YTSEJAM Digest 4209
Today's Topics:
1) Camden DT/ELP/DP Show --- WTF?
by Bruce Duesterhoeft <bduesterhoeft@enter.net>
2) S-X: Good news, Bad News
by T_Karrde@prodigy.com (MR STEVE J VOGEL)
3) Re: Click Tracks
by "Michael Velders" <dtdrummin@hotmail.com>
4) Re: Oh my god, they've muted Damon! You bastards!!!!!!; Merry
by Phil Carter <carter@negia.net>
5) Van Halen and Drummer Posture
by Inflammabl@aol.com
6) Fire Donations?
by Mike Pontrelli <ponte@essc.psu.edu>
7) Who's Mike Bahr?
by Michael Bahr <durnik@goodnet.com>
8) Dream Theater in Southamerica CONFIRMED
by Oscar Garcia Verastegui <trashboy@amauta.rcp.net.pe>
9) Re: Eddie VH & Derek - take 3!!!!
by "Michael Velders" <dtdrummin@hotmail.com>
10) Re: Click Tracks.
by "Michael Velders" <dtdrummin@hotmail.com>
11) Re: Dream Theater in Southamerica CONFIRMED
by Carlos Alfaro <calfaro@caribe.net>
12) Extinguishing the flames: FII etc
by Oysterman <nv99701@egymn.tranemo.se>
13) Who's Eddie Van Bahr?
by "KorgX3" <korgx3@safelink.net>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 22:50:27 -0400
From: Bruce Duesterhoeft <bduesterhoeft@enter.net>
To: YtseGods <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Camden DT/ELP/DP Show --- WTF?
Message-ID: <35DCE073.8965CAEE@enter.net>
Does anyone know????
I heard on a local radio station (93.3 - for those keeping score) that
the show was cancelled period! No return - go get your refunds.
Yet I called TicketBasterd to have my $200 put back on my CC MC and they
said that it's not 'officially' cancelled.
WTF!!!!!!
Does anyone know the truth?
The truth is out there!
Bruce Duesterhoeft
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 23:02:39, -0500
From: T_Karrde@prodigy.com (MR STEVE J VOGEL)
To: balkiewi@umdnj.edu, Gundam@frontier.wilpaterson.edu, someone@enteract.com,
Subject: S-X: Good news, Bad News
Message-ID: <199808210302.XAA19898@mime4.prodigy.com>
First the bad news:
For those of you who may have planned you trip to Baltimore in hopes
of seeing Symphony X, run to your phone & try to get your money back,
cuz it ain't gonna happen. I don't know specifcs (nor do I WANT to
know them), but they're out.
Now the good news:
They WILL be performing in NYC on Aug 29 (yes, this August!). At a
place called "Downtime" (or something like that) on 30th st (again, I
think). Anyone know of this place?? Got a phone number for those
intrested.... 212-695-2747.
This IS as written in stone as it gets (unless a freak football
accident happens this weekend when I clobber Russ going across the
middle.. LOL!!)
Finally, S-X stateside!!! Its about freaking time!!!
Spread the word people. A good showing might get them in your neck of
the woods someday.
____
Carpe Diem
Steve
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 20:15:18 PDT
From: "Michael Velders" <dtdrummin@hotmail.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Click Tracks
Message-ID: <19980821031518.16730.qmail@hotmail.com>
Dave, yeah, Mike does use Click Tracks. He said that whenever possible
he tries to use them when recording. He said it's pretty much
impossible with songs like Metropolis because of the odd times and
polyrhythms in the middle, which, now that I think about it, kinda blows
that theory out the window. I never put the two things together until I
just said it. So you just helped me rule one thing out. Now I just
have two more. I really think it's an overdub. Do you know the part
I'm talking about? He also mentioned Tama Rhythm Watch. I was thinking
of giving one of those things (an electronic metronome) a try first. I
wish Mike would answer this one. Just to know. In any case I really
love that part and the whole song. It's definitely my favorite song to
play!
>
>
>Hi,
>
> Mike "The Drummer" asked about "click tracks". A click track is
>like a metronome for drummers. It will click in their cans during
>recording and help them keep time. I can't stand the things and never
>used them when ever my band did any recording. Does anyone know if MP
>uses click tracks?
>
> Dave (a UK jammer - now in Alabama).
>
Nice talkin to ya!
The Hugest Music Fan,
Mike "The Drummer"
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 00:02:31 -0400
From: Phil Carter <carter@negia.net>
To: A Pleasant Shade of Ytse <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Oh my god, they've muted Damon! You bastards!!!!!!; Merry
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980821000231.00699764@pop.negia.net>
Greetings ye 'jamanoids....
Damon inquired:
>What does
>aol have against me, anyway. Well, I do think they are a low-rate isp that
>sucks its users into the abyss and breeds spam and rips everybody off.
Just as an interesting sidenote, was anybody else getting nervous twitches
when we were discussing the Explorers Club release because they, like me,
were seeing "AoI" as "AOL" with a small o and a small l? Maybe it's just
the font I use, but man that disturbed me.
Dushko wants to know:
>BTW, somebody heard those new Vai projects - "Angelica" and "Merry
>Axemas"? I'm really interested to hear some reviews!
Er, "Merry Axemas" isn't new, exactly; it was released in October or so
last year. But it kicks ass. Top talent including Steve Vai, Joe Satriani,
Joe Perry, Brian Setzer, Eric Johnson, Alex Lifeson, Richie Sambora....the
list goes on. I don't think there's really a song on the disc that's out of
place or isn't well interpreted (although some have complained that Joe
Satriani's "Silent Night / Holy Night Jam" should have left out the "Holy
Night Jam" part and just stuck with the "Silent Night", I disagree).
It's definitely worth grabbing if, like me, you like new interpretations of
traditional Christmas songs. :)
Ta,
Phil
=========================================================
Phil Carter -- carter@negia.net http://www.negia.net/~carter
"Music brings peace to the restless, and comforts the sorrowful. They who
no longer know where to turn find new ways. And those who have despaired,
gain new confidence and love." -- Pablo Casals
Currently playing: "Return of the Jedi" -- Soundtrack
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 00:17:21 EDT
From: Inflammabl@aol.com
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Van Halen and Drummer Posture
Message-ID: <43fa738c.35dcf4d3@aol.com>
Neil wrote:
I'm a day behind on jams, so I apologize if someone has beaten me to this
response..
** That's okay man.. You can't read them all.. especially if they send 20 a
day! : )**
Inflammabl@aol.com didn't think before typing:
**I beg to differ.. It's opinion.. not "thinking before typing"
>The work they did with Sammy is mature,
>unlike the work they have done with DLR and Gary Cherone.
I like all of the "eras" and I think the use of the term "mature" to
describe music is gayer than a hootenanny (TM).. Your use of this term
could be translated to "I like the music they played with Sammy better than
the music they played with DLR and Gary."
** Mature is correct IMHO.. I have no direct opinion. I can really bob my
neck to "Panama" or "Without you" or anything of "Balance"
>but let's face the real truth
>(Eddie) Randy Rhodes did it first!!
I am a fan of both Randy and Eddie but IMO Eddie is clearly the better and
more inventive guitarist. I think Randy had the potential to be his equal,
but his life was sadly cut short as he was approaching his prime. Watch
Ed's solo in, for example, the "Live Without a Net" video. There wasn't a
guitarist then or now who could play like that (except Ed). While he is not
the fastest or most technical guitarist on the planet, Ed's style is
inimitable.
** He may be.. but I was just stating that Randy did it first. He started the
tapping thing and was the first to do it. This isn't a pissing contest as to
who is better, its an opinion of who did it first**
>but I must say that III sucked
I disagree - I think it's a pretty strong album, albeit shocking at first
listen (to someone who has listened to all the other VH stuff in the past)..
**This album was along the line of "freelancing" and trying to work with
Gary's background. You can tell because "Without you" is totally Nuno.
Listen to Eddie play and you can see the Nuno influence. It's very apparent.
I feel that this album really blew and it feels like VH didn't put their full
effort into it (i.e. the record company delaying the release.. they weren't
pleased either!) ***
>Eddie looks burnt
I just saw 2 shows on the "III" tour and Eddie (and the whole band) were
absolutely on fire.. Totally psyched, Eddie was jumping all over the place
and showing no evidence of hip problems. His guitar playing was also
top-notch (as expected). Alex looks aged with the neck brace and all but
hey, this is music not a fucking fashion show..
** Yes, music isn't a fashion show, but look at Eddie.. He looks totally
burnt. I saw and have "Live from the ten spot" Eddie totally looks burnt.
He looks like a Keith Richards look alike. I believe Sammy when he said that
Eddie was boozing again**
>Overall, VH isn't the same.
Nope, they're older and the music that Ed is writing is definitely a little
different.
** Yup, the music is sure different. Did they bring Nuno over to show Eddie
how to play his stuff? ***
>VH was better with a musician at the helm instead
>of a vocalist.
Are you implying that Gary is writing all the music these days? Ed is, and
always has been, the music writer for VH. Attribute any change in style to
him, for better or worse.
** No, it's very obvious that whoever is at the helm has an influence as to
what Eddie is playing. I.E. if DLR was at the helm is would be "free-
sprited" and free from serious music direction, when Sammy was at the helm..
heavy musical content and serious musical direction, with Gary at the helm,
Extreme's influence with some "sammy sounds" to the music. Gary never opened
up his vocal chords and showed what he could really do. All he did was keep
whithin the range that Sammy could do. Gary is a superb vocalist, just listen
to the stuff that he has done in the past (Extreme) and you can see the
difference.***
I guess it will always be the case with any long-lived band that has
distinct musical phases that there will be fans who prefer one phase to
another and who cast negative aspersions on the less-preferred eras. I can
get a lot out of each phase of Van Halen, and appreciate the differences as
well as the similarities (Ed's ass-kicking guitar).
** Yes and no. I can't say that I 'hate' what Gary brought to the table in
III. I can say that it is FAR from the quality that Balance had and OU812.
DLR is a totally different thing.. It was party music. With the band dancing
all over the place. It's like VH degressed from the quality that they had
with Sammy. ***
I encourage anyone who is a fan of the guitar and who can be open-minded
about hard rock music to give III several listens. It won't hit you
immediately, but there is a good deal of depth on the album. Its diversity
may also make it hard to comprehend on first listen. If you don't like it,
you can always give "Fair Warning" a spin!
** I am.. I'm just stating my opinion. Later, J **
Jammin',
-Neil.
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 00:22:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mike Pontrelli <ponte@essc.psu.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Fire Donations?
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.94.980821000524.15108C-100000@thunder>
I know this might be against the rules, but I figured I would ask since
this list is a second family to me (with all the normal feuds, etc).
A second cousin of mine just lost their family buisiness to a devastating
fire, and they did not have any insurace. They basically lost their
entire livelyhood. Anyway, a trust fund has been set up to help them out:
"The Courtwright trust fund
Diane Sawyer
First National Bank of Palmerton
PO box 510
Sciota, PA 18354"
(717) 992-5555
You can read a short newspaper article abou the store by going to
"www.poconorecord.com" and selecting "archives" and going to August 18
1998. It is under the Local section as "Neighbors help couple who lost
store to fire".
Anyways, It is very sad for me to watch their livelyhood go up in smoke (I
have been sifting through the rubble this past week and will help them
rebuild as soon as they can).
Again, sorry if this offended anyone.
In lighter news, I turned another person over to Dream Theater, my fifth
of the year.
take care
-Ponte
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 21:59:53 -0700
From: Michael Bahr <durnik@goodnet.com>
To: ShadowBor@aol.com
Subject: Who's Mike Bahr?
Message-ID: <35DCFEC9.706F@goodnet.com>
Who am I?
Currently, Mike Bahr is just another Jammer. Long-time DT fan, got into
the band in 1992 after hearing PMU on the radio.
For a long time, I was providing a service of bootleg CDs to the
Ytsejam list, but that time has passed. :) Thanks for asking.
-- - Mike Bahr - Wizard's Tower Gaming Center in Mesa, AZ (602-962-0151) - http://www.goodnet.com/~emerald/ - Magic, AD&D, Battletech and more! - Magic: the Gathering "Duelists' Convocation Level 2 Certified Judge" - d u r n i k@g o o d n e t.c o m - If it's nae Scottish,it's CRAP!------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 00:30:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Oscar Garcia Verastegui <trashboy@amauta.rcp.net.pe> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Dream Theater in Southamerica CONFIRMED Message-ID: <m0z9ipt-0012a2C@amauta.rcp.net.pe>
Hi: At this time the band has 4 dates in southamerica confirmed along with Van Halen.
9/20/98 San Juan, PR Roberto Clemente Stadium 9/25/98 Curitiba, BZ Pedreira Paulo Liminsk 9/26/98 Sao Paulo, BZ Pacaembu Stadium 9/27/98 Rio de Janiero, BZ Metropolitan
Is limited only to both countries...so I hope the band will take part on the Monsters festival in southamerica for next December in Argentina and Chile. Regards, Oscar
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 22:35:40 PDT From: "Michael Velders" <dtdrummin@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: Eddie VH & Derek - take 3!!!! Message-ID: <19980821053540.176.qmail@hotmail.com>
DAMN what is this. Gettin' me all excited and shit. Does Mike ever really post here? If so, can you answer my question about Metropolis?
> > > >aawwww fuck it! > >Mike Portnoy >
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 22:38:01 PDT From: "Michael Velders" <dtdrummin@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: Click Tracks. Message-ID: <19980821053801.11434.qmail@hotmail.com>
Yeah, I know he didn't use one on LTE, that's what he said. As a matter of fact, 3 minute warning was done all on the spot. Awesome, eh?
> > >It's amazing that someone said that they don't like this. Everyone doesn't >like them, but 99% of them use them. I believe that MP didn't on LTE because >everything was done pretty much on vibe and not firmly laid down before hand. > I agree with what was said before, you'd be a fool not to play without >it. Here's a way to check: Take your recording, count the pulse and set a >metronome to it. Then see how much you are off and trying to keep time. >Remember, that's the drummers job! Later, J >
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 01:53:41 -0400 From: Carlos Alfaro <calfaro@caribe.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: Dream Theater in Southamerica CONFIRMED Message-ID: <35DD0B64.2E837307@caribe.net>
Oscar Garcia Verastegui wrote:
> Hi: > At this time the band has 4 dates in southamerica confirmed along with > Van Halen. > > 9/20/98 San Juan, PR Roberto Clemente Stadium > 9/25/98 Curitiba, BZ Pedreira Paulo Liminsk > 9/26/98 Sao Paulo, BZ Pacaembu Stadium > 9/27/98 Rio de Janiero, BZ Metropolitan > > Is limited only to both countries...so I hope the band will take part on > the Monsters festival in southamerica for next December in Argentina and Chile. > Regards, > Oscar
Where did you get this information? Here in Puerto Rico i already heard the ad for the Van halen showon 9/20/98.. but they didnt mention dream theater... ( i was dissapointed of course ) Can anyone please confirm.. itchy? derek? mike? any response would be EXTREMELY appreciated
In the stream of consciousness There is a river crying Living comes much easier Once we admit , We're dying. Dream Theater: Lines in the Sand http://premium.caribe.net/~calfaro Tech Support Rep : Caribbean Internet Service mailto:calfaro@caribe.net mailto:ytseprog@yahoo.com Universal Internet Number (ICQ) 1254229
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 11:56:06 +0100 From: Oysterman <nv99701@egymn.tranemo.se> To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Extinguishing the flames: FII etc Message-ID: <98Aug21.085236gmt+0100.31367@gate.tranemo.se>
Seems like there's been quite some response to Geddy Lee's awful temper. = Oh yeah, that was me. Changed the alias - are you satisfied now, = Georgie?
Norg sez:
> FII is mixed great. we can hear everyone.
Well, occasionally, at least. At some points (e.g. verses of LiTS), = Derek disappears. And John P disappears. John M is heard too much. Only = satisfied with the volume of James & Mike, really. That's what I say.
> they move on. > do we move with them? that's up to us. most of us choose to because = we > have open minds. we appreciate the music for what it is. we don't > flame the songs we don't like. constructive critisizm is one thing, > flaming is another. one is usually an ok thing, the other is just = plain > silly. your take on the whole thing may be totally legitimate, but = the > way you express your thoughts will certainly have some bearing on how > people take your ideas. you're on the defensive. you have a chip on > your shoulder. loosen up. go get a massage or something. relax. i > thought europeans were all relaxed because they have more holidays = than > americans but apparently i'm wrong. (:
Well, perhaps it hasn't shown with my expressions, but I do *accept* the = songs I don't *like* - because others like them (at least we can hope = they do). The problem I have is that most of the DT's specific sound has = gone with FII. I find the music dull, almost like a standard-frame = thing, that could have been done by anyone (well, maybe not Warren G or = the likes, but you know what I mean). Some europeans may seem relaxed, but that's just because they're = building up a tension and anguish inside that the just keep preventing = from expressing (that's why we don't like the talkative americans (the = only good thing with USA is DT...!)). I happened to let loose here. BTW, have you ever seen an Italian in action...? :-)
> there were no facts, there wre opinions. yes there are still = communists > and nazis. it's not a perfect world. oops.
Definitely not a perfect world. DT's not on the radio...! >:-(
> so far nobody has done better with dream theater. let's use a change = of > seasons as an example. ouch. sting. the music was great. the = mixing > wasn't so hot. right now we're talking about mixing, thank goodness. = (:
Yipes! There's an opinion! Waah! :-)
> that's the kind of attitude i'm talking about that drives people = crazy. > you stated it right there, you are using opinion. we don't have to > prove you wrong, but i will. what commercial song has time changes = like > burning my soul? what commercial song has a good keyboard lead? what > _good_ commercial song has profound lyrics at the same time as "shit"? > (: name a commercial song that even remotely accomplishes what even > burning my soul has done. please. i double dare you.
Keyboard lead, I can tell you - "The Final Countdown"! That song was written before Majesty even existed! When it comes to lyrics, I can just say that I don't read them that = well, and, OK, for commercial songs, the text is of no matter. I'm very fucking sorry, OK?
> hmm. take both of them to another stereo. seriously. give > them a listen on something other than the panasonic system. let us = know > what it sounds like then. if it still sounds like dog droppings on > ther stereo systems, then we'll have to talk more about what stuff > sounds like. other than that, we can drop a bomb on the panasonic > plant. =20
Uh-huh. OK, if I take it to my friend's $1200 system (Sony), will that = do?
Dushko-man wrote:
> > "Awake" is dark. FII is a happy stroll in the park compared to it. >=20 > Oh yeah! "Innocence Faded" is the most commercial DT song! IMO,=20 > "Awake" is heavier.
"Innocence faded?" Eh - is that one of the tracks 2 or 3? I dunno. I = never listen to those two. (Oh, gosh!) <:-D
> and i'm just wondering how does FII sound bad in comparison to others? = by=20 > the way, i'm looking for specific instruments here, not just parts of = the=20 > spectrum. =20
Bass, guitar & keys are either too loud or too low. I.e. occasionally. = When Myung & Portnoy enters ToT, the bass guitar drowns the whole = picture. Utterly irritating.
That's that. Perhaps we'll all feel a little better now...?
//Oysterman "Alive at both ends but a little dead in the middle"
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 01:05:53 -0600 From: "KorgX3" <korgx3@safelink.net> To: "Multiple recipients of list" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Who's Eddie Van Bahr? Message-ID: <005401bdccd2$4e930ba0$180d84d0@korgx3>
> For a long time, I was providing a service of bootleg CDs to the >Ytsejam list, but that time has passed. :) Thanks for asking.
The one and ONLY living Ytse-legend (since Bafu and Hairball seem to have crapped out).
And he goes by his REAL?!? name! This is the internet! Get a real alias!
As for Van Halen, you guys need a reality check. I liked VH3 from the first listen. Parts of it take me back to when the band was in their early era. To me, VH3 actually sounds fun. It may not be a colorful production-wise, but it's loose. I like that. The guys are just chillin' by the pool with a 40 in one hand and a handful of nadz in the other. Yes, Gary helped write the songs. At least some of them. They never list the true credits in the albums. They just say "all songs by Van Halen." If you listen to the Sammy Era stuff, there's alot of Sammy sounding songs. Same with the Roth stuff. How much do you think DLR contributed to VH in the early years? I would estimate alot. He came out of Van Halen with a couple of succesful solo albums. Much of which sounded like older VH stuff, while suddenly when Sammy dives in, BAM! Instant rehashed Sammy shit with a few rehashed old VH songs mixed in. I think Eddie works close with the singer to not only produce what they're comfortable with, but to get a clear vibe as to what they would like to work with. Nuno wrote most of the stuff with Extreme as far as I know, so we've never really had a shot at hearing what Gary's all about. I think VH3 was what you get. If you don't like it, too bad, I love it.
You can't honestly tell me you don't hear the difference between 1984 and 5150. It's WAAAAY too fucking obvious. Eddie obviously changed styles cuz he was co-writing with the singers. End of story. What the hell am I talking about. It's time for bed. Mosh. Mosh. Where's my crackpipe, bitch ... Ahgggg. :P -- KorgX3
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4209 **************************
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