy go to make a buck.
Read it yourself:
Rush 'Grace Under Pressure Tour' Laserdisc
http://www.goodnet.com/~durnik/c199805.html
Rush 'Exit Stage Left' Laserdisc
http://www.goodnet.com/~durnik/c199804.html
Rush 'A Show Of Hands' Laserdisc
http://www.goodnet.com/~durnik/c199806.html
Though these seem not to be Prism releases Bahr
is still offering these boots through his page.
This is cleary WRONG, putting out boot
of commercially available Laserdiscs is just
wrong, no if, buts or maybe's
~Robert
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 02:48:46 -0500 (CDT)
From: Matt Evans <bmajik@abeln621a.unl.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Megadeth, new CDs, NDTC
Message-ID: <199804130748.CAA01511@goliath.unl.edu>
Well last wednesday i went to the Megadeth concert here in Lincoln, nebraska.
They played quite good as usual, except something happened that i had never seen
or heard of before. On the opening song,(holy wars), Mustaine, after finishing
his last solo and diving down to who knows where with the bar, as he came back
up the tone didn't sound quite right. so i look up from the pit and what do i
see, it looks like there's a D string who's action is about 8 inches too high.
Admirably he finished the song, trying to recalculate where to put his fingers
based on the guitar's now completely incorrect tuning. everyone loves floating
bridges :)
new cd's in the last 2 or 3 weeks. I got LTE. It rocks. Universal Mind is one
of the coolest songs I've ever heard. Also, I picked up Death:Human (if you
like to imagine drummers in pain, this is an album to get), Cacophony:Go Off
(heard it a whole bunch, but i never really owned it. figured everyone needs
both Cacophony albums :), Greg Howe's first one (hadn't really heard him much
before, now i know what iw as msising) and Howe and Kotzen's: Tilt. All in all
I did pretty good :)
BTW, if there is still anyone that hasn't bought cd's from www.cheap-cds.com,
please do so. They *are* the least expensive around, and they have downloadable
mp3 files instead of that realaudio shit.. I've bought probably 8-10 cd's from
them now. It helps if you buy them in chunks since there's no additional charge
for more than 3. (either S or H is higher, but not both)
BTW, i dont work for them, i just dont want to see em go under or anything.
they rock.
***********************************************************
* Matt Evans *
* University of Nebraska, Lincoln work: bmajik@ntr.net *
* Computer Engineering Major school: mevans@cse.unl.edu *
***********************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 01:55:55 -0700
From: Michael Bahr <durnik@goodnet.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: I guess I'm not welcome here?
Message-ID: <3531D31B.2196@goodnet.com>
ytsejam@ax.com wrote:
Chris Merlo writes:
> Ah, yes, the fabled Mike Bahr debate. I wouldn't tell anyone not to purchase
> any of Mike's productions, but I will offer a brief list of reasons why I have
> chosen not to buy any more. Do with my list what you will. (Just
Chris, let me preface this reply by saying that nearly all your
information is inaccurate, so nearly all your conclusions are invalid,
and what you've done here is nothing more than a common mud-slinging
slander.
> Unfortunately, somewhere along the way, Mike lost the vision of Prism Records.
> What had started out as a hobby, with the purpose of helping collectors,
> turned into a business. Corners were cut, production costs were lowered.
How do you figure? Production costs have gone through the roof since
the end of the silvers era.
> Silver CDs became a way of the past.
This wasn't my doing. The production plant locally closed down. Not
only that, they closed down BECAUSE OF ME. That's right, they lost their
license with 3M and had to go out of business because some moron decided
to give a copy of the then-in-production Inside The Storm disc to
someone at management, who noticed it was Tori Amos. And as a result I'm
blacklisted at nearly every CD plant in the world. If I COULD do
silvers, I WOULD. As it is, the best thing I can do is use the Verbatim
silver/silver CDRs that are supposed to be coming out this fall.
> Virtual Songs doesn't even have a spiffy
> label. Just something like "VS Disc 1" written on the CD-R with a
Chris, you're inaccurate once again. VS has Echo tour artwork painted
directly onto the disc, on all discs shipped from March onward... and
those of you who got your orders too soon to have had them painted in
advance, will soon be able to GET them painted for FREE just for the
trouble of sending your discs in a SASE. Everybody wins here, except the
few who had their discs labeled, which is something I unfortunately
cannot undo.
> I wouldn't even mind if the sound quality were better than the
> casette copy I have of the Albany show.
When I was putting together Virtual Songs, I offered a bounty of $500
to alt.music.rush, TNMS, and a.m.dt for the best boot from the Echo tour
anyone could provide. I have the tape of Albany and it does not sound as
good as the tape from Phoenix. I have tapes from Philadelphia, San
Diego, New Jersey, etc etc. If you have some miraculously better tape
from Albany, why didn't you cash in and make everyone happy in so doing?
Now your stinginess has cheated us all. That is, IF your tape is truly
better. Until I hear it, I do not believe it. If there were a soundboard
show, someone would have cashed in. If there were a truly awesome
audience DAT, someone would have cashed in. Nobody cashed in. VS is as
good as the Echo tour gets.
> Dollar signs started to float around the air. Mike thought of more ways to
> make money. He turned from fans-for-fans collections to outright bootlegging.
Ah, news flash Chris... a fans-for-fans collection is a bootleg.
> And not just music. Movies, video games. All for a buck. When he
"All for a buck". Man, you sound quite naive here, Chris, and I mean
that. What was my motivation *supposed* to be? Good intentions and
internet prestige don't pay rent. And it takes too much time and effort
making these to have a "normal" job on the side, at least when you deal
in the volume I deal in now. Also, I don't do movies. In fact I can't
remember when I ever did!! You have me stumped on this one. I don't do
video games. I offered them for the sum total of around two months, and
figured it wasn't worth the risk, and I've been out of video games since
early March. Chris, it sounds to me like the last time you looked at my
web page was in 1997 sometime when all the shit was still hitting the
fan. Right now I stand at around 5 to 6 weeks away from having every
CD... EVERY CD... caught up, and to start to stockpile for the future.
That's a 100% turnaround, pal.
> over his head with all these side projects, shipping dates got more and more
> backlogged. Mike wrote to us with heroic stories of crimefighting,
and sad
> tales of selling his bass equipment and breaking up the band. While I
I fail to see how my getting stabbed and having Scoobaca break up
affects Prism Records, because if you'll check your past Jams, you'll
notice my work was not interrupted by these events.
> Prism Records' quality, now, is far inferior to what it once was. There's a
> saying in computer science: "Garbage in, garbage out." Put more
You're 100% wrong on this one, and that's all there is to it. My
current discs are 10,000% better than my old stuff. I even took the
trouble to remaster my old stuff to bring it up to the current
standards! Stream of Consciousness is the best DT boot I've ever done,
it was my dream for years, to do a complete soundboard show! My current
crop of Rush boots is pleasing even the #p/g and #yyz IRC folks who used
to hate me for being so slow. They're so pleased with the current boots
that my sins of the past might as well have been washed away... or at
least, their weekly money orders seem to say so. As time went on, I got
better at what I did, and the boot quality reflects it. Having all the
discs painted now is just icing on the cake.
> remains to be seen is what he will do to earn our business back.
Chris, you're so picky I wouldn't even want to try. Sorry, but it's
true. Every time I've made a mis-step, you made sure I knew about your
opinion of it. For everyone else, I'm sure that as soon as my delivery
times improve, the complaints will gradually fade away. It's like you
said yourself, "Mike may have been a friend, but it didn't matter,
because he had my money and I didn't have my discs yet". Nobody is going
to give a shit about whether I do it as a hobby, a business, a religious
ritual, or whatever, as long as I've got delivery time under control and
I continue to make good stuff. Therefore, that's ALL I ever concentrate
on anymore.
Matt Johnston writes:
> My opinion is this: Mike made major mistakes in 1997. MAJOR mistakes.
> He moved faster than he thought he could, ran before he could crawl,
> Now, he's paying for it. He knows this. I know this. You know this. We> all know this. Enough of this.
This is about the most accurate thing written in that entire Jam!!!
Just so everyone knows, by all rights Prism should have gone under in
mid'1997. Everything had gone wrong both in production and in my own
life. I was without even a CD burner, and on top of that without a
vehicle, and the money that remained from paid orders was enough to
fulfill them... IF everything was working, which it wasn't. I could have
done two things at that point: 1. Shut it all down and just filed
bankruptcy, and everyone gets screwed, or 2. Find a way to continue. I
chose 2. I kept Prism alive by force of will alone. I gambled a bit on
new releases and hoped they would help pay for the rebuilding of my
manufacturing facilities, and it worked... but the damage had been done,
and the delay had already taken effect, so it's been a long hard game of
"Catch-up" ever since. I ask all of you, should I have just closed up
shop? Would that have been the better option? I know anyone who had an
order in at the time is glad I did what I did.
That isn't a sob story. I'm not fishing for sympathy. I don't want it
and it won't affect me anyway. It's just a clear-cut explanation of what
happened. I was fucked; and to this day I'm still un-fucking things in
an attempt to bring back the Silver Age of 1995-96.
> Now, how many complaints have you heard about SoC? Any of the new 'Ryche> or Rush releases? Anything in 1998?
To date I've had exactly one complaint about SoC, from Joe Cristina,
and I'm gonna replace his discs for free to solve the problem, which is
a technical one and not a qualitative one.
> And that's you. I've never waited less than 4 weeks for a Bahr boot, but> I haven't been disappointed. I guess I just have a higher tolerance for> pain (grin!)
Well, Adam was right because I really, I mean ROYALLY fucked up his
order. And I'm not very proud of that. And I *AM* going to make it up to
him. I don't know how yet, but it WILL happen.
David Kobayashi writes:
> all this talk of mike bahr's knack of not delivering goods in a timely manner
> has me sweating here....
>
> i finally got my precious things cd after 18 months....
> law of averages?
Yours was the last one... typical of my luck that you'd chime in here.
:) - (they're all shipped at this point, even most newer PT replica
orders).
Later that same Jam...
> Chris Ptacek
> someone@prognosis.com
And you call ME a backstabber, you untrustworthy fellow! I thought we
had an agreement... I don't post about Prism on the Jam, and you won't
either. I didn't (well, until today). You did anyway. Thanks a fuckin
lot. Last time I bother trusting YOU with anything.
Ah well. What say ye all? If you tell me to pack up my bags and go
away, I'll do it. It's your call. If I'm not welcome here anymore, I
will leave. Enough of this. It would be the height of irony that I leave
NOW, just as things are beginning to go right for a change, but I will
accept the plurality decision on the matter.
-- - Mike Bahr - Prism Records - d u r n i k @ g o o d n e t . c o m - http://www.goodnet.com/~durnik/------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 02:23:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Matt Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Bahr? Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980413022232.18209C-100000@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
On Sun, 12 Apr 1998 someone@prognosis.com wrote:
>in. I'd love to investigate this further, to really see if you have >any reason for posting other than to see your own name on the jam, >but I'll let your post speak for itself.
(grin) nah, I just want to make sure Alane doesn't get most frequent poster. Now *that*'s the real war around here!
And certainly the more exciting one for me -- I have a stake in this one! ^_^
> >- The Kinder, Gentler Mads > >
--Matt
--------------------------------------------------------------------- They Might Be Giants: REM with a sense of humor. ---------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 20:20:20 +1000 From: Luke Bateup <slslb@winshop.com.au> To: ytsejam <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Eldritch and converts... Message-ID: <3531E6E4.693E@winshop.com.au>
-- Jeff :^) wrote:
> I thought I'd share with you the monster take I hauled in at today's > record show in Wayne, New Jersey. This was without a doubt a day spent > in prog-metal heaven, thanks to the fine folks at Sentinel Steel and > JART Music.
BAH!, lucky bastard! :-)
> Anyone out there familiar with Eldritch
Yeah, I got Seeds Of Rage - an album I was quite impressed with actually since I wasn't expecting much from it. The guitarist, Eugene Simone, is a monster, IMHO he's right up there with the best of 'em. Not to overshadow the rest of the band, they're all incredibly adept as well.
I think these guys just need to tighten up their songs a bit and they'd be awesome. Also, their lead singer occasionally sounds a bit thin and biting, but that's a minor setback.
IMO, they do compare a bit to Superior in terms of heaviness, but I reckon they've got a more neoclassical style. Ultimately, their resulting sound is derivative, but unique to them, never sounding 'clone-ish'.
For those who haven't heard Eldritch - Mosh has an MP3 of 'Colours' which is an awesome song, it's what made me get the album.
I don't have 'Headquake', can anyone fill me in as to what it's like?
> Keep converting out there, fellow 'jammers. It's *not* very hard, in > most cases. At least from my experience . . .
Aye, there's only two of out eight people who I haven't managed to convert yet, and one of those two *is* a fan, he just doesn't know it at the moment.
The other one was almost there, but has suddenly started claiming that DT are SHIT. She won't just leave it at, "I don't really like their music...", she has to insist that they are crap - and she listens to Aqua, En Vogue, Real McCoy and various other R&B/dance stuff.
What a f**ken joke! That's like someone with a huge penis hanging of their forehead like a 'beef-pimple from hell', insulting someone else by calling them a dickhead.
Some people just won't budge - of course, not everyone wants a creative, intelligent outlet in music and are just content with being herded around with the rest of the sheep. Oh well, their loss...
Luke. [only just beginning Operation: Conversion]
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 3736 **************************
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