YTSEJAM Digest 3417
Today's Topics:
1) WAAF's response to playing Prog-metal
by "Adam Cook" <acook@tiac.net>
2) Re: Review of Hollow Years single
by Damon Fibraio <damon@injersey.com>
3) KM and DS
by "Woolcock" <woolcock@pl.camtech.net.au>
4) Re: VA license plates
by Brian Wherry <bwherry@bu.edu>
5) Re: Bass Drum Pedals No DT Content
by Shawn Carroll <carrolls@psi.com>
6) FW (no DTC)
by "Charlie Korch"<ckorch@raleigh.ibm.com>
7) Bass Drums (no DTC)
by "Charlie Korch"<ckorch@raleigh.ibm.com>
8) X-Mas Cd SPOILERS
by Brian <DreamNDay@dreamt.org>
9) Has California gotten the xmas CD yet?
by Stephen Dedalus <mattb@mbay.net>
10) Re: You or/not Me
by "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com>
11) Re: FW (no DTC)
by "Brian J. Ketelsen" <bketelsen@earthlink.net>
12) speaking of boots and your mother
by Thrak75 <Thrak75@aol.com>
13) DT in Australia
by Bryce Kelaart <bryce@profit.com.au>
14) Re:Bass Drum Pedals
by "ProMark707" <promark707@gccweb.net>
15) Bostonjammers...
by ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack)
16) To those of you who can't read...
by Steve Godbout <sgodbout@microtec.net>
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Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:32:39 -0500
From: "Adam Cook" <acook@tiac.net>
To: <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: WAAF's response to playing Prog-metal
Message-ID: <199801062132.QAA01623@mailnfs0.tiac.net>
Hey guys,
For those of you in the Boston area who are familiar with WAAF....I
thought you may be interested in this post I found on the Perpetual Motion
prog-metal board as it relates to why DT and prog-metal in general doesn't
get airplay...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Posted by Larry D on January 05, 1998 at 17:34:47:
This is one of the few times I will post an e-mail here on the Board,
because I had already planned to ahead of time....
The first letter I wrote was to John Ostiland, the program director fo WAAF
... basically, my letter to him asked if he would consider playing some
prog metal on WAAF
and what he thought was the reason that it wasn't played on radio stations
...
Here is his answer:
hi larry...thanx 4 the kind words...2 reasons: 1). we resrearch our music
weekly, to make sure we are playing songs people want to hear, and "pull me
under" by dream theatre, after a TON of airplay, did not make the cut: the
people did not want to hear it...we don't play genre's, we play songs(how
much new ozzy do you hear? we can't get anything from his last three discs
to test)...2). the masses are asses, and we program to those masses...the
music in that genre, goes way over the masses heads'...j.o.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
There you have it. John Ostriland is probably the best DJ at WAAF these
days and he himself admits that the music in the prog-metal genre in
general tends to go over the masses heads....discuss.
Adam
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:51:51 -0500 (EST)
From: Damon Fibraio <damon@injersey.com>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Review of Hollow Years single
Message-ID: <Pine.BSI.4.01.980106165125.2935C-100000@nj5.injersey.com>
Can somebody give me info on the other two fii singles, BMS and YNM in
addition to HY?
-- Damon Fibraio - (keyboardist, vocalist, college radio nightmare) eMail: <damon@injersey.com> "Welcome back my friends to the show that never ends we're so glad you could attend. Come inside, come inside." --Emerson Lake and Palmer------------------------------
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 07:48:31 +1030 From: "Woolcock" <woolcock@pl.camtech.net.au> To: "YtseJam Mailing List" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: KM and DS Message-ID: <199801062144.IAA28893@goliath.camtech.com.au>
Hi there!
I've been thinking for some time now that I feel I prefer Kevin Moore over Derek Sherinian. It seems as if now that KM has left, the band are starting to have quite a different sound, and I wouldn't like to see them turn into another average Metallica or Pantera (not that these two bands are bad). I think DS just hasn't got the same feel as KM. WFS from I&W and SDV from Awake (both written by KM) have excellent keyboard parts. I feel that DS has different views as to how the band should play (although I've never met him) and I certainly miss how KM used to accompany JP when he played his solos (ie. the whole song).
Well, see ya from down under. Love to hear from any other Aussies on the 'jam.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------- Shane Woolcock - woolcock@pl.camtech.net.au WWW - http://rampage.ml.org/sector1/~samah/ "Lifting shadows off a Dream once broken She can turn a drop of water into an ocean" - DT --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:47:11 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Wherry <bwherry@bu.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: VA license plates Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.96.980106164538.15482B-100000@acs6.bu.edu>
There are several personalized ones? Hmmm.... seems like every VA plate I've ever seen that was not personalized started with the letter "z".
Interesting.
Wacky
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 16:50:16 -0500 From: Shawn Carroll <carrolls@psi.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Cc: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Bass Drum Pedals No DT Content Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980106165013.0098cd30@p3.herndon.psi.com>
I use a DW 5002A double pedal. I used to use a turbo double (I don't remember the model number) when I was gigging in school. =20
I also have mine relatively loose. It seems to me that the tighter they are, I find myself working overtime to play fast.
I know that Neil Peart switched to trad. grip for the test for echo tour/album. Also, Stewart Copeland from the Police uses trad grip.
Shawn
> Ville Rassi wrote: >Hey. > >Since there hasn=B4t been any "drumtalk" on the jam for a while, I thought= =20 >I should start some up. :-) I=B4d like to know your insights about=20 >bassdrum pedals.What brand do you use, how you tension your pedals,=20 >etc...I personally use a Pearl p-202 double pedal, and tension the=20 >springs very loosely.I can=B4t understand how someone can play fast=20 >doublebass patterns with the springs tensioned tightly.I know Nick Menza=20 >of Megadeth does this. > Also, are there a lot of drummers here who only use=20 >traditional(military)grip?I use it when I play jazz, since it doesn=B4t=20 >require much volume but I find it really difficult to play hard with a=20 >traditional grip.Doesn=B4t Mark Zonder play with a trad.grip? > >-Vilzu- >
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 17:26:38 -0400 From: "Charlie Korch"<ckorch@raleigh.ibm.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: FW (no DTC) Message-ID: <85256584.007AF212.00@ATLMAIL.IBMUS2.IBM.COM>
>>I finally broke out the Chasing Time cd I bought last summer and started listening to it because of all the FW content on the 'Jam lately. Some of the stuff is really good, but some of it sounds too much like 80's metal.<<
Some of it is 80's metal. I myself was not much of a FW fan before they got Ray Alder (No Exit, and after), and I am not that fond of the "80's" stuff either. Check out their albums from newest to oldest if you aren't a fan of the Iron Maiden/early Queensryche stuff.
>>Can a dedicated Fate's fan tell me which songs come from which albums so I can gauge what albums I can safely buy?<<
It is listed in the liner notes. Just crack it open and take a look inside.
Charlie
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Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 17:36:45 -0400 From: "Charlie Korch"<ckorch@raleigh.ibm.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Bass Drums (no DTC) Message-ID: <85256584.007ACC95.00@ATLMAIL.IBMUS2.IBM.COM>
>>I?d like to know your insights about bassdrum pedals<<
I personally like the Yamaha pedals. I use the old Pearl p-880 model double pedal, and I haven't had any problem. The Yamaha seems to be a little smoother. I have also tried DW's and I am in the minority, in that, I don't really care for them. I don't dislike them, I just rather have a set of Yamaha pedals. If there good enough for Dave Weckl, there good enough for me.
>>how you tension your pedals<<
Medium
>> Also, are there a lot of drummers here who only use traditional(military)grip?<<
I doubt this. There aren't many drummers today who use atraditional grip. I would tend to think that most drummers are using matched grip these days.
>>I use it when I play jazz, since it doesn?t require much volume<<
There are many drummers who are able to achive power while using the traditional grip. Check out Stewart Copeland, and Dave Weckl. Now that is power (and finesse).
>>but I find it really difficult to play hard with a traditional grip.<<
I also find it hard, but because of my setup. I tend to hit my elbow against the hi-hat when playing traditional, and trying to get around the kit.
>>Doesn?t Mark Zonder play with a trad.grip?<<
Exclusively (as does Neil Peart, who fomerly switched back and forth). If you ask me, it is a personal preference. There is no right or wrong way. Just do what feels right. But I must say, that the only way to properly play the brushes (IMHO) is by using a traditional grip. Come to think of it, all of my favorite drummers play traditional. I better go switch :)
Charlie
Sorry about the long post everyone.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 17:39:06 -0800 From: Brian <DreamNDay@dreamt.org> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: X-Mas Cd SPOILERS Message-ID: <34B2DCBA.47C7@dreamt.org>
Well, I was pleasantly surprised to recieve my XMas cd today. While I was hoping to have some of the unreleased tracks, or possibly some covers, The making of FII was pretty cool, and gave me something to listen to at work. The packaging is better too. Now it looks like a professional bootleg instead of someone's basement bootleg ;) Does anyone know if the alternate version of Take Away My Pain is the same as the demo version from the Japanese FII? It really moved me. When he said "All I could think about was this was the last time we'd ever talk again" or whatever the exact lyric was, it sent chills all throughout my body. I also liked Derek's little Elton John riffs. Anyway, that was in addition to Grip Inc's Nemesis and the new Primus that I recieved as late Xmas presents today, so it's been a good day. ========================================================================
"Are you gonna bark all day, little ----- doggie, or are you gonna ---- ------------- ---- bite?"-Micheal Madsen, ---- - ---- Reservoir Dogs -- - - - - - - - -- "Years of pain I will take and hone - - - - - - - Manifest with your broken bones - - -- - -- - - My heart bleeds for none but my -- - - - - - - - -- own"-Machine Head ---- - - - ---- "None But My Own" ---- ------------- ---- Brian ----- DreamNDay@dreamt.org ========================================================================
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 14:41:07 -0800 (PST) From: Stephen Dedalus <mattb@mbay.net> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Has California gotten the xmas CD yet? Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.980106143940.6684A-100000@otter.mbay.net>
Yo... mamas, This is mainly to all the jammers in CA. Have any of you gotten the xmas CD yet? I haven't. I just wanna make sure that I'm still on the fan club list or whatever. Be well. Matt B
"That is the truth. Not the hammer and sickle; not the stars and stripes; not the cross; not the sun; not gold; not yin and yang, but the smile... Because they died, we know we still live. Because a star explodes and a thousand worlds like ours die, we know this world is. That is the smile, that what might not be is." (John Fowles, The Magus)
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Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 14:46:37 -0800 From: "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: You or/not Me Message-ID: <199801062248.OAA12195@baygate.bayarea.net>
Trevor W. Hoit wrote (regarding You or/not Me):
> In the latest issue of the fanzine, it says that they were going to > "throw away" > the track, so what the heck, give it to DC and see what he could do with > it. > This proves two things: > A) Without DC, we may never even have heard You or Me or You Not Me, > so you really should thank him.
Who's to say it wouldn't have still been released as a b-side? Now, I do think that there is a potential advantage of letting Desmond Child doctor the song and putting it on the album. Namely, it could be a big hit for them, meaning more fans, more album sales, and ultimately a greater guarantee of more future albums. However, there is at least one potential disadvantage to You Not Me becoming a big hit. If You Not Me does well, then EastWest may pressure DT into doing more Desmond Child collaborations in the future. I know that this is something I definitely don't want to see. > 2) The fanzine contains information that is not on the Jam, and is well > worth > subscribing to, especially since you get a free cd that is really > cool.
Good idea! In fact, I sent in my subscription fee a few months ago. Unfortunately, the fan club is currently having some problems processing subscriptions sent to the NY address, so mine has not yet been processed. :( (By the way, if any of you jammers who have been complaining about the contents of the Christmas CD want to give your copy to me, I'll be happy to take it off your hands.)
Vincent G. LuPone wrote (regarding You Not Me):
> To me, this is the weakest song Dream Theater has ever put out. It > ranks right down there with "Poor Twisted Me" by Metallica, > "Problems" by Megadeth, and that song on Steve Vai's Fire Garden > where all the people are singing. Every great band needs at least > one bad song :) Let's be thankful it's only one bad song, out of 5 > albums. Not too shabby!
I agree with these sentiments 100%!
Paul
----------- Paul Humm humm@levy.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:41:21 -0700 From: "Brian J. Ketelsen" <bketelsen@earthlink.net> To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: FW (no DTC) Message-ID: <001601bd1af4$399991f0$070325a6@csp03996.cs.mci.com>
I forgot to mention that my ex-wife seems to have the case with liner/notes...
BrianK
>>>Can a dedicated Fate's fan tell me which songs come from which albums so >I >can gauge what albums I can safely buy?<< > >It is listed in the liner notes. Just crack it open and take a look >inside. > >Charlie
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Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 17:43:04 EST From: Thrak75 <Thrak75@aol.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: speaking of boots and your mother Message-ID: <7a2f7951.34b2b37b@aol.com>
a) i'm realllllllllllllllllly hoping that there is someone on here who was slick enough to have carried a dat recorder into the vanderbilt show and taped it. if someone does have a boot, PLEEEEEEEEEEEASE email me. plotkin, oh he with the nice hair, had a good point in stating that that show was one of a kind.
b) regarding the setlist debate- metzger, m'boy, you so money, you don't even know how money you are. i've always wished that they could be a little more surprising with the setlist. not like it makes a whole big difference to me, since i don't go to all that many of their shows (in comparison to other jammers). however, other people brought up good points about how they have to promote fii, and how perhaps since there's not a lot of room for improv/error, they like to keep things as close to same as possible.
but look at a guy like zappa (not that i'm comparing dt to zappa- zappa wins, always *smirk*)...he put on a show where there was almost no room for error, and i have a hard time imagining that a setlist stayed the same for more than 2 nights on a tour. just my thoughts on the matter.
peace. ytsegoon
************************************************************************ david y. kobayashi the new york law school thrak75@aol.com dkobayashi@nyls.edu
"i'm the monster you created in your daddy's name." - j. petrucci ************************************************************************
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Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 09:52:00 +1100 From: Bryce Kelaart <bryce@profit.com.au> To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: DT in Australia Message-ID: <C18C6DDCB0F9D01192CB00403330BAB3025274@hal.profit.com.au>
>Fingers crossed DT make it downunder this year > >graham
Considering Australia's DT fanbase was introduced to Mike P when he came down to do the drum clinic and with FII being released locally, along with the rest of the back catalogue (Finally!), this could be a possibility.
Bryce K bryce@profit.com.au
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Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:53:33 -0600 From: "ProMark707" <promark707@gccweb.net> To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re:Bass Drum Pedals Message-ID: <000a01bd1af6$7089d4c0$9870d9cd@default>
>etc...I personally use a Pearl p-202 double pedal, and tension the >springs very loosely.
I use the Pearl Power Shifter P-202 also. It's way smooth. I also like Tama's Iron Cobras. I haven't tried out the Premier Pedal yet, but I've heard much niceness about it.
> Also, are there a lot of drummers here who only use >traditional(military)grip?I use it when I play jazz, since it doesn=B4t >require much volume but I find it really difficult to play hard with a >traditional grip.Doesn=B4t Mark Zonder play with a trad.grip? >>-Vilzu-
I also prefer matched grip over traditional. (and MZ does use Traditional= )
Curtis "StickS" Toler ProMark707@DigiScape.com http://www.DigiScape.com/perspgs/272/sticks.htm Mr. Slate's Web Site: http://www.DigiScape.com/perspgs/272/default.htm
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Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 18:10:53 +0000 From: ernie@pananet.com (Ernesto Schnack) To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Bostonjammers... Message-ID: <19980106131348.AAC17557@sni.pananet.com>
As some of you may already know, Im going to Berklee soon (next week to be exact). So if anybody's interested in getting together for a beer or anything let me have your phone # so i can get in touch with you when i get there.
..and a welcoming party for Kevin Hammer and me is totally out of the question *hint*hint* ;)
later, Ern
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Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 18:29:54 -0500 From: Steve Godbout <sgodbout@microtec.net> To: YTSEJAM Mailing list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: To those of you who can't read... Message-ID: <34B2BE71.E27A67B9@microtec.net>
>>What a load of fucking bollocks, you speak for all the dedicated fans ? >>I don't think so, I concider myself to be a 'dedicated fan' and I like
>>every song on FII, granted some more than others. >>If you can only find '20 or 30 minutes of bliss' then that's your >>problem :) >> >>graham
>I second that emotion :)
>Buster
I will remind these two guys (and those who cannot read) that in my post, which caused these reactions, I said, not once but twice, at the beginning AND the end, that this was only MY OWN opinion. I also know, having read many jams since the album came out, that I am not alone. So, this being my opinion, it surely makes it my problem :-). I just hope that the jam is still a place to post opinions, ideas and thoughts about DT. If opinions are not your cup of tea, here are a few facts:
Here are a few exerpts from the December 97 issue of Modern Drummer featuring Mike Portnoy:
MD: How would you say the band has progressed?
MP: Well, it's been three years since the las full-lenght album. That's a long time in anybody's life. Three of us have become fathers--my wife and I had a daughter--so any time you have a significant change like that in your life it's going to reflect on your music. The band has a mature outlook now and a feeling of responsibility, and I think that has affected the music we've written. We've always had a vision of going into different musical worlds, but I don't think we had the maturity to be able to make it happen. This time around, we did it.
MD: When you mention the word "maturing" it gives me the impression that the new music is going to be more mainstream.
MP: We obviously want to be as successful as possible. And besides, we've always had a love for commercial music, just as we have for progressive music. We definitely want to be able to do both and not be pigeonholed into a progessive stereotype. At the same time there is the added pressure of the reality that this is the music business. The hardest thing that we've learned, especially in the pas three years, is how much of a business it is. We've been through a lot of changes since the last album--we've changed management, our label contacts have changed, and there has even been a bandmember change. Every time you start dealing with that stuff, you realize the pressures that come into a band. The label isn't telling us what to do, but we know that if we want to continue to do this we have to somehow CROSS OVER INTO THAT MAINSTREAM AND SELL RECORDS.
[...]
MD: There are a few parallels between Rush and Dream Theater, especially in that both bands have had to marry the progressive and commercial sides of the music.
MP: That's what we really focused on with the new album
MD: Are you worried about dissapointing your "progressive" fans?
MP: Yeah, I'm concerned about it. But I really think that people who appreciate good music--even the musicians who like us-- will still enjoy what we are doing. I think there is a lot of depth to this new music, even if it's not all in 13/8. Beleive me, the respect and appreciation that we've gotten from our fans is the most rewarding thing I could ever imagine. I don't want to dissapoint anybody. To win Modern Drummer Readers Polls is a Dream come true. Those mean more to me than gold or platinum albums. I Just hop we can find that balance between success and credibility.
+++++++++
There you have it, straight from the horse's mouth. Like I said, the talent is still there, it's juste the structural complexity of the songs I miss. What do you think? Have they acheived a good balance between sucess and credibility?
Take Care...
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 3417 **************************
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