YTSEJAM Digest 4685
Today's Topics:
1) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4681
by Stixntrixx@aol.com
2) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4683
by "Christopher W. Ptacek" <someone@prognosis.com>
3) Re: Just say NO to Vai & Satch
by "W. Tugmutton" <tugmutton@toast.net>
4) D'oh!
by "Alex O'Connell" <auocon@maila.wm.edu>
5) re: DT sightings
by "Christopher Lancaster" <cal@netease.net>
6) Zonder/Zimmerman project available...
by Michael Kizer <mike@ivorygate.com>
7) CD Now specials...
by Michael Kizer <mike@ivorygate.com>
8) Portnoy's Cymbol Setup
by CLIFFBUR10@aol.com
9) Vai/Satch....effects...*ignorance*...etc....
by JKorby1973@aol.com
10) The Quiet Room
by MusicSnob@aol.com
11) Re: Angra prog?
by mpm_2112@ix.netcom.com
12) Chameleons with English Accents
by "Korg Ecksthrey" <korgx3@safelink.net>
13) music industry
by "gregor" <gregor@rz-online.de>
14) "Power of Metal" (was: D'oh!)
by Lisa Marie <ytsegirl@pacbell.net>
15) In the Woods, blah blah blah, Echolyn
by "TSM" <tonimaki@dlc.fi>
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 13:19:50 EST
From: Stixntrixx@aol.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4681
Message-ID: <f00aa039.36cefcc6@aol.com>
In a message dated 99-02-19 11:14:44 EST, you write:
<<
Did anyone catch the DT article in the latest issue of Metal Edge mag?
Basically it talked about the releases of 5YIAL and OIAL. I was wondering =
why
it didn't include any info on Jordan joining the band...
Anyway it was cool to see DT in a mag... >>
No, it didn't mention it in the article because it was written over Christmas.
The Metalwire (the "News" section for the uninitiated) did mention it.
Apparently it happened right as the issue was going to press, so information
was scarce at the time. Paul, the new Editor, is a HUGE Dream Theater fan so
I'm sure we'll get the scoop. Great article, BTW.
Richie
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 12:31:59 -0600
From: "Christopher W. Ptacek" <someone@prognosis.com>
To: <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4683
Message-ID: <000c01be5cff$4e741980$8e88fea9@z979811wheat.farm.niu.edu>
>From: ANGELO LOMBARDI <angelo13@home.com>
>DT does NOT need more guitars!!!!!!! JP is incredible alone. Vai &
>Satriani are ALL effects. I SUCK on the guitar, BUT I can sound like
>Vai or Satriani with 20 effect rack AND about 15 foot pedals. Hit one
>note & it sounds like Bach or Mozart. ANYBODY can use effects, but JP
>is just GREAT! Probably my fav guitarist.
I swore I wasn't gonna comment on this, but I can't help it.
Dude, you're a FOOL. I don't want to flame anyone anymore... I'm trying
to be good about that stuff... but how the HELL do you come up with a claim
as ludicrous as this? Do you know ANYTHING about guitar and effects? You
need to stick your head in a plastic bag and breathe deeply for a few hours.
I don't care if you LIKE them or NOT... this statement is simply complete
and utter ignorance of anything guitar related. People like you should be
set on fire and forced to go door to door selling candy bars. Listen... if
you find the effects unit, or combination of effects units that Vai and
Satch use to sound like "Mozart," and are able to reproduce the effect, in
any way shape or form, I'll send you my 7 string and fill the case with $100
bills. What you're saying is not opinion... it's misguided and moronic.
Have a beautiful day.
- Chris
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 13:24:47 -0600
From: "W. Tugmutton" <tugmutton@toast.net>
To: "Ytsejam" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Re: Just say NO to Vai & Satch
Message-ID: <000301be5d06$c85bd100$d6dc1a93@tugmutton-.swt.edu>
Ahoy,
Angelo Lombardi wrote:
>With effects, it's MORE with Satriani. He's ALL effects. He (they)
>gets some cool sounds, but I don't know where people get by saying they
>are one of the best.
I disagree. Both Satriani and Vai cover a good range of styles in their music, they
both experiment with a lot of off-the-wall sounds but they are also just damn great
players who are very diverse in their styles and can *do* anything *with* anything,
and the playing is very much there. You can slap on all the effects you want, but if
you suck then you suck with a lot of effects. Not only are they both excellent
players but they know how to play with a lot of feel and soul. Not everyone can mix
technical ability with feel in a convincing way. If you still think that Satriani is
all effects then listen to the self-title album.
I think you're also failing to consider the songwriting aspect of their
music. The solos are only a portion of the whole picture. Look at Vai's songwriting.
If you shoot him down then you've got to take Al DiMeola with him, because there is
an enormous influence there. Both Satch & Vai end up doing most of the work for their
songs when it comes to songwriting. That's why you see their name on the cover of the
album.
You cannot make these kinds of generalizations.
- Mark tugmutton@toast.net
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 14:32:22 -0500
From: "Alex O'Connell" <auocon@maila.wm.edu>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: D'oh!
Message-ID: <199902201927.OAA10796@maila.wm.edu>
>Black on Black" (revealed!)
>The amazing song "Black on Black" was a Japanese bonus track for >the
"Power of Metal" live 2-disc set on Noise Records...the song has >only
appeared on that live >compilation as far as I know. But.....WHAT >A SONG
IT IS!!!
>.....what a gem. hope that helped :) cheers, Carlo (Fates)
ARGH!!
Well actually I should first thank you for clearing this up for me finally.
:) I appreciate it. But now I have another problem; knowing where it's
from, I can't get my hands on it!! I have been browing around Noise
Records' site for a while, nada. I didn't expect much from them either,
but one can always hope. Other than that tape your friend sent you, you
have no other copy of it though? Dammit! I NEED TO HEAR IT!! This isn't
fair. I would probably go all out and pay the double-cd jap import price
just for that song, that's how fixated I am now . But I can't find it
anywhere. GRRRRRR. Off to search the web some more. Thank you for your
nugget of information, though.
Alex
"We at the FBI have no sense of humor that we are aware of" - K, MiB
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 13:54:01 -0800
From: "Christopher Lancaster" <cal@netease.net>
To: <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: re: DT sightings
Message-ID: <001101be5d1b$87437dc0$6b5c18d0@oemcomputer>
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A few years ago when I was in college the Memphis State University =
Tigers basket ball team used the intro to Metropolis part one as the =
promo music to advartise their games. I could not belive it at the =
time. Now it especially seems odd since Dt has only played one date in =
Tennessee ever. No one has heard of them here.
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<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>A few years ago when I was in =
college the=20
Memphis State University Tigers basket ball team used the intro to =
Metropolis=20
part one as the promo music to advartise their games. I could not =
belive=20
it at the time. Now it especially seems odd since Dt has only =
played one=20
date in Tennessee ever. No one has heard of them=20
here.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 14:05:26 -0700
From: Michael Kizer <mike@ivorygate.com>
To: "fates@listservant.com (Parallels List)" <fates@listservant.com>,
Subject: Zonder/Zimmerman project available...
Message-ID: <36CF2396.AA4EFB43@ivorygate.com>
Just got this from Eric Zimmerman:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Zonder and Eric Zimmeramnn's recording project can now be
purchased. In addition to three full length songs, this limited edition
recording will include two instrumental demo songs. Real Audio
demo clips will be available with in the next few days. These are just
the demo clips folks. The CD that will be shipped will be what you
expect. CD quality. We are just giving you a taste here.
This CD can be purchased by sending a check or money order for
$9.00 US dollars (shipping included) to:
Zonder/Zimmermann
7551 Melrose Avenue #3
Los Angeles, California. 90046
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm going to try and put some sound clips from it up on my web page in the next
few days....
-- ~Michael Kizer <mike@ivorygate.com> <ICQ # 2070538> "Enter ivory gates through midnight skies..." - http://www.ivorygate.com >>> Fates Warning ~ Island In The Stream <<< >>> Dream Theater and Kevin Moore "Unofficial" Song Books <<< >>> Come join the discussions in the new online Bulletin Board! <<<------------------------------
Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 14:09:36 -0700 From: Michael Kizer <mike@ivorygate.com> To: "fates@listservant.com (Parallels List)" <fates@listservant.com>, Subject: CD Now specials... Message-ID: <36CF2490.FA356A0F@ivorygate.com>
Also, CD NOW is having a cool sale right now... all imports are 30% off, plus you can get a $10 discount by clicking through my website... so grab those hard to get (ie, $$$) imports! hehe
For the link go to: http://www.ivorygate.com/fw
-- ~Michael Kizer <mike@ivorygate.com> <ICQ # 2070538> "Enter ivory gates through midnight skies..." - http://www.ivorygate.com >>> Fates Warning ~ Island In The Stream <<< >>> Dream Theater and Kevin Moore "Unofficial" Song Books <<< >>> Come join the discussions in the new online Bulletin Board! <<<
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 16:12:03 EST From: CLIFFBUR10@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Portnoy's Cymbol Setup Message-ID: <29cc59ef.36cf2523@aol.com>
Can someone please email me mike portnoy's Sabian setup, sabians site used to have it up but not no more. so i would appreciate anyone who could send some info on the exact models of his cymbols. also any info on his signature series cymbols would be good too. -Cliffbur10@aol.com
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 17:09:57 EST From: JKorby1973@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Vai/Satch....effects...*ignorance*...etc.... Message-ID: <813950de.36cf32b5@aol.com>
In a message dated 99-02-20 02:20:01 EST, you write:
<< DT does NOT need more guitars!!!!!!! JP is incredible alone. Vai & Satriani are ALL effects. I SUCK on the guitar, BUT I can sound like Vai or Satriani with 20 effect rack AND about 15 foot pedals. Hit one note & it sounds like Bach or Mozart. ANYBODY can use effects, but JP is just GREAT! Probably my fav guitarist. Angelo >>
Hmm. Interesting. Last I checked, the only effects Satriani uses are a Boss overdrive pedal(occasionally), a Boss chorus pedal for the clean tones, a Dunlop wah pedal, and on occasion uses a Digitech Whammy pedal. In the studio he's used an Eventide Harmonizer on a couple of things, but most of his harmonies on his records are him overdubbing the parts himself. Otherwise, 90% of his sound is his guitar straight into a Marshall amp. As for Vai, he definetely has a ton of shit in his studio, but if you've seen him live- for example on the G3 video, the only effects he uses are a wah-wah pedal and possibly an overdrive pedal for extra sustain/feedback on certain parts. Yeah, he also has used an Eventide Harmonizer in the studio, but just like Satch, almost all of his harmonized parts are overdubbed, NOT done by an effect. Now Satch, Vai AND JP are my top 3 favorite players, so I'm not taking any sides. I also can't picture a Vai or Satch in DT. But to blatently rip on them by saying they have to rely on effects is utterly retarded- er wait, that's giving retarded people a bad name- I mean it's fucking ignorant. Also, this is in no way a rip on JP, but in case you haven't noticed, JP's rack setup is the size of a fucking refrigerator! It's all there so that he's able to recreate the tones/sounds we hear on the records almost perfectly, and it sounds ubelievable. So, think before you speak/type, and enjoy the new asshole I've torn for you. - JK
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 17:44:44 EST From: MusicSnob@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: The Quiet Room Message-ID: <1da4e69c.36cf3adc@aol.com>
The "new" vocalist is not a "cookie monster" singer. I saw/heard him at Powermad 97, and he is a regular old prog metal singer, sticking mostly to the areas the original singer covered. I can't even imagine TQR with a cookie monster singer. Oscar the Grouch - sure. Anyone else going to the KX show tonight at JAXX? I will be the one with the #10 Milwaukee Admirals jersey.
NP: Power of Omens - Eyes of the Oracle
Kevin
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 16:49:57 -0600 (CST) From: mpm_2112@ix.netcom.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: Angra prog? Message-ID: <1999220173153741@ix.netcom.com>
<<On a completely different note, I've come to a conclusion about Angra. I have all 3 of their studio discs. I think we can all agree that Holy Land is by far their most progressive. But I think a lot of us also agree that their first (Angels Cry) and their latest (Fireworks) really aren't all that progressive at all. Don't get me wrong, they're awesome discs, but I think we're quick to lump Angra in with our favorite prog-metal bands without really giving thought to what Angra is all about.>>
Id have to dissagree. Although I dont have Holy Land, I would say that Fireworks is a very prog album. Just listen to Wings of Reality, Petrified Eyes, Lisbon, the middle section and end of Speed, etc etc. Theres a lot of that kind of stuff in there, moreso than Angel's Cry.
Matt
===================================================== "A daily dose of eMpTyV "Following our instinct will flush your mind not a trend. Go against right down the drain." the grain until the end." -Dream Theater -Metallica =====================================================
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Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 16:21:02 -0700 From: "Korg Ecksthrey" <korgx3@safelink.net> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Chameleons with English Accents Message-ID: <005c01be5d27$b1aa7a80$580d84d0@default>
>led by the diabolical Zartan. That's all I know. Do not e-mail me for more
Holy shit, you're right! I never understood, though, what good it did for Zartan to turn that sickly greyish green color. I guess it was supposed to be for camouflage, but he was a master of disguise and all that it seemed rather rediculous to me. I guess whenever he got in sunlight he could use it as a sympathy trick and start rolling around on the ground. A concerned passerby could yell, "Oh my God! That man is choking!" and a heroic muscleboy would hurry to give Zartan a heimlich maneuver whereby Zar would cop tremendous feels... This is going absolutely nowhere....
DTC... Zartan and his family drive James LaBrie's old caddilac. It still has James' hair glued to it and growls like a grizzly sometimes.
>Well, it worked with Aeon Flux. I can't speak for your own personal >miscreantic ideas, (Korgx3^23)+3.14.
Aeon Flux don't have shit on my photographic abilities... although I wish she did... -- KorgX3 the fecaphiliac
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Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:40:58 +0100 From: "gregor" <gregor@rz-online.de> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: music industry Message-ID: <002801be5d2a$9824a2e0$8b1efea9@Sprite.rhein-zeitung.de>
Wow, this is my first posting to the list, a strange feeling.
<If you buy the new Hanson album and love <it (like I did, keep reading if you dare), you're more likely to buy <future <albums, go to concerts, buy merchandise, etc. If you didn't, you <won't. <If a record company shells out $150,000 to make an album and it <goes platinum <ten times over, everybody involved stands to make a shit load of <money (with <the artists being the lowest head on the totem pole). You don't <think t= hat the <record companies, promoters, merchandisers, etc, want that to <happen wi= th that <same artist every two years? Of course they do.
That is pretty clear, they want to make money as long and as much as possible. But you never know who starts the circle: they give people what people want or they make the people want something? I think it is a problem of both sides, industry and people. People don=B4t want to listen music, they just don=B4t want silence. In every supermarket and fashion shop they are playing the charts in backround, mostly songs you can sing after 2 or 3 times listening. If you would listen, you would be bored very fast (IMO). They just consume, it is the same with soap operas on TV. Industry of course is clever enough to feed the need; they even realized that you can create a need (pushing it over MTV, all radio stations ...). That is the same with fashion and i think it is a problem of a society in which a lot of people think that it is important to be "in".
DT will never have the attention of "the world". The mass doesn=B4t want songs over 4.00 minutes with more than a simple melody, 3 or 4 chords and a straight drum. That would be not comfortable to listen (consume). I took a friend of mine to the concert in Bonn ( he is drummer in an alternative rock band), he was just standing there, mouth and eyes open, staring at MP. (me too :) ). After the concert he told me how great it was, how good... ; but he also told me that he couldn=B4t listen to DT often because it would be to hard to follow the music!!
I think even if industry want to make prog pop, they would not be able to. You can make people do a lot, but just if they want or if they don=B4t care, never if they don=B4t want in any way.
But i agree with Joshua, that industry also don=B4t want to. Even if DT would sell like Matchbox20 or Hanson or the whole boygroups, i don=B4t think that they would be happy ( they would like the money, of course, but not the evolution in the buisness generally).
The thing is that it is so easy ( and money-making) to "create" bands wh= en a new hype has been established, if this hype is not too complicated. Example: Take 5 nice guys, a beat and a melody, let them dance and, if you have courage, let them sing ;) and i bet they will make it (NKotB, TT, BSB, NSync...). The same about Live, Matchbox20, Bush... . But imagine them to make clones from DT. Ups, we need good musicians, what now? Of course there are a lot of talented guys out there, but compared to the mass it is nothing. You cannot flow the market with bands like DT, and it is hard to replace them. Why?? They are creative, original, no standard!!!
I don=B4t know if it is advantage or not that bands like DT are "underground", but it is like this and it will not change before people do not change their way of "consuming". And that, IMHO will take a looong time, when i think optimistic.
So, that was all, i think it is long enough. Just my point of view, write if you disagree!
Gregor
"Todo lo que es hermoso tiene su instante, y pasa." Luis Cernuda
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 16:16:26 -0800 From: Lisa Marie <ytsegirl@pacbell.net> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: "Power of Metal" (was: D'oh!) Message-ID: <36CF505A.5D9B917C@pacbell.net>
You can get "Power of Metal" from The Laser's Edge... http://www.lasercd.com
-- Lisa Marie "Jessie" ytsegirl@pacbell.net _______________________________ Ytsejam Radio on Real Audio http://www.dreamt.org/ytseradio
Alex O'Connell wrote: > > ARGH!! > Well actually I should first thank you for clearing this up for me finally. > :) I appreciate it. But now I have another problem; knowing where it's > from, I can't get my hands on it!! I have been browing around Noise > Records' site for a while, nada. I didn't expect much from them either, > but one can always hope. Other than that tape your friend sent you, you > have no other copy of it though? Dammit! I NEED TO HEAR IT!! This isn't > fair. I would probably go all out and pay the double-cd jap import price > just for that song, that's how fixated I am now . But I can't find it > anywhere. GRRRRRR. Off to search the web some more. Thank you for your > nugget of information, though.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 03:19:14 +0200 From: "TSM" <tonimaki@dlc.fi> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: In the Woods, blah blah blah, Echolyn Message-ID: <199902210127.DAA23534@laatikko.saunalahti.fi>
Hi there
Joe DeAngelo wrote: >I happened to see some In the Woods discs at a local store (Omnio.... >and something else). I remember hearing mention of the name on the Jam >before, but don't recall any details. Are these guys worth checking >into? Info please! =)
Well, it depends on your musical preferences but IMO they are great. They are not anywhere near prog-metal or prog. Their first (?) album Heart of the Ages is a mixture of melodic black and death metal with clean vocals and bm shrieks but it's still very far from your avarage black metal like Cradle of Filth (whose vocs and drums make me think of enraged Donald Duck beating a typewriter with a sledge hammer.) Omnio is best described as atmospheric metal. It's more melodic, features clean male and female vocals and less distortion on guitars. I suggest that you go and give it a whirl.
A snake fellating itself wrote: >I have no idea what a "ripper" is for DVD. Ripper was one of the Dreadnoughts, >led by the diabolical Zartan. That's all I know. Do not e-mail me for more >information about Ripper. He could tear stuff up in ways that would make even >the Nemesis Enforcer jealous.
You're so childish. I thought that everyone on this list had grown out of G.I. Joe. Besides, Megatron could beat the shit out of your stupid Zartan. G.I. Joe comics and action figures are trash. I'd put 'em in a trash can. Transformers rule.
Dave Peterson wrote: >I gave a listen to Chaosphere, their (Meshuggah) newest one, without >ever hearing them before. Boy were my ears in for an awakening!
Yeah! Great, isn't it?
>Rhythms. Plain and simple. No melody, no riff, nothing but shouting >and endless, non-stop, ever-changing, pulsating, battering rhythms. >Polyrhythms, I believe. No trace of a pattern either. Sure the drummer >keeps time with his high-hat but everything else after that is >completely random. At least it sounds that way.
The only album I've heard from these guys is Destroy Erase Improve. It's also very aggressive and filled with polyrhythms but at least there are some melodies. And even if it might be a little challenging you still can find a rhythm pattern from here and there ;) If I remember correctly some people have described them as a progressive version of Pantera but I think they have misunderstood the meaning of the word "prog". Sure, their music is fast, technical and has lots of time changes and polyrhythms but that doesn't mean it's prog. Morbid Angel is fast, somewhat technical and has time changes but I doubt that anyone would say that they'd be very progressive. Even though the guys of Meshuggah list Rush, Mike Oldfield, Allan Holdsworth, Tori Amos (!) etc. amongst their "sources of inspiration" the music is clearly death metal (or cyber metal or whatever.) I like their music very much but don't expect that it's anywhere near Oldfield, Rush, Yes, DT or anything that prog is about. Balls and chunk is where it's at.
Angelo Lombardi wrote: >I'll tell you what... "For The Love Of God" is the ONLY song by Vai that >I like. Seems like the only song that he sat down & thought about it.
Well, of course it's not my business to tell you what's good music and what isn't but IMO Vai is a great guitarist with a very unique style. I bet Petrucci couldn't play like Vai even if he wanted to but hey, I'm a bassist, what do I know. Anyway, you might want to sit down, listen to Passion & Warfare and Fire Garden one more time and think about it.
Matt T. wrote: >And.... if you haven't done so, pick up "Tales From the Thousand Lakes", >"Elegy", and the "My Kantele" EP from Amorphis. Incredible stuff. Melodic >prog death metal. Incredible stuff. "Elegy" is one of my favorite albums in >recent years. Can't wait for their new one! :-)
A good band but once again not prog. Elegy might have some Pink Floyd influences but I don't consider even PF to be prog so that's it then ;) And I like TFtTL better, anyway. The forthcoming album should be somewhere between these two so I expect it to be worth buying.
And now for something completely different. I have four (4) songs by Echolyn. I want more, more, more. I've ordered As the World from the local Free Record Shop but unfortunatelly that's the only one available. I hope that some kind soul could copy me all of their other releases on cds. I have nothing to trade so I could either trade for blanks or pay cash. And I'm willing to send the guys (and their record company) their share so no-one can accuse me of piracy ;) That's all for now. Fish On.
NP: More Best of Leonard Cohen
------------ tonimaki@dlc.fi --------------- | There are three kinds of people; | | Those who can count and those who can't. | --------------------------------------------
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4685 **************************
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