YTSEJAM Digest 4017
Today's Topics:
1) Re: Good thread
by Tom Cox <lexine@rollanet.org>
2) Evaluate
by dreamakers83@hotmail.com
3) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4016
by "Richard A. Rivera" <rrivera@zoo.uvm.edu>
4) Evaluate
by dreamakers83@hotmail.com
5) Re: FX Processors / Gigs
by Madsag@aol.com
6) Double album/Video...
by Alan Estrada <alan_estrada@bigfoot.com>
7) OH MY GOD!
by "Andrew Forcier" <thomas.o.forcier@worldnet.att.net>
8) Remasters / DT/DP/ELP in "Philly"
by Lobsterback <hender@wam.umd.edu>
9) Enough already, Mr. Bahr
by "Mike Patrick" <mepatric@indy.net>
10) Re: LiveConcerts.com Weekly Newsletter 6/29/98 (fwd)
by Mark Bredius <bredius@globalxs.nl>
11) Chromakey! kinda DTC
by calfaro@caribe.net (Carlos Alfaro)
12) Re: ProgMetal Origins
by "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com>
13) Spastic Drummers (was: Dali's Dilemma)
by "Mike Patrick" <mepatric@indy.net>
14) Re: ProgMetal Origins
by KEZCOM@aol.com
15) Re: Official Paris set list
by KEZCOM@aol.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 02:36:02 -0500
From: Tom Cox <lexine@rollanet.org>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: Good thread
Message-ID: <3594A0E2.1CCC@rollanet.org>
> Gigs: I hope my current band will be gigging this fall. From
> those I know who DO gig, I hear that prices are always negotiable once
> the band has established a following. A percentage of the door, a minimum
> amount, and even sometimes a percentage of the bar sales can be
> expected/obtained. It would be great if people would post their common
> percentages / min costs for their band to play. Chances are, Jim, you ARE
> getting screwed if you think you are. If you bring business to the bar,
> then you deserve a cut.
OK, I was a drummer in a cover band for the past two years(until this
last May). Common percentages / min costs? Where I am from, a smaller
hick town in Missouri, you pretty much walk into a place and agree to
what they offer... THAT would be on the first weekend your band played
at the given establishment. Everything after that is in the hands of
whoever has the upper hand. Here's the thing with club and bar gigs,
and gigging in general- Bar owners could give a fuck if your band can
play "Metropolis Pt. 1" note for note, or Beethoven's 5th, for that
matter. It all comes down to how many people you bring in, and, most of
all, how much ALCOHOL you sell. And people, to do that, you have to put
on an awesome show, a LIVE show. You have to make people think that
they are there to watch the sun rise and set on your ass and your ass
alone. That is, if you want to make more and more money at it. Now, my
band was just a party cover band, lots of Ozzy, Metallica, Alice In
Chains, stuff like that. I had one of the best frontmen I have ever
seen(that's "singer" for those that don't talk in barspeak), awesome
voice, tons of power, and presence that would blow people away. Every
damn chick in the places we played wanted to fuck his brains out. Plus
the rest of the band also had the same amount of energy and presence.
Bottom Line: Bars don't care how you play, they care how much money you
make them. My band always sold SHITLOADS of alcohol at gigs. One
night, at this club(I forget where or when), after the night was done,
there was a total of three beers left in the place, and one keg out of
about seven. Not bad considering the place only held 200 people. That
was our first gig there. Our pay went from $250 a night, to $600 a
night, just because of that fact. So, the moral of the story is, learn
your instrument, play it well, play it better than well, and THEN, learn
how to make people have fun and drink and worship the ground you walk
on. If you have hair, use it. If the bar countertop is low enough,
jump up on that fucker and play a guitar solo on it, etc. Everyone
appreciates good musicianship, but Everyone also has a stereo at home.
So if you stand there like a tree stump and play flawlessly, they will
most likely stay home and listen to the stereo the next time you're in
town. If you play the best that you can, while haveing a fucking blast
and going absolutely nuts, those people will travel a long way to see
you again(I know, I've been there). My philosophy is: The key word in
the word "live," is, in fact, LIVE. So go play LIVE, and do it well,
and you'll make money.
Tom Cox
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 00:37:01 -0700
From: dreamakers83@hotmail.com
To: dreamakers83@hotmail.com
Subject: Evaluate
Message-ID: <16346415_95780894>
HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO BE PAID "UP FRONT" LIKE THIS ?
********************************************************
Would you like to EVALUATE a world-wide business that pays you daily,weekly, monthly and compensates you on a years Business Volume IMMEDIATELYup front?...
*What if this made it possible for you to earn over $15000US in your first month?
SERIOUS ENTREPRENEURS ONLY d_koll@hotmail.com reply with "EVALUATE" in subject box.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 03:56:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Richard A. Rivera" <rrivera@zoo.uvm.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4016
Message-ID: <Pine.A41.3.96.980627035105.70406B-100000@elk.uvm.edu>
On Sat, 27 Jun 1998 ytsejam@ax.com wrote:
> Today I received confirmation from East West / Elektra that they have OK'd my
> request for a DOUBLE CD!!!!
There is a God!
It would be great if people would post their common percentages / min costs
for their band to play.
Interesting. If anybody has this kind of information on the Boston scene,
I'd appreciate it if you would drop me a line privately. I'll be moving
there in a couple of months and I want to hit the ground running.
Chances are, Jim, you ARE
> getting screwed if you think you are.
If you're a musician, your automatically getting screwed. It's just a
question of degree :)
Richie
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 01:09:03 -0700
From: dreamakers83@hotmail.com
To: dreamakers83@hotmail.com
Subject: Evaluate
Message-ID: <31624024_55979789>
HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO BE PAID "UP FRONT" LIKE THIS ?
********************************************************
Would you like to EVALUATE a world-wide business that pays you daily,weekly, monthly and compensates you on a years Business Volume IMMEDIATELYup front?...
*What if this made it possible for you to earn over $15000US in your first month?
SERIOUS ENTREPRENEURS ONLY d_koll@hotmail.com reply with "EVALUATE" in subject box.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 05:19:03 EDT
From: Madsag@aol.com
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Re: FX Processors / Gigs
Message-ID: <418e32ca.3594b908@aol.com>
>>I've got a question for all you gigging musicians out there: how much do
y'all make in a typical club gig? A portion of the door? a set price?
the amount based on the number of discount tickets you hand out? I have a
feeling these San Antonio clubs are ripping us off, but they're the only
experience we've got so far, so we can't be sure. Feedback?<<
dayton is basically 2 circuits, the cover band circuit or the all original
circuit
im playing in a cover band at the moment
were currently making 600 a night.
we get a flat rate.
we pay for our own soundman (none of these bars has house sound)
we own our own lights.
i know most other bands in our circuit go with a flat rate but some of them
choose to take the door, because they have a HUGE following and its more
lucrative for them to go that route. most of the bars in our circuit will do
either, its pretty much up to how the band wants to do it, either flat rate or
the door. most clubs will rip up the bands tab. i know one band that gets 2
cases of beer in addition to their flat rate of a grand a night (the best paid
cover band in town and with the biggest following, also have 2 cd's of their
own stuff out)
there arent any HUGE places in town to play whether youre all original or a
cover band, and the clubs here basically dont charge more than 2 or 3 bucks to
get in, so unless you have a gigantic following youre usually better off
taking a flat rate, which you can increase as your following does, or start
taking the door if its in your financial interest.
were doing fine and id say were being paid fairly compared to what i know
other bands with a larger following are making. the one problem we keep having
is losing a drummer, weve had to stop playing for 3 big chunks of time in the
last 2 years to find replacements and work them in. this always happens when
were really starting to draw people into clubs.
i can only think of about 2 or 3 bars in town right now that have all original
music, but there are quite a few bands in the area doing all originals. there
have been a couple others but they seem to close as soon as they open. they
pay the door. they usually book 2 or 3 bands a night, and you have to split
the door with them. both have house sound. we ran lights for a friends band
last sat and there were 2 bands playing, i think our friends band walked away
with maybe 100 bucks between the 3 of them. the other problem these bands
seem to have is they will record a cd, and after that process is done, they
break up. thats happened A LOT here.
the cool thing is almost all the clubs we play at dont frown on originals, so
you can play your own stuff too, just gotta do covers as well. a lot of the
cover bands in town do originals too, quite a few of them have done their own
cds as well.
- melissa
madsag@aol.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 05:59:18 -0500
From: Alan Estrada <alan_estrada@bigfoot.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Double album/Video...
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980627055918.00818510@academ04.mty.itesm.mx>
hey, the best news of the week, well done DT!!!
it's nice to hear some news from Mr Portnoy again, so what will the video
and CD have? will it be only from one concert each (live LATM or the video
LIT?)
or are they going to be just like clips from each one?
it would be nice to have the bsides there (in any of those) it's a shame
that they didnt play raise the knife since Ive wanted to listen to it again
with vocals...anyway those were killer setlists...I guess the covers wont
be there, or will they?
I like LIT a lot, the new video should be as long as the first one was,
they should include videos (lie, hollow years) and anything else like the
LIT video...
I like videos which are long 1:30-2:30 cause when i got the video for G3 I
was totally dissapointed it was only 3 songs from each one and it was
pretty short, it wast from the best performances they did on the tour and
didnt have any comments from the guys, I know that what it most important
is the music but is alwas cool to hear what they think about the tour or
whatever...I just hope the new video will be as good as LIT
I bet the live album will be a killer...75+75mins=150mins, that's 2 hours
and a half of pure DT live, pretty cool.
--- Alan Estrada Adler ICQ #9267174MP3 of the week - "80's medley" by Dweezil Zappa and Mike Keneally at: http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/2025/ Shredder's Lair: http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Theater/7842/
Monterrey, Mexico -------------------------------------------------------- TAKE NOTE OF MY NEW EMAIL ADDRESS: alan_estrada@bigfoot.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 08:44:03 -0400 From: "Andrew Forcier" <thomas.o.forcier@worldnet.att.net> To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: OH MY GOD! Message-ID: <19980627123930.GQYN87@239157822worldnet.att.net>
>Today I received confirmation from East West / Elektra that >they have OK'd my request for a DOUBLE CD!!!!
Sure there will be a half million of these, but: YES YES YES YES YES YES!!!! Just make sure that The Way It Used To Be and Peruvian Skies are on there if you please, Mr. Portnoy (my hero!). Speaking of which, I still believe that Peruvian Skies is the first song ever where I pay more attention to the drums thatn almost anything else. Over the ending chorus, Mike's bass beat is so inspired! I know I said this when the album came out, but it's worth repeating. Damon: > if I flamed somebody unintentionally, I am sorry
Don't apologize. I'm sure I deserved it for something. <g>
> Former shitty pop station Alice@104.1FM changed
Hey! We had a station like this in Charleston. Same name, and they played shitty pop too (Kiss the Rain?). Coincidence? It can't be... And on the effect hunt, I hit the stores again today! I was pushing against Digitech, and isn't ADA out of business Mads? My merchant of choice is going to let me take units home and swap them around to find what I want. Other stores have told me they'd have to order things special and I'd have to make a down payment! But I may just put this purchase off a couple weeks since I've finally found an original Whammy pedal at a good price. Nothing beats solid metal, and hey: what's inside ain't even Digitech! Woo-hoo!!
Stodgers likes pedals that make him sound more talented
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 08:48:17 -0400 From: Lobsterback <hender@wam.umd.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Remasters / DT/DP/ELP in "Philly" Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19980627084817.008d4ec8@pop.wam.umd.edu>
Thanks to those that answered my Marillion remaster question. Bonus discs?! That's the magic word right there!
Any word on King Crimson remasters? Anybody, anybody?
One last thing: does anyone have any friggin' idea when tickets go on sale for the Camden (the *other* Philadelphia) DT/DP/ELP show? Radio men said last weekend, no dice. This weekend? Again, nada. They aren't thinking of cancelling this show, are they...? Sales for the Holmdel show are apparently not doing all that well. Hrmm...
Brian "Dazed and Confused" Henderson
[Addendum: Three words to brighten your day..."double disc set"...]
=================================== Name: W. Brian Henderson, Esq. Contact: hender@wam.umd.edu ROBOT-CENTRAL: http://www.wam.umd.edu/~hender/ His Faithful Bootleg Page: http://www.wam.umd.edu/~hender/Musik/Boot/ ===================================
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 12:02:57 -0500 From: "Mike Patrick" <mepatric@indy.net> To: "DT" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Enough already, Mr. Bahr Message-ID: <199806271345.IAA15395@indy3.indy.net>
>Although I admit Rush alone is maybe 50 to 55% of all the work I do. By >rights I should just leave... I'm certainly not here for any financial >gain anymore. But I'm not going to just say "the hell with you all" >because there are good people here, friends of mine (whether they order >CDs or not) and I'm not about to abandon or condemn them for the actions >of a few bad apples. OK, a lot of bad apples. I'm more loyal than
I consider personal attacks to be the height of bad taste, but I have weathered YEARS of your posts without a single reply. And yet you continually spew the same shit, wasting bandwidth, wasting everyone's time with you're tireless self-justification. You have got the biggest fucking martyr complex of anyone I've ever had the displeasure of associating with. Make the CDs, keeping your mouth shut, or GO AWAY. You're reason alone to not get the jam in digest form - that way I can add you to my manual kill file (that would be the 'delete' key).
Mike Patrick Indianapolis, IN mepatric@indy.net
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Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 14:55:02 +0200 From: Mark Bredius <bredius@globalxs.nl> To: "'Ytsejam'" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: LiveConcerts.com Weekly Newsletter 6/29/98 (fwd) Message-ID: <01BDA1E2.C5DCBAA0@62.154.dialin.mxs.nl>
Rogerio Brito wrote :
> Thought you people might find this interesting...
[Entire LiveConcerts.com newsletter snipped]
Somehow, I think this would've been sufficient :
LiveConcerts.com Schedule Of Events http://www.liveconcerts.com/ July 15 @ 6:30 PM - Dream Theater interview and concert
Anyway, it's a rebroadcast of the House Of Blues show Dream Theater did on May 17th, preceeded by their Portnoy chat... Here's the direct URL for more information :
http://www.liveconcerts.com/events/980715dreamtheater/prebodyframe.html
Mark Bredius ____________________________________________________________ Dream Theater - Under A Cyber Moon E-mail: itchy@dreamt.org * http://www.prognosis.com/dream * Last updated: 06-27-1998
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 13:13:10 -0500 From: calfaro@caribe.net (Carlos Alfaro) To: Ytse Jam Mailing List <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Chromakey! kinda DTC Message-ID: <35953636.F13B022C@caribe.net>
Hi, I just received my chromakey cd from Fight Evil Records...Im only half way thru and it sounds great!!! Its even personalized by keVmo himself ( it says To carlos , kevin moore, isntead of just the signature) Its great! In the stream of consciousness There is a river crying Living comes much easier Once we admit , We're dying. Dream Theater: Lines in the Sand http://premium.caribe.net/~calfaro Tech Support Rep : Caribbean Internet Service mailto:calfaro@caribe.net mailto:ytseprog@yahoo.com Universal Internet Number (ICQ) 1254229
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Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 10:41:23 -0800 From: "Paul Gregory Humm" <humm@levy.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: ProgMetal Origins Message-ID: <199806271744.KAA12698@baygate.bayarea.net>
> What band(s) would you consider to be the "originator(s)" of the progmetal > genre. By this I mean who was playing DT-type music before DT?
Great thread Neil!
I think there are several pre-DT bands that we could classify as prog-metal, however they generally lean a little more toward the metal and a little less toward the prog. Two obvious examples are Queensryche and Fates Warning. Maybe a better term for these bands would be "complex metal" or how about "pre-prog-metal"?
Then, of course, there's Rush -- one of DT's biggest influences. They do have both prog and metal tendencies, but I don't feel that they hit the extremes of the spectrum the way DT does. They definitely have some pretty complex stuff, and their music gets pretty heavy at times. But the heaviest Rush isn't as heavy as Dream Theater, and even the most beautiful, melodic Rush songs can't quite compare with Wait for Sleep or Space-Dye Vest. I'm not necessarily saying that DT is better than Rush, but DT turned everything up a notch!
To my knowledge, DT was the first band that could combine the "balls and chunk" of Metallica with the melodic beauty of Yes, as well as some unbelievably complex instrumental passages and time changes (along the lines of La Villa Strangiato or some of the complex Dregs stuff), ALL IN THE SAME SONG!
I personally had the same experience as you, Neil. Namely, I had never heard anything quite like Dream Theater until Dream Theater came along. In fact, at the time I first heard Dream Theater, two of my favorite bands were Yes and Metallica. I never DREAMED that a band would come along and put those two vastly different styles together the way DT did. When I first heard DT, I had the same reaction as you: "This is what I have been waiting for without knowing it!" My initial exposure to their music left an impression on me which I will never forget. I guess that's why I, like so many others, am such a huge fan, and always will be.
Paul
----------- Paul Humm humm@levy.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 16:12:19 -0500 From: "Mike Patrick" <mepatric@indy.net> To: "DT" <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Spastic Drummers (was: Dali's Dilemma) Message-ID: <199806271754.MAA20732@indy1.indy.net>
>Actually, that kind of overplaying on the drums is what suckered me >into DT in the first place.
Hey, I like drumming too, but there's a fine line between an active drummer who augments the band and one who steps all over them.
I love Paul Craddick and I love Enchant, but there are places - maybe not so much with 'Wounded', but certainly with 'Blueprint' - where I find myself asking if he's the only guy in the band. I mean, he's THAT out front.
Speaking of active drummers who make perfect choices and never override their bandmates, I can think of two guys who I'm nuts about that rarely get any mention:
Kevin Soffera, ex of Shadow Gallery. Man, his playing on 'Carved in Stone' is really amazing. Big loss for them.
Nathan van de Wouw of Lemur Voice. His leading the band through time changes on 'Insights' would make Mike P. blush. Not really - Mike is still THE MAN, but the Lemur Voice album is just so intense.
I just think it takes WAY more than a mastery of 16th and 32nd notes on double bass to make a prog metal drummer.
Mike Patrick Indianapolis, IN mepatric@indy.net
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Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 13:57:54 EDT From: KEZCOM@aol.com To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: ProgMetal Origins Message-ID: <e28a66a8.359532a3@aol.com>
In a message dated 98-06-26 19:44:55 EDT, a very intelligent person wrote:
<< It seems to me that DT is really the first band to have melded the Rush/Yes progressive rock style with the balls and chunk of Metallica and produced intense, compelling music in the process. When I first heard DT (not to resurrect this thread), a massive "CLICK!!!" sounded in my universe as my brain said YES - THIS IS WHAT I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR WITHOUT KNOWING IT! I will literally never forget that day, and my fervor over DT has not dimished one bit in the 5+ years since. >>
Thank you, Neil, for saying this so well. This is EXACTLY how I have felt since my first exposure to I&W in '92.
<<We all know that there are dozens of DT-like bands that have sprung up in the wake of the mother of all recordings, "Images and Words". Some of them are pale imitations, and some very creative and interesting (Symphony-X, Lemur Voice, Superior, Angra, etc).>>
May I be so bold as to add my new, 2nd favorite band to this list: Vanden Plas I can't wait to get my copy of 'The God Thing'. Get yours now. <A HREF="http://www.pendragonusa.com/index3.html">P E N D R A G O N * M E R C H A N D I S I N G...</A> http://www.pendragonusa.com/ or <A HREF="http://www.knightsoftheround.com/home.htm">Knights Of The Round - Import Hard Rock & Metal</A> http://www.knightsoftheround.com/zcatv.htm
And while your waiting for delivery, go to Mosh's maniacal Feast and pick up the MP3's that have me sending money to strangers. :~) <A HREF="http://progmetal.gmsnet.com/audio_europe.html">Dr. Mosh's Progressive Feast</A> http://progmetal.gmsnet.com/audio_europe.html
<<However, I think DT has been and will be recognized as the most important force of ProgMetal in the 90's.>>
I second that nomination.
And finally, a message to Volodya at OAN. May I be first in line for a copy of the Paris, Bataclan show? God, I hope this is on tape(and not just "official" sources) ;~)
Carpe Musica, Kez
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Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 14:01:57 EDT From: KEZCOM@aol.com To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: Official Paris set list Message-ID: <f09f7a50.35953396@aol.com>
In a message dated 98-06-26 19:44:58 EDT, some animal wrote:
<< .And, I am here to deliver some good news which (sorta) re-news my faith in this crazy music industry...... Today I received confirmation from East West / Elektra that they have OK'd my request for a DOUBLE CD!!!! It's gonna be very cool!! : ) More news as I have it.... Mike Portnoy >>
Damn, now I gotta' clean my monitor!
I spewed when I read this.
YES. YES. YESSSSSSSSSS!!!!!
Once again, I must state the obvious:
Mike Portnoy is THE MAN!!
Thanks Mike, Kez
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4017 **************************
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