YTSEJAM Digest 3795
Today's Topics:
1) Irving Plaza
by "Alex O'Connell" <auocon@maila.wm.edu>
2) Re: earplugs
by AEllis1222 <AEllis1222@aol.com>
3) DT will come to MN
by Trevor Morris <morr0209@tc.umn.edu>
4) Re: $15 disc
by NuGgeTMaN <emoeglin@infinite.wezl.org>
5) The Fat Lady is Singing the Bahr Wars Theme (NDTC)
by Kevin Madden <kwmadden@pipeline.com>
6) King Crimson, new albums, self-pitying whine
by Jay Omega <jw@winternet.com>
7) Bootcamp
by Haje Jan Kamps <hajejan@mail.geocities.com>
8) Re: $15 disc
by Haje Jan Kamps <hajejan@mail.geocities.com>
9) two right here together!
by "jason braswell" <funkbreath@hotmail.com>
10) Typo in the previous review
by Jay Omega <jw@winternet.com>
11) Re: boots
by The iban <Theiban@aol.com>
12) Anyone Else Have This?
by KEZCOM <KEZCOM@aol.com>
13) Beyotch!
by Christopher Ptacek <someone@prognosis.com>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:06:09 -0400
From: "Alex O'Connell" <auocon@maila.wm.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Irving Plaza
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980425220608.0071dce8@maila.wm.edu>
>>I'm going to be attending the DT show at Irving Plaza, and I'm probably
going to need to take a bus back to Boston. How close is Irving Plaza to
Port Authority,>>
I would love to know this as well!!
If all works...and I actually get up the east coast...then I should have a
ride, but planning for all contingencies is always good...
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:09:49 EDT
From: AEllis1222 <AEllis1222@aol.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: earplugs
Message-ID: <2ff51927.3542976f@aol.com>
I always wear earplugs to a show, and it never sounds like I'm listening thru
a pillow, I get them at the local police suppluy store, 50 pairs for $8. You
could probably find the same ones at a gun shop. No need to spend a ton on
plugs, unless you're a sound engineer!
~~~~Art
In a message dated 98-04-25 19:23:10 EDT, you write:
<< Hey guys, this summer I'll be in Europe going to two DT concerts very
close together. Now, I hate to be a big pussy, but that's pretty rough
on the ears. I've heard several people say something about high quality
earplugs that, supposedly, protect those great auditory hairs that we
all love while not making the music sound as if the band is playing
inside a giant pillow. Do such devices exist? If so, where do I get
them.
jason >>
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 21:47:48 -0500
From: Trevor Morris <morr0209@tc.umn.edu>
To: jpmohr@primenet.com, hayd0029@maroon.tc.umn.edu, ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: DT will come to MN
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980425214748.007e3330@morr0209.email.umn.edu>
with Deep Purple and ELP
August 23, Grand Casino Amphitheater
from www.deep-purple.com
Trevor
ICQ: 5664775
http://members.xoom.com/towdog/
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:05:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: NuGgeTMaN <emoeglin@infinite.wezl.org>
To: graham boyle <icarus@sydney.net>
Subject: Re: $15 disc
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.980425230027.6752F-100000@infinite.wezl.org>
O.k. so it's obvious that because I want to help people I'm a complete
asshole and loser. I'm personally apologzing to Graham...I NEVER meant
this as a personal attack on him personally, and I guess one thing that
really sucks about E-mail is people can't understand where yer coming
from, and how you actually meant what was said. To all the Ytsejammers who
can't stand me right now...go trade your asses off, sell the shit
whatever, I could give a crap! All I'm stating is I have a problem with
people who try to make a financial gain off the exellent music DT makes.
As for the "Ytsepawnbroker" thing, I'm totally out of line with that
statement, and Apologize to all the traders on the Jam...I was WAY outta
line with that statement, and had a brainfart during a serious deprival of
sleep. Keep Jammin'!!!
^ According to the circle of fifths, and the order of sharps and flats: ^
^ If the alphabet continued as notes progressed (Using Major Key Sigs) ^
^ (i.e. A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, etc.) eventually the key of Z Major ^
^ would have 4 sharps. ^
^ Eric Moegling: Manager for "Lifting Shadows Off A Ring" ^
^ and "Progressive Genius" ^
^ The Dream theater and Progressive Metal WebRings ^
^ HOMEPAGE - http://www.wezl.org/NuGgeTMaN or http://www.wezl.org/lift ^
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:23:52 -0400
From: Kevin Madden <kwmadden@pipeline.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: The Fat Lady is Singing the Bahr Wars Theme (NDTC)
Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19980426032352.006faa30@pop.pipeline.com>
Re: Bahr Wars, A New Beginning. Stop. Please. We give in.
No more anti-Bahr, anti-bootlegger, pro-Bahr, pro-bootleg,
pro-shot, probate, procreate, whatever. Nobody cares anymore.
Re: Atomic Opera. They have a new cd out call Penguin Dust or
something like that. Independantly distributed. I think
it's available through the internet somehow. I don't have it,
but it's out there...
CD/s of the Day: Joe Satriani - Crystal Pepsi
Symphony X - The Divine Wings of Tragedy
Kevin Madden <kwmadden@pipeline.com>
Detroit Red Wings 1996-97 Stanley Cup Champions
First Round of the Playoffs vs. Phoenix Coyotes
Game One: Detroit - 6 Phoenix - 3
Game Two: Phoenix - 7 Detroit - 4
Game Three: Detroit at Phoenix, Sunday 3pm, FOX
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:35:44 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jay Omega <jw@winternet.com>
To: Just Words <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: King Crimson, new albums, self-pitying whine
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980425200254.818A-100000@parka.winternet.com>
On Sat, 25 Apr 1998, Shane Liebling wrote:
> Hey to the guy who is looking into King Crimson. I would say go pick up
> Sleepless: The Concise King Crimson. I am not a huge Crimson fan but from
> what I hear it has some of the best stuff from the 3 (or however many)
> "eras" of Crimson.
It has stuff from the first 3 "eras." The current lineup, the double
trio, is not (yet) represented on any compilation album.
One warning: be sure to get the "Concise" King Crimson. There's also
a "Complete" KC which is heavily slanted towards one of the three
early eras. (I forget which one; I don't own the album.)
------
Now that I've had time to listen to them, I'll write something about
my six recent CD purchases. Fair warning: I'm stingy with my stars. I
only own one five-star album amongst 300-400 CDs. (Lots of 4-*'s and
several 4.5-*'s though.)
Glass Hammer - Perelandra (***)
The second GH CD I've bought; I also have "Journey of the Dunadan."
Both albums are music-plus-non-musical-interlude type concept albums.
The first was based on Tolkein's works; this one doesn't mention any
source in the liner notes, but I thought it was based on something by
C.S. Lewis. Anyway...
This album is an improvement over the previous one. It's more
focused and musical; the non-music tracks don't break things up as
much as they do on "Journey." I usually preprogram my CD player to
skip about half of Journey, while I can listen through this one.
Sound-wise, they've improved as well; bringing in a few more
instrumentalists (Journey has only two main musicians) and creating
less-meandering compositions. Sound-wise, they're about 1/3 Floyd,
1/3 Fates Warning - APSOG, and 1/3 Arena. Mostly electronic/keyboardy
sounds, and lots of harmonic-type vocals.
Magellan - Test of Wills (****)
Again, this is my second album by a band. I've had "Impending
Ascension" for a couple years.
If you know I.A., this one will sound familiar. They're still
a 3-piece band, but they lost one guitarist and gained a real drummer,
who gets to show off some chops with a minute-long solo at the start
of track 2, "A Social Marginal." And he (Brad Kaiser) _has_ chops.
He needs them; Magellan's use of weird times makes "Erotomania" look
like a Garth Brooks song. ;)
They're a little more polished-sounding on this album, but that's
probably just production. Test of Wills hasn't lost any of the
progressive wankiness that I.A. had. And that's a good thing,
because Magellan wanks with the best of 'em. Just try to tap a
foot along with this stuff; you'll look like an epileptic in a stobe
light factory. :)
Their sound is truly unique; crunchy guitars, wailing keyboards,
two-part harmony vocals, and a trombone. Not quite a "prog metal"
sound... Imagine Echolyn or Gentle Giant playing prog metal. That's
Magellan's sound.
Iced Earth - Days of Purgatory (***1/2)
"Greatest Hits" they way they should be; re-mixed, re-performed,
and re-done. Worth buying even if you have all the original albums.
Doubly so in this case, since 1/3 of the tracks are from their early
demo work under the name "Purgatory." (Thus the title.)
I have three other Iced Earth albums, so I'd heard some of what's
here before. Six of the fifteen tracks are from "Night of the
Stormrider," four are from "Iced Earth," and the other five are re-
performed demos from their early days. There's also a blurb in the
liner notes about a "reworked Dante's Inferno" from Burnt Offerings;
but nothing from Offerings is on this disc. Is there a second disc
to this that's sold separately? (DI is too long to fit on this one.)
Iced Earth is a thrash-metal outfit with slight prog leanings.
They also have some slight devil-music leanings, so the fundies may
want to avoid Iced Earth's stuff. (Not that the fundies would buy an
album with a half-naked vampire/demon chick on the cover, anyway. :)
Iced Earth is not death metal, though... the vocals are listenable.
The guitars are fast and crunchy, and the drummer has a decent double-bass
sound. Good driving music if you're the speedy type.
Savatage - The Wake of Magellan (***)
on this one. It's good, but not that good. They tried to hard to make
a concept album. If this had been their only concept album, I'd love it.
However, it just isn't as powerful and moving as "Dead Winter Dead", and
it's on a par with "Streets". (I even like "Xmas Eve and Other Stories"
more, which is just Savatage plus some session musicians, in my mind.)
Don't get me wrong, it's still a good disc. I like the music to tracks
1-5 and 9-13. Adding lyrics, "The Wake of Magellan" and "The Hourglass"
are two of 'Tage's best songs. Tracks 6-8, though, are 12 minutes of
filler, music and lyrics both. Concept albums don't need that.
Among the 'Tage albums I own (Hall of the Mountain King, Streets,
Edge of Thorns, Handful of Rain, DWD, and XmasEAOS) I'd put this one
just over HotMK, and tied with Streets.
Pallas - The Sentinel (***1/2)
This is my only Pallas album. I found it in a local used-CD shop, and
remembered seeing the name on one of the newsgroups a couple years ago.
They're a neo-prog outfit; very much in the vein of Arena, or Marillion's
earlier stuff. The very brief liner notes claim that the concept behind
the album has been in the works since '79, but the album was made in '92.
The story is a fantasy/sci-fi allegory to the Cold War of the past
decades, but someone pressed "the button"...
Quick aside: If anyone here knows Pallas... was "Arrive Alive" ever
given any airplay? For a band I'd "never heard before" it sounds too damn
familiar...
Soundwise, Pallas is a blend of many things. The instrumental work
reminds me of Marillion (Grendel, especially), but the vocals are kinda
Duran Duran-ish (several places have that "Hungry like the Wolf" echo
effect; very 80's sounding).
Cairo - Conflict and Dreams (***)
Again, another effort by a Magna Carta band. Again, I've got the
previous album--self-titled, in this case. Again, their sound hasn't
changed to any appreciable degree.
Cairo are the ELP of the 90's. Cheesy synths at the front of the band,
guitar and bass behind. (OK, ELP only had a bass. Sue me. :)
Like the new Magellan album, the main improvement here is a slightly
more polished sound; the style and presentation haven't changed a bit
from the previous album. Cairo might sound a little tighter and less
repetetive overall on this album, but that's offset by the longer songs
(1, 8, 10, 12, 15, and 17 minutes long, respectively.)
If you really like Cairo, both albums are worthwhile. If synth-prog
isn't truly your thing, just get this one and ignore their first release.
There's a little more variety here... i.e. more wanky guitar and less
wanky keyboards. :)
------
Having a cold sucks. Being stuck at home on Saturday night because of
a cold sucks worse. At least the weather is getting cold & cloudy, so
I won't be bummed out about being stuck indoors tomorrow...
--Jay "but two days off from work was nice..." Omega
--NP: Victor - Victor
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 00:08:13 -0400
From: Haje Jan Kamps <hajejan@mail.geocities.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Bootcamp
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980425235544.006c90b4@mail.geocities.com>
> New recruits will have to hold their hand up and repeat 'PMU ends abruptly
> because it's supposed to, and the quote is from Hamlet.'
Hmmmz. Well.. I guess there is a reason for people asking.. I recall to
have read the WHOLE FAQ.. But I also admit that I didn't look for it
specifically.
>Any recruits that still seem somewhat dense will have the FAQ stapled to
>their foreheads.
Now that is a great idea..
Get me a printout and a stapler... Heck.. Sure seems like I need it!
Haje Jan
+----------------+
/ Haje Jan Kamps /
+-------------------+----------------+
/ http://home.sol.no/~lrovers/haje/ /
+------------------------------------+
I'm through just getting by
Countless times a friend has told me
Watch out for the wave
Now it seems the sea will be my grave
And still you swim to save me
Even though the water is much colder now
Dream Theater: Don`t look past me
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 00:08:23 -0400
From: Haje Jan Kamps <hajejan@mail.geocities.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: $15 disc
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980426000723.006dd008@mail.geocities.com>
>FUCK OFF BAHR! Out of all the people here you are the LAST person to be
>preaching the morals of bootlegging to ANYONE! You're just a snivelling
>selfish little prick who is trying to horde all the business for yourself
>and trying to get other jammers busted for what you've been doing for three
>years now. I'm warning you right here on this list. If ANY person on this
>list gets busted for selling boots I will email every federal law
enforcement >agency in the USA and the state of Arizona as to your business
practices
>(which I'm sure you pay NO state or fed taxeds on). Even if they ignore
>the illegal practices of your cd selling I'm sure they'd be PLENTY
>interested in your practices of Income Tax evasion.
>DON'T FUCK WITH JAMMERS MIKE!!!!!! I FUCKING MEAN IT!
Okay.. I do realize that I am not american and that my english is far from
perfect, and I have to admit that that whole spelling / grammar discussion
is 101% buss, but I do need to have somebody translate the thing above for me
1 - What is he trying to say
2 - Why does he sound so damn mad
I have read it about six hundred and fourty-two times, but I don't
understand it. If any of you do, please rewrite & post it again.
In the future how about an Ytsejam digest with translations? No I don't
give a flip about the cursing.. And no I don't care that 25% of the
messages have nothing to do with DT.. But COME ON PEOPLES....
phew.. Another load off my shoulders.
A wasted two cents tho...
Haje Jan k.
+----------------+
/ Haje Jan Kamps /
+-------------------+----------------+
/ http://home.sol.no/~lrovers/haje/ /
+------------------------------------+
I'm through just getting by
Countless times a friend has told me
Watch out for the wave
Now it seems the sea will be my grave
And still you swim to save me
Even though the water is much colder now
Dream Theater: Don`t look past me
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 21:21:38 PDT
From: "jason braswell" <funkbreath@hotmail.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: two right here together!
Message-ID: <19980426042138.12631.qmail@hotmail.com>
Hey Scott, go fuck yourself, you piece of shit. If you don't want
Mike Bahr's CD's, then don't fucking buy them, asshole. What he said is
right on; if the band requests that you don't circulate something, then
don't do it; that is a violation of the band's rights. If they don't
care, though, THAT'S THEIR FUCKING BUSINESS. For whom do you think the
copyright exists? You can reprint, copy, sell, show, whatever anything
anyone has ever made, written, recorded, whatever, as long as you have
their permission, you moron. I know; that's the second flame in the
past few days when I have never flamed before, but dammit, I like buying
Mike Bahr's shit, and I don't care if he buys a third world country with
the money he makes off me or anyone on the jam.
jason
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:38:30 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jay Omega <jw@winternet.com>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Typo in the previous review
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980425233332.1971B-100000@parka.winternet.com>
Oops. I guess starting a line with " From" is as bad as starting
one with "From". My bad... The Savatage bit should have started:
Savatage - The Wake of Magellan (***)
]From what I've seen on the jam so far, I'll be the dissenting opinion
on this one. It's good, but not that good. They tried too hard to make
a concept album. If this had been their only concept album, I'd love it.
[...]
--Jay "Whitespaceisfutileandwillbesummarilyignored." Omega
--NP: Pallas - The Sentinel
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:53:41 EDT
From: The iban <Theiban@aol.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: boots
Message-ID: <bf39150.3542a1b6@aol.com>
In a message dated 98-04-25 22:50:16 EDT, you write:
<< Except Mike Bahr, who thanks to the jam owns a (at the time of purchase)
BRAND NEW pickup! I have sold a few boots in my day, but not enough to even
put a down payment on a box of condoms let alone buy an automobile. YOu buy
from
Mike Bahr you deserve what you get.
YES, I used to buy from him, now I just borrow the cd's from people and
transfer them
on to MiniDisc. I hope that isn't illegal and Bahr doesn't sue me for
copyright
infringement };-> >>
ahh, well, that doesn't solve my prolem .. =\
Rocky
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 02:21:37 EDT
From: KEZCOM <KEZCOM@aol.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Anyone Else Have This?
Message-ID: <412d63ee.3542d273@aol.com>
Aloha 'Jammers,
Does anyone here have a Steve Howe CD called "Not Necessarily Acoustic"?
Just picked it up at the local used CD store for $7.99(Thank you P&L Compact
Discs), and I really like it. No shred or wanking in particular, but some
well played, passionate, acoustic guitar music. Plus, it's worth the price to
hear Mr. Howe sing Roundabout!!
Never really thought that much of Mr. Howe before(I'm a mild YES fan), but I
saw him appear with ASIA at the Bayou in D.C. a few years ago, and was very
impressed with his playing(DUH!?).
Comments and opinions welcome.
Kez
P.S. Daytona's, here we come! Bafu, wear your Nascar hat!
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:47:00 -0500
From: Christopher Ptacek <someone@prognosis.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Beyotch!
Message-ID: <199804260642.BAA13345@wheat.farm.niu.edu>
>From: graham boyle <icarus@sydney.net>
>> What happened to trading for blanks and postage? Why would you go so far
>> as to actually sell a cdr of these tracks? =20
>
>Please tell me where I actually ask the guy for $15 ??
>Read the fucking thing properly before you start accusing me=20
>anything sinister :)
>He offered me the money didn't he ?
>I haven't agreed to this, nor have I contacted this guy again !
No, no, no... that's not what I meant. I just thought it was odd that
you'd take $15 for the cdr instead of trading for blanks or the cost of
blanks. I'm not accusing you of anything sinister. I know you better than
that, bro.
>It skrikes me odd that you think I am 'selling these tunes' I am
>certainly not selling DT songs for my own profit.
Let's look at a hypothetical situation: You make a CDR of these songs.
The cost for you is the cost of the CDR (because I believe you're the kind
of guy who would make someone a cd as a favor, and enjoy doing it... the
time wouldn't be an issue for you.) You then sell the cd for 10 times the
cost of the CDR. Who does that profit go to? In this hypothetical, you
are selling DT songs for your own profit. This is very much what it looked
like you were doing in reality. If that's inaccurate, then you have my
most sincere apology.
My point is this: I personally think it's cooler to make costs involved
in a trade deal minimal. I think it's best when these things are traded
out of friendship, rather than profit margins. I think you agree with me.
I'm not saying "don't sell," but I am pointing out that not everything has
to come to dollars and cents. I think you got unintentionally nailed here
because you accepted the hypothetical offer for $15 for the CDR, when I
believe that you'd gladly make that CDR for 2 blank cds. I know it would
be the other dude screwing himself over for making that offer, but don't
you feel the slightest moral obligation to inform the person that you don't
really ask $15 for the cd, but instead require much less? =20
>From: "Matt Halloran" <imemnok@hurricane.gnt.net>
>What is the deal with saying that providing boots for personal gain is a
>bad thing. In each case, both parties are gaining, no one is forcing
>anyone to pay $15 for a boot disc.=20
Just so that there's no mixup, I want to state that I have no problem
with people on both or one end of a trade benefitting... I personally have
a problem (but do not enforce my own morality on others) with people making
a significant profit off of boots and ANY real profit off of bootlegged
commercial material. That comes from being a musician, I guess. It's
theft, no different from taking credit for the work, and taking money from
the musician. This is simply my perspective on the issue. Don't bother
telling me "I'm wrong" unless you really want that argument, and really
have some evidence to support such a contention.
> Sure maybe it is not that expensive to
>make these discs, but do you have a problem spending $15-$20 for a studio
>recording released from a record label? It amounts to the same thing,
>these people who are providing boots are taking time out of their life to
>provide quality recordings to others who may not be fortunate enough to get
>them for themselves. =20
You miss my point, if this is addressing me. My distaste for such
transactions is on a level at which it is NOT the same thing. One is theft
and one is hard work. It doesn't MATTER how much effort goes into the
bootleg making... it's morally wrong, IMO, to make boots for profit.
Because it is wrong, IMO, no amount of labor can make it right. Even if
you make it look and sound prettier than the original.
All I'm doing is fostering the idea of making trades easier and more
available to people without pre-existing collections of rarities, and
without tons of money.
>From: Calvin 6S <Calvin6S@aol.com>
>This is a little annoying. First off, I would have no problem if someone
>charged me shipping, "production" costs (blank CD-R), and added a little
>extra. <*snip*>
>That is why I have no problem with somebody adding a little extra. And the
>fact of the matter is, Graham never even asked for money or a profit.
And I don't have a problem with tacking on a minimal fee either, because
sometimes you screw up a cd, or whatever. I was just commenting because of
the $15 thing. Even if it's worth that to the dude who wants to buy it, I
know GaZ would make that cd for much less. The issue is that I think GaZ
was just making a point, and not really accepting the offer. I originally
thought he was taking that offer, in which case, I thought it might merit
speaking up about this. I really don't think I have an argument with GaZ,
but since this has become a thread, I might as well explain myself, you=
know?
>Then when it is realized that Graham didn't ask for money, but rather asked
>for a trade - he is still attacked as shooting for something to gain. =20
He was not attacked by me. My post was a couple questions and then a
philosophy on trading boots in general. Please note that, when adding me
to the fray. :)
>From: Edward Polzin <polzin@uiuc.edu>
>Well, my questions is, what's cheaper and more convenient, writing a
>check for $15 and mailing it? or going out, trying to find cdrs, buying
>a 5 pack for $10-$15 for one, buying a package or box to send them in,
>going to the post office before 5 PM and mailing it off? Personally,
>I'd rather write the check and have it done with.
Trading for blanks often presupposes that you send the cost of the blank
media so that the person on the other end can choose which tapes or cds he
or she prefers. But to your point, if you would rather overpay then that's
your business... I still think the seller has some moral obligation to
inform the buyer of the overcompensation... but that's me and my own
philosophy. Again, I'm not forcing that on anyone; the practice of
trading for blanks has been around since before I have been in the trading
scene... it's taken a seeming nose dive here on the Jam, and I merely
wanted to try to revive it.
>From: "jason braswell" <funkbreath@hotmail.com>
>Subject: the dumbass that hates profit
Ah, the Ytsejam; where people who don't know how to argue peacefully
decide to become beligerant and show us all how truly cool they are! Gotta
love it.
> This is to that total moron who thinks it is so "immoral" for=20
>someone to get personal gain from selling their CD's. Why don't you=20
>carry your bullshit to its logical conclusion. Do you work? Why don't=20
>you give back your paycheck to your boss since it's your "service" or=20
>whatever the hell you called it. Come on, man! Don't be selfish! =20
Wow... this argument is so completely non sequitur, I wouldn't even know
where to begin. You've either totally missed the point, or you think in
Klingon. How's this as a rebuttal: I work, but I eat meat, and I drive a
car, and thus you aren't a Dream Theater fan, and therefore Blind Melon is
the best band in the world!
Do you actually mean what you're saying here, or is this yet another joke
that I accidentally took seriously?
No one is demanding or even recommending that people give anything away.
What a couple of us are saying, is that there are issues to be dealt with
when people inflate prices like that, and ignore other, arguably more
reasonable methods of trading. If, after the arguments are presented,
people would still prefer to overpay for merchandise, then that's fine.
But seeing as the Ytsejammers tend to like to look out for each other, we
had every reason and right to step in and comment here. This list is not a
business forum... it's a community of fans. If you have a problem with me
wanting to help people add to their collection as cheaply and honestly as
possible, then you're just going to have to sit there in tears, firing off
your pitiful little insults, because I'm not going to stop what I'm doing.
Why don't you give yourself a few minutes to cool off before firing off
responses to the jam? No one will take your arguments seriously if you
can't make them without the insults.
=09
Christopher W. Ptacek
http://www.prognosis.com/madsman
IRC: Madsman
=93I wonder if Harley-Davidson makes a unicycle=85=94
- Michael Hedges
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 3795
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