YTSEJAM Digest 4474
Today's Topics:
1) Cody/Tolkein
by "Neil Gallop" <nga@software-ag.de>
2) The Crossroads Debate
by Uroborosss@aol.com
3) re:MORE. GEORGE. BELLAS. / JAZZZZZ
by O-P Komonen <op777@surffi.net>
4) Re: GEORGE. BELLAS.
by Phil Carter <phil@usefulware.com>
5) Re: Drum Corps (NDTC)
by Al Balkiewicz <balkiewi@UMDNJ.EDU>
6) FII
by "Schnipp -" <schnipp@hotmail.com>
7) Paganini thread / Zappa
by CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk>
8) Petty, Danzig, and Burners
by "Earle Jason" <earle_jason@bah.com>
9) Speaking of Jaxx shows...
by "Blevins, Mike" <BlevinsM@amsc.belvoir.army.mil>
10) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4469
by Lisa Marie <ytsegirl@pacbell.net>
11) Junoon
by "Krishna Donepudi" <skd7789@megahertz.njit.edu>
12) guitarists / Crossroads / DT acapella
by CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 10:46:26 +0100
From: "Neil Gallop" <nga@software-ag.de>
To: <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Cody/Tolkein
Message-ID: <000101be1ea1$cb5c14d0$2fa1bd9d@pcnga.software-ag.de>
Hi all
somebody called Cody was asking about a post concerning Tolkein
and a black metal band. I was the originator of that post, and the band
in question is The Summoning. Not at all like Blind Guardian, but
equally interesting.
Where is Hairball when you need him?
stay safe and happy listening
Neil Gallop (nga@software-ag.de)
Currently playing: Noisebox - Monkey Ass
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 05:16:43 EST
From: Uroborosss@aol.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: The Crossroads Debate
Message-ID: <f87a46b.3666650b@aol.com>
> From: Simon Wilkins <s.wilkins@rocketmail.com>
> Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4470
>
> Hi there again
Hello.
> 3) Paganini & Instigation
> by Uroborosss@aol.com
>
> The Crossroads endpiece is NOT Paganini
> It is based on a Turkish March by a composer I cant remember.
The entire piece is not Paganini. There are notes in it taken directly from
Caprice #5. I've transcribed both. I've played both. I know what I'm talking
about. (In fact after this paragraph you'll find a transcription of the part
of that Crossroads duel that can be heard in Caprice #5.)
The ending piece Eugene floors Jack Butler with could be a mixture of pieces,
I cannot say. Perhaps part of the Turkish piece you refer to has a passage in
it that can also be found in Caprice #5 and the two composers worked without
ever meeting one another. My point is, there's a chunk of Caprice #5 in that
showdown. It might be a coincidental match between two completely different
composers coming from completely different countries, but it's also an exact
match between two easily-found pieces of music. Again, I know the whole thing
isn't Paganini, but this part definitely IS:
(hard to type this on AOL, may look totally distorted on your screen)
E-------------------------------------------17-15-13----------------
B-------13-17-13-----15-17-15-13---------------17-15-13--
G--14---------------16-----------------------------------------------
Eugene begins playing this diagram after the small bit of silence where the
crowd starts clapping for him. In the movie you can see him close his eyes and
really get into it. Anyway, pick up your guitar and play that diagram over and
over. Recognize it from Crossroads? Good, now get out your signed copy of
Paganini's "24 Caprices." For the example of this diagram in Caprice #5 (and
your version might be timed slightly differently depending on the speed of the
violinist), cue up to approximately :35. There it is.
I'm not done. Now get out those Joe Stump albums I know you all love to
collect, specifically his first album, "Guitar Dominance." You can hear the
above lick from Caprice #5 (or The Turkish March) at 2:06 of track #3, which
is aptly entitled "Paganini's Revenge." Little did Mr. Stump realize he should
have called it "Paganini's Revenge and a lick from a Turkish March." Anyway,
the song is a big mish-mash of licks from Paganini's caprices and violin
concertos, mixed with Stump's own soloing. The Caprice #5 lick occurs right
after the main lick from Caprice #24, which Stump seems quite fond of.
I also think that piece in Crossroads is a mixture of things because Vai uses
part of it near the beginning of "The Audience Is Listening." Considering how
paranoid Vai is about sounding like other people and accidentally ripping off
other composers (and his nightmare really came true with "Bangkok"), I doubt
he'd steal an exact lick from someone else (regardless of what instrument they
composed on) and first use it in a movie, then claim it's his on a "solo
album" of guitar instrumentals. That'd be like playing "Pachelbel's Canon in
D" on a guitar album and replacing the title with "My Canon in D." Malmsteen
rips off licks from classical and baroque composers all the time and adds his
own lyrics and song titles, but Malmsteen's brand of creativity is a little
different from Vai's. If the whole piece in the movie IS in fact Turkish
March, I'm surprised Vai would carry part of someone else's work over into one
of his "original" songs. (and no I'm not referring to the beginning of "Bad
Horsie," that's in Crossroads too but that ain't what we're discussing)
If you want this other lick I'm talking about transcribed so that we can
REALLY beat the life out of this topic, just ask.
> Watch the credits at the end of the film and see for yourself.
I believe the ending lick of the solo in Ron Thal's "Rowboat" is exactly the
same as the end of the solo to the song "Right Here, Right Now" by a band I
can't remember the name of. I don't think either one ripped each other off,
and I'm just fine saying that a particular lick sprang into existence in two
completely separate places at the same time. Calling Ron Thal a "Right Here,
Right Now" rip-off artist makes no sense, nor does listening to "Rowboat" and
saying "this isn't Ron Thal, this is that other band, the one that did 'Right
Here, Right Now.' "
> This was discussed at the beginning of September on the jam if you
> want to look it up.
Was I part of the discussion in September? My proof hasn't changed at all
since then, so if I was part of that discussion then you weren't paying
attention. If I wasn't part of the September discussion, here I am now, I just
offered a few reliable sources for finding the lick in question and resolving
with your own ears whether it's one of Paganini's or not. Step up.
Bafu Vai
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 13:49:43 +0200
From: O-P Komonen <op777@surffi.net>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: re:MORE. GEORGE. BELLAS. / JAZZZZZ
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19981203134943.00996910@mail.surffi.net>
>What I like to do is put my portable cd player in one corner of my room
with a
>Bellas disc blasting out, then I toss a Malmsteen cassette into my tape deck
>and put that in the opposite corner of the room, also at high volume.
Helps me
>relax. Makes me feel like Bellas and Malmsteen are right there shredding each
>other's asses off as I study Hegel's parallel theories of self-consciousness
>and master-slave relationships...
heh.. reminds me of the other day when I was listening to VSP-projekt demos
from mosh's FTP, and inserted Gambale/Smith/Hamm in computer's CD player at
same time... results we're, uh, jazzzzzzziiieeeeeeeee
try it.. you might regret :)
op777
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 09:17:42 -0500
From: Phil Carter <phil@usefulware.com>
To: The Divine Wings of Ytse <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Re: GEORGE. BELLAS.
Message-ID: <4.1.19981203090541.0091e080@pop.usefulware.com>
Greetings ye 'jamanoids...
First off, Bafu, I must take you to task for copyright-infringing on the
dot-format for names (as we all know, the only name we are allowed to use
that format on is the mighty MICHAEL .ANGELO. -- tm; c; all rights
reserved; some cars not for use with some sets; tax, tag and title not
included).
>As for me, I love 'em both. I consider them parts 1 and 2 of a single long
>release. The major thing separating the two albums (for my ears at least) is
>the "Orchestral Suite" at the end of "Mind" which is very long and complex,
>and a step into the classical end of the neoclassical shred found on "Turn."
Yeah, I think "Orchestral Suite" really shows how much Bellas is maturing
as a writer and musician in general. It's easy to imagine Bach might have
produced something like that (if he had been born a couple hundred years
later and had picked up an electric guitar too).
>I agree here, the songs are better and there's a wider variety of instruments.
>Make no mistake, on either album Bellas is an absolute monster.
OH yeah. First time I heard "Mind over Matter" it was like something out of
the Bible -- there was much weeping and gnashing of teeth. Nobody should be
able to play guitar AND keyboards that well. It's not fair, I tell you.
ta,
Phil
==================================================
Phil Carter -- Usefulware Tech Support -- phil@usefulware.com
"Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life."
-- Berthold Auerbach
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 09:54:37 -0500 (EST)
From: Al Balkiewicz <balkiewi@UMDNJ.EDU>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Re: Drum Corps (NDTC)
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.981203095207.29380A-100000@njmsa.UMDNJ.EDU>
On Wed, 2 Dec 1998, Paul Fanguy wrote:
>
> Phantom is certainly not a little old drum corps, I was just messing around. We
> should do really good this year, alot of vets returning. I sure would like to have a
> DCI World Championship ring.......
I wish ya luck, but the Cadets kicked some serious ass this year.
You should hope that they have an "off" year one of these next
years, because this year's show was absolutely amazing....if they
continue in that direction, they're gonna be tough.........
-Al
"closet drum corps fanatic"
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 07:03:42 PST
From: "Schnipp -" <schnipp@hotmail.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: FII
Message-ID: <19981203150343.24373.qmail@hotmail.com>
hi all,
first thought
maybe DT doesn't get videoplay because"a daily dose of eMpTyV"
second thought
who the fuck is Shannon Hood anyway?
third thought
in the bridge of YNM (that's alright I'm okay...) did anybody else
notice these spacy rotating (on the manual) sounds way back?
apart from that: who has a CD-Rom burner and owns many AC/DC discs?
I want to compile my own best of, cause there's not that many songs I
like(blablablabla). Offers private. Of course I'll pay or trade .
Later dudes
schnipp
NP: 6345789
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 10:55:58 +0100
From: CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Paganini thread / Zappa
Message-ID: <3666602E.5EA87124@mol.com.mk>
> Date: Wed, 2 Dec 1998 08:36:10 -0800 (PST)
> From: Simon Wilkins <s.wilkins@rocketmail.com>
>
> > 3) Paganini & Instigation
> > by Uroborosss@aol.com
>
> The Crossroads endpiece is NOT Paganini
> It is based on a Turkish March by a composer I cant remember.
>
> Watch the credits at the end of the film and see for yourself.
Here we go again! :)
I know the Paganini caprice #5 and I'm SURE that's it!!! You just can't
miss, that's the melody. Although on Crossroads they don't play it same
all the way, just the intro.
Maybe that composer ripped Paganini? ;)
> Date: Wed, 2 Dec 1998 14:56:16 -0500 (EST)
> From: Paul Weiss <paulw@bass.org>
>
> CuberDuke questioned my mental perspicacity when he posted:
> >Punky's Whips is from the "Sheik Yerbouti" album!
> Umm..look again. On SY, he sings lead vox on Broken Hearts Are for
> Assholes, I'm So Cute, and Tryin' To Grow a Chin.
I never said he doesn't! :)
OK, I checked my Music Central CD-ROM in order not to turn out to be
fool, so, ....er, ...., hm...., yeah Punky's Whips is on "Zappa In New
York"! :(
I made the confusion because just 2 weeks ago I took SY together with
this one and one more Zappa CD froma a friend.
But the title of that one was not "Zappa In New York" but "Just anotehr
Live Zappa album"!?!?
BTW, Cruisin' For Burgers is some of the best Zappa songs! :)
> Maybe on the Macedonian Pirate copy...:)
Now, that was really funny!!!! :)))
Nope, I was holding an original SY CD in my hands (or maybe that's what
they wanted me to think) ;)
--CyberDuke _______________________________________________________ Home Page http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Gym/3466/ E-mail duskob@mol.com.mk ICQ# 17392722 _______________________________________________________
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 10:11:08 -0500 From: "Earle Jason" <earle_jason@bah.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Petty, Danzig, and Burners Message-ID: <3666AA0C.F4CB941@bah.com>
> From: Nshsunsfan@aol.com > > Subject: Danzig/Petty >
> Ohh, yum, I love the smell of sweet sarcasm in the morning. . . LOL, lol, > LOL.
I wasn't being sarcastic. I *LIKE* Tom Petty and Glenn Danzig.
> >mechanism by which CD-ROMs run). You simply cannot be losing bits during > >such a transfer (else how would a cd-rom program run? Having random bits > > cd readers have error correction. that's why you can still play a CD that's > visibly scratched - once you can see the scratch there's no doubt that some > of the pits and flats have been altered. it can make up for a certain amount > of missing bits. so yes, even if you lost bits, it woudn't stop working > altogether, although the bits stuck in by the error correction algorithm > aren't the same as the original ones, and after quite a few generations i'm > sure you'd be able to audibly notice the difference. > i'm no expert either, i only have a basic understanding of all this stuff > (although i'm a computer engineering major so i'll be learning it all soon, > i'm sure :), but that's what i udnerstand. maybe someone like rogerio or > sumfin who actually knows about thsi stuff technically can expand what i > said? also, i'm curious - what's CRC, exatcly? i know when you're extracting > a compressed file it has CRC checks (i asume to verify that the extracted > file matches the original) and i also assume that this is extended to cd > reading. info? moo.
CRC stands for "Cyclic Redundancy Check", if I'm not mistaken. Information is stored sequentially multiple times - this is why you can have a scratch and lose NO quality - the CD-player will notice that one of the multiple instances of the digital word (I'm not sure of the bit length) is different than the others, and will ignore it. Note that this solves your problem for radial scratches only... for scrathes that are in a ring (perpendicular to the radius...), you more likely than not have fucked up all instances of the sample. (I'm not sure if they are stored exactly in a row or if they space them slightly...I believe its the latter, but they aren't too far apart.) HOWEVER, since the data represents sampled analog audio, which has a bandwidth of approx 20-22.05 kHz, and cannot change values instantly, the player can make an educated "guess" as to what the missing data should be, given that only a few of the samples are bad. Yeah, it's not the same as the original, but it's better than scrapping the whole track, and *MY* tin ears can't tell anything is wrong unless it skips over a few samples.
Now Al, I wasn't taking into account outside disturbances like a full power RF source or a nuclear explosion or anything like that, and I can see how it might affect your electronics, but shouldn't the recorder fail to record totally if it is recieving constant errors? I mean, if *I* were to design the thing, I'd want the whole damn thing to crap out instead of giving me incorrect data - that would be the use of redundancy and error checking. I mean, if you were recording data instead of audio, there's no way in hell you'd want the random bits CowGod (moo.) was mentioning in there - do you have a crappy piece of equipment, or are most burners this way? Can you record data onto floppies or other magnetic media when your friend cranks up the juice? I'm curious... Maybe I'm not understanding.
Body strong. Mind weak. -Loooooooooeeeeeeeeee
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 10:13:24 -0500 From: "Blevins, Mike" <BlevinsM@amsc.belvoir.army.mil> To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Speaking of Jaxx shows... Message-ID: <413835162AC9CF11AE9602070116CC5EAD6648@AMSC_NTAS>
Kez scribbled...
> So, Mr. Port........err........Mike, it's not THAT far to hop > down to VA > again, is it? > Pretty please?
Somehow I don't see it happening, which is too bad, 'cause the place woul dbe packed again.
Mike very graciously passed on the correct info to me - DT's not doing any shows after the 1st. Jay got ahead of himself, as usual. :)
HOWEVER, do you NoVA/DC/Maryland types want to to a fellow 'jammer a favor? There's a little underpromoted show on the 19th of December that it would be really cool if some of you would come down to. My band, Division (like you guys don't know that...) managed to talk Jay into letting us bring an unknown, out of town band that we like down on a weekend. That band is Enertia, who are an excellent power metal band from NY. If this show goes well - i.e. the turnout is good - we'll have some latitude with what bands we can get into the club. This may let us do something like bring labelmates Digital Ruin down to do a show at some point.
So, HELP! It's only six bucks, and the bands will be good for a change... :)
Mike Division
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 07:39:06 -0800 From: Lisa Marie <ytsegirl@pacbell.net> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4469 Message-ID: <3666B09A.962E380F@pacbell.net>
Tobias Eidem wrote: > > Hi! > Does anybody here know about some sites with prog on mp3, for example spocks > beard, magellan and stuff like that?
You can find a few Spock's Beard mp3s here... http://www.dreamt.org/jessie/mp3.htm
I don't have any Magellan, but there are a few other bands you might want to check out if you haven't heard them already (Porcupine Tree, Vanden Plas, Event).
-- Lisa Marie "Jessie" ytsegirl@pacbell.net http://www.dreamt.org/jessie _______________________________ Ytsejam Radio on Real Audio http://www.dreamt.org/ytseradio
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 10:39:45 -0500 From: "Krishna Donepudi" <skd7789@megahertz.njit.edu> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Junoon Message-ID: <002901be1ed3$42d76e20$6fb2eb80@krishna.njit.edu>
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0025_01BE1EA9.3E795D40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hey everyone,
I have a Pakistani friend who insisted that I listen to a Pakistani rock = group named Junoon. Well, I gave them a listen and they are awesome. = Very progressive. If anyone wants to check them out, go to = http://www.bates.edu/~amalik/musicMP.html . Their bassist is American = (dominating bass lines like Geddy). Of course, the lyrics are not in = English, but they are worth a listen.
Thanks
Krishna Donepudi kdonepudi@yahoo.com
------=_NextPart_000_0025_01BE1EA9.3E795D40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"> <HTML> <HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 = http-equiv=3DContent-Type> <META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV> <DIV>Hey everyone,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have a Pakistani friend who insisted that I listen to a Pakistani = rock=20 group named Junoon. Well, I gave them a listen and they are = awesome. =20 Very progressive. If anyone wants to check them out, go to <A=20 href=3D"http://www.bates.edu/~amalik/musicMP.html">http://www.bates.edu/~= amalik/musicMP.html</A>=20 Their bassist is American (dominating bass lines like = Geddy). Of=20 course, the lyrics are not in English, but they are worth a = listen.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Krishna Donepudi</DIV> <DIV><A=20 href=3D"mailto:kdonepudi@yahoo.com">kdonepudi@yahoo.com</A></DIV></DIV></= BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0025_01BE1EA9.3E795D40--
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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 16:58:00 +0100 From: CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: guitarists / Crossroads / DT acapella Message-ID: <3666B508.9EF90124@mol.com.mk>
> Date: Wed, 02 Dec 1998 21:30:59 -0500 > From: Mike Coulam <mcoulam@magma.ca> > Subject: 90s guitarists > > Shawn Lane, Greg Howe, Michael Lee Firkins, Tony McAlpine,
Geez! Recently I found album by Michael Lee Firkins!!! Wow! This guy can play! :) But he surely had weird style! I never heard of him! Can anyone say some more???
> Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 01:36:11 EST > From: Nshsunsfan@aol.com > Subject: Vai-Cross Roads *NDTC* > > << Can PLEASE someone say if the Vai stuff from "Crossroads" > can be found on some kind of release??? >> > > Hey Cyberduke: > An insider to the Vai group answers your question: > > <<however Steve has a box set > coming out next year that will include all of that music > and even more that you never heard in the film edit.>> > > Lots of good info at Vai.com too.
I can't get www.vai.com! Few days already! :(
> _____Nikki_____________________
Thanks Nikki! So, how does usually box set sells? Separately or all box set! I know FlexAble will be available separately but what about others?
> Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 04:13:42 EST > From: Uroborosss@aol.com > Subject: Shortenings, Portnoy Clinic, Fan Club > > > Mike playing a drums-only version of the middle of Metropolis I > > (thankfully we'll have to start specifying I and II :) with the > > rest of us humming all the guitar/bass/keys parts. > > Fun, wasn't it? Makes you want to start an acapella DT choir. :)
Woohoo! That'll be the day! Why not? After I heard song like "Ytsejam on classical piano", everything is possible! :)
Hey folks, one cool thing: For all your friends who hate loud guitars music, rock 'n stuff and your fave band DT, just play them "Ytsejam for classical piano"! I swear they'll accept it as good stuff, good playing - they'll like it, because folks when hearing piano only think it's Liszt, Chaikovsky etc. = classical music; and they can't say classical music is NOT good!
And then you smack their heads and say "That's DT cover dude!" :) It happened to me already! :) I just LOVE proving people wrong! ;) --
CyberDuke _______________________________________________________ Home Page http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Gym/3466/ E-mail duskob@mol.com.mk ICQ# 17392722 _______________________________________________________
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4474 **************************
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