YTSEJAM Digest 4659
Today's Topics:
1) mac machines
by Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
2) Boots
by Calvin6S@aol.com
3) Re: ideally...
by Phil Carter <phil@usefulware.com>
4) Two things
by Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu>
5) re: Open letter to the Calicrew!!!
by Brian Hansen <bhansen10@yahoo.com>
6) The Day's mumblings from above...
by "Ambassador Nelaskon" <cyaron@mailcity.com>
7) TONY HARNELL VOCAL RANGE
by drussell29@juno.com
8) I'm full of
by "Rahul Ananda" <rananda@mcn.com>
9) Jazzy Theater
by "Rahul Ananda" <rananda@mcn.com>
10) OIAL
by "Steve Ferris" <stevo_14@hotmail.com>
11) Re: OIAL
by Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu>
12) Home on the Range
by Adam Barnhart <adamb@cfmc.com>
13) Re: Jazzy Theater
by Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
14) Bret Michaels & other 80's news-c'mon, I know you're curious!
by JKorby1973@aol.com
15) Re: DT-DS Anthology? | FAQ spoilers | lyrics | ideally
by JamesAhab@aol.com
16) TNT, OIAL, and I'm a little teapot, short and stout.
by "Korg Ecksthrey" <korgx3@safelink.net>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 17:33:25 -0500
From: Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: mac machines
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19990208173325.007e0ec0@mail.avnl1.nj.home.com>
Well, this is better than flame wars.
Anyway, here are my mac machine nightmare.
The worst one being the mac machine with braille buttons, but a touch
screen interface where the buttons for accessing the menus are. Like this
is really going to help us out, folks. What about the machines where the
braille is so worn down that it isn't readable. Or the ones where they are
outdoors and always where the wind is blowing the hardest in the middle of
winter so that your fingers are too numb to read the buttons. And of
course, my favorite, the buttons are in braille, but the screen is still
inprint and your receipt is still in print, so it still requires, to some
degree, sighted help, unless you can memorize all the damn possibilities,
which doesn't exactly work if they constantly upgrade the software.
Whew, I need oxygen.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 17:41:05 EST
From: Calvin6S@aol.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Boots
Message-ID: <16ab4835.36bf6801@aol.com>
> If anyone ever makes profits off of CD-Rs.. (which would likely be very
> small)... perhaps they should think about pyutting someof the money asside
> and sending it to the band :) Perhaps give some to JP and he will like
> boots better!
I am pretty sure JP could not accept (unless it was payed in cash :o). I
think if he accepted, he has just profited outside of his record contract
without permission from the record contract (of which the record contract will
of course NEVER permit). Ever noticed the "xxx appears courtesy of xxxx" on
an album when an artist records outside of his PRIMARY record label? Same
idea.
The main problem is the record companies in general. The business deal is
struck as: Record label = employer / Recording artist = employee. In other
words, the employee (artist) produces a product or report (CD/album) for the
employer (label). Just like in any business, you can't get payed by an
employer to do research (writing and recording songs) and then give that
research to a competing employer (competing label - which is every label BUT
the original label). It really is best to just think in BUSINESS terms.
So you say the problem is that it should be Recording artist = employer /
Record label = employee. Well, what makes an employer? The guy with the know
how? Nope. The guy with ideas? Nope. The guy with the money? YES. The
other things help, but what it comes down to is recording artists don't have
the MONEY to record and promote their own album. So the record label provides
the money, much like an advance. The big difference from a bank is that a
record label doesn't sue the artist if the "loan" isn't repayed through sales.
A bank would. That is why the record labels penny pinch with artists.
Because for every SUCCESSFUL artist they have - there are 99 more UNSUCCESSFUL
artists. I'm not siding with the record label, but sometimes you have to look
at both sides. I still think the record labels play dirty.
I would love to see DT getting proceeds from bootlegs, but I think it isn't as
simple as the bootleggers sending a percentage to the band.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 17:56:35 -0500
From: Phil Carter <phil@usefulware.com>
To: A Pleasant Shade of Ytse <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Re: ideally...
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990208175635.006bb6fc@pop.usefulware.com>
Greetings ye 'jamanoids...
Madsman wrote:
> I totally concur with Al... it's really rare that you hear a stunningly
>real piano on a prog cd. I assume it's been done a lot, but that effects
>tend to try and make piano sound like something it's not.
Not much to argue about here, since I agree with both Madsman and Al. No
matter how good an electronic piano sound is, it doesn't compare to a REAL
Steinway grand.
I think that's why I like Cairo so much. Quite aside from the fact that the
entire band is built around Mark Robertson's vast keyboard wizardry,
Robertson insists on using a real grand piano for his music. Go listen to
"Ruins at Avalon's Gate" from the self-titled Cairo release, or "Valley of
the Shadow" from "Conflict and Dreams".
>I don't for a second expect that Jordan will use anything
>buy Kurzweil gear.
Jordan has stated several times that he will never use anything but
Kurzweil. I would find that a bit disturbing if it weren't for the fact
that he can make his Kurzweils dance on the head of a pin, sit up and beg,
and deal cards. :)
ta,
Phil
=========================================================
Phil Carter -- phil@usefulware.com http://www.mindspring.com/~philcarter
"Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life."
-- Berthold Auerbach
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 18:02:38 -0500 (EST)
From: Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Two things
Message-ID: <Pine.BSF.3.96.990208180035.25407A-100000@oz.plymouth.edu>
On Mon, 8 Feb 1999, Christopher W. Ptacek wrote:
> BCDADCBGBCDADCBF#
Chirs, what the hell is this song? I tried humming the melody to myself,
but without a rhythm I'm rather lost. Help me out!
----------
I've been trying to figure this out to no avail. What is the piano riff
that Derek plays in Lines in the Sand? I know that the first two notes
are the two lowest D's on the piano, but after that... The right hand part
starts on a G below middle C then jumps to the C... And after that, I lose
it. Can anybody point me in the direction of this in notation or help me
out or something? Thanks.
-------------------------------------------------
Andrew Coutermarsh
a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu
http://cout.ml.org/
ICQ: 2513441
-------------------------------------------------
FOR SALE: One parachute, used but unopened. One
small stain. Going VERY cheap.
-------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 15:10:50 -0800 (PST)
From: Brian Hansen <bhansen10@yahoo.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: re: Open letter to the Calicrew!!!
Message-ID: <19990208231051.21064.rocketmail@send103.yahoomail.com>
Andreas Schaefer <jerry@muc.de> wrote:
> I'd like to use this forum to thank all the guys that gave me such a
nice
> welcome in California! ...
> As soon as I find my own place there will be a big
ytsejam-housewarming
> party - I'll keep you posted (that also means you Mark Stahl and
Paul Fini).
Glad you're enjoying sunny(?) California! Bet you never thought you'd
be listening to a live band play disco and top 40! ;op
Actually that was just a happy hour that got big, not a full
"Calicrew" party. There's a "Calicrew" mailing list with a lot more
people on it (not sure about the full address). You may want to get
yourself added to it...as well as anyone else out there new to the jam
or the SF Bay area.
Who maintains that list?
hasta, BH
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 23:53:06 -0000
From: "Ambassador Nelaskon" <cyaron@mailcity.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: The Day's mumblings from above...
Message-ID: <IHFNBDNKMGPHBAAA@mailcity.com>
Okay. Here are my responses to the last several jams.
>>>I find the cycle interesting. We go from dysfunction in tracks 7 and 8 to happiness in track 9.Then we return to dysfunction in track 10. SDV kicks in, and the dysfunction continues and, perhaps, deepens. We have come out of turmoil. We have been inspired by someone who can turn a drop of water into an ocean. Then, we end up in isolation, arguably worse off than we started. It's a pessimistic mood here in" Awake," but it's beautifully presented.<<<
I agree here fully. And I think that's intentional too. The Awake album DOES tell a story, and what's REALLY sad is how true it is in reality.
------------
>>>You've never been more fooled if you say II is better than I! II is a
result of I! :)
The freak wrote Tubular Bells I on the age of 18 I think! :(( I don't
get it, I just don't get it! When you listen the album you just can't
comprehend how ca a human write that music!<<<
Why not?
But really, I heard TB2 first, and I thought it was cool. THEN I heard 1 and realized how much 2 was just a clone. Still, hear Tubular Bells III. It's not a clone. There's some really cool stuff on there, though I still think 1 is the almighty classic.
Since when did the Ytsejam talk about my *other* style of music anyway? :)
------------
>>>Those of you looking for a nice DT-friendly music magazine might find it interesting to pick up a copy of the UK mag 'HardRoxx', which is apparentlygoing to be distributed throughout 80 Towere Records stores in the USA.<<<
Yeah. It's so DT-friendly because the woman you all hate, Nikki Brooks, pushes them so hard there and is the ONLY one getting DT into that magazine. But nobody here cares. It's just me.
------------
>>>On the OIAL version of "Metropolis", what is the song they break into near theend (about 5:17)? It is some improv jam or is it a cover of another song?<<<
QUIT asking that!!! It's been said SO many times.
Okay, sorry. I asked too. After it was already dead. It's Freebird (by Skynyrd?) Anyway, it rocks out, but I don't listen to Skynyrd.
------------
And I'm going to look in the Guiness book for myself. I was absolutely SURE that the record for vocal range was just over 4 octaves. NOBODY has a 7 octave range. That's the whole frigging piano. Absolutely impossible. That blue chick in The 5th Element didn't have 6+ octaves. The "Lovin You" chick doesn't have 6+ octaves. No way in Hell Mariah does. The best opera dudes are 4. No way can a person cover 7. (please no play-on words jokes)
But I'll go look it up for myself. Then I'll tell you if I'm right or wrong. Either way, I still don't think lame-ass Mariah can do it.
------------
Hey! Did you guys see that new Dax chick in DS9? Oh, my GOD!
------------
See 'ya next jam!
-Nelaskon ECA
Get your FREE Email at http://mailcity.lycos.com
Get your PERSONALIZED START PAGE at http://personal.lycos.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 18:53:40 -0500
From: drussell29@juno.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: TONY HARNELL VOCAL RANGE
Message-ID: <19990208.190050.-138107.2.drussell29@juno.com>
Mr. Tony Harnell from TNT is in the Guiness Book Of World Records for
having a vocal range of 8 octaves....I repeat 8 octaves.....if anyone has
seen him live or has any TNT material....they will know this is
true....please respond if you dare.
Later On Homos
___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 15:57 -0800
From: "Rahul Ananda" <rananda@mcn.com>
To: "ytsejam@ax.com" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: I'm full of
Message-ID: <199902090010.QAA24459@knight.axnet.net>
questions these days. I was listening to the radio at work
and Led Zeppelin's "In the Evening" was played. During
the guitar solo (the earlier part) Page makes this really
insane guitar explosion kind of noise. I can't really
describe it, but it sounds like he is physically reaching into
the guitar and yanking out its colon. What the fuck is he
doing there? 'Cause that's a really bitchin' sound.
-Rahul Ananda
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 15:36 -0800
From: "Rahul Ananda" <rananda@mcn.com>
To: "ytsejam@ax.com" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Jazzy Theater
Message-ID: <199902090010.QAA24460@knight.axnet.net>
Chris Ptacek says: "it's really rare that you hear a stunningly real
piano on a prog CD. I assume it's been done a lot..."
This is weird to me but totally true. I, too, assumed that it's
been done and keyboard players have seeking a piano sound that
suits rock a bit more than the tonality of an actual piano, which seem
to be confined more to jazz and classical. The trouble is, I can't
think of an album in the prog realm with a real piano...though I'm not
as much of a prog-head as some people on this list. Does anyone know
specifically where real pianos or organs can be found? All I can
think of is Rick Wakeman's church organ work on Going for the One, by
Yes. Also, is that a real organ in the I Get Up I Get Down section of
Close to the Edge? Because it sure as shit sounds like one and I
don;t think they had keyboard sounds that sophisticated in the 70s.
I've always thought DT could sound really great with a piano and
JP playing jazz chords behind it, and JM doing some kind of walking
bass line. Hell, let Mike throw a jazz ride pattern behind it
and we might have their version of assymetric jazz ala Dave Brubeck
or Dave Holland.
Too bad they play Satan music, instead :)
-Rahul Ananda
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 16:15:20 PST
From: "Steve Ferris" <stevo_14@hotmail.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: OIAL
Message-ID: <19990209001520.28905.qmail@hotmail.com>
Why isn't the symbol that's on every other release on the cover of
OIAL???????????????????????????????????????????
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 19:46:47 -0500 (EST)
From: Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Re: OIAL
Message-ID: <Pine.BSF.3.96.990208193956.9000A-100000@oz.plymouth.edu>
On Mon, 8 Feb 1999, Steve Ferris wrote:
> Why isn't the symbol that's on every other release on the cover of
> OIAL???????????????????????????????????????????
You know, that's really a good question - Why ISN'T the Majesty symbol on
the front cover of OiaLT? I can only say that it's probably because they
have it on the BACK cover. I see a Majesty symbol on the front cover of
Falling Into Infinity, but not on the back cover. I see a Majesty symbol
on the front cover of ACoS, but not on the back cover. So maybe they
decided to put it on the back of this album instead of the front cover
because of the particular artwork that was being used. That's the best
explanation I could think up.
-------------------------------------------------
Andrew Coutermarsh
a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu
http://cout.ml.org/
ICQ: 2513441
-------------------------------------------------
Sometimes, when I would read a very good book,
I would stop and thank my teacher. At least, I
used to, until she got an unlisted number.
-------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 16:54:25 -0800
From: Adam Barnhart <adamb@cfmc.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Home on the Range
Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19990208165425.006e7ba8@pop.cfmc.com>
>From: Jon Parmet <jon@parmetpc.volpe.dot.gov>
>Subject: Re: mariah carey & her self-cleaning vocal range
>
>Mariah who? :)))
>
>Back in the mid-late 70's, Minnie Ripperton hit an excruciatingly
>painful note in a song called, IIRC, "Loving You." I'm sure there must
>be a few people on here who remember this song and the absolute primal
>agressions it would stir up?
Yep. And Burger King's actually running that song in a commericial of
theirs now. Painful, man...painful.
>Imagine the alarm clock going off in the morning and this song comes on.
>Now imagine the alarm clock in fully non-functional pieces :)
>
>That song actually pissed me off!
>
>I know nothing about comparing octave ranges but I'd hazard a guess that
>Minnie had to be a good octave higher than the highest note I've ever
>heard Mariah hit. There are some sounds that simply should be left in
>the realm of silence; and on that note.... :)
Actually, I heard a song of Mariah Carey's a couple of years back that
really reminded me of "Loving You." It was very simple, in that she was
"la la la"-ing sounds that only dolphins could hear. I don't know if it
was THAT high, but if it wasn't, it was awfully close.
Adam D. Barnhart
adamb@cfmc.com
ydnt85a@prodigy.com
http://www.cfmc.com/adamb
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 20:28:32 -0500
From: Damon Fibraio <dfibraio@home.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Re: Jazzy Theater
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19990208202832.007efa50@mail.avnl1.nj.home.com>
if you listen to most any prog album from the 70s, any piano or organ you
hear is authentic piano and organ. In fact, I am willing to bet that any
authentic piano you hear in most 80s prog albums is just that. Not until
the late 80s and early 90s when samples were easier to stick into keyboards
is the line becoming blurrier and blurrier. Most Genesis albums use real
organs and pianos upt hrough Wind and Wuthering, with the exception of the
obviously electric pianos on Supper's ready, lamb lies down, trick of the
tale and such. yes is always real piano for the most part. If it sounds
really electric it is obviously not a piano. To my knowledge, Geddy Lee
rarely used a real piano at all, let alone a real organ. Pink floyd? All
those pianos in the 70s were real to me, except for the rhodes sounds which
was a real rhodes. I would imagine that Derek and Kevin used real pianos in
the studio for the albums, though.
At 04:28 PM 2/8/1999 -0800, you wrote:
>
>
> Chris Ptacek says: "it's really rare that you hear a stunningly real
> piano on a prog CD. I assume it's been done a lot..."
>
> This is weird to me but totally true. I, too, assumed that it's
> been done and keyboard players have seeking a piano sound that
> suits rock a bit more than the tonality of an actual piano, which seem
> to be confined more to jazz and classical. The trouble is, I can't
> think of an album in the prog realm with a real piano...though I'm not
> as much of a prog-head as some people on this list. Does anyone know
> specifically where real pianos or organs can be found? All I can
> think of is Rick Wakeman's church organ work on Going for the One, by
> Yes. Also, is that a real organ in the I Get Up I Get Down section of
> Close to the Edge? Because it sure as shit sounds like one and I
> don;t think they had keyboard sounds that sophisticated in the 70s.
>
> I've always thought DT could sound really great with a piano and
> JP playing jazz chords behind it, and JM doing some kind of walking
> bass line. Hell, let Mike throw a jazz ride pattern behind it
> and we might have their version of assymetric jazz ala Dave Brubeck
> or Dave Holland.
>
> Too bad they play Satan music, instead :)
>
> -Rahul Ananda
>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 20:53:31 EST
From: JKorby1973@aol.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Bret Michaels & other 80's news-c'mon, I know you're curious!
Message-ID: <e6e3e31e.36bf951b@aol.com>
In a message dated 99-02-08 17:33:31 EST, you write:
<< Anybody listened to Bret Micheals knew one? Murder in death row? I saw
it out. >>
"A Letter From Death Row"
This is Bret Michaels solo album, which is also the soundtrack to a movie
that he wrote, directed, and starred in. It was basically an independent film,
so if you haven't really heard of it, that's why. It also stars Martin and
Charlie Sheen. The album is actually really good and quite different than
anything he did in Poison. It's basically a rock album, but not really in an
80's "big rock" vein. It's more reminicent of today's pop "rock" bands like
Smash Mouth or something like that. He's also got some other movies coming out
that he's either starred in or directed. One of which stars Mira Sorvino and
Marlon Brando, to name a few. These movies are being put out by his production
company called Sheen/Michaels Entertainment, which he's partners and good
friends with Charlie Sheen. I heard Poison is gearing up for a big summer
reunion tour starting Labor Day called "The Exiled From Mainstream Tour". So
far, it looks like it may include Poison, Ratt, Great White, and
Dokken-(who've just picked up Reb Beach to replace George Lynch). Other
possible bands may be Def Leppard and Warrant. OK, I'm done ranting about 80's
glam bands. But I feel I must add (before the inevitable flaming) that I'm a
fan of this stuff because it's what was big when I was growing up through jr.
high and high school, and they had some cool VH type solos which -hey, led me
to find the real kickass guitar music like Vai, Satch, and of course our very
own DREAM THEATER! Ok, ok. NOW I'm done. Later!
Flame on,
Justin
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 21:10:12 EST
From: JamesAhab@aol.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Re: DT-DS Anthology? | FAQ spoilers | lyrics | ideally
Message-ID: <1b61caf7.36bf9904@aol.com>
>< Why not do an anthology double CD of all of the Derek-era stuff that was
unreleased (or at least, as much of it as will fit on a double CD)? And for
that matter, it'd be pretty cool to hear some of the demos that never got to
the studio. Songs like Speak To Me" have huge potential for Radio airplay, so
why not release it properly? ><
Because *that* would be the ultimate sell-out. Rather than progress and work
on new songs and look towards the future, they do no work and throw together
an album of already existing songs, throw some tag line on like "rare Dream
Theater gems" or some shit, release it, make money, and get a single out of
it. They have more integrity than to pull shit like that. Save it for the fan
club CD.
>< Part 3: A Crack In The Mirror from "Mind Control" bootleg! On trhis one
Kevin is
on keys right? After the piano sound solo, he changes the sound into more
electirc,
distorted AND he plays the first notes of Lines In The Sand!!!! What the ...
??? ><
Of course that's Derek. Kevin didn't play any shows on the Awake tour.
>< The question? Well I haven't read the story yet, but how come love is the
final dance 'eternal', in "the only one". In my eyes 'death' is the eternal
dance that is best described as eternal. "Love is the Dance of eternity"
sounds very final to me. ><
I guess the message is, love lasts forever, even after death. I guess.
>< it's really rare that you hear a stunningly real piano on a prog cd. ><
Doesn't Jon Oliva use a real piano? Honestly, I wouldn't know whether it's
real or a keyboard unless I listen very closely, which I haven't, but I've
never heard Savatage use keyboard sounds, so I'd assume he uses a piano.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 19:26:35 -0700
From: "Korg Ecksthrey" <korgx3@safelink.net>
To: <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: TNT, OIAL, and I'm a little teapot, short and stout.
Message-ID: <006201be53d3$acdfb720$4b0d84d0@default>
>seen him live or has any TNT material....they will know this is
>true....please respond if you dare.
Hmmm... I know he has a huge range, but 8 octaves? wow... That's
including super pinchy squeally falsettoing and such? If you count that
crap I think I have about 4 octaves (and I almost have tonal control over
those higher registers). I thought we were just counting actual vocal
range. Most people don't talk falsetto unless they're crossdressing...
> Why isn't the symbol that's on every other release on the cover of
> OIAL???????????????????????????????????????????
It's there. The little guy standing in the middle of the stadium has one
tatooed just below his left nipple.
>was a real rhodes. I would imagine that Derek and Kevin used real pianos in
>the studio for the albums, though.
I'm trying to remember back to the Live in Tokyo vid, but I'm pretty damn
sure that when they were showing the studio clips, Kev was playing a real
piano. (Surrounded? I can't remember) He was using a synth for the piano
in Learning to Live, though... And wasn't that a real piano used for
AnnaLee? I'm thinking it was because just as soon as Derek stop playing and
the track fades out you can hear someone move a chair in the background, and
I don't think that was from James' mic.
>Later On Homos
No, crossdressers...
-- KorgX3 wishes he could find Knights of the New Thunder on CD. :\------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 4659 **************************
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