YTSEJAM Digest 3501
Today's Topics:
1) Rating DT and DT converts
by Matthew Robbins-McDaniel <cfi@disknet.com>
2) DT Japanee tour report (part 1)
by "Hitomi Iwai" <hitomi@fsinet.or.jp>
3) rating systems
by Chris Daley <cdaley@gmu.edu>
4) Re: Innocence Faded rocks my ass!
by Stephen Dedalus <mattb@mbay.net>
5) Re: Innocence Faded rocks my ass!
by Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
6) Re: The math of music
by a thing with a voice <afn39111@afn.org>
7) math/innocence
by Brian Larkin <ambicwts@postoffice.ptd.net>
8) re: playing with the humour impaired
by a thing with a voice <afn39111@afn.org>
9) Re: Well I knew it was comming....
by Matt Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
10) Re: song length
by Matt Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
11) Metropolis Part 2 lyrics!
by Jeremy Hyde <tempus@trek.alliance.net>
12) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3500
by "Brian Reeves" <ytsejammer@writeme.com>
13) Re: Metropolis Part 2 lyrics!
by Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
14) Rating System Thread
by "Richard D. Urban Jr." <radmax@fia.net>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:13:25 -0500
From: Matthew Robbins-McDaniel <cfi@disknet.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Rating DT and DT converts
Message-ID: <34CBD525.FD39C14D@disknet.com>
Hi everyone,
> I just read some jerk off who made a rating system of 1 to 5 for DT
> songs. This guy must have his thumb up his ass. He's obviously into
> Dream Theater entirely for the "balls and chunk" aspect of it.
Maybe the original post rating the DT albums was just a joke, maybe not.
Doesn't really matter to me. The point is that it is all subjective and totally
based on personal opinion. I did find it interesting to all the
"keyboard/piano" songs got a "zero" rating. I know that there are a ton of
jammers that think those are the best of the DT songs. I have one DT convert to
my credit and I was able to achieve that by getting him to listen to Surrounded,
Another Day, Wait for Sleep, Anna Lee, and all the other DT songs that the balls
and chunk only guys always seem to bitch about. I personally love the balls and
chunk of DT, but I have a varied enough musical interest to apperciate
everything they do for what it is...great!
~Matt
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:16:25 +0900
From: "Hitomi Iwai" <hitomi@fsinet.or.jp>
To: <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: DT Japanee tour report (part 1)
Message-ID: <008f01bd29ef$dffc0500$4f6ed7ca@toshiba-user>
Hello, there.
This is my first time to post my mail on Ytsejam.
I attended to all the DT Japanese shows this month. They played 6 shows here
in Japan.
Their Japanese concert promoter UDO carried DT tour report on their web
pages in Japanese (I guess it's called 'DT episodes on Japanese tour' rather
than 'DT tour report'!).
I translated it in English. In spite of it, I wrote some concert reviews,
setlists and the other things as follows:
*DREAM THEATER JAPANESE TOUR REPORT BY UDO ARTISTS*
(Setlists and my comments included.)
---Jan. 8th---
DT got to Japan one day late comparing to the normal arrival date.
Unfortunately, it snowed a lot in Tokyo. Although we always take the band
and crew to the hotel by car, we changed a plan to use airport train called
"Narita Express" for Tokyo station. But "Narita Express" is also stopped
because of too much snow. After all, the DT family had to take 6 hours to
reach Tokyo station by train. They arrived at a hotel at 1 a.m.
(My thought...)
Japanese
fans think why it snowed too much in Tokyo was DT came to Japan! Whenever
they come to Japan since '93, there have been natural disasters here for
example
typhoon in '93, earthquake in Osaka, '95 etc.. Be honest, we DT Japanese
fans
were discussing
before they came here about what would happen next!
---Jan. 9th---
All the members slept before noon deeply because of the horrible happening
last
night. And then, they were headed to the venue Nakano
Sunplaza Hall for the soundcheck and tonight was their 1st gig. After the
show,
They
had dinner
booked by UDO. They looked forward to this dinner-time and they ate meals
with a smile till last.
(My comments)
The audience was a bit of cool. And all the DT guys didn't seem to act so
much in the beginning of the show. But the more this show
went on, the more their performances turned into active. I thought their
performances were great especially the latter of the show. And KJL's voice
was the most wonderful one during this tour. JP used one brand-new Picasso
guitar in blue or gray. He
told me later he got it from Ibanez last month. One Japanese Satellite TV
called 'NHK' recorded some parts of its show and it broadcast in their
music program on the 13th of Jan.
*****SETLIST (at Nakano Sunplaza Hall, Tokyo)*****
Lines in the Sand
Burning My Soul
Voices
Hollow Years
Crack in the Mirror / Puppies on Acid
Just Let Me Breathe
Lie
Peruvian Skies
Pull Me Under
Take Away My Pain
ACoS IV
Ytse Jam (drum solo)
New Millennium
-------------------------------------------------
Metropolis
---Jan. 10th---
Show In Yokohama. That was the only one all-stanging style gig on this tour.
All the members were pleased with the audience's hot reaction.
(My comments)
I was really happy with hearing "Scarred"! This is my best tune from "AWAKE"
album and this was the first time they played this song on the Japanese
tour. In encore
time, their side punk project NICKY LEMONS were formed without JM and KJL. A
guitar-
tech Mark played the bass instead of JM. And of course...a song was "I Don't
Like You" feauturing DS on vocal. DS wore a yellow feather muffler! And the
setlist
was supurb! I guess this show was the best
one during this tour. But Derek told me that some Japanese fans didn't like
NICKY LEMONS because that was just like a comedy. I like NICKY LEMONS
because I realized they could play simple 3-code punk song after hearing
it:-)
One local TV 'TVK' camera crew recorded this show with a couple of cameras
and its live
version "Burning My Soul" broadcast in Masa Itoh's TV program "Bang Up
Rock" on the 15th of Jan. I heard that they had dinner at the Hard Rock
Cafe, but I don't know which HRC they went, HRC Tokyo or HRC Yokohama.
*****Setlist (at Yokohama Bay Hall, Yokohama)*****
Lines in the Sand
Burning My Soul
Voices
Under a Glass Moon
Hollow Years
Crack in the Mirror / Puppies on Acid
Just Let Me Breathe
Peruvian Skies
Pull Me Under
Scarred
ACoS IV
Ytse Jam (drum solo)
New Millennium
----------------------------------------------------
Metropolis
I Don't Like You (featuring NICKY LEMONS)
---Jan. 11th---
Day off. Lots of interviews all the day.
(and Something more...)
Derek had a keyboard clinic at
Laox in Tokyo by Korg. And as far as I know, Mike went shopping to get tons
of bootlegs in the Bootleg-heaven town 'Shinjuku'. I've come out one of his
favorite bootleg video shop called "AIRS" located in Shinjuku the day before
their 1st gig in Tokyo and I talked to one shop clerk at "AIRS" . He longed
Mike came out there......
---Jan. 12th---
At Tokyo Koseinenkin Hall. After the show, They had dinner at the Hard Rock
Cafe Tokyo. They drank little for showing people good shows tomorrow and the
day after tomorrow.
(My comments)
KJL's voice was getting worse a bit since this 3rd show. And DS sang again
in
encore time. But I didn't understand which song they played at that time.
While
Mike's drum solo, he walked down to the front stage from the drum set stage
as hitting one drum, and
he played a drum with 3 fans standing in front of the stage each. He added
this communication-time into his drum solo from this show. And Finally, I
was lucky enough to
hear "Trial of
Tears" here in Japan. Although I felt sleepy while I heard it for the first
time last April in the Netherlands (Sorry!), but I didn't this time! The
more I
listen to this song, the more I can understand how beautiful this song is.
The sound was sometimes awful. I remember that the guitar sound was
too loud in "Hollow Years" and so the bass sound's was.
*****Setlist (at Tokyo Koseinenkin Hall, Tokyo)*****
Lines in the Sand
Burning My Soul
Voices
The Silent Man (electric version)
Pull Me Under
Guitar Solo / Improvised Jam
Peruvian Skies
Hollow Years
ACoS IV
Ytse Jam (drum solo)
New Millennium
--------------------------------------------------
Metropolis
I'll post DT Japanese tour report part 2 in a few days.
To be continued......
_________________________________________________________
+ From: Hitomi Iwai / / / -
- Email to: hitomi@fsinet.or.jp ++-
+ ___/_____/_______/________/_________/__________/
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:51:33 -0500
From: Chris Daley <cdaley@gmu.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: rating systems
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980125195131.007f0540@mason.gmu.edu>
Why have a rating system for DT albums/songs in the first place? It's all
opinionated, everyone has their own preferences...people like DT for
different reasons...having a rating system is absurd because nobody will
agree on anything...therefore it will be inaccurate through everyone's eyes.
Chris.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:26:42 -0800 (PST)
From: Stephen Dedalus <mattb@mbay.net>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Innocence Faded rocks my ass!
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.980125172517.15490A-100000@otter.mbay.net>
I love that song, too. It's definitely in my top ten. Dude, you forgot
to mention when James does that long melisma at the end of the vocals.
That gives me chills every time, especially when he hits that little
"yeah" with all the vibrato. I would listen to that entire song just for
that moment, but the rest of it is just so cool. Be well.
Matt B
"That is the truth. Not the hammer and sickle; not the stars and stripes;
not the cross; not the sun; not gold; not yin and yang, but the smile...
Because they died, we know we still live. Because a star explodes and a
thousand worlds like ours die, we know this world is. That is the smile,
that what might not be is." (John Fowles, The Magus)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 23:58:43 -0200 (EDT)
From: Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: Innocence Faded rocks my ass!
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.980125235755.12506B-100000@dijkstra.linux.ime.usp.br>
On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Stephen Dedalus wrote:
> I love that song, too. It's definitely in my top ten. Dude, you forgot
> to mention when James does that long melisma at the end of the vocals.
Would you people care to help this poor soul and tell it what a
melisma is?
Thank you for any enlightening, Roger... :-)
-- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 21:23:28 -0500 (EST) From: a thing with a voice <afn39111@afn.org> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: The math of music Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.95.980125212140.188429A-100000@freenet2.afn.org>
> this bullshit assumes that the arbitrary numbers anyone chooses to assign > to each song have some real-world concrete value, and that subjective > personal issues have now bearing on the ratings. I could just as easily
"Personal issues." You mean, like *opinion?* The only thing important in artistic judgement?
-=- "I know you all love Billy Ray Cyrus... Fuck, any woman here would fucking almost break her pelvis to open her legs for that mongoloid fuck to drop his filthy cracker seed into your fucking womb. Liar! Liars!" -- Hicks
--------------------==== Broken via True Love ====------------------- http://www.afn.org/~afn39111 Butcher, Rape, Smash to Pieces
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 21:22:56 -0500 From: Brian Larkin <ambicwts@postoffice.ptd.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: math/innocence Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19980125212256.006c7348@postoffice.ptd.net>
Re: that math rating system, I'd have to say without even rating each song that WDADU, I&W, Awake, and ACOS would all get anywhere from 3.5 to 4, and FII would probably get between a 2.7 and a 3.5.
As for Innocence Faded, I too am at a loss to understand how so many people would rate this one as a 2 or less. IF is probably also on my Top 10 Fav DT Songs list. The instrumental end to the song just blows me away every time I hear it, especially Petrucci's solo. And the vocals are fucking awesome.
-bRiAn
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 21:33:32 -0500 (EST) From: a thing with a voice <afn39111@afn.org> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: re: playing with the humour impaired Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.95.980125212615.188429B-100000@freenet2.afn.org>
> songs. This guy must have his thumb up his ass. He's obviously into > Dream Theater entirely for the "balls and chunk" aspect of it. He's
My fave 5 bands are Anglagard, Gentle Giant, King Crimson, Marillion, and DT, not necessarily in that order, so take that as you will as far as balls and chunk and slayer goes.
Face it, though, DT does balls and chunk *well*. But I liked them even better before bnc (would you call OaMoT or the original ACOS "balls and chunk?").
But...
Chris Calabrese wrote:
> > I think the joke's on you... > ..I took it as a joke (especially when he said, "and since I know > everything" or something like that). Grow a sense of humor, unless it's a
This is a smart man, here.
NP: "Starless"
-=- "I know you all love Billy Ray Cyrus... Fuck, any woman here would fucking almost break her pelvis to open her legs for that mongoloid fuck to drop his filthy cracker seed into your fucking womb. Liar! Liars!" -- Hicks
--------------------==== Broken via True Love ====------------------- http://www.afn.org/~afn39111 Butcher, Rape, Smash to Pieces
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:58:46 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Well I knew it was comming.... Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980125185715.26163A-100000@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Mark Philpot wrote:
> >In responce to Matt Johnston...
awww, in response to li'l ole me? Thanks!
> >So, every song kicks ass, excpet for the ones that don't. ^_^ >Very (and I mean this honestly) logically sound. >Unfortulately, you succeeded in making no point whatsoever. >Sorry. Come again drive thru. > > >I succeeded in making no point, but I've come back to the drive thru and >hopefully have successfully reorderd.
Yes, sir. One eXtraValu(tm) meal. That'll be $60 US, please ^_^
> >Every song kicks ass... just some just get a little further up.... :) >
Agreed.
>Mark > > >
--Matt
--------------------------------------------------------------------- "..." --James LaBrie, "Hell's Kitchen" ---------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:18:13 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Johnston <matt2518@gladstone.uoregon.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: song length Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980125190104.26163B-100000@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, a thing with a voice wrote:
> >I don't know. It only takes me a moment to begin on track 3 when >playing Images and Words, so does it really matter how long Pull Me Under >is?
yes. If you hate it -- hate it for all 8:00 (or so). ^_^ That way, you can increase the curve downward, and really drive your point home.
> >Also, if Ytse Jam were twice as long, would it be a better song, and would >WDADU be a better album? You'd probably have to count the song as less on >account of rambling. To use other bands as example, one "Knots" by Gentle >Giant is far superior to one "The Camera Eye" by Rush (still a classic song, >three times as long), and so my opinion would be that "Knots" contributes >more to OCTOPUS than TCE contributes to "MOVING PICTURES." >
I am *not* linking length to quality. I'm just saying if a 3 minute song suck, fine. If Innocence Faded was 12 minutes long, verse, chorus, verse, chorus, wouldn't you want to give it more than a 0? Like a 0 x 12? (well, maybe you should use a 1-5 scale...)
I mean, give credit here -- LTL kicks ass for 11 and a half minutes! By saying Another Day sucks (at only 4 minutes), you saying that Another Day sucks as much in 4 minutes as LTL kicks ass in 12. While that may be true (I won't argue it... ^_^), it isn't fair.
Since you *do* live in a perfect world (you said yourself, you're always right -- I'd want that in my perfect world -- *me* always being right), why not keep things fair? ^_^
on a scale of 1-5, you could have I&W with: <all times rounded> PMU (8:00) -- 3 AD (4:00) -- 1 TTT (8:00) -- 5 Surr (5:00) -- 1 Met (10:00) -- 5 UaGM (7:00) -- 5 WfS (3:00) -- 1 LTL (11:00) -- 5
Total:216/57min = 3.76 Significant change, non?
> > -=- >"I know you all love Billy Ray Cyrus... Fuck, any woman here would fucking >almost break her pelvis to open her legs for that mongoloid fuck to drop >his filthy cracker seed into your fucking womb. Liar! Liars!" -- Hicks > >--------------------==== Broken via True Love ====------------------- > http://www.afn.org/~afn39111 Butcher, Rape, Smash to Pieces > >
--Matt
--------------------------------------------------------------------- "..." --James LaBrie, "Hell's Kitchen" ---------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 23:12:49 -0800 From: Jeremy Hyde <tempus@trek.alliance.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Metropolis Part 2 lyrics! Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980125231245.00686180@trek.alliance.net>
I did a little poking around on the web yesterday, and I believe that I've stumbled upon what looks to be the lyrics for Metropolis Part 2! The page is: http://pw1.netcom.com/~plev/countrylyrickit.html
Enjoy!
Jeremy Hyde - tempus@alliance.net
.loof a er'uoy ,2 tarp siloportem rof sciryl eht era esoht taht kniht uoy fi
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 21:09:54 +0000 From: "Brian Reeves" <ytsejammer@writeme.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3500 Message-ID: <199801260410.UAA06487@odin.ax.com>
I'm surprised that no one else has posted this yet.
I just returned from seeing Spice World at our new 25 theater complex here in town. Wow, not only was it a 4 star movie, but the use of CIAW during the chase scene really made the flick worth seeing again.
And as to all this Empty Tremor stuff, I am of the opinion that,with the exception of Mayadome's Paranormal Activity, this is probably the worst record I've heard since I&W was released.
Just my opinion, of course.
'nuff said
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 02:40:54 -0200 (EDT) From: Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: Metropolis Part 2 lyrics! Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.980126023858.13044A-100000@dijkstra.linux.ime.usp.br>
On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Jeremy Hyde wrote:
> .loof a er'uoy ,2 tarp siloportem rof sciryl eht era esoht taht kniht uoy fi
(-: 31-tor desu uoy fi daer ot redrah eb dluow ti.
...regoR, s[]
-- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 23:37:54 -0600 From: "Richard D. Urban Jr." <radmax@fia.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Rating System Thread Message-ID: <34CC2132.7616@fia.net>
Enough with the rating systems, everyone has their OWN Humble opinion
> On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Chris Calabrese wrote:
>
> >
> >attitude just pisses me off. I'm sorry I'm coming off as an asshole
> >here...but I'm really sick and tired of this shit!
On Sun Jan 25 Matt Johnston wrote, in response to Chris's response of
TWAV's rating system
> I think the joke's on you...
> ..I took it as a joke (especially when he said, "and since I know
> everything" or something like that). Grow a sense of humor, unless it's a
> misdomenor offense to grow/own one in your state.
>
Matt, try looking at "thing with a voice's" web link. IMHO, he DOES think he knows everything, including "C", his own personal GOD. This person IS
really OUT THERE!! This guy has either the biggest insights of anyone
since Moses (yeah, and monkeys might fly out of his but), or he's totally off his rocker. Just look at his SIG file, sounds like he got jilted by a girl who liked country 'shit' better than HIS music.
And to CLUELESS with a voice, IMHO, and I quote from your own
TREMENDOUSLY boring, SEEMINGLY endless and TOTALLY USELESS site "be quiet. No one wants to hear your shit, okay? That's the way it is.
Surround yourself with yourself." If you think OFB is going downhill, quite buying their CD's, quite listening to their music, and BY ALL MEANS, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, quit wasting OUR bandwidth with your excentric meanderings. (OUR meaning the fans who still like OFB)
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 3501 **************************
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