YTSEJAM Digest 5524
Today's Topics:
1) David Hasselhoff
by "Agar, Jonathan (CAP, EURO)" <Jonathan.Agar@gecapital.com>
2) re:DT does a cover of the Kinight Rider theme
by "Webmaster Ytsejam.com" <webmaster@ytsejam.com>
3) Re: Traumatising Hasselhoff Experience
by Zen102600@aol.com
4) RE: Das Rheingold des Hasselhoff; Joe Jackson
by "Steven Zebrowski" <szebro1@gl.umbc.edu>
5) label
by "Sager" <zero@garden.net>
6) "Progressive", "Barbecue" remain undefined; "Blue" a stumper
by Digital Man <cmerlo@optical.mindstorm.com>
7) physical geniuses
by Digital Man <cmerlo@optical.mindstorm.com>
8) RE: "Progressive", "Barbecue" remain undefined; "Blue" a stumper
by Coldfire The Gallery Mistress <coldie@bellatlantic.net>
9) Re: "Progressive", "Barbecue" remain undefined; "Blue" a stumper
by Brian Hayden <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu>
10) Rsepnose ot a dsixlesic jmamer.
by "Korg Ecksthrey" <korgx3@safelink.net>
11) Re: SyX - V
by "Matt Molite" <ytsejam11@dreamtheater.zzn.com>
12) Re: We All Need Some Light
by "Sasha C." <sasa.cabaravdic@pu.tel.hr>
13) Re: Progressive Music
by Fett2002@aol.com
14) Re: YTSEJAM digest 5523
by IAmClay777@aol.com
15) Re: Dream DVD
by Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu>
16) Re: Kings's X in Ljubljana 23rd
by Andrew Goktepe <goktepe@citilink.com>
17) Re: 1,5 + 1,5 = 2,10?
by Andreas Skarin - SDTS <sdts@sdts.nu>
18) Re: YTSEJAM digest 5513
by "M P" <mremann6@hotmail.com>
19) re:DT does a cover of the Kinight Rider theme
by Vince LuPone <vgl@syspac.com>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 18:55:20 +0100
From: "Agar, Jonathan (CAP, EURO)" <Jonathan.Agar@gecapital.com>
To: "'ytsejam@torchsong.com'" <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: David Hasselhoff
Message-ID: <83E9BD6E053FD111B35A0000F6093E2703A11BBE@LON01XBCAPGE>
Fett2002@aol.com <mailto:Fett2002@aol.com> wrote:
Does anyone have any possible kind of rational explanation
why David
Hasselhoff is popular in Europe? He's especially big in
Germany if I'm not
mistaken. What's the deal with this?
-mike C.
Well, Knight Rider was popular throughout Europe, he's got a
German name, his awful 'Night Rocker' album did really well in Germany while
he was a non-person in the States, and, moreover, Baywatch really doesn't
lose very much in translation, now does it folks? And since he bought the
show when they were going to axe it, you've got to hand it to him and let
him enjoy his success. And the English-sounding gentleman on Knight Rider
was DevOn, not DevIn. Devon is a county in south-west England. Not some
nondescript place in Pennsylvania where my company has a trailer rental
division.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 10:55:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Webmaster Ytsejam.com" <webmaster@ytsejam.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: re:DT does a cover of the Kinight Rider theme
Message-ID: <20000627175504.69818E0A9@sitemail.everyone.net>
>Or the face-off against the semi?
The semi in Night Rider was named Goliath, owned Garth the evil David Hasselhoff.
My god! What have I just done??? Sorry folks, a bit of geek regression.
Go get a free ytsejam.com email ;)
-Koggie
_____________________________________________________________
This email originated from http://www.ytsejam.com - Free YourName@Ytsejam.com email addresses, 6MB of Storage and no limit on file attachments.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 13:59:53 EDT
From: Zen102600@aol.com
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: Re: Traumatising Hasselhoff Experience
Message-ID: <73.4893291.268a4599@aol.com>
There I was....Minding my own business....flipping through channels
on tv.....I saw hasselhoff on tv....at first this was mildly acceptable
seeing as I was in the mood for some 80s nostalgia..thinking it was night
rider...I continued watching...not 2 seconds passed and I noticed he was
walking on a beach with a surf board thingymahjigger .....I freaked out and
reached for the remote....but it was too late....HE STARTED SINGING!!!!! HE
HAD A BAND BEHIND HIM AND EVERYTHING!!!!!...AN ENTIRE SONG!!!!!
needless to say I dident sleep well that night......
ok sorry...I know that has nothing to do with DT but I had to get that off my
chest.....
thanks...
-Luc
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 14:21:09 -0400
From: "Steven Zebrowski" <szebro1@gl.umbc.edu>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: RE: Das Rheingold des Hasselhoff; Joe Jackson
Message-ID: <NEBBIHDFALHOPNNPNHKNEEDKCAAA.szebro1@gl.umbc.edu>
Dudes, the reason why Hasselhoff is so revered in Deutschland is this:
just say "Hasselhoff" with a German accent - it sound f'ing cool!
}I actually believe that Hasselhoff is related to US
}football's Dan Marino.
}Look at them, they look alike.
I have always thought this. Someday when there's a TV movie made
about Marino's life, they should get Hasselhoff to play Dan the Man.
As far as Progressive music is concerned, I always thought that Joe
Jackson's music was incredibly progressive. Save the early stuff, it
always featured top notch musicianship, and lately he seems to be a
different artist on every album.
That being said, i hear his next album is going to be "Night and Day
2" - revisiting the theme of one of his earlier albums. Hmmm...
Steve Z
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 14:26:18 -0400
From: "Sager" <zero@garden.net>
To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com>
Subject: label
Message-ID: <001a01bfe065$30064820$6714b6d8@oemcomputer>
progressive is only a label. its a catagory to "catagorize" music under.
hell, they could call it "tomato" and it would still only be a label for
that style of music (although the example i used probably wouldnt catch on)
but you get my point. stop trying to break apart the meaning of the word.
the word doesnt always have to describe the music.
-evan
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 15:25:34 -0400
From: Digital Man <cmerlo@optical.mindstorm.com>
To: ytsejam@torchsong.com
Subject: "Progressive", "Barbecue" remain undefined; "Blue" a stumper
Message-ID: <20000627152534.A31905@optical.mindstorm.com>
On 2000-06-27 at 10:50 -0700, ytsejam@torchsong.com
<ytsejam@torchsong.com> truly believed:
> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 07:25:39 -0500
> From: Brian Hayden <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu>
> Subject: Re: hm...
>
> Now we get to the crux of the issue, obviously. There are two basic ways of
> using the word progressive with regards to music.
When asked to describe what my band sounds like, I try as hard as
possible not to use the term "progressive" for most of the reasons
discussed here. I prefer to say "Well, we're influenced by Rush, Yes,
Kansas, King Crimson, ELP..." to which most people respond "Oh, Tom
Sawyer, Owner of a Lonely Heart, Dust in the Wind, and that Carnival 9
song. Gotcha."
> I would like to submit that people should go back to using the term "art
> rock" rather than progressive. It is more indicative of what the sound
> actually is.
I'm starting this today. Thanks, Brian.
---> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 17:25:56 +0300 > From: Janne Jokitalo <janne_jokitalo@yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: We All Need Some Light? > > But, it's not Roine who sings on that one, it's a complete Neal > tune, he sure as hell sings it too =)
Roine does indeed sing WANSL on disc 2 of the special edition. I like Roine's voice, but I far prefer the final arrangement of the song (as found on disc 1).
---
> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 11:27:11 -0400 > From: Adam M Cook <ac003i@mail.rochester.edu> > Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 5522 > > Can't a good song be written in an already existing genre?
That seems to me to almost be the definition of a good song. People, as a whole, can't deal with new stuff, and most, I think, tend to define the term "good song" as "a hook-laden, easy to dance or copulate to, happy melody in a major key and 4/4".
I, on the other hand, tend to define a good song as "one which elicits an emotional response, and sticks around a while in your memory". Which really is the same thing, unless you're too shallow to get anything that's not about fucking, or too stupid to remember a Bungle tune.
> If we want our bands to be truly > progressive, shouldn't we look for completely original styles of music? > The only cd I've heard that comes anywhere close to this is probably Mr. > Bungle's California cd. I have no idea what to call or how to describe 95% > of the music on that disc. At the same time, about 50% of it is pretty > unlistenable to me so I'm not sure truly "progressing" is always a good > thing.
Reading this paragraph, I was reminded of two bands. The sort of bands that you either love, hate, or have never heard of. King Crimson and Thinking Plague. Crimson is one of the only truly "progressive" (see Hayden's definition #1) bands out there, and might only be accurately described as post-"progressive" (#2).
But I used to think that KC was about it, as far as being out there. Then I saw Thinking Plague at NEARfest. They politely disregard most of the rules about rhythm and melody, only barely clinging onto them so that we might be able to discern one song from another. It would be complete noise were they unable to repeat it. They have "progressed" (#1) beyond normal rock. They've evolved, hanging onto some vestigial elemnts (like, you know, having a drummer and stuff), and throwing away what they didn't need (such as two measures in a row in the same time or key).
Damn near everyone I spoke to after the show thought that Thinking Plague was just nonsense. "It's utter crap," my keyboardist said. But I'd been doing a lot of thinking about what progressive is (since I was trying to pitch my band to strangers -- one of whom actually fed me the "Dust in the Wind" thing), and I got something out of it. Once I allowed myself to progress past the normal definitions of typical Western music, I had opened myself up to enjoy something that most of my fellow attendees wrote off because it's too far out there. And these are progressive rock fans! (Clearly #2, though.)
---
> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 09:50:29 -0600 > From: "Matthew Tedesco" <Matthew.Tedesco@colorado.edu> > Subject: disconnected/prog definitions > > But push them still further, asking, "I don't want to know what blue is > LIKE, or what it reminds me of; I want a definition of blue ITSELF," and I > don't think many people would know how to respond. It'd be wrong to > suggest, though, that because of this they don't know what blue is. And,
I disagree. There is one true definition of "blue", and it has something to do with frequencies of light waves. (I work around physicists. :) However, as we've seen here in the last couple digests, there apparently is no one true definition of "progressive rock".
I like "art rock" more and more. It infers everything I wish people to understand about my stuff, and leaves very little room for false interpretation.
Of course, I'd kinda feel like a dork calling Dream Theater "art metal".
---
> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 13:16:43 -0300 > From: Alexandro Talamini <Alexandro@Boticario.com.br> > Subject: 1999 Christmas CD > > On the past couple of weeks I e-mailed the DTIFC twice. Didn't do it more > times to avoid boring people (I think 2 e-mails is more than enough). So, > guess what?? No answers so far. > > QUESTION: What should I do??
While I don't have an answer, I'd imagine that bugging us isn't it.
---
> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 11:29:10 -0500 (CDT) > From: Brian D Hayden <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu> > Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 5522 > > Or maybe I'm just talking shit since I was up all night trying to fix a > toilet and getting nowhere.
You clearly have a flawed approach. Use your hands next time.
---
> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 11:04:39 -0600 > From: "Korg Ecksthrey" <korgx3@safelink.net> > Subject: Progressive Folk Music? > > Freakin' Tracy Chapman, Indigo Girls, the Lick Sisters, etc... I have
The Lick Sisters, huh? They have any videos out? :)
> no idea where they even thought to coin progressive to that stuff, > considering it's about as regressive as music can get.
A couple years back, shortly before I became a grad-school dropout :), the Grad Student Association at William and Mary invited us to a barbecue. This was a painful day for me, because I realized that two of my favorite words are grossly misused by a lot of people.
You see, there was a band there, which is one of the primary reasons I went. (The free barbecue was the other. Grad students + free food = good attendance.) I walked up to one of the band members as they were setting up, and asked what kind of stuff they'd be playing. "Progressive rock", the guy said. I just about dropped one right there. "Really!? Do you do any covers?" "Oh, yeah, all covers." "No kidding! Like Supper's Ready, or Crimson King, or what?" "Huh? What's that stuff?" "Uh... er... well, um, what do you play?" "You know. Cracker. Wilco. <other bands I can't remember the names of now, in the same genre>." So close, yet so far.
I almost turned and left at that, when I remembered the free barbecue. I walked over to where everyone else was -- around the free food -- and said to one of the people behind a table, "I'll take a hot dog, please." "Oh, this is (a) barbecue."
It's important to note that, upon further reflection, I very strongly wanted to hear the word "a" there, because otherwise the sentence makes no sense to someone who's not from the southern US, and I may have forced myself to believe I heard it.
"OK, fine, I'll take a hot dog", I said, with that typical "I'm a New Yorker and your lack of comprehension is pissing me off" inflection. "But this is barbecue." Clearly no "a" there. Now I started to get suspicious. "Um, uh... well, fine, what do you have?" "Barbecue." The two of us simultaneously went into vapor lock, unable to speak, since it was quite clear at this point that neither had any clue what the other was talking about. Funny in Abbott and Costello; far less so in real life.
By this point, some of my Southern-bred classmates were starting to chuckle at my confusion. It turns out that the word barbecue, exclusively restricted to a verb or an adjective up here, is a *noun* in the South, referring to some totally fucked-up concoction of pork and... well, I don't even know what, but I guess it was barbecue sauce. Almost like a stew. And there were no dogs, or burgers, or steaks, or shish kebabs, at this barbecue. Only barbecue. Which my classmates strongly suggested was better than any "Yankee cookout" with burgers and such.
*Then* I left.
---
> Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 19:18:17 CEST > From: "Ricardo Testa" <ricardotesta@hotmail.com> > Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 5521 > > I am sorry Krog, but I have never "jammed" with David Hasselhoff. But I did > "jam" with Edward Mulhare.
Is your computer that far from home, that you have to drop such a long trail of names to find your way back?
-d NP: King Crimson/The ConstruKction of Light
------------------------------------------------------------------------ The Digital Man \|/ ____ \|/ "640 K ought to be enough d-man@dreamt.org "@'/ ,. \`@" memory for everyone." -Gates cmerlo@mindstorm.com /_| \__/ |_\ "He won't need a bed http://www.dreamt.org/d-man \__U_/ He's a digital man" -Peart ------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 15:33:31 -0400 From: Digital Man <cmerlo@optical.mindstorm.com> To: Ytse Love-In <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: physical geniuses Message-ID: <20000627153331.A1727@optical.mindstorm.com>
This one's for all you speed-freak guitarists. I found an interesting article on the web today, comparing a brilliant neurosurgeon with perennial batting champ Tony Gwynn. Might be influential in your quest for ever more BPM. (Or not. Whatever. Just trying to help.) http://www.gladwell.com/1999_08_02_a_genius.htm
------------------------------------------------------------------------ The Digital Man \|/ ____ \|/ "640 K ought to be enough d-man@dreamt.org "@'/ ,. \`@" memory for everyone." -Gates cmerlo@mindstorm.com /_| \__/ |_\ "He won't need a bed http://www.dreamt.org/d-man \__U_/ He's a digital man" -Peart ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 15:46:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Coldfire The Gallery Mistress <coldie@bellatlantic.net> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: RE: "Progressive", "Barbecue" remain undefined; "Blue" a stumper Message-ID: <383046730.962135185865.JavaMail.root@web621-wrb.mail.com>
On 2000-06-27 at 10:50 -0700, Chris Merlo spake thusly:
<snip>
A couple years back, shortly before I became a grad-school dropout :), the Grad Student Association at William and Mary invited us to a barbecue. This was a painful day for me, because I realized that two of my favorite words are grossly misused by a lot of people.
You see, there was a band there, which is one of the primary reasons I went. (The free barbecue was the other. Grad students + free food = good attendance.) I walked up to one of the band members as they were setting up, and asked what kind of stuff they'd be playing. "Progressive rock", the guy said. I just about dropped one right there. "Really!? Do you do any covers?" "Oh, yeah, all covers." "No kidding! Like Supper's Ready, or Crimson King, or what?" "Huh? What's that stuff?" "Uh... er... well, um, what do you play?" "You know. Cracker. Wilco. <other bands I can't remember the names of now, in the same genre>." So close, yet so far.
I almost turned and left at that, when I remembered the free barbecue. I walked over to where everyone else was -- around the free food -- and said to one of the people behind a table, "I'll take a hot dog, please." "Oh, this is (a) barbecue."
It's important to note that, upon further reflection, I very strongly wanted to hear the word "a" there, because otherwise the sentence makes no sense to someone who's not from the southern US, and I may have forced myself to believe I heard it.
"OK, fine, I'll take a hot dog", I said, with that typical "I'm a New Yorker and your lack of comprehension is pissing me off" inflection. "But this is barbecue." Clearly no "a" there. Now I started to get suspicious. "Um, uh... well, fine, what do you have?" "Barbecue." The two of us simultaneously went into vapor lock, unable to speak, since it was quite clear at this point that neither had any clue what the other was talking about. Funny in Abbott and Costello; far less so in real life.
By this point, some of my Southern-bred classmates were starting to chuckle at my confusion. It turns out that the word barbecue, exclusively restricted to a verb or an adjective up here, is a *noun* in the South, referring to some totally fucked-up concoction of pork and... well, I don't even know what, but I guess it was barbecue sauce. Almost like a stew. And there were no dogs, or burgers, or steaks, or shish kebabs, at this barbecue. Only barbecue. Which my classmates strongly suggested was better than any "Yankee cookout" with burgers and such.
*Then* I left.
******Chris darling....please please please don't hold it against them darling. I tell you what darling....you have an open invitation to VA and I'll have A Barbeque for you. in fact you should come down August 5th since SB/DT will be playing that nite in DC! ;)
That would mean I'll make you some good old fashioned Noooo Yawk Koshah Hot Dawgs. And then I'll make some DECENT barbeque for you to try as well. Ribs, Shredded pork without the grease and plenty of real sauce, steaks, ya know...stick to ya ribs food.
I'm southern, I know how to Barbeque!
Coldie
---
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 15:00:37 -0500 From: Brian Hayden <hayd0029@tc.umn.edu> To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Re: "Progressive", "Barbecue" remain undefined; "Blue" a stumper Message-ID: <B57E7215.6471%hayd0029@tc.umn.edu>
on 6/27/00 2:33 PM, Digital Man at cmerlo@optical.mindstorm.com scribbled in vibrant crayola:
> Damn near everyone I spoke to after the show thought that Thinking > Plague was just nonsense. "It's utter crap," my keyboardist said. > But I'd been doing a lot of thinking about what progressive is (since > I was trying to pitch my band to strangers -- one of whom actually fed > me the "Dust in the Wind" thing), and I got something out of it. Once > I allowed myself to progress past the normal definitions of typical > Western music, I had opened myself up to enjoy something that most of > my fellow attendees wrote off because it's too far out there. And > these are progressive rock fans! (Clearly #2, though.)
This is funny, because the reason I wrote that little spiel to begin with is because a couple folks on another list I'm on (an Al Stewart list, mostly acoustic singer-songwriter dude...think 'Year of the Cat') were discussing NearFest and old prog and new prog. One dude keeps plugging Porcupine Tree over and over. He's also just about the only person I've met away from this list who knows Chroma Key. heh.
> Of course, I'd kinda feel like a dork calling Dream Theater "art > metal".
BWAHAHAHAHA. That would rule. I'm waiting for the day when Sam Goody has a section labeled "art metal."
"Hey Beavis, check it out, these guys are like art metal or somethin." "Yeah! Yeah! Their perms are a work of art!" "No dumbass, I mean, they like, play really fast and stuff." "Heheh...heheh...heh.... I'll play your mom really fast!" *thwack*
> sauce. Almost like a stew. And there were no dogs, or burgers, or > steaks, or shish kebabs, at this barbecue. Only barbecue. Which my > classmates strongly suggested was better than any "Yankee cookout" > with burgers and such. > > *Then* I left.
Merlo, ya damn carpetbaggin bigot. ;) Barbecue rules, and I'm not generally a fan of pork or barbecue sauce. That stuff is just plain good.
--
This is no country for old men.
-W.B. Yeats
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 13:53:02 -0600 From: "Korg Ecksthrey" <korgx3@safelink.net> To: <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Rsepnose ot a dsixlesic jmamer. Message-ID: <004b01bfe071$b8bbe0b0$0201010a@chuck>
> I am sorry Krog, but I have never "jammed" with David Hasselhoff. But > I did "jam" with Edward Mulhare.
I am sorry, Rick Head, but I am not a Danish Physiologist. But I did eat a Danish with "jam" this morning. She was wonderful.
> And there were no dogs, or burgers, or steaks, or shish kebabs, at > this barbecue. What? No chicken?!?
> Only barbecue. What? No mutton?!?
> Only barbecue. What? No crustacians?!?
> Only barbecue. Damn. -- KorgX3 wonders if he needs to change his nick to Kruzweil.
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 16:19:20 -0400 From: "Matt Molite" <ytsejam11@dreamtheater.zzn.com> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: SyX - V Message-ID: <AE0A4385CBB44D11DA5E00807CFD6BE9@ytsejam11.dreamtheater.zzn.com>
> This is at least what the unofficial site says. > (http://listen.to/teof)
I believe there was a notice on The Edge of Forever stating that it is (or is in the process of becoming) the official site.
Matt ============================= Now you've got your voice Your own speech Don't wait 'till Someone else agrees -Rafael Bittencourt, Angra ============================= Dream Theater newsletter - http://www.dreamtheater.net/uacmmail/ ____________________________________________________________ Get your own Web-Based E-mail Service at http://www.zzn.com Get your 100MB FREE Internet storage! Sign up now - www.netdrive.com/?O=ZZN4
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 22:22:00 +0200 From: "Sasha C." <sasa.cabaravdic@pu.tel.hr> To: "Ytsejam Mailing List" <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Re: We All Need Some Light Message-ID: <001201bfe075$5f019d40$12ed1dc3@sasha>
>Janne Jokitalo <janne_jokitalo@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>"Sasha C." wrote:
>> no shit? thanx for enlightening me... >> I just ordered the damn album 5 days ago, and it'll take at least 3 weeks >> until I get the Transatlantic and my copy of Gordian Knot Interview Disc. >> So, I asked nicely if someone could post me the lyrics to We All Need Some >> Light... I downloaded an mp3 of the alternative mix (btw, there are no >> limited edition copies available anymore so don't preach how I'm stealing >> from the band by downloading mp3s) and I couldn't figure out what mr. Roine >> was singing half the time... that's it.
>But, it's not Roine who sings on that one, it's a complete Neal tune, he sure as >hell sings it too =)
Alternative mix? From the Limited Edition? 2nd disc, track 2? Hellooo?!? Unless Neal has a voice range like Daniel Gildenlow [Pain of Salvation], meaning that he can sing very low and very high that you'd think it's 2 different persons singing, I'm wrong... But I think I'm not... Roine is singing on the other version.
NP: Al Di Meola - Kiss My Axe
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 16:35:18 EDT From: Fett2002@aol.com To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: Progressive Music Message-ID: <de.6e8bb2a.268a6a06@aol.com>
In a message dated 6/27/00 1:46:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ytsejam@torchsong.com writes:
<< Now we get to the crux of the issue, obviously. There are two basic ways of using the word progressive with regards to music. 1. as a genre designation, a type of music employing lots of time and key changes etc etc all the other good crap. By this definition, yes, most of the bands discussed in this forum are prog of one flavor or another. 2. the true sense of the word. Something which marks progress. Progressive. >>
I think most people go by the first definition, even though the second really makes a lot more sense, but is never used. For example, using that definiton wouldn't the Beatles be considered perhaps THEE most progressive rock band ever, considering the amount their music progressed from their early years to their later years? And not to bring up the whole Beatles arguments again, so for the sake of avoiding this let's just assume that it is a given that they did progress just to make the point clear.
>No. No. No. We've already established that "progressive" music actually has >nothing "progressive" about it. So, we are forced to conclude that the term >only has meaning as defined at (1) above.
Yep, agreed.
> Now, basically the only legitimate >reason for having genre labels is to have a loose way of describing an >artist to someone who has not been exposed to said artist previously, a >loose categorization. Now, if you contend that "prog" can meaningfully >signify different things to different people, the term has become utterly >and completely useless.
Well, sort of agreed. There are still basic guidelines and parameters using your first definition.
>People should just quit using the word "prog" because in its alluvia of >meanings it is rendered meaningless.
Every musical description should probably get dropped. Why do people feel the unending need to catagorize everything?
>As 'Alternative' has long since ceased to be a meaningful term and become a >label, so has 'progressive.' Alternative is not the alternative to anything >these days, it's mainstream; what most people in prog circles ceased to be >progressive long ago. It is nothing new.
I hate the label "alternative." It is completely meaningless. It stopped having meaning (if it ever had any to begin with) about 10 years ago. It just became a buzz word for college kids who though they were part of some great non-conformist culture that made them cool. How ironic, that by doing this, they were in fact conforming. -mike C.
NP: deftones- white pony
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 16:56:53 EDT From: IAmClay777@aol.com To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 5523 Message-ID: <50.74dbf38.268a6f15@aol.com>
The guys from King's X both have instruments (In addition to their drop D ones) tuned: Guitar (low to high): A, E, A, D, F#, B Bass (low to high): A, E, A, D This is to accomodate the heavier stuff from Bulbous.
<<Ty played his new signature Yamaha axe tuned down heavily to D and what sounded like C. The weird chordshapes that he played make me think that he tuned the whole guitar differently, too bad I forgot to ask him about that. Doug used two of his new Yamaha basses, one J/P tuned to D and one P tuned down to C>>
On the regular cd, it it sung by Neal, with backing vocals by Mike and Pete (I think). However, on the special edition there is indeed a version of this song with Roine on lead vocals.
> > But, it's not Roine who sings on that one, it's a complete Neal tune, he > sure as > > hell sings it too =) > > - Rock
> Well i kind of did mean it like "if you buy the disc, you get the lyrics". > Anyways, i dont think Neal sings this one, the vocals on the verses sound > wierd and completely un-neal like. Now the chorii, well..thats another > thing. >
~R. J. M.
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 17:29:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Andrew Coutermarsh <a_couter@oz.plymouth.edu> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Re: Dream DVD Message-ID: <Pine.BSF.4.10.10006271727120.34840-100000@oz.plymouth.edu>
On Mon, 26 Jun 2000, Coldfire The Gallery Mistress wrote:
> Nope...some of us can't afford DVD. ALso, more speakers means more > things that could and will get broken and then I'd have to pay even > more money to get fixed. Then again a Shitallica DVD is the last > thing in the world to entice me to get something.
Well, first of all, if you didn't treat your equipment like shit and/or don't buy shit equipment to begin with, it wouldn't break in the first place.
Secondly, why not save and get DVD? As of right now, the prices aren't too much different for DVD movies from VHS, and the you can get a player for between 200 and 350 dollars. Besides, when the Playstation 2 comes out, you can get that! :)
Third, why did you insist on insulting his choice of music? I, for one, am not a Metallica fan, but I found their S&M disc to be quite interesting, regardless of whether I LIKE their music or not. Quit being so damn adament in your prog-snobbishness.
------------------------------------------------- Andrew Coutermarsh a_couter@mail.plymouth.edu http://cout.dhs.org/ Cloak on IRC ICQ: 2513441 ------------------------------------------------- "I'm not going to have some reporters pawing through our papers. We are the President." - Hillary Clinton commenting on the release of subpoenaed documents. -------------------------------------------------
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 18:14:06 -0500 (CDT) From: Andrew Goktepe <goktepe@citilink.com> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@torchsong.com> Subject: Re: Kings's X in Ljubljana 23rd Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000627175756.1583A-100000@foshay>
> Ty played his new signature Yamaha axe tuned down heavily to D > and what sounded like C. The weird chordshapes that he played > make me think that he tuned the whole guitar differently, too bad > I forgot to ask him about that.
On the new album, I believe Ty tunes down to an A. They said that now so many bands tune to D, so they went even lower. I also read that he used a POD to record that album. I haven't spent much time with 'em, but they seem pretty cool.
Andy Goktepe goktepe@citilink.com
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Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 02:18:55 +0200 From: Andreas Skarin - SDTS <sdts@sdts.nu> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: 1,5 + 1,5 = 2,10? Message-ID: <3959446F.8B03D2F7@sdts.nu>
Janne Jokitalo wrote:
> Huh, thank God for telling me this, now I'm even more grateful I'm NOT = a Swede > !!! =3D)
Since your pursuit of provocation is so obvious I'll indulge you. I stron= gly condemn the above remark and I've told you before, Sweden and (most of) i= ts citizens are, and will always be superior to anything even remotely conne= cted to Finland.
There's nothing like a little patriotic bickering to brighten up my day := -)
Andreas Skarin Svenska Dream Theater S=E4llskapet http://www.sdts.nu - mailto:sdts@sdts.nu
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 21:29:41 EST From: "M P" <mremann6@hotmail.com> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 5513 Message-ID: <20000628022941.75092.qmail@hotmail.com>
>From: EvoReaper@aol.com >Subject: Re: Rock Discipline/Concept Album
>Right now, I've got some ideas for the concept, but I could probably come >up >with something better. >My idea: >Reaper and Reapress live in present day world,
interesting, but wouldn't Death know who killed who?
>Columbine-Write through the kid's eyes as they ran through the halls and >witnessed everything, kind of in a tribute.
Please do the kids a favor. Let it die. We kinda thought the actual Columbine tribute album was in poor taste. Doesn't help that one A. Belew is on it too.
Other ideas... Finding a singular truth in a world of deception. Might be hard to do well.
take a concept and essay it to death rather than write a story around it (much like Dark Side of the Moon does with insanity). War is rather commonplace, as is Love. Desensitization - this might be interesting.
JAJUID ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
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Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 21:21:20 -0600 From: Vince LuPone <vgl@syspac.com> To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: re:DT does a cover of the Kinight Rider theme Message-ID: <3.0.32.20000627212118.006fb9cc@pop02.syspac.com>
Hey man, don't fret. I still remember playing with my hot wheels toys and re-creating that Knight Rider Kitt/Semi face off :) Hell, I was only like 5 or 6 when it aired :)
~Vince
>>Or the face-off against the semi? > >The semi in Night Rider was named Goliath, owned Garth the evil David Hasselhoff.
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End of YTSEJAM Digest 5524 **************************
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