YTSEJAM Digest 4205
Today's Topics:
1) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4203
by Mike Pontrelli <ponte@essc.psu.edu>
2) Re: VH and Zappa
by Paul Weiss <paulw@bass.org>
3) Re: Ultimate Band List
by Mark Bredius <bredius@globalxs.nl>
4) Re: Little Stevie Vai, blah blah
by Paul Weiss <paulw@bass.org>
5) Re: Fave keyboard moments
by Rob Bowen <rfbow@erols.com>
6) more nonsense
by "Nowik, George" <NowikG@data-io.com>
7) Richie's kids, AOI, Cairo
by Phil Carter <satriani@negia.net>
8) Re: Free Bird
by drnewb@spiff.net
9) Eddie VH & Derek
by Portnoy420@aol.com
10) Influences
by Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
11) MEMKIL's confussion is over! :-)
by Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
12) Re: Little Stevie Vai; What a nice, cheating bastard!
by Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
13) Re: FII
by Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 11:34:42 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mike Pontrelli <ponte@essc.psu.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4203
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.94.980820113338.12362A-100000@thunder>
I was in the process of moving a few hundred miles and I missed a week's
worth of jams. Can someone email me in private information about POWERMAD
and YTSEJAM SHIRTS?
Thanks!!!!
np: the ringing in my ears
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 11:45:01 -0400 (EDT)
From: Paul Weiss <paulw@bass.org>
To: we be ytsejamming <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: VH and Zappa
Message-ID: <Pine.BSI.3.95.980820112736.12573A-100000@gs.bass.org>
I had to throw in my ha'penny.
Look, y'all, think back to 5150...you remember now (I know it was a long
time ago)? OK, Hagar was trying desparately to sound like Roth on that
first album. Yes, they had better tunes than III, but you can't fault
Cherone for trying to emulate Hagar. Hagar finally found his own voice by
OU812/FUCK so hopefully Cherone will do the same (by a sophomore/junior
album). Yeah, my opinion's not worth the bandwidth, but there ya go.
For those interested in getting into Zappa and not knowing where to start:
It all depends on what you are looking for. Joe's Garage (2 Discs, 3 Acts)
is a concept album that pokes fun at religion and music. Sheik Yerbouti
features many of his straight ahead pop songs. Overnight Sensation is also
a classic.
If you buy the live albums recorded by his 88 big band, they
feature many songs that span his career, revisited and treated in a
different way than originally recorded. The live albums are great, because
there is a lot of lyrical modification, throwing in "secret words" ala
PeeWee Herman. If you just want guitar, get his instrumentals: Guitar and
Shut Up and Play Yer Guitar. If anyone wants other particular titles, I've
got them.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul's thought for the Month:
We all came out to Montreux...
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 17:47:06 +0200
From: Mark Bredius <bredius@globalxs.nl>
To: "'Ytsejam'" <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Ultimate Band List
Message-ID: <01BDCC62.C4C8D7C0@161.154.dialin.mxs.nl>
Ryan wrote :
> I e-mailed the UBL webmasters and asked why Dream Theater
> had been removed from their list. I did receive a relatively
> polite response. They claim that "the Dream Theater webmaster"
> (???) had set up some kind of mechanism where every visitor to
> that particular website triggered a hit on the list. I don't
> know exactly how they count hits, so this could be plausible
> or just a bunch of B.S. At any rate, they've removed all
> reference to Dream Theater until this gets fixed.
Here's the whole story... For about a week, I had a hidden
frame on UACM which loaded UBL's Dream Theater "band card"
whenever someone visited the site. I figured I'd give DT a
little boost but underestimated UACM's "powers"... That is
how Dream Theater got to be number one in the first place.
Someone at UBL found out and mailed me. I dumped the frame
within minutes after he sent me that note, and apologized.
He said it was ok and told me they were looking forward to
promoting Dream Theater's upcoming double live album... So
far so good, right ?
I expected DT to drop off their top 100 the next week, but
they remained at the number one spot. People were probably
checking out this mysterious Dream Theatre band, wondering
who they were and how they got on the top of the list. ;-)
A few hours later Dream Theater was removed from their top
100 and database *altogether* (although the page was still
available through the direct URL). I *immediately* emailed
the guy who spotted the hidden frame in the *first* place,
but he didn't write me back until yesterday...
Turns out he was on vacation all week... When his boss saw
that Dream Theater was at the number one spot for a second
week, he freaked out and simply pulled DT's band card from
UBL's database.
Anyway, it's all fixed now... I was asked to pass along an
apology from them to Dream Theater's fans and I would like
to offer mine to you guys too... What I did was wrong, and
it won't happen again.
One good thing came out of it though... Dream Theater will
be UBL's Band Of The Week when the live album comes out...
The End. :)
Although the old direct URL is still valid, there is a new
address for Dream Theater's band card. Notice how they put
UACM at the top, while the rest is there alphabetically...
http://www.ubl.com/ubl/cards/130/4/96.html
Go check it out. ;-)
Mark Bredius
_______________________________________________________
Under A Cyber Moon - The Official Dream Theater Website
http://www.dreamtheater.net/ E-mail: itchy@dreamt.org
The Official H website -- http://www.hogarth.com/steve/
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 12:01:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: Paul Weiss <paulw@bass.org>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Little Stevie Vai, blah blah
Message-ID: <Pine.BSI.3.95.980820115622.16501A-100000@gs.bass.org>
In YtseDigest 4202 Eckie postulated:
> What does it matter if he's still the one who wrote it? His forte's
<snip>
Actually, he didn't write it. It was originally the intro to One Night in
Bangkok from the musical Chess by Tim Rice, Bjorn Ulvaeus, and Benny
Andersson. All apologies if I'm duping someone else's post.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul's thought for the Month:
We all came out to Montreux...
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 11:59:07 -0400
From: Rob Bowen <rfbow@erols.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Fave keyboard moments
Message-ID: <35DC47CB.825DD916@erols.com>
- Steve Vai - Bangkok/Fire Garden Suite (piano solo)
Great, great piece! What a playing! And then, I opened the CD booklet
and saw that Vai's playing it!!! Get outta here! :-)
Just a correction. Actually, Steve is not playing the keys on this
track. I too was floored when I thought he was (like, how does this guy
have time to practice piano!?!?), but I read an interview with him
shortly after the release of the album and he indicated that he
programmed the keys on a sequencer and had it play the parts for him.
Still, it goes without saying, he is one of the greatest musicians on
earth (IMO), and that track is my favorite on the disk. Gives us
mortals a little bit of hope, though. :-)
If you don't know the stuff, FIND IT! :-)
I agree completely. This album is incredible.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 08:03:27 -0800
From: "Nowik, George" <NowikG@data-io.com>
To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: more nonsense
Message-ID: <C7EA264064ACD011BE4500805FC1DCA101D9C6C3@SATURN.nt.data-io.com>
wow, never been in on a flame war before. peanuts envy abound.
> Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 14:45:53 +0100
> From: Geddy Lee <nv99701@egymn.tranemo.se>
> Subject: Answers for Norg!
>
> Right - if I happen to have a NEGATIVE aspect of ANY of DT's works,
> does =
> that mean that I won't have permission to say "Well, guys - you are =
> great, but this sucks!"? You're supposed to hear and hopefully benefit
> =
> from ALL opinions, right? This isn't a brown-nosing list for boosting
> =
> DT's slef-confidence, is it? And I said I LOVE I&W and "Awake", didn't
> =
> I?
>
given that that is true and we are not here to brownnose the group and
make them feel warm and fuzzy, neither are we supposed to thrash on
their stuff. there are other ways of expressing one's opinion of music
and songs and albums but critisizing an entiere collective of an album
just because it doesn't tickle your pickle doesn't exactly settle well.
perhaps i'm just too critical and i can hear things better, but the
sound on FII is far better than Awake and Images and Words could be
simply because it's newer, they have a producer who knows how to mix,
newer equipment, better sounding instruments, etc. images and words had
terrible mixing and triggered drums, awake was awfully deep in the low
end. FII is mixed great. we can hear everyone. so it's not the mixing
but the music. let's move on.
> At least I'm not flaming it "just because". I really don't like FII. =
> There ARE good moments and there ARE worse albums (I happen to have
> the =
> world's worst in my collection...), I know. But *I* think that, let's
> =
> say, Majesty's "InstruMental" has more charm and "fire" than FII,
> which =
> fully compensates the worthless sound and overplaying. Definitely more
> =
> fun to listen to than PARTS of FII.=20
>
so now we're doing the metallica "Load" argument. "their music evolved
without me so it sucks." well, times change. everything changes.
time, diapers, underwear, clothes, tastes, etc. (well, most people
change their underwear...) their evolution doesn't go with your current
likings. does that make it suck? oh please. (: InstruMental 1, 2, and
3 (is there a 4th?) are very raw albums, but they are also probably just
under 10 years old. with the exception of derek, these guys are
married. they're not in 20's anymore. they're in 30's. they move on.
do we move with them? that's up to us. most of us choose to because we
have open minds. we appreciate the music for what it is. we don't
flame the songs we don't like. constructive critisizm is one thing,
flaming is another. one is usually an ok thing, the other is just plain
silly. your take on the whole thing may be totally legitimate, but the
way you express your thoughts will certainly have some bearing on how
people take your ideas. you're on the defensive. you have a chip on
your shoulder. loosen up. go get a massage or something. relax. i
thought europeans were all relaxed because they have more holidays than
americans but apparently i'm wrong. (:
> Opinions are made WITH facts as well. There are still communists, you
> =
> know. Nazis as well.
>
there were no facts, there wre opinions. yes there are still communists
and nazis. it's not a perfect world. oops.
> What's the thing with "sexual preference"? Don't follow you there.
>
that was a joke. (:
> Of course I can't do it better than Caveman Shirley. But there are =
> people who can. And people who don't.
>
so far nobody has done better with dream theater. let's use a change of
seasons as an example. ouch. sting. the music was great. the mixing
wasn't so hot. right now we're talking about mixing, thank goodness. (:
> Beacuse how I see it: FII sounds weak & thin. Empty sometimes. I have
> a =
> Panasonic system that's about 2 years of age, and (almost) everything
> =
> sound great on it. Maybe I need to listen to FII on a "reference
> system" =
> to hear it at its full. But it does NOT sound good on my stereo.
>
i saw the thread about stereos and high end stuff and reference system
things and so forth and so on ... i don't have a reference system
unfortunately because anything that sounds that fancy has to cost more
than i'm worth. when i got falling into infinity, i had a discman. (:
it sounded so wicked cool to me just on that. i later heard it on a
stereo system. it still rocked my shorts. the cd is produced great.
the music is diverse and diversity is what makes the world go around.
it's why there can be communists and democracies, good people and
republicans, etc etc etc. the list goes on. (no, don't anyone bother
getting on my case about politics because i'll ignore you and laugh
insanely).
> What's a "real" alias? I know he is great. He's my god. Sorry if I =
> disappointed you. And since YOU are so upset, I might consider
> changing =
> it, just for you, matie...
>
a real alias is one that you come up with that does not defame the name
of someone. i seriously doubt that the person you are emulating thinks
or acts the way you do.
i'm not your matie. you're not even remotely good looking enough, and
there's not enough hootenanny in me to make a flake of dust.
and just to move onto the next email since i'm feeling frisky,
> > BMS commercial?????
>
> IMO, yep. Prove me wrong!
>
that's the kind of attitude i'm talking about that drives people crazy.
you stated it right there, you are using opinion. we don't have to
prove you wrong, but i will. what commercial song has time changes like
burning my soul? what commercial song has a good keyboard lead? what
_good_ commercial song has profound lyrics at the same time as "shit"?
(: name a commercial song that even remotely accomplishes what even
burning my soul has done. please. i double dare you.
> > This is odd to hear - LTE sounds awful???
> > Is your Hi-Fi OK? :-)
>
> It sound good with everything else. Perhaps it's Panasonic's fault in
> the first place, what do I know?
>
ok, now i'm beginning to wonder. i think panasonic must have some sort
of anti-prog chip in each of their players, because LTE sounds so wicked
cool on any stereo i've heard so far. the funny thing is that both of
the albums which most people agree have some of the best sound of any
dream theater related stuff are both sounding like shit on your stereo
system. hmm. take both of them to another stereo. seriously. give
them a listen on something other than the panasonic system. let us know
what it sounds like then. if it still sounds like dog droppings on
other stereo systems, then we'll have to talk more about what stuff
sounds like. other than that, we can drop a bomb on the panasonic
plant.
-= norg =-
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 12:10:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: Phil Carter <satriani@negia.net>
To: Liquid Tension Ytse <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Richie's kids, AOI, Cairo
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.95.980820104929.10583A-100000@peach.negia.net>
Greetings ye 'jamanoids...
Richie R. remarked:
> let me remind you that I worship
> Poison, live and die by Warrant, and plan on naming my first child after
> an undetermined member of Motley Crue (I don't care if it's a girl).
Hey, if it's a girl, call her Nikki! It fits....
Jani L. wants to know:
> Ok,could someone PLEASE post me some info about this Age of Impact
> thing???
It's an excellent album. 5 tightly-woven "Impact"s, basically one
extremely long song. Bret Douglas (Cairo) takes lead vocals on the first
Impact, Matt Bradley (Dali's Dilemma) takes lead vocals on the second
Impact, James LaBrie does lead vocals on the third and fifth Impact, and
D.C. Cooper (Royal Hunt) does lead vocals on the fourth Impact.
The whole album is a virtual arsenal of prog talent. If you like
Magellan's stuff, you will definitely like Age of Impact; it's Magellan on
SEVERE steroids. Better drums, better guitars, better keys, better vocals.
(Which isn't a slight on Magellan, because I love Magellan's stuff; it's
just that Age of Impact is better). Wicked time changes, layers and layers
of guitar and key tracks, and a vicious rhythm section (Terry Bozzio and
Billy Sheehan).
The only problem is that its production leaves something to be desired.
Lots of people have said that Bozzio can hardly be heard in the mix, and I
agree. Sheehan's bass sound also sounds washed out in a lot of cases. The
vocals and lead guitar parts are mixed well, but the rest of it is not.
Jorgen B. wrote (commenting on Age of Impact]:
> Personally, I think it's a great to here other singers, In
> particcular Brent Douglas cought my ear. Can anyone say something
> about Cairo, afterall they are not objective at [Magna Carta]
> and i thought he did a good job.
I just recently picked up Cairo's first album (self-titled). It's great if
you like prog music that concentrates more on the keys and piano side of
the music than on the drums/bass/guitar side. The vocals are also quite
good; although Douglas sounds good on Age of Impact, he sounds even better
on the Cairo disc, singing songs that were written with him in mind. The
epic track "Ruins at Avalon's Gate" is just over 22 minutes and is
outstanding, with some wicked keyboard solos.
The Digital Man was planning to write a review of the newest Cairo disc,
"Conflict and Dreams". What happened to it, D?
Ta,
Phil
=======================================================================
Phil Carter -- satriani@negia.net (work), carter@negia.net (personal)
Tech Support Manager, NorthEast Georgia Internet Access, 546-5787
"I should never have written all those tank programs."
-- Kevin Flynn, "Tron"
Currently playing: Metallica -- "...And Justice For All"
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 11:13:56 -0500
From: drnewb@spiff.net
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Free Bird
Message-ID: <199808201610.JAA19969@odin.ax.com>
> I know the Freebird song from that gig of Lynyrd Skynyrd on Knebworth
> festival (??1980??) and they really kicked ass there! Especially the
> extended solo parts of the guitarists. MAN, that was somethin!
> Did DT play this part, or some of the singing parts?
When I saw them in Chicago last May (DT, not Skynyrd :), they
played the ending "guitar solo" part of Free Bird, and yes, it was
damn cool :).
Dale r. newberry
"I'm hip about time."
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 12:28:38 EDT
From: Portnoy420@aol.com
To: Ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Eddie VH & Derek
Message-ID: <93734844.35dc4eb7@aol.com>
Damon sez:
<<<<
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 17:30:45 +0200
From: Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Influences
Message-ID: <35DC4125.2AB9BCDF@mol.com.mk>
> Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1998 23:09:01 -0400 (EDT)
> From: Damon Fibraio <damon@shell.monmouth.com>
> Subject: Re: Attempting a new thread..... :)
>
> Three words, Stevie Ray Vaune. Drew his influence from early Blues music
> which is American as hell.
YYYYYYYYYES! Way to go Damon! :-) SRV rules! OK, America is certainly
going up the charts. :-)
> And for another British influencial band, try The Who.
Heck, I WANTED to mention them but seeing all you listeners of this
bunch of new prog bands I thought I'll look like a grandpa! :-) WHO
RULES! "Tommy" is certainly one of best concept albums ever.
> From: "Thomas Forcier" <thomas.o.forcier@worldnet.att.net>
>
> Roots of rock can be
> traced all the way to Brahms for chrissakes... (Just ask Steve Howe)
HaHa, I knew that eventually we'll come to this! Well, let's shorten
this and give the final conclusion: The roots go back to the first men
on earth, when they lived in caves and drummed those bones 'n woods.
Right?
____________
Dushko
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 17:45:45 +0200
From: Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: MEMKIL's confussion is over! :-)
Message-ID: <35DC44A9.29780E8@mol.com.mk>
> Date: Wed, 19 Aug 1998 22:34:37 -0700
> From: "MEMKIL" <memkilun@earthlink.net>
> Subject: I'm confused! please advise!
>
> i can only afford to go see one show a month, and i'm having trouble
> deciding.
>
> 1.Deep Purple, ELP, Dream Theater
> doubts: I don't listen to Deep Purple or ELP, and not sure if it's worth
> $40 to see
> a 45 minute opening by DT.
>
> 2.Tool, The Melvins
> doubts: same night as Metallica, already seen Tool twice, The Melvins
> suck
>
> 3.Metallica, Days of The New, Jerry Cantrell
> doubts:Load, Reload, hmm..., same night as Tool
>
> Please give me some input to lead me in the right direction!
> (I already see everyone flaming me because i'm supposed to be at the Deep
> Purple show but i'm questioning it anyhow.)
You see, you know the right answer already! ;-)
You said you don't listen DP and ELP. Does it mean not liking them or
not knowing them? Big difference. If it's the 1-st go and YOU'LL NOT
REGRET. And obviously you don't wanna go the last 2 shows :-)
I DO think that the time of DP passed out long ago, but live they
problably still can make you wake up right?
ELP you shouldn't miss naturally! :-)
Dushko
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 17:55:02 +0200
From: Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Little Stevie Vai; What a nice, cheating bastard!
Message-ID: <35DC46D6.6B5CF496@mol.com.mk>
> Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 01:12:38 -0700
> From: Eckie <eckie@imap1.asu.edu>
> Subject: Little Stevie Vai; What a nice, cheating bastard!
>
> > Dushko was heart broken:
> > > OK, I got thr proof I thought doesn't exists! What else to say except
> > > :-(((
>
> What does it matter if he's still the one who wrote it? His forte's
> obviously in the 6 string sex machine (also known as a "guitar" to
> laymen and keyboard players ;^) ). Give the man a Roland virtual guitar
> pickup processor, and poof, instant piano playing ability. :P
>
> ~Eckie
Yeah right! :-)
That's all fine, but if I knew that I could stop embarassing myself
those days while spreading the rumour about Vai being a MASTER OF
INSTRUMENTS! :-)
Dushko
NP: Faith No More - Angel Dust
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 18:31:23 +0200
From: Dushko <duskob@mol.com.mk>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: FII
Message-ID: <35DC4F5B.2C2C87F5@mol.com.mk>
> Date: Thu, 20 Aug 1998 14:47:14 +0100
> From: Geddy Lee <nv99701@egymn.tranemo.se>
> Subject: Answers for Dushko!
>
> > JLMB commercial?????
> > BMS commercial?????
>
> IMO, yep.
> Listen to the music. Perhaps it's some kind of irony with it all
> (the lyrics (great) are strictly anti-commercial).
Phew, first I'm kinda sorry for confronting you. :-) I hate bad words
flying between jammers. Afterall, everyone has right on his own opinion,
and, I guess, right to SAY IT! (the American way! ;-)
> > Derek's keys are certainly "painting" the whole album, adds much to the
> > feeling of the whole. I just hope they won't go on with that electronic
> > stuff to extent of doing and album like
> > U2 - Pop! :-)
>
> Yeah, not like "Pop"! NOT "POP"! Yuck! >P
:-)
> > Also the whole album has this dark feel to it. But it's definitely DT
> > sound.
>
> Nah... is it?
C'mon, it IS dark! After my first listening I was all in chaos and not
remebering details but I had that feeling - dark, psychodelic, more than
and DT album before! Just listen intro of New Milennium, actually the
whole songs. Especially the part 1:51 - 2:34!!!!!! I also recall when
first heard those first LaBrie lines - Whow, this is grungie stuff.
> "Awake" is dark. FII is a happy stroll in the park compared to it.
Oh yeah! "Innocence Faded" is the most commercial DT song! IMO, "Awake"
is heavier.
> > This is odd to hear - LTE sounds awful???
> > Is your Hi-Fi OK? :-)
>
> It sound good with everything else. Perhaps it's Panasonic's fault in the first place, what do I know?
>
> GL
Might be! :-) I'm not a sound engineer but I just know that JLMB, BMS
ROCKS on good stereo! :-)
Same AND DOUBLE goes for LTE too!
And folks, "Just Let GL Breathes" OK? :-)
Dushko
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 4205
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