YTSEJAM Digest 4702
Today's Topics:
1) 5 minute argument or the full half hour?
by "Agar, Jonathan (CAP, EURO)" <Jonathan.Agar@gecapital.com>
2) Re: ATTENTION ALL DRUMMERS
by David_Cuthbert@Interflora.CCMAIL.compuserve.com
3) Poundhound
by "Trevor W. Hoit" <TrevorW@ms.kallback.com>
4) NIN, some relavance to DT
by Amanda Rosenblum <mildew@ucla.edu>
5) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4701
by "Jan Melander" <jan.melander@got.wmdata.se>
6) DT tribute / Bands
by CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk>
7) End of LtL
by Calvin6S@aol.com
8) Re: I wanna fuck you like a ytsejammer
by Frank Benenati <fmb@frontierlogic.com>
9) NIN etc.
by Steffen Barabasch <TheMirror@westend.com>
10) Threshold
by ASHLEY WONG <ashley.wong@etl.ericsson.se>
11) Da Blues
by "Giannotti, Nick" <GiannottiN@hanscom.af.mil>
12) DT tribute, mp3s, echolyn
by "Toni Maki" <tonimaki@dlc.fi>
13) Re: Grrrrrrr
by mpm_2112@ix.netcom.com
14) DT fan cult / KWS
by CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 10:38:17 -0000
From: "Agar, Jonathan (CAP, EURO)" <Jonathan.Agar@gecapital.com>
To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: 5 minute argument or the full half hour?
Message-ID: <83E9BD6E053FD111B35A0000F6093E2701A5BC97@LON01XBCAPGE>
>From:"Isaac Trumbo" <inferno_one@hotmail.com
<mailto:inferno_one@hotmail.com> >
>so what you're saying is that you feel the majority of people only >enjoy
listening to music at relatively poor quality and only while they >sit at
the computer.. sure..
No, 'course not. I'm not an expert, but having an MP3 source makes pirate
CD-R burning much easier, I presume... And only fans would worry about the
cover sleeve.
>secondly, if an artist makes music that people want to hear.. people >will
support it.. I think it's safe to say that the majority of mp3 >connoisseurs
buy albums of artist they want to support..
Don't we moan on this list that DT just isn't getting enough exposure, and
'if only more people knew...'? If mp3s spread the message, that's a plus.
But as CD burning gets easier and cheaper, I'm worried that you could be
wrong on your second point.
>don't you think it's a good idea to go to dreamtheater.net listen to all
>of Awake (or however much DT wants to make available) and when >you pick up
your chin from the floor and kick down the cash, Dream >Theater gets 50 - 70
percent of the cash instead of like 6%?...
If the artist can get that much and is satisfied with the promotion, it
sounds like an interesting proposition. But if everyone just rips and
burns, 50% of nothing is less than 6% of everything. Is it profitable for
the little guys as well as the big names you mention? Would they ever take
off properly? Maybe it is the right solution for niche bands who won't ever
conquer the world. But not for the mainstream.
>Anyways... put that in your pipe and smoke it
>inferno
I love the smell of an argument in the morning!
>From: "Brian Hayden" <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu <mailto:hayd0029@tc.umn.edu> >
>Subject: Re: Fear of the Hand of Ptacek smiting my breasts.
>The NIN line is one of direct rage, visceral hate, wanting to >physically,
mentally, emotionally ravage the one who has hurt you. >Whereas, the SDV
line is one of resignation; the narrator will stick >with inanimate magazine
models rather than risk any emotional >involvements, now that he has faced
the losing side of love. There is >no threat of malice here.
Wow! Intelligent conversation on the 'jam! Now everyone's doing it! I
want my money back!
Jonathan
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 05:44:25 -0500
From: David_Cuthbert@Interflora.CCMAIL.compuserve.com
To: "INTERNET:ytsejam@ax.com" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Re: ATTENTION ALL DRUMMERS
Message-ID: <199902250544_MC2-6BB9-710B@compuserve.com>
Jeremy added
> ** Pick up a set of ear protection that lumberjacks use. I think
> these are the best. If you get a good pair, you can use them for
> hours without wax
Vi Virth do some headphone type things like this, they actually do one
set that are just for protection and another that are headphone like
(i.e. they have speakers in them). Rod Morgenstein and Jordon Rudess
use them I think, well they the last thing I heard. I wanted a pair
but when I rang Vic he said they were looking for a new manufacture.
DTX Dave
(Yes a UK jammer but you wouldn't know it from my mail address)
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 02:44:01 -0800
From: "Trevor W. Hoit" <TrevorW@ms.kallback.com>
To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Poundhound
Message-ID: <E04FDFCFDC87D21194D300A0C9D4BAFA0F3CDD@ms.kallback.com>
> And now for something completely different . . . Has anyone heard the
> Doug
> Pinnick solo album "Poundhound"??
I never even heard of it til I saw it in the CH catalog, but I ordered
it anyway.
How bad could it be?
On the other hand, how its the Ty Tabor solo cd?
More like Kings X, Platypus, both or neither?
Trevor
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 02:57:06 -0800
From: Amanda Rosenblum <mildew@ucla.edu>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: NIN, some relavance to DT
Message-ID: <36D52C81.55B5FBB2@ucla.edu>
Hi again,
Just had to interject when NIN was mentioned. Seems like NIN bashing
is popular nowadays, not to say that all those Trent haters out there
are only doing it to do the trendy thing. Sadly, enough, listening to
NIN got me through some of the toughest stuff of my life. Being only
18, some people would argue that what I consider to be emotionally
traumatic and tough is nothing compared to blah blah blah, but the fact
remains. Sometimes I would come home from an awful day, feeling like a
miserable waste of space, and somehow listening to Trent scream,
agonize, yell, sob, and whatever else he does, made me feel like I
wasn't alone. Just knowing that someone out there felt the same way as
I do made me feel like maybe there was a point to my life.
I love DT's lyrics, but in a different way. When I listen to their
songs, I get an alternate point of view, and new insight and perspective
into some of the events of my life. IMO, both bands are brilliant, but
for what are obviously very different reasons. Nothing beats coming
"home" to this cramped dorm room after a frustrating day of classes and
work and putting on "Broken", and telling the whole world to go fuck
itself.
~~Amanda
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Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 12:01:36 +0100
From: "Jan Melander" <jan.melander@got.wmdata.se>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4701
Message-ID: <199902251047.LAA17968@goethe.got.wmdata.se>
>..........SRV........well..........is he white or am i
> wrong........
Well, not any more.... ;-)
/Janne
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
Jan Melander, WM-data
jan.melander@got.wmdata.se
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
#define QUESTION ((bb) || !(bb)) - Shakespeare
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 22:40:25 +0100
From: CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk>
To: YtseLand <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: DT tribute / Bands
Message-ID: <36D471C9.C196F5AA@mol.com.mk>
Wow, wow, what was that thing - Tribute to DT????? Is this some official
stuff or ...?
'Bout that influences thing:
I think 80s and 90s were also quite good, although taken all together
not as much as the 60s and 70s!
But I think in our age we also have quite much good music to be proud
of, no matter how much of it was radio or TV exposed.
The Grunge thing was quite big and brought great fresh blood:
Soundgarden (pioneers)
Stone Temple Pilots
Alice In Chains
Pearl Jam
Some other great stuff:
Living Colour
Peter Gabriel, Dead Can Dance
Simple Minds, U2
Pop music had much stars, as metal and rock too - so it's counts too.
-- CyberDuke*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* "Chuck! Chuck! This is your cousin ... your cousin, Marvin Berry! Remember the new sound you were looking for? Well listen to THIS!" - Back To The Future I *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* _______________________________________________________ Home Page http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Gym/3466/ E-mail duskob@mol.com.mk ICQ# 17392722 _______________________________________________________
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 06:51:36 EST From: Calvin6S@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: End of LtL Message-ID: <6b94517c.36d53948@aol.com>
Forgive me if in the skimming of ytsejams that I had failed to realize that this question was already addressed But just in case it wasn't, Mike Portnoy addressed "the mysterious" choir at the end of Learning to Live on the AOL message board earlier this month:
___________________________________________________________________
Here's some trivia..... That is NOT James... It is I&W Producer David Prater. On the last day of mixing (while we were not in the studio), he took it upon himself to sing on our record....(The closing moment of it - no less!!!) He then hopped on a plane to Florida...
When we came into the studio to hear the final mix, he was already gone and his vocals were there with nothing we could do about it!!!!
And he sometimes wonders why we won't work with him again!! : )
Just some Ytse trivia for ya'...
Mike Portnoy
PS - more LTL-outro trivia: On that same section near the end of LIVEtime, you can hear the whole audience in Paris singing that choir part... Well, that was the very 1st time ever that I heard the audience sing that part... I thought they choose a particularly cool evening to do it....
__________________________________________________________________
I don't think I have violated Mike's privacy (I hope not) by reposting this because he originally posted it to a public message board.
So Mike, tell us what you think of the Sax on Another Day.
"Sax is a lot like sex. Even when its bad, its good." (quote is probably not exact and it isn't from the mouth of Portnoy)
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Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 07:31:47 -0500 From: Frank Benenati <fmb@frontierlogic.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: I wanna fuck you like a ytsejammer Message-ID: <36D542B3.1229BD18@frontierlogic.com>
Larry wrote: > Sorry, Brian, but have you actually fucked anyone? Ever really get into it, > and feel like your whole reason for being is embodied in your dick? Ever > rock your baby like your back ain't got no bone? (Apologies to Bonnie > Raitt, John Lee Hooker, et al). Ever lose your self in the raw, animal lust > of hot, sweaty sex until you finally explode in orgasmic pleasure????
Oh Man!!! Did you HAVE to write that???? If ever there were an example of the phrase 'too much information', you would have been contacted by Webster's Dictionary! :)
Actually, I somewhat agree that those lyrics don't really talk about rape, than they do sex, but I have to mention that I question the motive. I mean, wanting to have sex with someone is a perfectly normal subject for a song. It almost makes me think back to the wonderful late 80's. Unfortunately, it was all too normal to construct a song about desiring someone sexually. That is the main reason why I question what that song is really about. I mean, every band up till that NIN song was writing about sex. Do you really think Trent Reznor was going to follow a trend???
-mojoman
Don't forget about fantasy baseball. email me at fmb@frontierlogic.com for league password and ID. /\ /\ \_\/_/ . / _ _ \ . |\ |(*)(*)| /| #-----------------OOO---oo---OOO------------# # Frank Benenati - fmb@frontierlogic.com # # "Some of the nicest people are dogs" # # - Richard Dean Anderson # #__________________________ooo______________# ooo (_) (_)
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Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 14:10:36 +0100 From: Steffen Barabasch <TheMirror@westend.com> To: Ytsejam <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: NIN etc. Message-ID: <v04020a00b2faf4be5fc1@[195.14.233.96]>
Hi!
"fuck you like an animal" sounds pretty *deep* for me, in a certain sense... ;-)
And please stop posting the info about the tribute album a dozen times here. It's not *that* interesting!
Steffen -- Steffen Barabasch (mailto:TheMirror@westend.com)
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 14:31 +0100 From: ASHLEY WONG <ashley.wong@etl.ericsson.se> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Threshold Message-ID: <199902251331.08T1@eds.ericsson.se>
--- Received from ETL.ETLAYWG +44-1444-231883 99-02-25 14:31
-> ytsejam(a)ax.com
Hello all,
Just a few comments on the Threshold gig on Sunday just gone.
Setlist: (photocopy pinched from the stage...) Freaks Angels Devoted The Latent Gene Sunseeker Life's Too Good Into the Light/Sanity's End Change Goodbye MotherEarth Voyager II Siege of Baghdad/Part of Chaos Sunrise on Mars Paradox (Encore)
Definetely more aggressive sounding and more heavier. Andrew M cdermott, the new singer, fits in well with this new sound on Clone. Later, during the evening his voice went a bit awry and was looking tired. In fact, when we shouted for the Paradox encore he just said 'oshit=A4' (he mentioned that he had a cold anyway).
Did anybody notice Johanne James, their current drummer? Jeez, is he brilliant or what? He just simply added real intensity to the sound. I overheard a few other guys commenting on Johanne as well.
On the merchandise stall I had a very pleasant chat with Richard West's, keyboards, wife (Kelly, I think). The night had been recorded and will be released as another live album later this year (Livedelica II ?). Also, I mentioned about the fanzine closing down. And she replied it was a shame but the time and effort required was way too much for the small subscriber base :( Then unexpectedly she gave me the Decadent CD (it was due to be sent out to make up for the lost subs.) and just asked for my name=A4 My faith in the future of humanity was briefly resurrected for that evening - thanks Kelly=A4
Sorry for not meeting the other ytsejammers=A4- (hello Charlie=A4)
regards,
Ashley.
ps. one of my mates didn't bother turning up even though I got his ticket well in advance - advice for getting him to pay up?
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 09:10:21 -0500 From: "Giannotti, Nick" <GiannottiN@hanscom.af.mil> To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Da Blues Message-ID: <390762D98D63D2118C280060081358CC41483B@hamsxha2.hanscom.af.mil>
> to sum up KWS and johnny lang, and all the other BB King wannabe's I mearly > quote George Carlin....White people have no business playing the blues...EVER!
If there's ever been a crock of shit that's been said or written, this is it. Even more than, "Hey, I think Nirvana had some redeeming qualities." Like Ptacek said before he was assimilated by the Borg, there's a VERY impressive list out there of white guys who can play the blues (and not just play the blues, but *play* the blues - case in point, the Satriani/SRV MTV Unplugged, where one guy very impressively played blues licks on the guitar, and the other guy played the blues), and names like Bonnie Raitt, Eric Clapton, the Vaughn brothers, and anything that ends in Allman are just scratching the surface.
And to lump KWS and Johnny Lang in with B.B. King, by the way, is akin to saying Symphony X, Yes, and Frank Zappa are all progressive. Der. Yeah, they all are, but there are different subdivisions of blues, just like there are any other type of music. R-E-S-E-A-R-C-H. KWS is Texas; Lang, I'm not sure about, but BB is a cross between Mississippi and Chicago Blues. Different sound, feel, and style to all of them.
Nicholas Giannotti x6745 Joint STARS Contracts giannottin@hanscom.af.mil ---------------------------------- Si hoc signum legere potes, operis boni in rebus Latinus alacribus et fructuosis potiri potes!
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 16:15:07 +0200 From: "Toni Maki" <tonimaki@dlc.fi> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: DT tribute, mp3s, echolyn Message-ID: <199902251424.QAA11447@laatikko.saunalahti.fi>
Miguel Farah inquired: >I say... isn't a bit EARLY (as in 20 years before the right time) to do >a DT tribute album?
Not necessarilly. If I remember correctly a tribute to Metallica (Metal Militia) was made shortly after the release of the Black Album (I'm not quite sure here but it was before Load, anyway.). DT has been around over a decade and I think this time is as good as any. Who are you to say you have to wait for a certain time before you can give a tribute to an artist or a band? Remember that there have been i.e. Oasis tribute/cover bands for a good while, now.
>>This whole thing smells rotten. > >Indeed.
Nope. It only smells funny.
Isaac Trumbo wrote: >so what your saying is that you feel the majority of people only enjoy >listening to music at relatively poor quality and only while they sit at >the computer.. sure.. even portable mp3 players, CDs are transportable >and twice the sound quality of your average 128kbps mp3... also there's >no way to make up for album sleeves electronically..
Hmmm... Just a few remarks a) 128kbps mp3s are far from poor quality. They're not as good as cds but most of the ppl don't notice the difference. I don't know if I would 'cause I haven't had a chance to compare them in a fair race. At the moment it's my homestereos vs. my crappy portable. But after all, people did well w/ tapes so I can't see the problem w/ mp3s. b) I know some guys who's computers have better audioplayback than their stereos. Or who don't own stereos at all but listen to music through their computers. c) You're completely ignoring the possibily that somebody might convert mp3s into wavs and burn a cd of 'em. d) Most people don't give a rat's ass of album sleeves.
>secondly, if an artist makes music that people want to hear.. people >will support it.. i think it's safe to say that the majority of mp3 >connoisseurs buy albums of artist they want to support.. i know for me >it's been a means of research.. it's not every day you turn on the radio >and hear royal hunt playing.. if i hadn't heard an mp3 they never would >have seen my money..
BS! AFOM has almost all music Jethro Tull has put out and he hasn't bought a single album. It's all on mp3s. The dude has 13-14 cds full of nothing but mp3s downloaded from the net. Not to mention all the cds he has copied with his burner. It's true that mp3s are a good way to get into some new bands but if someone can get a full lenght album from net he most propably won't go to buy it. You, I and mr. Ptacek would but most of the people don't have any special urge to support the artist.
>the point i was trying to make was that people like liquid audio >are doing a damn good job promoting bands online.. they stream >music at CD quality without having to download it.. you can go >to the artists page, sample the music and buy it if you want it..
Didn't this thread start from somebody's idea to trade full albums in mp3 format?
>anyways... put that in your pipe and smoke it
<poof, poof> Hmm.. some good shit. <poof>
Korg Ecksthrey thus saith: >Damn Chris, I thought you were gonna quit flaming people. :D
Hell. I'm most certainly not complaining if he carries on. Althought sometimes quite ruthless and reckless in his statements he always has a point. I usually agree with Chris but he says things in a better way than I do. When we let Chris loose I don't have to waste time and effort in typing, I still see people (who deserve it) get their butt kicked and get a few good laughs as a bonus :)
>I can smell the Baked Al"ASS"ka from here. That whole speil makes me think >you don't like the idea of me charging $20 a month entrance for my 10GB MP3 >server, you poo poo head. :) <j/k> I agree with you. But I'm still not >deleting my 10GB MP3 disk
LOL! I don't think you have to fear for your jukebox as long as there's only mp3s YOU made of YOUR cds YOU BOUGHT. I'm (once again) not sure but i think that if you own the original cd you can make as many copies of it as you wish in any audio format as long as they remain in your use and nobody else's.
My relationship with mp3s? Liberal, I guess. My mp3 collection consist almost solely of music that isn't available in any official cd. All the rest is stuff I'm going to get as soon as possible. If I download songs I don't like they usually stay in my hd for a couple of days. I give em a new chance and if I don't like it it's nothing more than waste of discspace so off it goes. If I suddenly decide to like it I buy the cd and then it's all the same what I do with the mp3 file.
On relative note, I need more space on my hd so I would gladly dump echolyn's Shades and Winterthru. It's only that it's impossible since the original cds aren't available anywhere. So if any jammer happens to have any cds by echolyn that he/she dislikes mail me! I will buy them! All of them! (except As the World, which arrived yesterday! Woohoo!) Or, if you know someplace where I can order them, mail me as well.
NP: echolyn - As the World Secret Chiefs 3 - Second Grand Constitution and Bylaws
------------ tonimaki@dlc.fi --------------- | There are three kinds of people; | | Those who can count and those who can't. | --------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 09:09:07 -0600 (CST) From: mpm_2112@ix.netcom.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: Grrrrrrr Message-ID: <199922594724541@ix.netcom.com>
<<Not to get too PC here, but:
A). What the fuck does George Carlin know about music? He's trying to make a joke. That's what he's good at. He doesn't believe everything he says. B). I don't know... but it's not funny when you say it.
You've admitted to a dislike of the blues, and your above statement illustrates an ignorance to it as well.... these guys aren't B.B. King rip offs. Don't talk about things you don't know anything about>>
First of all, exactly, he's a comedian. Its supposed to be funny, so dont take it too seriously (as many people do nowadays). In the context of his skit at the time anyway.
Second, I know the blues pretty well, since it was the first form of guitar type music I listened to. Yeah, I used to appriciate it more than I do now, but basically, it bores me. Its too repetative for me, and it sounds like its the same thing over and over again. You may even say a lot of it is too simple for me. I happen to like more complicated stuff (hence the fact I like DT, LTE, Angra, and other forms of prog, prog/metal, and fusion), and as a guitarist, I just dont go for that "he's got GREAT feel" thing. Perhaps Im still young, but I would much prefer listening to John McLaughlin, DIMeola, and Paco DeLucia completely shred up their acoustic guitars on Friday Night In Sanfrancisco than listen to a blues cat that has "great feel." For the record, there has only been one blues guitarist that I have been entertained by, and thats SRV. When I heard him on a SNL rerun, I felt that his playing was more than just rehashed cliches, and he kept his playing very interesting to listen to. I dont hate blues, but for the most part it doesnt entertain me as much as some other genres that I could be listening to.
Oh and by the way, George Carlin does practice much of what he preaches, and believes most of the stuff he says on stage (at least, thats what I've gathered from some interviews he's done).
Matt
===================================================== "A daily dose of eMpTyV "Following our instinct will flush your mind not a trend. Go against right down the drain." the grain until the end." -Dream Theater -Metallica =====================================================
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 13:03:59 +0100 From: CyberDuke <duskob@mol.com.mk> To: YtseLand <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: DT fan cult / KWS Message-ID: <36D53C2F.8CE47121@mol.com.mk>
> Right now, DT has, at best, a widespread cult-type following.
Heh, I heard this in more occasions, and I guess it's true. Any idea of WHY we (DT fans) act like this????? I mean, OK, all of you, me and everyone are fans of wider spectar of music, but I also noticed that toward DT we are kinda too intense in a way! :) Whta's going on, what is the power that makes us do that? Some inverted deep vocals "Adore Us! Worship us!" behind the DT songs or .... :) Interesting stuff!
KWS: I only once saw a video clip from KWS band! The first thing that made my hair goes nuts was his playing style! "Wow man, this guy rips SRV!"
But I don't care, I LOVED the song! That's why I'm still looking to hear their album. And for later ... we'll see. :) -- CyberDuke
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* "Chuck! Chuck! This is your cousin ... your cousin, Marvin Berry! Remember the new sound you were looking for? Well listen to THIS!" - Back To The Future I *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* _______________________________________________________ Home Page http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Gym/3466/ E-mail duskob@mol.com.mk ICQ# 17392722 _______________________________________________________
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4702 **************************
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