YTSEJAM Digest 3484
Today's Topics:
1) Dream Theater in Louisiana?
by Kevin Loechner <kloechn@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu>
2) Adam the Bassist
by Adam Barnhart <adamb@cfmc.com>
3) King's X
by a thing with a voice <afn39111@afn.org>
4) Spock's Beard (yes, AGAIN)
by Lisa Marie <peterson@fore.com>
5) Don't copy the FII cut tracks to CDR, please.
by Michael Bahr <durnik@goodnet.com>
6) What happens
by "beanvet" <beanvet@accessus.net>
7) Re: FII unreleased tracks...
by Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br>
8) $60, are you nuts!!!
by larryd@boca.net (Larry Doe)
9) Castronovo
by "Charlie Korch"<ckorch@raleigh.ibm.com>
10) Front row, Shadow Gallery, Lemur Voice, Symphony X
by Phil Carter <satriani@negia.net>
11) Re: Favorite Guitar Solos Anyone? Fire Away!
by Carol Dellinger <cdelling@mail.legato.com>
12) Tori Amos
by "Brian Hayden" <Brian.D.Hayden-1@tc.umn.edu>
13) Favorite Guitar Solos
by Nicholas Giannotti <nickg@gis.net>
14) Vocalist
by krackley@weidmuller.com
15)
by krackley@weidmuller.com
16) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3482
by Brian <ambicwts@postoffice.ptd.net>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 12:50:13 -0600
From: Kevin Loechner <kloechn@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Dream Theater in Louisiana?
Message-ID: <34C64365.50F6@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu>
Hey,
Does anyone know if Dream Theater will come through Louisiana on the
second U.S. leg of their tour? I am a Dream Theater fan in Louisiana
and the following does not seem to be that large here, but hopefully
large enough to warrant at least a stop in Lafayette, Baton Rouge, or
New Orleans.
Kevin Loechner
http://studentweb.tulane.edu/~kloechn
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 10:59:09 -0800
From: Adam Barnhart <adamb@cfmc.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Adam the Bassist
Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19980120105909.006b374c@pop.cfmc.com>
I know I'm a bit behind, but I'm quite busy to really be up-to-date with
all of you. Had to make a point, though...
>From: "Nick Giannotti" <nickg@gis.net>
>Subject: More on bass solos....
>
>Dave (Zildjian) wrote,
>
>>>I've *never* heard a rock song that has a
>>>bass solo that still sounds 'full' when the bassist is soloing.
>>
>> Get Billy Sheehan's "Kings of Sleep" (i think). Put it this way....If a
>>bass player has his OWN cd's out....you can bet he's gonna do some
>>soloing on it ! He rips !!
>
>I have it, and yes, he does rip, and, by the way, it's Stu Hamm :) But I'll
>still stick to my guns. Stu's, Billy's, Manring's, Wooten's - all of them
>are great players, all of them are, to some degree or another, influences
>on me, and all of them deserve a place in the annals of Bass Playing. But I
>still think bass solos should either be:
>
>a) unaccompanied, and thus, a song into themselves (i.e. 'NV43345' by Billy
>Sheehan or 'Monkeysuit Businessman' by Michael Manring - two compositions
>that can stand on their own), or
>
>b) non-existant in your typical rock song. IMHO, they just don't work.
>
>Remeber, as I said before - it's called bass for a reason!!
My recollection is that your argument is that the song doesn't sound "full"
when the bass is soloing, hence the bass ought not to solo. Let me run
four things by you:
1) I don't think a song is always intended to sound "full." We've had a
million power ballads over the years, which is precisely an issue of
contrasting weight with less aggressive sections. Kurt Cobain made a
(short) career out of that very tool. In the case of our beloved band,
you've got songs like "Learning to Live" which, very specifically, build.
To get to that whole balls-to-the-wall hugeness (hmmm....I dunno about that
phrase), it's often most effective to start smaller. But a lot of the
"great" songs in rock history (Adam searches at random) -- "Stairway to
Heaven," "Fade to Black," "Aqualung," "Spirit of Radio," "Smells Like Teen
Spirit," "Dream On" -- have that dynamicism in them. Is it possible, then,
for a bass solo to be the lead voice when accompanied, say, by only a
piano, mixed low, rather than a more traditional arrangement with guitar?
2) What about more than one bassist? I see Wooten's name up there, but I
see no recognition of the fact that he's recorded a bit with Steve Bailey,
where they've gone back and forth, sharing soloing and more rooted playing.
Surely at least THAT sound is "full." Or if it isn't, I can't imagine why
it wouldn't be. And two bassists isn't really that strange a concept.
James Earl played with Stanley Clarke for a while -- Ned's Atomic Dustbin,
Cop Shoot Cop, and Ronald Shannon Jackson's Decoding Society all had a
couple of bassists in the room.
3) And what of couterpoint? Again, I see Manring and Wooten up there.
Neither of these guys NEEDS another bassist for there to be meaningful
traditional bass lines along with their soloing. We haven't seen a lot of
that playing in traditional rock songs, but there IS a bit of that sort of
thing, and Myung's actually pointing vaguely in that direction (though I
think it's probably going to be a bassist in a trio who really exploits
that sound well). That most contrapuntal bass playing exists as solo
pieces doesn't mean that it can't have a greater future. I've tried a
little myself, though sharing sonic space with two guitarists, it wasn't
something that was often appropriate.
4) The actual sonic space of the bass. Unless you're playing with a really
bassy, throbbing sound with very little top end, there's nothing that says
that you have to solo at the 16th fret or something. Meaningful melodic
lines can be drawn up that live below the 7th fret. You may be playing
something melodic, you can even give it a heavy rhythmic edge, but you
don't necessarily have to play it in a place that leaves the bottom end out.
>I never realized that I'd open a can of worms with this thread. This is
>interesting.:)
Agreed. Actually, I'm not sure I agree with your initial supposition,
anyhow, but I did think your argument is something that ought to be
addressed. I don't conceptualize the role of the bass the way a lot of
folks do, so perhaps I'm not the one to argue against your point. I
thought it might be worth chewing on, anyhow.
Five Gratuitous CD's:
=====================
1. Rush: Critical Mass (Disc 1)
2. Rush: Critical Mass (Disc 2)
3. Spacehog: Resident Alien
4. Marillion: Reel to Real
5. Marillion: Brief Encounter
Adam D. Barnhart
adamb@cfmc.com
ydnt85a@prodigy.com
http://www.cfmc.com/adamb
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 14:10:06 -0500 (EST)
From: a thing with a voice <afn39111@afn.org>
To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com>
Subject: King's X
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.95.980121140619.45669B-100000@freenet2.afn.org>
The best starting point, in my opinion, is Gretchen Goes to Nebraska. The
other albums are good, sure, but it was GGtG that made me a die hard. A bit
less progressive than Faith Hope Love, but kick ASS.
NP: Orbital - In Sides
-=-
"I'm me, it's true, shut the fuck up." -- Bill Hicks
--------------------==== Broken via True Love ====-------------------
http://www.afn.org/~afn39111 Butcher, Rape, Smash to Pieces
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 11:13:14 -0800
From: Lisa Marie <peterson@fore.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Spock's Beard (yes, AGAIN)
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980121110402.0071cb04@mailbox.sj.fore.com>
At 09:37 AM 1/21/98 -0800, josh wrote:
>
><snip> ...kindness of strangers, whatever.
HEY! Speaking of The Kindness of Strangers...
that just happens to be the title of the new Spock's Beard cd!
(I'll bet Carol just KNEW I was going to say something! ;o)
The last show of their European tour is tonight in Hamburg,
there are a couple of great reviews on the Thoughts homepage
(url in my sig), more will be added over the next few days.
The official Spock's Beard website has FINALLY been updated!
http://www.altura.com/jordanz/spocks_beard
There are samples off the new cd, so go check them out now!
I'm serious!!
If everyone buys their cds, I promise to shut the hell up...
maybe ;o)
Take care everyone!
Lisa Marie
".`^~,^. __ _
'._',_.; Lisa Marie Peterson \ \ ___ ___ ___(_) ___
( \/ ) jessie@cheerful.com \ \/ _ \/ __/ __| |/ _ \
\ / ICQ UIN#1518578 /\_/ / __/\__ \__ \ | __/
\/ \___/ \___||___/___/_|\___|
http://www.a-vip.com/jessie
---------------------------------------------------------
THOUGHTS - The Official Spock's Beard Mailing List
http://home.pacbell.net/proghead/thoughts.html
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 12:43:26 -0700
From: Michael Bahr <durnik@goodnet.com>
To: ytsejam@ax.com
Subject: Don't copy the FII cut tracks to CDR, please.
Message-ID: <34C64FDE.58A7@goodnet.com>
Like the subject says. The band has made it clear that we're going to
get legit CDs of the cut tracks from FII in some form or another
(indeed, all but WAYN and RTK are already out!!) and to copy them at
this point would be piracy, not bootlegging. It crosses the line from
fandom into outright disrespect for the band, because this is stuff
that's been officially released. You might as well copy Awake while
you're at it.
I mean, don't you think if the great Portholio had given the nod, that
I'd already have released a CD with those songs? ;)
-- - Mike Bahr / Prism Records - durnik @ goodnet . com - http://www.goodnet.com/~durnik/------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 13:44:05 -0600 From: "beanvet" <beanvet@accessus.net> To: <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: What happens Message-ID: <199801211949.NAA10024@postal.accessus.net>
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01BD2672.A3CB9F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Possibly in the middle of the year I'm gonna get to see DT in St. Louis = hopefully, when they start their second leg of their US tour. Was = wanting to know from some experienced jammers if on occasion they come = out to sign merchandise, videos, cd's, shirts, etc...? Whether or not = it's worth bringing out the pricless stuff, don't wanna take it, if no = reason, but sure would be great to have some signed merchandise for the = collection, since this is the only band I would consider doing this for, = besides Iron Maiden. So sorry to keep bugging everybody but I just can't = wait to see the show. Anybody know?
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01BD2672.A3CB9F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"> <HTML> <HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 = http-equiv=3DContent-Type> <META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.71.1008.3"' name=3DGENERATOR> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <P><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3DArial size=3D2> Possibly in the = middle of the=20 year I'm gonna get to see DT in St. Louis hopefully, when they start = their=20 second leg of their US tour. Was wanting to know from some experienced = jammers=20 if on occasion they come out to sign merchandise, videos, cd's, shirts, = etc...?=20 Whether or not it's worth bringing out the pricless stuff, don't wanna = take it,=20 if no reason, but sure would be great to have some signed merchandise = for the=20 collection, since this is the only band I would consider doing this for, = besides=20 Iron Maiden. So sorry to keep bugging everybody but I just can't wait to = see the=20 show. Anybody know?</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3DArial size=3D2><A=20 href=3D"mailto:beanvet@accessus.net">beanvet@accessus.net</A> </FONT= ></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01BD2672.A3CB9F80--
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 07:52:01 -0200 (EDT) From: Rogerio Brito <rbrito@dijkstra.ime.usp.br> To: Multiple recipients of list <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Re: FII unreleased tracks... Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.960102074429.462A-100000@iverson.linux.ime.usp.br>
On Wed, 21 Jan 1998, II Stephane Fortin wrote:
> Hi jammers!
Hi, Stephane.
> I just can't believe some people can do that to others. About the > unreleased material from FII, instead of freakin paying "60$ US", you > can go buy some other bootleg that has these songs. Like, for RTK, LWY > or some more, just buy the CD: Guitar Talkin. There you'll find some > interesting stuff paying a lot less then what's proposed... Think about > it, when you search, you can find some pretty good stuff!!!
So you think $60 is way too little?? :-)) Ok. I'll charge you $75 for it, with RtK *WITH* vocals. By me. :-)
Shipping: $15. You know, the way here to Brazil from the US has a lot of difficulties, many jungles with snakes, the rainforest, you know.
> Le Dragon
[]s, Le Ripper...
-- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - rbrito@ime.usp.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 15:01:18 -0600 From: larryd@boca.net (Larry Doe) To: <Ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: $60, are you nuts!!! Message-ID: <19980121195614616.AAA68@larryd9.boca.net>
you have to be kidding me. you in their mind would ask people such a ridiculous price for 5 songs. a couple of newsletters ago someone posted a URL of progmetal.gmsnet.com where they had posted the unreleased materials for free. sure you have to have something capable of reading MPG3, but he also has the listing for that. come on people let's not be trying to rip each other off. I downloaded the files and then, oh no, made a copy onto minidisk. don't send the copyright police after me. sure the quality isn't perfect, but it still was better then an analog tape. I have a simple set up of a Ensoniq soundScape and just plug the analog output into my minidisk. sure not everyone has this capability, but I'll glad make copies of the material for the cost of the tape and shipping. I can't make CDs but I can do the minidisk. if you want you can then convert that somewhere. e-mail me privately if you want to take me up on this. so now we can discuss the legality of internet provided material in a digital state, converted to analog, re-recorded in digital. I give you a few minutes to think this one over.
Lary larryd@boca.net
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 15:10:33 -0400 From: "Charlie Korch"<ckorch@raleigh.ibm.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Castronovo Message-ID: <85256593.006E7C9B.00@ATLMAIL.IBMUS2.IBM.COM>
Chris
>>Firstly, to the girl who met JLB and said he was arrogant. It's not the first time I've heard someone say that. Remember Bad English? I've been e-mailing the drummer for a while and he met the band a few weeks ago (or something like that) and said "He was a bit of a dick". His words, not mine , jammers.<<
Was this drummer you speak of Dean Castronovo? He is one of the baddest drummers on the face of the earth. I have seen him with Bad English, and in clinic twice (including the Modern Drummer Festival) and he never ceases to amaze me. If DT ever needed a replacement Deen would be the man. MP also agrees that Deen would be the perfect man for the job.
By the way, does Deen have a home page?
Charlie.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 15:35:01 -0500 (EST) From: Phil Carter <satriani@negia.net> To: Under a Glass Ytse <ytsejam@ax.com> Subject: Front row, Shadow Gallery, Lemur Voice, Symphony X Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.3.95.980121143906.2189A-100000@peach.negia.net>
Greetings ye 'jamanoids...
from Josh: > Hey, all this talk about getting to the front row at a good concert got > me thinking. Wouldn't the best way to be at the front be to get there > EARLY? 8)
Hell yes. I'm the sort of fanatic who will get there four hours early for a seat in front. It's kind of a dilemma; I'd like to see Dream Theater, for example, selling out huge venues, but then I'd never get to be right in front and let them see how much I'm enjoying the show. :)
from Brian: > Haven't heard the other bands you mention, but I have had Shadow Gallery > "Carved in Stone" for years. It does border on cheesy. The production could > be better. Overall, it seems to need some refinement. It does show promise. > They are supposed to have new one out soon (Tyranny?). I would wait for > this to come out, and skip Carved in Stone until after that. (I would also > characterize this as a "Christian" band, if that matters to you.)
I have yet to see "cheesy" with respect to Shadow Gallery, unless it comes to the lyrics in a song or two. "Atmosphere" is the keyword for Shadow Gallery -- they've got it in spades. Layers of majestic keyboards and piano, choral vocals, and powerful bass, drums and guitar. The emphasis is more on keyboards, but the guitar work is strong and there are chops aplenty from all concerned. The guitars do sound a bit thin and biting (to borrow a phrase from Chris Ptacek) in places, but that's the only real problem I have with the production. Vocalist Mike Baker has a voice which soars without ever screaming, and the choral backing vocals are outstanding. Plus epic tracks like "Ghostship".
The lyrics for one or two songs are a bit weak, but the lyrical work in tunes like "Warcry" and "Ghostship" are so strong that it's easy to forget the momentary lapses. Overall a very good disc; I'm looking forward to "Tyranny".
> As for other bands, you didn't mention Lemur Voice. If you don't have it, > get it before you get ANY other band mentioned on this list.
Lemur Voice is indeed well worth the price of admission; another band where keyboards shine just as much as the guitars. Lots of Chapman Stick playing on the album too. Gregoor van der Loo has a clear, cloudlike tenor which is a bit hard to understand sometimes, but the band is very good.
My highest Ytse-recommendation, though, would probably have to go to Symphony X's "Divine Wings of Tragedy". This, in my opinion, is a perfect progressive metal. Heavy guitars with the occasional shredfest thrown in, atmospheric neoclassical keyboards, powerful low end bass and drums, and a very strong vocalist. Impeccably composed and executed songs, with vicious time changes and epic structures, make this one a keeper.
Cheers, Phil
===================================================================== Phil Carter -- satriani@negia.net (work), carter@negia.net (personal) Senior Tech, NorthEast Georgia Internet Access, 546-5787 "Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life." -- Berthold Auerbach Currently playing: Rush -- "Hold Your Fire"
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 12:32:48 -0800 From: Carol Dellinger <cdelling@mail.legato.com> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: Favorite Guitar Solos Anyone? Fire Away! Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19980121123248.009f13a0@mail.legato.com>
Okay you ask for Guitar solos....here goes!
DT....Voices....as many of you can testify, that solo where JP winds it up sooooo tight just gives me screaming Eargasms! Better yet watch the master play that sucker live.....catch me boys I'm falling!
Damn....ALL of Hell's Kitchen! I laugh, I cry...nuff said!
or for a different change of pace....
Gary Hoey....Bug Alley...track 6.."Peace Pipe" Lord that thing is freaking brilliant! I am soooo moved by hearing it....not a cover tune, but a moving original that I highly recommend!
Just my fuel from the Fire...
Hearts away,
Coldfire coldfire@pacbell.net http://www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/haight/25/
"And all this could be just a dream so it seems, I was never much good at good-bye."
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 98 14:59:32 -0600 From: "Brian Hayden" <Brian.D.Hayden-1@tc.umn.edu> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Tori Amos Message-ID: <34c661b32e8b002@mhub3.tc.umn.edu>
Okay, after lots of raves about Tori Amos from various sources, I went out and bought "Boys for Pele." This is one of those CDs that really frustrates me. There are places where it's really getting good, and then she ruins it with those high squeaky/whispery vocals that she does sometimes. Overall I really like the music, and some of the vocal work is excellent, but...
What I'm wondering is, does she have anything that's a little less, I guess "meandering" is the word I'm looking for. Something with more consistent vocals. Private email if you want. Thanks!
-Brian
******************************************************************************** "You know me, Marge. I like my beer cold, my TV loud, and my homosexuals flaming." - Homer Simpson "Cloning is just reproduction without naked people." - James Mohr "I'm bored. Let's screw." - Drew Pauley ******************************************************************************** Coleridge on IRC
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 16:08:57 -0500 From: Nicholas Giannotti <nickg@gis.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Favorite Guitar Solos Message-ID: <199801212105.QAA21381@ns2.gis.net>
- Giant: "In My Dreams" Wow. Dan Huff rocks. Listening to this shows why he's one of the TOP guitar sessionmen around. - DT: "Another Day" Nothing I can say that hasn't been already said. Pure Emotion. - The Cure: "Pictures of You" Robert Smith ROCKS. Enough said. - Stevie Ray Vaughn: "Empty Arms" What it's all about when you talk about Texas Blues. -Guns & Roses: "Paradise City" The outro solo is, IMHO, Air Guitar music at its finest.
There are more, but these are the ones that I can think of when I'm NOT near my CD's.
-Nicholas
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 16:09:13 -0500 From: krackley@weidmuller.com Subject: Vocalist Message-ID: <199801212109.QAA00170@mail.weidmuller.com>
> BTW, Lobsterman, the greatest vocalist of all time, hands down, with no if 's, > and's, or but's is.... PAUL STANLEY !!!!!!!!!
You'll get nothing but thumbs up from me. That guy actually sounds better the older he gets. Amazing.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 16:09:19 -0500 From: krackley@weidmuller.com Message-ID: <199801212109.QAA00159@mail.weidmuller.com>
> Albert Wrote: > Once again, my vote for kick-ass vocalist has to go to Sebastian Bach.
Who's that, I thought we were talking about vocalists.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 16:06:35 -0500 From: Brian <ambicwts@postoffice.ptd.net> To: ytsejam@ax.com Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3482 Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19980121160635.006c3d08@postoffice.ptd.net>
At 08:46 AM 1/21/98 -0800, you wrote: >Before people start sending me hate mail and so on, let me first say that Genesis >were one of THE bands for me when I was a kid (like Dream Theater for many >of the younger readers on the list - don't worry, you'll grow out of it).
Shit, I hope not.
------------------------------
End of YTSEJAM Digest 3484 **************************
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Thu Apr 01 2004 - 18:07:02 EST