YTSEJAM Digest 4595
Today's Topics:
1) Myung/Levin
by David Dixon <David@iisweb.com>
2) Jens
by David Dixon <David@iisweb.com>
3) ds stage presence
by MeatCakes@aol.com
4) King's X & Galactic Cowboys
by Doug Cronkhite <c4@san.rr.com>
5) JR
by Pat Daugherty <Pat.Daugherty@trw.com>
6)
by "Ed Wilk" <ed_wilk@hotmail.com>
7) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4594
by Nick Giannotti <nickg@gis.net>
8) a business view...
by drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh)
9) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4593
by Calvin6S@aol.com
10) falln asleep for a day and see what I missed?
by "Partha Mukhopadhyay" <ahtrap@hotmail.com>
11) Bwahaha
by "Brian D. Hayden" <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu>
12) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4594
by Amanda Rosenblum <mildew@ucla.edu>
13) "The Rudess Experiment"
by "David-Whitaker" <David-Whitaker@worldnet.att.net>
14) What I was actually trying to write
by Amanda Rosenblum <mildew@ucla.edu>
15) Female Musos Again
by IceQD@aol.com
16) Next Producer?
by Brian Hansen <bhansen10@yahoo.com>
17) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4594
by TEDESCO MATTHEW A <Matthew.Tedesco@Colorado.EDU>
18)
by "maX Verran" <maxverran@hotmail.com>
19) Next Producer? Album Title?
by Rick Audet <Ytse@concentric.net>
20) same thing. Just blow me off
by "maX Verran" <maxverran@hotmail.com>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 14:20:19 -0700
From: David Dixon <David@iisweb.com>
To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Myung/Levin
Message-ID: <3093FD59DB69D11193AA00A0C96056498091E8@messaging>
<<<< 1) John Myung to be replaced by Tony Levin
Portnoy + Petrucci + Rudess now think that they had so good time awhile
LTE, that they want Tony instead of John. Then they have "all-prog"
instrument-section. >>>>
I think Myung is a LITTLE more prog than Tony. Don't get me wrong, Tony is
my absolute FAVORITE bass player, with Myung, Sheehan, Hamm, and Burton
close on his tail. Tony is the groove man - as far as I can tell, he's
never been a shredder, or die-hard prog-man. He played for Peter Gabriel,
etc. (and I LOVE his work with them). Oh, BTW, he's on Pink Floyd's "A
Momentary Lapse of Reason" as well. Myung uses more 'prog' techniques, such
as two-hand tapping, etc., like other 'prog' bassists (though he is better
than them all:).
My 2 pesos
David Dixon, MCP
Internet Developer
Integrated Information Systems, Inc.
david@iisweb.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 14:27:27 -0700
From: David Dixon <David@iisweb.com>
To: "'ytsejam@ax.com'" <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: Jens
Message-ID: <3093FD59DB69D11193AA00A0C96056498091E9@messaging>
<<< Apparently you're not familiar with Korg products. Just having a
sound similar to Derek's doesn't mean that he's trying to be Derek. I
wonder how closely you are listening though... I couldn't think of two
more profoundly different rock keyboardists if I tried. >>>
Does Jens play Korg? And anyway, I wasn't really serious. I love Jens -
he's the man, and I love that he uses that wacky harpsichord sound all the
time. I was just hinting at the humorous possibility that Derek's sound may
have influenced him, due to his DT ties, etc...
David Dixon, MCP
Internet Developer
Integrated Information Systems, Inc.
david@iisweb.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 16:35:06 EST
From: MeatCakes@aol.com
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: ds stage presence
Message-ID: <c8ba59f2.36a64c0a@aol.com>
what a good point:
> One thing that has been mentioned a couple of times, and is wide-spread
> common knowledge: DS played with both KISS and Alice Cooper. Think about
> this...These are two the most OVER-THE-TOP, Flashiest, Glam-&-Slam stage
> shows in the history of Rock and Roll. Naturally, DS learned a thing or
> two about stage presence, showmanship, and theatrics from these acts.
> And these lessons are going to influence his style for the rest of his
> performing career. So it may not have been an ideal marriage when DT was
> on stage [i live in a very rural area and have yet to see DT perform
> live :-(((( ], but it is him -- nothing we can do about it but get over
> it; no sense in slamming him for being himself -- lest ye be slammed as
> well.
it's hard to knock someone's stage presence who has been in those bands....
besides, just because it's a little different than anyone else's doesn't mean
anything... besides, there can't be a whole lot you can do when you're stuck
behind a keyboard, ya know? I think he was rather creative with it.
rob
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 13:39:53 -0800
From: Doug Cronkhite <c4@san.rr.com>
To: ytsejam@axnet.net
Subject: King's X & Galactic Cowboys
Message-ID: <36A64D29.992740E9@san.rr.com>
Hey all,
Just saw this show last night here in San Diego.. King's X was great
from a musical standpoint.. but not much on show..
Galactic Cowboys however just ROCKED. Much fun.. great live energy,
solid sound, and really cool new material..
-Doug
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 16:52:50 -0500
From: Pat Daugherty <Pat.Daugherty@trw.com>
To: Dream Theater Mailing List <ytsejam@axnet.net>
Subject: JR
Message-ID: <36A65032.F715AFCD@trw.com>
Everyone keeps saying how Jordan didn't join DT in the first place was
because of family matters. That is crap. Read his bio on the DT web
page. It was written by him and says he decided to tour with the Dregs
instead of joining DT. That doesn't sound like family matters to me
unless the Dregs are related to him. So who knows why he is joining DT
now? Perhaps LTE got him to say wow?
anyway from the bio:
"When it rains it pours!!... In the course of one week I got a call from
"Dream Theater" and the "Dixie Dregs". I had about one week to
transcribe the music and program all the sounds for an upcoming Dregs
tour. On top of that I did the same with Dream Theater's music because I
had an audition with them two days before going out to Steve Morse's
house for rehearsal. I had a great whirlwind experience with Dream
Theater, and actually performed at the Concrete Music Convention with
them. When the storm blew over I decided to join the Dregs, and stay on
for all the upcoming tours. That was not an easy decision!"
NP:Star Wars-disc 1
-- |----------------------------------------------------------------| | Pat Daugherty Email: Pat.Daugherty@trw.com | | Web : http://www.abs.net/~patnbeck/pat/pat.html | |================================================================| | "Every breath leaves me one less to my last" --Dream Theater | |----------------------------------------------------------------|------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 13:59:22 PST From: "Ed Wilk" <ed_wilk@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Message-ID: <19990120215922.6019.qmail@hotmail.com>
My turn.
Derek sucked. He was a pop keyboardist who cold play and was lucky enough to be accepted into DT. DT found a better keyboardist and booted his ass out. Thank God. I, for one, can't wait to hear some wankery from DT and Rudess. Some PROG wankery. Not pop bullshit like Anna Lee. Viva la Jordan. I hope Derek has fun as a second keyboardist for Hanson. He fits in, there. He'll get more chicks than all 3 of the Hansons put together.
Ed-San
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 17:12:33 -0500 From: Nick Giannotti <nickg@gis.net> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4594 Message-ID: <36A654D0.E03EFC6A@gis.net>
Tell that to Keith Emerson. He'll stab both you AND Greg Lake in your 'organ'. :)
ytsejam@ax.com wrote:
> > From: "Merlo, Christopher" <ChristopherMerlo@Waterhouse.com> > Subject: derek/jordan
> Now, I'm not trying to imply that James isn't into the music, or anything
> like that at all, so put the torches away. I'm just saying that when the
> keyboard player makes more of a show than the singer, it's a little > unsettling, that's all. Jordan is quite a bit more reserved on stage.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 14:17:31 -0800 From: drkhoe@gms.gmsnet.com (Dr. Mosh) To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: a business view... Message-ID: <199901202217.OAA28538@gms.gmsnet.com>
Well, there's been much heated debate from a sentimental point of view for Derek versus Jordan, etc... but let's look at it from a cold biz point of view...
FII - it didn't sell like Awake of I&W... boot Derek? Sure... he's not a founding member... he's been like a hired gun all 4 years. When a corporation's stock is down... personnel changes are made.
Feel bad for Derek? No... he's got other fish to fry... other ventures to startup.
Jordan Rudess - a corporate recruit that was headhunted from day one... couldn't assimilate him because of prior obligations, best fit for organization , a definite yes... He's available, we snag him...
What's next? A change in the dynamics of the machine... perhaps a positive vibe... that'll get stockholders to be excited about the machine again...
My personal feelings? I'm very glad Jordan has joined the band... he's the next best thing from Kevin...
-The Doc
-- > drkhoe@gmsnet.com > http://progmetal.gmsnet.com > Windows will rule the world... and one day, you'll have to reboot the entire > thing cause it'll crash.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 17:20:08 EST From: Calvin6S@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4593 Message-ID: <d001a710.36a65698@aol.com>
> I was just thinking that even though Derek is out of DT, it may not be > the last time the members of DT work with Derek. Who knows, he may > ask John M or Mike P to help him on his solo effort
]From what I have heard, this is definitely not the case.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 14:26:10 PST From: "Partha Mukhopadhyay" <ahtrap@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: falln asleep for a day and see what I missed? Message-ID: <19990120222611.25010.qmail@hotmail.com>
geez, 11 jams in a day, and I figured sloppyjoe, hazex and Michael COughlin all jumped out of their shared closet on the same day and ignited a flame was the likes of which had never been seen on this jam, and as you know, we've had some good ones.......
Just checking in on UaCM, like i do every once in a while, and the bombshell hits me, and I know why traffic has suddenly tripled on this here forum.....and I'm guessing the 20 or so jams awaiting my reading (dis?)pleasure have little more than some variation on the Jordan Vs. Derek theme
I'm sure whatever i have to say has all been said before, but I feel this all too human need to say it all again.....
just one question: will this finally put the Derek vs Kevin debate to rest?
i lied: one more question: Rudess had the gig once before, what again were the reasons for his backing out then, and why dump Derek now? reading the announcement on UaCM, it doesnt seem like he left the band, but was rather forcibly replaced, like Mike and Johns and James saying, we don't wanna play with you anymore.....
a comment: sure hope the next dream theater album doesn't end up sounding like an extension of LTE, with vocals, because LTE is an album I haven't listened to, oh, probably since last summer.....early summer......(when did it come out, anyway?)(call me a beeyotch, but I never wrote a review of LTE because I didn't wanna slam that group of musicians)
as for the departure in other terms, let's just say this: this move guarantees that I witnessed the last ever performance of Nicky Lemons! man, am i ever the selfish bastard today....
one last question: wonder what the label's reaction to this change will be? there's an idea floating around some dark corner of my brain saying that someone will recognize this change as being a move away from commercial potential rock, which Derek with his background might be seen as an anchor to, towards a more progressive, more commercially marginalized band, and if that person happens to hold any sway, can you say, Magna Carta, here we come?
partha
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 16:27:15 -0600 From: "Brian D. Hayden" <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu> To: ytsejam@axnet.net, ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Bwahaha Message-ID: <36a65841250b002@mhub2.tc.umn.edu>
Responding to the message of <19990120215922.6019.qmail@hotmail.com> from ytsejam@ax.com:
> Derek sucked. He was a pop keyboardist who cold play and was lucky > enough to be accepted into DT. DT found a better keyboardist and booted > his ass out. Thank God. I, for one, can't wait to hear some wankery > from DT and Rudess. Some PROG wankery. Not pop bullshit like Anna Lee. > Viva la Jordan. I hope Derek has fun as a second keyboardist for > Hanson. He fits in, there. He'll get more chicks than all 3 of the > Hansons put together.
Hey, did you know that you're a big asshole? Quit trying to be cool, we all know you have a closet full of Elton John albums. If you were in Hanson the only action you'd get would be all three Hansons put together!
Oh yeah, I'm gonna kick your ass. Cause you suck. And your opinions suck. Cause they're WRONG.
-Yo mammy ;D
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 14:24:15 -0800 From: Amanda Rosenblum <mildew@ucla.edu> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4594 Message-ID: <36A6578F.EB9FABF9@ucla.edu>
In regards to what was listed below, in addition to other personal information listed by the Ice Queen that I am too lazy to copy... I believe that ytsejam is still a mailing list for Dream Theater fans, not the personal adds.
>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 16:26:39 -0600 From: "David-Whitaker" <David-Whitaker@worldnet.att.net> To: <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: "The Rudess Experiment" Message-ID: <008001bf4b39$637b3060$4beb490c@flapjack>
Boy, talk about an appropriate time for this bootleg to come out, eh?
If you're interested in how DT sounds with Jordan Rudess, then look no further. "The Rudess Experiment" is a soundboard recording of a mini-concert DT played back in '94. It's the only show Jordan Rudess filled in as interim keyboardist. The sound quality is amazing, and coincidentally the keys are oftentimes high in the mix. It's from the same show as the Rudess TTT clip that's been floating around for a few months. Go to http://dreamtheater.mit.edu (Bogie's "Lines in the Sand" site) for it if you haven't heard it yet!
I've just added three reviews of the disc to my site, and here's a quick link directly to them: http://scarred.mit.edu/re-information.html
I post *all* reviews for my discs (with permission first), so I'm not just posting the ones praising the disc, although that's all that have come in so far. ;)
The reviews are courtesy of people like Matt Teiper, Rodney VerBrugge and the infamous Scott Hansen, former master of the setlist project (now it's Bogie).
Take care, everybody! Ryan Whitaker Scarred Records http://scarred.mit.edu
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 14:29:14 -0800 From: Amanda Rosenblum <mildew@ucla.edu> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: What I was actually trying to write Message-ID: <36A658B9.19598164@ucla.edu>
Damn, I hit send a little too early. I was attempting to bitch about IceQueen and this: > I am 5' 10" tall and I have red crinkly hair. At school I used to get called > Queen Elizabeth 1 because I also have big blue eyes like an Elizabethan > painting.
I for one dont give a f***. If IceQueen feels she has been poorly represented on this mailing list, I think she should email those persons she feel are treating her unfairly, and do it privately. I dont want to hear anyone's life story. Or their stats. Like I said, this isnt a personal ad. Alright, back to DS vs JR. heh.
~~Amanda
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Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 17:53:22 EST From: IceQD@aol.com To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Female Musos Again Message-ID: <3545649a.36a65e62@aol.com>
Hi there
This is Ice's boyfriend Fire Fire & Ice (geddit) heheheh
Anyway, looking over the lists of all the lady musicians everyone so kindly supplied, I wondered why none of them play prog rock.
Does anyone else think (like I do) that this is mostly a GUY thing?
Before anyone flames me on this (don't worry I'm wearing my suit) I know there are various women subscribed to this list who enjot that sort of music, but are there any women who actually play prog rock in their bands out there?
Thanks
Fire
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 14:57:04 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Hansen <bhansen10@yahoo.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: Next Producer? Message-ID: <19990120225704.9742.rocketmail@send106.yahoomail.com>
Someone mentioned this before, but does anyone know who will be the producer on the next DT studio release? Producers are usually changed quite a bit, but they can often make quite a difference.
If Kevin Shirley is not there for the new one, who will it be? A previous producer, a famous producer, an unknown?
Hmmm...How about:
Dave Jerden - Infamous Dirt producer Sylvia Massy - Infamous Tool Producer Mutt Lange - Infamous Hit Producer John Paul Jones - Infamous Bass god and producer.
John Purdell, Duane Baron? Rob Zombie? Terry Brown? Terry Date? Puff Daddy? Steve Evetts, Eric Rachel? Kevin Moore? Flemming Rasmussen? Bob Rock? ;op
Of course it wouldn't be a surprise to see the recording co-produced by Dream Theater...
my $.02, BH
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 16:15:03 -0700 (MST) From: TEDESCO MATTHEW A <Matthew.Tedesco@Colorado.EDU> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4594 Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.990120160150.27746A-100000@ucsub.Colorado.EDU>
]From D-man:
> keyboardist and a great showman, but I don't think I'm alone when I say that > he just didn't fit into DT. I happen to love FII. I think it's a > great-sounding album with some magical songs on it. But let's call a spade > a spade now. Trial Of Tears and Lines in the Sand notwithstanding, there's > no Metropolis, no Scarred, no Learning to Live on that disc. (That's just
One question: I'm genuinely unsure what's meant here by "ToT and LitS notwithstanding." I'd have no problem putting these two songs (along with NM, possibly) on par with the epic DT songs you mention. I'm not sure if you mean that you include the two FII songs, or that they're close to that level but not quite there.
I only being this up because, while I do think FII keeps up with or surpasses the other albums in terms of epic song content, my problem with FII is that it's the first DT album for me (and seemingly several others) with skippable tracks. For me, I can't stomach YNM or BMS; others count HY, TAMP, AL, etc. on this list. I wasn't in on the FII sessions, obviously, so specifying about the reason for this skip-ability (whether it be Derek, which I doubt, or the group dynamic as a whole, which I tend to think more plausible) seems useless.
So to Jordan's arrival, then, I can only say that I look forward to this new dynamic, and listening to the results, hopefully without this skippable quality that I and many seem to think plagued FII.
-MATt
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 15:21:17 PST From: "maX Verran" <maxverran@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Message-ID: <19990120232117.24625.qmail@hotmail.com>
So they dumped Derek.
What the FUCK!!!
I'm about to proclaim Fates Warning my favorite band.
Hate mail me, of course...
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 18:24:46 -0500 (EST) From: Rick Audet <Ytse@concentric.net> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@axnet.net> Subject: Next Producer? Album Title? Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.4.01.9901201821160.22435-100000@galileo.cris.com>
Brian Hansen wrote:
> Of course it wouldn't be a surprise to see the recording co-produced > by Dream Theater...
Or produced by Rhys Fulber. That could make for an interesting record...
In other news, and I heard the tentative title for the new album is "Godot". ;)
Rick Audet San Francisco
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Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 15:27:34 PST From: "maX Verran" <maxverran@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@axnet.net Subject: same thing. Just blow me off Message-ID: <19990120232734.5661.qmail@hotmail.com>
I really like Jordan's playing, but he is NOT Dream Theater. And now I guess LTE will just go all to hell.
It's like, as soon as people finally get an idea just how good Derek is, they screw him over. You do NOT do this to a band member unless you can't work together.
Can you tell I'm just a little pissed off?
-maX
NP: Fates Warning: Chasing Time Explorers Club: Age Of Impact Brainbug: Benedictus
Like you care.
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4595 **************************
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