YTSEJAM Digest 4498
Today's Topics:
1) Re: 7-String by ear
by Uroborosss@aol.com
2) Re: TSO on Conan!!!
by Michael Kizer <mkizer@goodnet.com>
3) TSO on Conan!!!/7-string guitars
by Rogerio Brito <rbrito@ime.usp.br>
4) Response: Let's chill; ego.
by Stephen Dedalus <mattb@mbay.net>
5) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4497
by JKorby1973@aol.com
6) New Prog/Metal Mailing list in the making
by "Di" <dcote@ttlc.net>
7) where to get the ytsejam shirt
by Joshua Rasiel <jrasi@bigfoot.com>
8) Trans-Siberian Orchestra on Conan
by Joe DeAngelo <jdeangelo@home.com>
9) Huh? :) (NDTC)
by Chris Schulze <schulze2@mindspring.com>
10) DT on LiveConcerts.com but also...
by Brad Plumb <palpatine@earthlink.net>
11) Re: TSO on Conan!!!/7-string guitars
by JamesAhab@aol.com
12) A Christmas Miracle
by Lobsterback <hender@wam.umd.edu>
13) Re: A Christmas Miracle
by "Graham Boyle" <icarus@sydney.net>
14) Livetime Reviewed
by Yes0001@aol.com
15) LTE2!!!
by "Jarno Tuomainen" <jarno_tuomainen@hotmail.com>
16) CD for sale/swap list updated, mainly Progressive Rock/Metal
by Erik Gorissen <egorissen@online-club.de>
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Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 18:38:40 EST
From: Uroborosss@aol.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Re: 7-String by ear
Message-ID: <a9fa0998.3672fe80@aol.com>
> From: "Christopher Ptacek" <someone@prognosis.com>
> Subject: 7-string by ear
>
> While I agree open strings sound different than fretted strings, it's simply
not
> the case that you can tell, when there's heavy enough distortion.
When there's heavy enough distortion sometimes I wonder if it's a six-string
bass emitting volcanic power chords. Then there's Korn, which uses distortion
that sounds like a garbage can being ground up between two garbage trucks
moving in opposite directions.
> The difference in tone that you hear between hitting an E5 power chord in
> open position or in 5th position on the low B/E can be produced by having
> dull strings, half wounds (what I have as a low B right now) etc.
It can be produced that way. The opening riff of King's X "Ear Candy" involves
the open A-string, which in their tuning is Ab. I know it's an open string
without reading a transcription, and I know it isn't just the fourth fret of
the low-E on a guitar tuned to E. The difference in tone between this opening
chord, and hitting an all-fret power chord with no open strings, CAN be caused
by dull strings or my EQ. That's not debatale. But I know that "Ear Candy"
chord is an open Ab power chord with an open string, and I don't need to ask
Ty Tabor to verify that. There are lots of cases where it's obvious what the
open strings are tuned to, which could lead to a conclusion that the player is
using a 7-string. And you're also correct in that sometimes it's impossible to
tell because of heavy distortion. I don't think we're still arguing about the
same thing.
> Your EQ can affect how it will sound. The amount of distortion will affect
the
> sound and your ability to hear what's going on.
Agreed.
> The only reason you know for sure that JP plays 7 string is because you know
> a lot about him.
I don't even need to know his name is John Petrucci to tell you that he uses
open high E's and B's in almost half of his big fat chords. I know it's a
7-string "for sure" because I can recognize the open high strings and the
obvious low pitches of the low-B. I don't need to study John Petrucci's
transcriptions or see him at a clinic to determine this stuff just by
listening to an album like "Awake."
> Bands like Orgy, KoRn, Crimeny/Derek Taylor, Symphony X, Sevendust etc are
> all very ambiguous as to 7 string usage.
Yes. Are they 100% of the possible examples? We're both correct because we're
not in complete opposition.
> As I said, the only way you can be sure is to see em play, or to read about
> it. Anything else is just conjecture.
After hearing "Hermit" by Ron Thal, it was also total conjecture for me to say
"sounds like he's using a nickel, or a thimble." Conjecture in YOUR opinion,
because I'd never seen him play and had barely owned "Hermit" for a month, and
no way could my ear tell the difference between a nickel, a thimble, and a
simple aluminum pick hitting the strings. Then you, who had his e-mail address
when I didn't, asked him what metallic device he was using to augment his
playing. What did he tell you? Was his answer "just conjecture," too?
My point is that writing off the human ear as a device for deciphering sonic
qualities is a stupid thing to do. Of course there are albums where it's
impossible to tell if a player is using 6- or 7-string, but in many cases
clues do exist. There are reasons I said "thimble" instead of "aluminum pick,"
and there are obvious reasons why someone could conclude that a band is using
7-string guitars.
Bafu Vai
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Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 17:23:48 -0700
From: Michael Kizer <mkizer@goodnet.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Re: TSO on Conan!!!
Message-ID: <36730914.F5398EF9@goodnet.com>
Darth1@aol.com wrote:
>
>> Just got done watching this...Finally the prog metal world gets some >>exposure!
>> They were AMAZING!
Yeah, it was a good performance, but did you notice that Al P. almost looked
bored to be there (at least he appeared that way to me)... Plus I don't get how
Conan didn't even plud the CD at all... sure he held it up and said the band's
name, but nothing more... He should have at least said "TSO, from their CD
'Christmas Eve and other stories'" and maybe even mention the fact that they do
have another new CD out... It was cool getting to see them on the show
though... I just wish they'd play Letterman or Leno, that would be cool too...
-- ~Michael Kizer <mike@ivorygate.com> <ICQ # 2070538> "Enter ivory gates through midnight skies..." - http://www.ivorygate.com >>> Fates Warning ~ Island In The Stream <<< >>> Dream Theater and Kevin Moore "Unofficial" Song Books <<< >>> Come join the discussions in the new online Bulletin Board! <<<------------------------------
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 22:53:18 -0200 (EDT) From: Rogerio Brito <rbrito@ime.usp.br> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: TSO on Conan!!!/7-string guitars Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.02.9812122248070.10642-100000@jaca>
On Sat, 12 Dec 1998, Michael Kizer wrote:
> Yeah, it was a good performance, but did you notice that Al P. > almost looked bored to be there (at least he appeared that way to > me)... Plus I don't get how Conan didn't even plud the CD at all... > sure he held it up and said the band's name, but nothing more... He > should have at least said "TSO, from their CD 'Christmas Eve and other > stories'" and maybe even mention the fact that they do have another > new CD out... It was cool getting to see them on the show though... I > just wish they'd play Letterman or Leno, that would be cool too...
Coming from under the rock were I've been hiding, here are some comments:
Just to make sure (I know Letterman), but are these Conan and Leno some well-known programs in the US? I mean, those "mainstream" programs, or just those with a small audience?
BTW, regarding the conversation about 7-string guitars, please do keep it here. Even though I can not comment on it (I am not even sure that I understand 100% of what is being said), I am enjoying it and trying to listen to the records/bands/songs mentioned to see if I can identify the elements you mention.
Back to under the rock, until 14th (then, VACATIONS!), Roger...
-- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
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Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 18:00:59 -0800 (PST) From: Stephen Dedalus <mattb@mbay.net> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Response: Let's chill; ego. Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.981212174936.20279A-100000@otter.mbay.net>
OK, this is the last I'll post on this thing, because I'm feeling a bit childish. Mads, I'm not trying to flame you, necessarily. I'm sure you are a musician who is starting to get some true knowledge about how everything works. It's not only what you say, but what other jammers have said that makes me think this. However, I think it's a much more harmonious and kind idea to take someone at face-value. If I told you I could play JP's solow in PMU about four times faster than he could, I think anyone's immediate response would be doubt, but maybe I can. You'd never know until you and I sat in a room with a guitar and amp. Let me just say now that I can't play that solow like that, but... I know it's finals time, I have some of my own. I know what stress feels like. Nevertheless, I think it's much more diplomatic to simply ask someone for proof of what they say they can do, rather than deny they can do it altogether. I am not near the guitarist that I believe you are. I know nothing about 8-finger tapping, very little about fusion-writing (though I'm learning), and my legato skills are lacking. However, I probably can do one or two things you can't, simply because I've practiced different things or whatever. The reason I call what I see from you ego is that your condemnations of other people's knowledge and skills seem exactly that; condemnations. do I have any definite proof you are the amazing guitarist that you might be? No, but you say some things that makes me think I can learn from you, so I present you with questions you might be able to help me answer. I don't think you're a bad person, just quick tempered and overly-cynical. This is *my* opinion and, if you're allowed to give yours about how people know so little, surely I can give mine about how you criticize people. I don't value what you have to say any less. Be well. Matt B
============================================================================ ATTENTION! ATTENTION! ATTENTION! Guitarist in the Santa Cruz/Monterey area of California seeks innovative, experimental, technical, and fun-loving musicians to create works of art and share them with the public. Enquire if interested. mattb@mbay.net ================================================================================= "With Man gone, will there be hope for Gorilla?... With Gorilla gone, will there be hope for Man?" (Daniel Quin)
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Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 21:07:14 EST From: JKorby1973@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4497 Message-ID: <642f14dd.36732152@aol.com>
In a message dated 98-12-12 18:33:25 EST, you write:
<< Darth1@aol.com wrote: >Just got done watching this...Finally the prog metal world gets some exposure! >They were AMAZING! >- 3 guitarists, two of them I recognized from Savatage >- 2 keyboardists, one I recognized from Savatage >- and a small orchestra! >They did that "Ring Christmas Bells" song (I don't know if that is the exact >title or not...). Christmas Eve Sarajevo 12/24 is the name of it, I believe. Kinda a hybrid of Carol of the Bells and God Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen. Cool tune. >Question: How many members of Savatage are in this band? Okay, the drummer, the heavy-set keyboardist with the long brown hair, the two outer guitarists (of the three), and the bassist are all Savatage performing members. Also, the third guitarist, the dude in the middle is Paul O'Neil. From what I've heard, he and Jon Oliva (the keyboardist) actually are THE driving force behind Savatage, so he's kinda like a 7th member. All of Savatage was there except for the vocalist, Zakk Stevens. They played the song nice'n heavy too :) But I was SOOOO waiting for Jon just to bust out with a gutteral scream... >>
--FUCK! I missed it! What REALLY pisses me off is that I was flipping through channels and caught Conan while he was interviewing one of those Baldwin brothers- William maybe? Anyways, I changed it to something else before TSO came on, (I didn't know they were gonna be on.) If only my batteries in my remote control would have gone bad, then I would've seen it because I would have been to lazy to change the channel! So, in the infamous words of Beavis, "DAMN IT, DAMN IT, SON OF A BITCH!!!!" But I bet you guys will be jealous though when I tell you that I was in David Letterman's audience Thursday night when he had Whitney Houston sing - along w/ a special appearance by Wyclef Jean. Yep, I knew you'd be jealous! Who needs kickass prog music when you have such an original and unique talent like the motherfucking Whitney Houston! Right? RIGHT? <insert chirping of crickets here> Thought so. Later chico's and chica's! JK PS- Those Whitney Houston comments were pure sarcasm by the way. I mean, she's talented I guess, but...well nevermind, you know what I mean. PPS- By the way, you know that totally difficult song she sang that night?(more sarcasm) Well, she had to perform it again after the actual taping of the show, all of those key changes and odd time signatures must have thrown her off the first time. (More sarcasm.) Happy holidays!
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Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 22:27:53 -0500 From: "Di" <dcote@ttlc.net> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: New Prog/Metal Mailing list in the making Message-ID: <004a01be2648$9245c7a0$78ac97ce@dcote>
Hi Everybody
I'm in the process of setting up Progressive and Heavy Metal mailing list.
Anyone who's interested, please e-mail me privately, or You can join the list by going to the following web page:
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/Prog_Heavy_Metal
If you do not wish to join this list, please ignore this message.
Thanks, Di *Keeper of the Prog and Heavy Metal List* dcote@ttlc.net
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Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 23:09:56 -0500 From: Joshua Rasiel <jrasi@bigfoot.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net, mwstanic@mtu.edu Subject: where to get the ytsejam shirt Message-ID: <36733E14.B213FCA7@bigfoot.com>
>Could someone please tell me where I can get the latest edition >of the ytsejam shirts? Thanks- > > Matt Stanich
Absolutely. You can get the ytseshirt from me by sending a check or money order for $18, including shipping. My address is:
Joshua Rasiel 5 Brookhill Drive West Nyack, NY 10994
Of course, all the info and pix are on my site. And, Matt, because your interest was so proactive, you'll be reading this twice. :)
-- Joshua Rasiel jrasi@bigfoot.com www.j51.com/~mrasiel "Shop Smart. Shop...S-Mart!"
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 00:14:00 -0500 From: Joe DeAngelo <jdeangelo@home.com> To: YTSEJAM <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Trans-Siberian Orchestra on Conan Message-ID: <36734D18.33751711@home.com>
Darth1@aol.com wrote: > >Just got done watching this...Finally the prog metal world gets some > exposure! > >They were AMAZING!
Hell yeah.
> > Question: How many members of Savatage are in this band?
Vincent replied: <SNIP> > Also, the third guitarist, the dude in the middle is > Paul O'Neil. From what I've heard, he and Jon Oliva (the keyboardist) > actually are THE driving force behind Savatage, so he's kinda like a 7th > member.
Yeah, that's correct. Paul O'Neill is Savatage's producer, and co-writer of nearly all of their stuff (with Jon Oliva). He doesn't actually perform on any Savatage releases though (at least, I'm pretty sure he doesn't).
> > Do they only get > > together around Christmas time?
No, actually TSO is currently at work on their 3rd release, a (non-holiday) concept CD called Beethoven's Last Night, which will be out early '99. Also, there should be a new Savatage release in '99 as well.
I'm EAGERLY awaiting both of these! =)
> > Because I remember seeing a music video on > >"eMpTV" about 5 years ago for one of the songs on an older album of theirs and > > remember thinking that, "Hey, this rocks... Christmas Metal!"
Was the video Savatage, or TSO? If you're talking about TSO, it couldn't have been 5 years ago, because they didn't come out until '96. The song they played on Conan was originally from a Savatage CD though, Dead Winter Dead...... but even that didn't come out until '95. Nothing else they've done is Christmas related.
--
- Joe D. aka Magellan jdeangelo@home.com ICQ # 1872723 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- I swear on tomorrow- If you take this chance- Our lives are this moment The music, the dance- And here in this labyrinth- Of lost mysteries I close my eyes on this night- And you're all that I see - Savatage, from "Not What You See" -----------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 00:38:50 -0500 From: Chris Schulze <schulze2@mindspring.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Huh? :) (NDTC) Message-ID: <367352EA.D9DF1778@mindspring.com>
First, I read this:
<<This is DEFINITELY of serious enough content to post!! How much can the government decide to take from us without the general public realizing that this is turning into a communist country? It's PATHETIC!! >>
Then I saw who wrote:
<<From: "Dream Theater" <dtdrummin@hotmail.com> >>
Then it all made sense :) Drummers... ::sigh:: :)
Now back to our regularly scheduled jam :)
Christian.
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 00:27:13 -0600 From: Brad Plumb <palpatine@earthlink.net> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: DT on LiveConcerts.com but also... Message-ID: <2.2.32.19981213062713.006acb24@earthlink.net>
Hey guys, if you check the schedule for the liveconcerts.com showings for that night, they're a Satch concert just before DT! Signing up is free, and they also have an interview with DT in their archives. Check it out.
BrAd PlUmB Co-President of NARF (North Houston Anime Resistance Force) If you live in Houston and you like anime check us out! NARF Homepage: http://students.ou.edu/T/Joshua.R.Tompkins-1/narf/ "Thank God I'm an aetheist" -Luis Bunel "What an incredible smell you've discovered" -Han Solo, Star Wars: A New Hope "High School's much better than Junior High, people still call you names but they don't do it as much to your face." -Welcome to the Dollhouse
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 01:21:43 EST From: JamesAhab@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: TSO on Conan!!!/7-string guitars Message-ID: <54158a41.36735cf7@aol.com>
>< Just to make sure (I know Letterman), but are these Conan and Leno some well-known programs in the US? I mean, those "mainstream" programs, or just those with a small audience? ><
Leno is another "mainstream" late night show, 11:30 to 12:30. Conan follows him from 12:30 to 1:30. Into their 5th year, Conan's starting to get more of an audience. I'm sure TSO gained a few fans after that appearance. I've been wathcing since the beginning myself.
Jim
"I just want to say that I believe life begins at masteurbation." - The Newsroom
NP - Dogma: Feeding the Future
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 01:38:02 -0500 From: Lobsterback <hender@wam.umd.edu> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: A Christmas Miracle Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19981213013802.0085ac44@pop.wam.umd.edu>
My Powermad CD arrived!! Only problem: none of the tracks are labled, save artist name. If anybody out there has the info (song titles, maybe even album of origin) and could pass it on (or a link where I could find it), I'd very much appreciate it.
For those of you in the Baltimore/DC/Philly region that didn't make it to the Soundscape / Emerald Tiers / Mercury Rising concert at Orion Sound Studios earlier this evening, you missed a friggin' good show. Only about 25 people in the audience, though. Sad? I'd say so.
Brian "Captain Insano" Henderson
=================================== Name: W. Brian Henderson, Esq. Contact: hender@wam.umd.edu ROBOT-CENTRAL: http://www.wam.umd.edu/~hender/ His Faithful Bootleg Page: http://www.wam.umd.edu/~hender/Musik/Boot/ ===================================
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 18:05:35 +1100 From: "Graham Boyle" <icarus@sydney.net> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Re: A Christmas Miracle Message-ID: <001001be2667$02ba3fc0$1b6716cb@graham>
>My Powermad CD arrived!! Only problem: none of the tracks are labled, save >artist name. If anybody out there has the info (song titles, maybe even >album of origin) and could pass it on (or a link where I could find it), >I'd very much appreciate it.
Yeah must be the season for miracles, I finally got my copy of '5YIAL' from cdnow only took 7 weeks to ship Federal Express, when normal airmail post (the 'OIAL cd) took only a week...... Now it would be a mircale if a certain Mr.Khoe, would send me what he owes me, from many months ago.............................. :)
GaZ
NP....Eldritch - El Nino/Nightwish - Oceanborn/Stratovarius - Destiny
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 03:20:05 EST From: Yes0001@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Livetime Reviewed Message-ID: <26b594f4.367378b5@aol.com>
In a special update, the following items have been added to Music Street Journal:A review of the Bruford Levin Upper Extremities December 9th show in Chicago, A review of Dream Theater`s Once In A Livetime (by guest reviewer Sean Faust of Money For The Toll), and an interview with Trent Gardner of Explorer`s Club and Magellan.
Music Street Journal is located at http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Arena/9250/ <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Arena/9250/">Music Street Journal</A>
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 01:01:36 PST From: "Jarno Tuomainen" <jarno_tuomainen@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: LTE2!!! Message-ID: <19981213090136.23306.qmail@hotmail.com>
Just browsed through www.magnacarta.net and found the following information:
LIQUID TENSION EXPERIMENT - "LTE II MA-9035-2 (May 4, 1999) The second dynamic studio album from Mike Portnoy, John Petrucci (both of Dream Theater), Tony Levin (King Crimson, Peter Gabriel, hundreds of others) and Jordan Rudess (Dregs, Rudess-Morgenstein Project). Two weeks, four musicians, lotsa jammin'.
Goddamn, how can I wait THAT long...
______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 11:02:35 +0100 From: Erik Gorissen <egorissen@online-club.de> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: CD for sale/swap list updated, mainly Progressive Rock/Metal Message-ID: <199812131003.LAA16897@clubserv.rp-online.de>
Hi there,
I just wanted to let you know that, after a long time, I have just updated my CD for sale/swap list again.
More than 80 new items (mainly progressive rock/metal) have been added. There are a lot of MP3 sound samples so you can get an idea of the music before you buy or trade anything. In case there shouldn't be a sound sample available for a certain CD (or a certain track) you'd like to check out, I will be prepared to record an MP3 and mail it to you. Just drop me a line.
My URL is: http://private.freepage.de/egorissen
If you would like to trade, please send me your list. In case you want to buy anything, just let me know, then I will reserve the CD/CDs for you and send it off to you after I've received the money. First come, first served, so don't you wait too long... ;-)
Erik
------------------------------------------------------------------- Erik Gorissen Moselstr. 3 D-41564 Kaarst Germany egorissen@online-club.de http://private.freepage.de/egorissen ------------------------------------------------------------------- Homepage of the German Progressive Rock Band MADRIGAL MP3 Sound samples ++ News ++ Lyrics ++ Pics ++ Bio ++ Misc http://www.phil.uni-sb.de/Musik/ProgTeam/Madrigal/ -------------------------------------------------------------------
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4498 **************************
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